Genesis 6:1-4, Sons of God, Giants in the earth, (Nephilim) are not angles who had relations with daughters of men!

[Bible Highlighter]

You also got weird stuff going on with these giants in that they have 6 fingers and six toes in the Bible. Why were all giants wiped out in the Bible? Again, in your view, these are mysteries or enigmas.

We have to back up what we are saying with scripture. Line upon line, precept upon precept.

2 Samuel 21:20
“And there was yet a battle in Gath, where was a man of great stature, that had on every hand six fingers, and on every foot six toes, four and twenty in number; and he also was born to the giant.”

As we can see in this verse above, this particular offspring of the giant who had six fingers and six toes.

Giants were the result of the offspring of the “sons of God” mating with human females. Sons of God are clearly referenced as angels in the book of Job three times. So logic dictates that these fallen angels broke the rule of good angels in not being allowed to be given in marriage and they married human females and created hybrid offspring who were unusually huge (i.e., The Israelites were grasshoppers in their sight in the land of Canaan), and some of the offspring of the giants have six fingers and six toes. Logic would dictate that the offspring of the sons of God (in Genesis 6) is unusual because the intimate union was unusual. If they were just mere humans, then why did they turn out to be giants? Why would one of the offsprings of these giants be described as having six fingers and six toes? It doesn’t add up in your version of the story. Why would God wipe all these Giants out if they are just normal humans? Were there any giants who were good in the Bible? There is no such record to my knowledge.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

This does not mean these angels were able to procreate. You are adding to things you don’t know about and to what the Bible has not told us.

No addition necessary. Genesis 6 says the sons of God had married the daughters of men.
Sons of God is referred to as angels three times in the book of Job.
The verse in Genesis 6 also stresses that these women were human in that they are the daughters of men.
So it is making a contrast between “sons of God” (angels) vs. ”daughters of men” (humans).
I am just reading my Bible and believing it.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

If you think about it, the Bible tells us that Satan will be punishment at the last day of Judgment, Revelation 20:10 KJV.

Second Peter sounds like the same angels in Jude 6.
2 Peter 2:4 KJV, “For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;”

The angels in 2 Peter 2:4 KJV are reserved for punishment, satan and his angels are reserved for punishment. Why are these diffrent angels?

Jude 1:6 KJV
”And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.”

The same idea is expressed in other translations.

Jude 1:6 (BSB)
“And the angels who did not stay within their own domain but abandoned their proper dwelling—these He has kept in eternal chains under darkness, bound for judgment on that great day.”

Jude 1:6 (AMP)
”And angels who did not keep their own designated place of power, but abandoned their proper dwelling place, [these] He has kept in eternal chains under [the thick gloom of utter] darkness for the judgment of the great day,”

I take it you are not a Preterist who believes we are now living in the 1,000 year reign of Christ whereby Satan is bound in the bottomless pit. I imagine you believe people can be possessed by demonic spirits today.

Yet, it is saying these particular group of angels who had sinned are being reserved in darkness in chains until the Judgment happens. We know that this is in reference to the angels that mated with human females because it ties in Sodom and Gomorrah in both Jude 1, and 2 Peter 2. If you were read to read it in context, it is referring to the sin that was unique to Sodom and Gomorrah (Which was unusual or unnatural sex). Again, put together the clues like a detective and it is obvious. But of course you can fight against these facts in Scripture because it is an idea you don’t like.

 

[BNR32FAN]

People say the Nephilims are the giants whose fathers are angle that married women during those days.

This issue has always caused me to wonder how can an angle who is spirit, marry a woman who is flesh and have a baby.

I ask this question especially because Jesus explained in Luke 20:34-36 that those resurrected from the dead neither marry, nor are giving in marriage; that they are equal to the the angles and cannot die anymore.

So Jesus is saying the angels cannot marry nor be givin in marriage, and that they are spirit because they cannot die. So how can a spirit posses a fleshly male seed to produce a baby? Well according to Jesus that can’t happen.

Because there is a flesh and blood creation and there is a spiritual creation - angels, you can’t mix the two. Only a man made of flesh can have relations with a woman made of flesh.

So to understand what Genesis is saying we have to look at God’s creation of man and where the woman fit in.

God created man, not woman. Woman was made from a man that God had already created; from the rib of Adam - Adam was God’s creation, not Eve.

