Jesus was crucified on Thursday

[prodromos]

He used synecdoche to represent his body as a temple

That is not synecdoche.

 

[Der Alte]

All I said, as an expert in literary language types and genres, I know what synecdoche is, and Jesus' three days and three nights were literal and not representative of anything else, and hyperbole, and His statement was not an exaggeration but a statement of fact.

I also have a M.Div, so that make me your academic equal and peer and therefore not intimidated by your academic qualifications. What this means is that my expert knowledge in language and theology is equal to yours and so my opinion is just as valid as yours. So, basically we are at a stalemate where you have your opinion and I have mine, and there is equal justification for both according to our respective interpretation of Scripture and Israelology..

I don't recall relying solely on my own qualifications. I'm quite sure I quoted several sources. There is a way we can include Thursday to the Heart of the earth Matt 12:40. There you go with "statement of fact" How do you handle "in three days" and "third day?"

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

This is simply your opinion. You have not explained how, as a literary expert, you have arrived at this conclusion.

How does it not fit the hallmarks of synecdoche?

Synecdoche is one thing that is representative of another. So, when Jesus said that He was going to be in the centre of the earth for three days and three nights, then "the centre of the earth" would be synecdoche because He is using it to represent the place where He is actually going. But what is represented by the three days and three nights? Nothing. Therefore it is literal.

If I say that I am walking down to the convenience store to buy a newspaper, that is exactly what I intend to do. But if I say I am taking the "wheels" down to the convenience store, the "wheels" represent my motor car, therefore it is synecdoche. If I say that I am going to "shoot" down to the store, I am using hyperbole because I am exaggerating my mode of travel. Similarly if I say that my laptop cost me "mega bucks", I am using hyperbole, because the laptop might have cost me just $500. Actually using the expression "laptop" is syndecdoche because it represents a portable compact computer.

But if I am going on a cruise around the Pacific and it is going to take three days and three nights, then it would be expected to take three days and three nights. That is neither synecdoche or hyperbole, but shows the fact that the cruise actually takes that period of time.

 

[Saber Truth Tiger]

Synecdoche is one thing that is representative of another. So, when Jesus said that He was going to be in the centre of the earth for three days and three nights, then "the centre of the earth" would be synecdoche because He is using it to represent the place where He is actually going. But what is represented by the three days and three nights? Nothing. Therefore it is literal.

If I say that I am walking down to the convenience store to buy a newspaper, that is exactly what I intend to do. But if I say I am taking the "wheels" down to the convenience store, the "wheels" represent my motor car, therefore it is synecdoche. If I say that I am going to "shoot" down to the store, I am using hyperbole because I am exaggerating my mode of travel. Similarly if I say that my laptop cost me "mega bucks", I am using hyperbole, because the laptop might have cost me just $500. Actually using the expression "laptop" is syndecdoche because it represents a portable compact computer.

But if I am going on a cruise around the Pacific and it is going to take three days and three nights, then it would be expected to take three days and three nights. That is neither synecdoche or hyperbole, but shows the fact that the cruise actually takes that period of time.

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Hi Watchman1

The problem I have is I have examined the evidence for the "three days and three nights" Hebraism or Jewish figure of speech and found it to be lacking. But, I have studied this subject extensively and have found no evidence that Nisan 15 is an annual Sabbath. So, the weekly Sabbath was the Sabbath referred to throughout the gospels during the Passion of the Christ.

Thanks for reading.

 

[BPPLEE]

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Hi Watchman1

The problem I have is I have examined the evidence for the "three days and three nights" Hebraism or Jewish figure of speech and found it to be lacking. But, I have studied this subject extensively and have found no evidence that Nisan 15 is an annual Sabbath. So, the weekly Sabbath was the Sabbath referred to throughout the gospels during the Passion of the Christ.

Thanks for reading.

You find no evidence that Passover is the 14th of Nisan and the feast is on the 15th?

 

[Saber Truth Tiger]

You find no evidence that Passover is the 14th of Nisan and the feast is on the 15th?