Genesis 6:1 says,….when men (God’s creation) began to multiply…and daughters were born unto them, 2 The sons of God saw the daughter of men…and took them wives…

The sons of God in Genesis 6:1-2 is God’s creation - man

The daughters of men are those women born who are patterned after Eve in creation.

The women could not be called the sons of God. They could only be called the daughters of men because as I pointed out earlier women were not created, they were made from an already existing creation - man. And it is man who holds the title sons of God. Women holds the title, daughters of men.

And although 2 Corinthians 6:18 says,
“And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty,” man’s position is still considered over the woman in title. This is why in 1 Corinthians 11:3 the man is the head of the woman, but Christ is the head of man.

Two angels ate a large feast with Lot in Sodom.

“Now the two angels came to Sodom in the evening as Lot was sitting in the gate of Sodom. When Lot saw them, he rose to meet them and bowed down with his face to the ground. And he said, “Now behold, my Lords, please turn aside into your servant’s house, and spend the night, and wash your feet; then you may rise early and go on your way.” They said however, “No, but we shall spend the night in the square.” Yet he urged them strongly, so they turned aside to him and entered his house; and he prepared a feast for them, and baked unleavened bread, and they ate.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭19‬:‭1‬-‭3‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

 

[GenemZ]

Angels appearing as men and angels becoming men are two different things. I don't see in Scripture where angels ever became men. Even for Jude 1:6; to say they became men would be a stretch!

Its the inner life that make angels different. Angels are spirits. Men are souls.

The bodies may in fact be very similar.

After all, angels who appeared as men ate the food offered by Abraham in Genesis 18!

"So Abraham hurried into the tent to Sarah. “Quick,” he said, “get three seahs of the finest flour and knead it and​

bake some bread.” ​

​

Then he ran to the herd and selected a choice, tender calf and gave it to a servant, who hurried to prepare it. He​

then brought some curds and milk and the calf that had been prepared, and set these before them. While they​

ate, he stood near them under a tree." Gen 18:6-8​

​

Angels when physically manifested, were only created a little higher than man!

​

But there is a place where someone has testified:​

“What is mankind that you are mindful of them,
a son of man that you care for him?
You made them a little lower than the angels;
you crowned them with glory and honor.." Heb 2:6-7​

​

grace and peace ................

 

[GenemZ]

People say the Nephilims are the giants whose fathers are angel that married women during those days.

They did not marry the women!

That is not what the Hebrew tells us.
There were no marriages involved! That wording was done by prudish translators.

​

​

Now it came to pass, when mankind had begun to become numerous on the face of the earth, ​

and daughters/'beautiful women' had been born unto them that the sons of God kept watching ​

the daughters of mankind that they were very beautiful . . .and they took/'seized passionately' ​

to them women of all whom they examined and selected. Gen 1:1-2​

Those women were seduced by the beauty and physical strength of the angels, like we see happen with
some women become like jelly around exceedingly handsome movie stars.

grace and peace ...........

 

[Bible Highlighter]

These were not angels. Look at Genesis 6:4KJV, the verse is telling us these giants were “men” - “when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”

The verse does not say the giants are angles, but men. Giant men, mighty men, men of renown, meaning status and position, and possibly wealth is the reasonable interpretation.

Giant = mighty, men of renown.

Genesis 6:4 says,

”There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that,​

when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them,​

the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.”​

~ (Genesis 6:4).​

So we see giants before the flood, and AFTER the flood.

After the flood: Goliath was a giant.

1 Samuel 17:4 KJV​

”And there went out a champion out of the camp of the Philistines, named Goliath, of Gath, whose height was six cubits and a span.”​

​

A cubit is 1.5 feet long.​

This would match up with the NLT that says he was over 9 feet tall.​

​

1 Samuel 17:4 NLT​

”Then Goliath, a Philistine champion from Gath, came out of the Philistine ranks to face the forces of Israel. He was over nine feet tall!”​

After the flood: The Israelites encountered giants when they spied out the land of Canaan.

Numbers 13:33​

“And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.”​

​

These giants made the Israelites feel like they were the size of grasshoppers by comparison.
This really does not add up with your version of the story, sister.
But if these men were the offspring of angel / human relations then it explains why they were so big.
It explains why one giant had six fingers and six toes.

While these things may be shocking in Scripture, it should be all the more reason for us to cling to Christ and His good ways.
Hope that what I said here may begin to make sense to you.
May God‘s peace always be with you.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Chains of everlasting darkness. Everlasting - the wicked will be punished in everlasting torment in outer darkness. This is the lot for the fallen angels. It has been determined already they will never return to heaven, and will be eventually thrown in the lake of fire.

There are three heavens. Could satan and his angels be in the second heaven? Is there light in the second heaven? They are not in the third heaven with God. So could they be bound in the second heaven until they are finally judged. This sounds more plausible.

Where is everlasting darkness that the wicked will be thrown into? Matthew 22:13 KJV, Matthew 25:30 KJV.

Wherever outer darkness is, the wicked will be bound, they will not be able to remove themselves from that place.
So are there actual chains, or is it a position of condemnation they cannot remove themselves from?

Synonym for chains: Restricted, bound, imprisoned.

Do you think there are angels that are servants of God that keep the way of these chains?

As shocking as this sounds, words like “everlasting, forever,…” etcetera do not always mean for all eternity in the Bible. Check out my post here in another thread explaining this fact. While I believe the KJB is the most accurate translation today, I do also believe it was written in archaic 1600’s English and it has influenced many Modern Translations involving these particular words. It is not that the KJB is not correct by using these words by any means. They are merely idioms or allegorical words painting a particular picture for us, and they are not to be read with our Modern understanding on these words. Yes, everlasting and forever can mean for all eternity, but the context determines this.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

@biblelesson

My apologies to you and others here about saying that the angels who mated with human females had became human in order to mate with them. It was a belief I latched onto temporarily yesterday only from listening to a video discussion on this topic. But I now have abandoned the idea that the sons of God (angels) had became human. I was thinking about it this morning and that idea undermines the uniqueness of the Incarnation of Jesus Christ. I now currently reverted back to my default belief (Which was my old position) that the sons of God remained as angels when they mated with human females. How did these angels do this? The same way angels ate regular food in Genesis 18, and Genesis 19. If they can eat food, they could surely do more, and that is exactly what we see described to us in Genesis 6.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

@biblelesson

Genesis 3:15
“And I will put enmity between thee and the woman,
and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head,
and thou shalt bruise his heel.”

I now see the word “seed” here as referring exclusively to “offspring.”

Jesus is the seed (offspring) of the woman (because Jesus was born only of a woman who was a virgin).
This would also eventually include all the saints who will have a resurrected body in the likeness of Christ’s body.
Satan’s seed (offspring) are those who follow him (Demons and wicked humans).
The physical reality of Satan’s seed was the giants or the Nephilim in the Old Testament.
The physical reality of Satan’s seed in the New Covenant will be the antichrist and the false prophet.

Jesus lives in the hearts of all the saints so that they can have eternal life (1 John 5:12).
Even Noah had Christ living inside of him so that he could have life.

So the seed of the woman (Jesus) was living in Noah while the seed of the devil (Nephilim or Giants) were living during his time in opposition (hostility) towards him and God’s purposes. Yet, Jesus was not incarnate yet (i.e., He did not take on physical flesh and blood yet) at the time of Noah. Yet, Jesus living in Noah (the seed of the woman) was at hostility towards these Nephilim (Who had physical flesh and blood bodies as a result of an unholy union between fallen angels and human females).

At the cross: Jesus was Incarnate and He had physical flesh and blood. Jesus was physically human at this point. Jesus was at hostility with the forces of the devil who were spiritual at that time and the devil bruised his heal (the nail in his feet), and yet Jesus bruised the head of the serpent (the devil) by His conquering the powers of the devil with what He accomplished on the cross.

So the OT and NT are painting the opposite side of things.

In the OT: You had Christ (the seed of the woman) living in Noah (spiritually) at hostility against the physical Nephilim (the seed of the devil).
In the NT: You have Christ (the seed of the woman) physical by the Incarnation against the spiritual unseen forces of the devil (the seed of the devil).

I hope this helps, and may God bless you.

Side Note:

The uniqueness of the Incarnation of Jesus Christ is that He was the Lord from Heaven (i.e., He was the eternal Word made flesh). The Word who is the second person of the eternal Trinity became a man. He is the God man. Jesus still has His physical body and yet He will always eternally be God. He will always be the God man. Jesus is eternal. Whereas, the angels mating with human females are created, and they produced offspring that was temporal only. They will perish in the Lake of Fire. They had a beginning and they will have an end. Jesus had no beginning and He will have no end. Also, the sons of God could not put on flesh themselves. They could only create offspring that were hybrid. Whereas with Jesus, He was the Word made flesh.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Angels are spirits. Men are souls.