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Passover is indeed the 14th of Nisan and the first day of Unleavened Bread is Nisan 15. However, Nisan 15 is not a Scriptural Sabbath. Originally, the weekly Sabbath preceded the waving of the Omer, the event that started the 50-day countdown to Shavuot (Pentecost). During or after the Babylonian Captivity the Jews made a subtle change to the Omer instructions in Leviticus 23:11, declaring that the waving of the Omer was to take place on the day after the first day, meaning the first day of Unleavened Bread. From that time until the destruction of the second Temple in 70 CE there were two major sects in Judaism and the Sadducees held to the belief that the waving of the Omer was to take place on the day following the first weekly Sabbath of Passover week.

The Pharisees, who believed that Nisan 15 was a Sabbath, taught their followers that waving of the Omer took place on Nisan 16, the day AFTER the first day of Unleavened Bread. The Pharisee view won out because with the destruction of the Temple in 70 CE the Sadducees ceased to exist and the Jewish reckoning prevailed. So, every since that time the rabbinical method of counting the Omer prevailed until today. The Jews today call the seven annual holy convocations high days and they reckon them as Sabbaths. But their view is based on a false teaching and the Hebrew Scriptures did not reckon those days as Sabbaths.

 

[BPPLEE]

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Passover is indeed the 14th of Nisan and the first day of Unleavened Bread is Nisan 15. However, Nisan 15 is not a Scriptural Sabbath. Originally, the weekly Sabbath preceded the waving of the Omer, the event that started the 50-day countdown to Shavuot (Pentecost). During or after the Babylonian Captivity the Jews made a subtle change to the Omer instructions in Leviticus 23:11, declaring that the waving of the Omer was to take place on the day after the first day, meaning the first day of Unleavened Bread. From that time until the destruction of the second Temple in 70 CE there were two major sects in Judaism and the Sadducees held to the belief that the waving of the Omer was to take place on the day following the first weekly Sabbath of Passover week.

The Pharisees, who believed that Nisan 15 was a Sabbath, taught their followers that waving of the Omer took place on Nisan 16, the day AFTER the first day of Unleavened Bread. The Pharisee view won out because with the destruction of the Temple in 70 CE the Sadducees ceased to exist and the Jewish reckoning prevailed. So, ever since that time the rabbinical method of counting the Omer prevailed until today. The Jews today call the seven annual holy convocations high days and they reckon them as Sabbaths. But their view is based on a false teaching and the Hebrew Scriptures did not reckon those days as Sabbaths.

If the Pharisees taught that it was a Sabbath couldn’t that be what John was writing about?

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Hi Watchman1

The problem I have is I have examined the evidence for the "three days and three nights" Hebraism or Jewish figure of speech and found it to be lacking. But, I have studied this subject extensively and have found no evidence that Nisan 15 is an annual Sabbath. So, the weekly Sabbath was the Sabbath referred to throughout the gospels during the Passion of the Christ.

Thanks for reading.

Here is an interesting fact:

When the Flood was over, the Ark rested on the mountains of Ararat on the 17th day of the 7th month (Nisan). If we relate that to Jesus Christ, when we calculate the crucifixion as Nisan 14, and count three days, we get Nisan 17. This makes the Resurrection of Christ on the exact anniversary of the resting of the Ark on the mountains or Ararat. What this shows is an example of the intricate design of the Bible where everything is put there deliberately. I think this is another proof that the crucifixion was on Nisan 14 and not Nisan 15.

 

[BPPLEE]

Here is an interesting fact:

When the Flood was over, the Ark rested on the mountains of Ararat on the 17th day of the 7th month (Nisan). If we relate that to Jesus Christ, when we calculate the crucifixion as Nisan 14, and count three days, we get Nisan 17. This makes the Resurrection of Christ on the exact anniversary of the resting of the Ark on the mountains or Ararat. What this shows is an example of the intricate design of the Bible where everything is put there deliberately. I think this is another proof that the crucifixion was on Nisan 14 and not Nisan 15.

It was the 14th,

 

[Saber Truth Tiger]

If the Pharisees taught that it was a Sabbath couldn’t that be what John was writing about?

SABER TRUTH TIGER
I find that very improbable. IF John wrote his gospel under the inspiration of God, I don't believe the Holy Spirit would have inspired him to call the wrong day a Sabbath. I find it more probable that God, Jesus, spoke the words to Moses in Leviticus 23:11 and told him the waving of the Omer would be the day after the weekly Sabbath. The correct day was important because originally, when God gave Moses the words to say, He told him that one would count seven Sabbaths toward Shavuot (Pentecost) and the day AFTER the seventh Sabbath would be Pentecost. Why would God inspire John to recognize the wrong day and call it a Sabbath if God knew it wasn't? The correct day was very important if one was to celebrate the feasts properly. If the Scriptures are not inspired of God then I could see that John might call Nisan 15 a Sabbath, following the Pharisees tradition of men. But since I believe John was inspired of God I don't have that luxury.

In any case, there is no evidence that Nisan 15 was ever called a Sabbath in either the Hebrew Scriptures or the Christian Greek Scriptures. Just claiming that Nisan 15 was an annual Sabbath doesn't make it so. If the Friday crucifixion to Sunday morning resurrection is correct, then Jesus rose from the dead on Nisan 16, the day the Omer was to be waved. The year Jesus died he died on the day before the Sabbath and rose from the dead on "the third day". Which was not only Sunday but was also Nisan 16. The year Jesus died the Jewish calendar fell just right, so the waving of the Omer happened according to the Pharisee and Sadducee reckoning on Nisan 16. That way, the day Jesus rose from the dead the almost the entire Jewish nation celebrated the day of the Omer, both Pharisee and Sadducee. There were some smaller sects (like the Essenes) who used their own reckoning but I am mainly concerned of the difference between the Sadducees and the Pharisees.

 

[Saber Truth Tiger]

Here is an interesting fact:

When the Flood was over, the Ark rested on the mountains of Ararat on the 17th day of the 7th month (Nisan). If we relate that to Jesus Christ, when we calculate the crucifixion as Nisan 14, and count three days, we get Nisan 17. This makes the Resurrection of Christ on the exact anniversary of the resting of the Ark on the mountains or Ararat. What this shows is an example of the intricate design of the Bible where everything is put there deliberately. I think this is another proof that the crucifixion was on Nisan 14 and not Nisan 15.

SABER TRUTH TIGER
I don't see that as a proof that Nisan 14 was the day of the Crucifixion. That could be a coincidence. Besides, Nisan was not the seventh month, it was the first month of the Jewish calendar. Tishri was the name of the seventh month. That month is a very sacred month in the Jewish calendar because four of the seven annual holy convocations fell in that month. I do believe that the crucifixion happened on Nisan 14 but I wouldn't use a coincidence as proof of anything. Did you know John F. Kennedy, C.S. Lewis and Alduos Huxley all died on November 22, 1963? Does this prove the intricate design of man's history where everything is put there deliberately? Or, is it more likely just coincidence?

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

It was the 14th,

If you meant Nisan 14 then that is what I said.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

SABER TRUTH TIGER
I don't see that as a proof that Nisan 14 was the day of the Crucifixion. That could be a coincidence. Besides, Nisan was not the seventh month, it was the first month of the Jewish calendar. Tishri was the name of the seventh month. That month is a very sacred month in the Jewish calendar because four of the seven annual holy convocations fell in that month. I do believe that the crucifixion happened on Nisan 14 but I wouldn't use a coincidence as proof of anything. Did you know John F. Kennedy, C.S. Lewis and Alduos Huxley all died on November 22, 1963? Does this prove the intricate design of man's history where everything is put there deliberately? Or, is it more likely just coincidence?

There are no coincidences in the Bible. Everything written n the Bible and the links between the Old and New Testaments are there by design. The teaching of Chuck Missler shows how remarkable the Bible is in its design as a totally integrated message system. He says that Jesus Christ is on every page of the Bible and if we view it that way, the Bible becomes a remarkable book that we can fully understand. You can find Chuck Missler on Youtube. His series on Genesis is very enlightening.