Yet, God is described as having a soul in the Bible.

• Leviticus 26:11 And I will set my tabernacle among you: and my soul shall not abhor you.
• Leviticus 26:30 And I will destroy your high places, and cut down your images, and cast your carcases upon the carcases of your idols, and my soul shall abhor you.
• Isaiah 42:1 Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.
• Zechariah 11:8 Three shepherds also I cut off in one month; and my soul lothed them, and their soul also abhorred me.
• Matthew 12:18 Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.
• Hebrews 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

They did not marry the women!

That is not what the Hebrew tells us.
There were no marriages involved! That wording was done by prudish translators.

​

​

Now it came to pass, when mankind had begun to become numerous on the face of the earth, ​

and daughters/'beautiful women' had been born unto them that the sons of God kept watching ​

the daughters of mankind that they were very beautiful . . .and they took/'seized passionately' ​

to them women of all whom they examined and selected. Gen 1:1-2​

Those women were seduced by the beauty and physical strength of the angels, like we see happen with
some women become like jelly around exceedingly handsome movie stars.

grace and peace ...........

I believe they did marry these women because it would be defying the order of good angels that they are not allowed to marry.
Not only that but I do trust that the KJB is the most accurate translation today. Granted, I cannot go into further details about that particular point, though.

Side Note:

Anyways, I also believe there is a good possibility that these angels who mated with human females were originally good angels (from Heaven) before they sinned by marrying these women. I believe Satan set these good angels up somehow to be tempted by the beauty of these women and to marry them. Angels are not supposed to marry and the good angels know this. So for them to break this command and leave Heaven (leave their first estate or domain) by doing so really was exceptionally wrong. It shows also that good angels can later fall prey to sin even after the rebellion of Satan. When I read Jude 1:6, and 2 Peter 2:4, it sounds like a sin that is fresh and new that the angels did for the first time (Being suggestive that these were new good angels that rebelled after the previous rebellion where Satan convinced 2/3 (two thirds) of the angels to go up against God in taking over his throne (to be like the Most High)).

 

[GenemZ]

Yet, God is described as having a soul in the Bible.

• Leviticus 26:11 And I will set my tabernacle among you: and my soul shall not abhor you.
• Leviticus 26:30 And I will destroy your high places, and cut down your images, and cast your carcases upon the carcases of your idols, and my soul shall abhor you.
• Isaiah 42:1 Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.
• Zechariah 11:8 Three shepherds also I cut off in one month; and my soul lothed them, and their soul also abhorred me.
• Matthew 12:18 Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles.
• Hebrews 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

Yes.... The soul of the man Jesus is that same soul of the "Lord God of Israel."

In heaven his soul preexisting the Incarnation. For the Incarnation the Soul of the Lord God of Israel agreed to deny himself of all the advantages he had known while having full access to being also God. He was having two natures (in union) before the Incarnation.

That is what Philippians 2:6-8 is all about!

Who, eternally existing in the form of God, (Soul and Deity in union)
did not consider equality with God as something ​

to be used [or grasped; seized; held on to] for His own advantage.
Instead He emptied Himself (disallowed himself to his right to the full powers to function as God)
by assuming the form of a slave,
taking on the likeness of men.
And when He had come as a man in His external form,
He humbled Himself by becoming obedient
to the point of death—
even to death on a cross." ​

That is why Jesus speaking from his soul was able to say......

Jesus said to them, “I assure you: Before Abraham was born, I am.” John 8:58​

Such passages are meant to confound.

Confound until God opens the door to shine light upon its meaning!




grace and peace ...................

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yes.... The soul of the man Jesus is that same soul of the "Lord God of Israel."

In heaven his soul preexisting the Incarnation. For the Incarnation the Soul of the Lord God of Israel agreed to deny himself of all the advantages he had known while having full access to being also God. He was having two natures (in union) before the Incarnation.

That is what Philippians 2:6-8 is all about!

Who, eternally existing in the form of God, (Soul and Deity in union)​

did not consider equality with God as something ​

to be used [or grasped; seized; held on to] for His own advantage.​

Instead He emptied Himself (disallowed himself to his right to the full powers to function as God)​

by assuming the form of a slave,​

taking on the likeness of men.​

And when He had come as a man in His external form,​

He humbled Himself by becoming obedient​

to the point of death—​

even to death on a cross." ​

That is why Jesus speaking from his soul was able to say......