He says that there were two calendars - The Genesis calendar that started from the Fall, and the Exodus calendar that commenced at the date of the Passover. This shows a difference in the dates when evens took place. Missler explains it more clearly. Here is the link:

 

[BPPLEE]

SABER TRUTH TIGER
I don't see that as a proof that Nisan 14 was the day of the Crucifixion. That could be a coincidence. Besides, Nisan was not the seventh month, it was the first month of the Jewish calendar. Tishri was the name of the seventh month. That month is a very sacred month in the Jewish calendar because four of the seven annual holy convocations fell in that month. I do believe that the crucifixion happened on Nisan 14 but I wouldn't use a coincidence as proof of anything. Did you know John F. Kennedy, C.S. Lewis and Alduos Huxley all died on November 22, 1963? Does this prove the intricate design of man's history where everything is put there deliberately? Or, is it more likely just coincidence?

But if you remember the calendar was changed so he is correct

 

[Saber Truth Tiger]

There are no coincidences in the Bible. Everything written n the Bible and the links between the Old and New Testaments are there by design. The teaching of Chuck Missler shows how remarkable the Bible is in its design as a totally integrated message system. He says that Jesus Christ is on every page of the Bible and if we view it that way, the Bible becomes a remarkable book that we can fully understand. You can find Chuck Missler on Youtube. His series on Genesis is very enlightening.

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Hey Watchman, can you prove that there are no coincidences the Bible? Can you show me where everything written in the Bible is by design? In order to do so you would have to beg the question of what you trying to prove. Missler says Jesus is on every page of the Bible? I don't see that at all. I don't follow the teachings of a man so I'll pass on listening to Missler. You though, I will try to reason with you.

Thanks for reading.

 

[Saber Truth Tiger]

But if you remember the calendar was changed so he is correct

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Who is "he"? In that statement "But if you remember the calendar was changed so he is correct. Which calendar change are you talking about?

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Hey Watchman, can you prove that there are no confidences in the Bible? Can you show me where everything written in the Bible is by design? In order to do so you would have to beg the question of what you trying to prove. Missler says Jesus is on every page of the Bible? I don't see that at all. I don't follow the teachings of a man so I'll pass on listening to Missler. You though, I will try to reason with you.

Thanks for reading.

Chuck Missler's PhD was in Information Technology. He applied his knowledge and skills to analyzing the Bible. I would just be repeating he taught. So I would encourage you to view his teaching on Bible codes. Here is the link:

 

[Saber Truth Tiger]

Chuck Missler's PhD was in Information Technology. He applied his knowledge and skills to analyzing the Bible. I would just be repeating he taught. So I would encourage you to view his teaching on Bible codes. Here is the link:

I am not interested in listening to Chuck Missler. In my lifetime I have read many theologians and they often disagree on key issues. I read Missler's belief that Jesus was crucified on the day before the annual Sabbath (Nisan 15)) and I knew then he was wrong on that issue, what other issues is he incorrect in? But I would like to exchange posts with you on this matter.

 

[Der Alte]

Chuck Missler's PhD was in Information Technology. He applied his knowledge and skills to analyzing the Bible. I would just be repeating he taught. So I would encourage you to view his teaching on Bible codes. Here is the link:
[Media omitted]

People have been finding hidden codes in the Bible for a number of years and it seems that they all don't agree. If there are such codes why weren't they recorded by the earliest followers? Why didn't Matthew, Mark, Luke, John Peter, Paul etc. ever say anything about them or even hint about them?

 

[Saber Truth Tiger]

People have been finding hidden codes in the Bible for a number of years and it seems that they all don't agree. If there are such codes why weren't they recorded by the earliest followers? Why didn't Matthew, Mark, Luke, John Peter, Paul etc. ever say anything about them or even hint about them?

SABER TRUTH TIGER
Yes, Der Alte, people have been finding hidden codes in the Bible for many years and those that do make a lot of money in so doing. It is odd that an all-knowing God that wants everyone to be saved would hide so many codes in the Bible for so many years and the select few who "discover" them make tons of money printing books about those codes. You asked a good question. I hope Watchman will provide some evidence such is the case.