Jesus said to them, “I assure you: Before Abraham was born, I am.” John 8:58​

Such passages are meant to confound.

Confound until God opens the door to shine light upon its meaning!




grace and peace ...................

First, I am not confounded. To me it is clear. Gotquestions believes the same way about God having a soul in that they think it is always in reference to Jesus Christ. I believe this is false. The OT verses I provided refer to God having a soul before the Incarnation, and they were not all speaking prophetically of the Messiah. So I disagree.

Second, Jesus was declaring He was the “I AM” from Exodus 3 in John chapter 8. The Jews went ape crazy when He said that and wanted to stone Him for it. So we appear to agree on this point.

Three, I believe Philippians 2 is not in conflict with Jesus having His own power during His earthly ministry.

For the Bible clearly teaches…

Jesus had power as God during His earthly ministry:

1. Jesus said He has power to raise the dead to life just as the Father had power to raise the dead (John 5:21).​

2. Hebrews 1:3 talks about how Christ held all things together by the word of His power when He purged us of our sins.​

3. Jesus said, He would raise up this Temple (His body) three days later (John 2:19).​

4. Jesus had the power to forgive sins and give eternal life (Mark 2:7) (Luke 7:44-50) (John 14:6).​

5 Jesus had power to take away the sins of the entire world (John 1:29).​

6. Jesus Christ said wherever two or three are gathered in my name, there I am among them (Matthew 18:20). This was said to the people he was around and not to just us today.​

As for the Father and Spirit doing miracles through Jesus:

We know the Father did works (miracles) through Jesus (John 14:8-12). We know Jesus cast out devils and healed others by the working of the Spirit (Matthew 12:22-32). But this is not in conflict with Jesus having His own power as God as I have demonstrated by the verses above.

I believe Jesus only suppressed His divine attribute of "having all knowledge" or His "Omniscience" (Which took place sometime before the world came into being). This is what I believe the "glory" that Jesus spoke of that He wished to share in again with the Father before the world existed in John 17:5. For Habakkuk 2:14 says, "For the earth shall be filled with the knowledge of the glory of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea." Also see 2 Corinthians 4:6.

The NLT is heretically wrong for saying that Jesus gave up His divine privileges In Philippians 2:7.
I believe the KJB that says, “But made himself of no reputation” is the true accurate rendering here.

 

[GenemZ]

First, Gotquestions believes the same way about God having a soul, and I believe this is false. The verses I provided refer to God having a soul before the Incarnation, and they were not all speaking prophetically of the Messiah. So I disagree.

Good for you!

 

[GenemZ]

Genesis 6 is the second fall but as you think there is nothing unusual happening here, you miss it. Why one would think that the seed of "men" should suddenly start producing "heroes" simply because they recognised women were beautiful, is beyond me. God told Adam and Eve to go forth and multiply so nothing unusual about men and women marrying. On the other hand, angels and women marrying? That's bound to produce something quite unusual and worthy of being thrown in chains. (Jude v.6)

Spiritual common sense vs human sense.


Wonder of wonders.




..................

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Good for you!

Well, that’s not really any kind of rebuttal with Scripture.
One needs to prove that all verses that refer to God’s soul in the Old Testament is a Messianic reference.
Sarcastic comments does not really prove anything.

 

[GenemZ]

Well, that’s not really any kind of rebuttal with Scripture.
One needs to prove that all verses that refer to God’s soul in the Old Testament is a Messianic reference.
Sarcastic comments does not really prove anything.

When Scripture continuously falls flat in the eyes it is presented to?

To then seek beyond what would should already have more than sufficed?

Well?

Paul got sarcastic at times. So did some prophets.

And, they were filled with the Spirit when they did.

Some come here to try to wear others out just to prove to themselves how clever they are. Would you agree?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

When Scripture falls flat in the eyes it is presented to?

To seek beyond what would should already have more than sufficed?

Well?

Paul got sarcastic at times. So did some prophets.

And, they were filled with the Spirit when they did.

First, while the apostle Paul was sarcastic at times, he was not doing so without providing any truth from Scripture involving a point of discussion with others. Paul also stressed the importance of how we are to love in everything we do (1 Corinthians 13), and let our speech always be with grace, seasoned with salt (Colossians 4:6).
Does Jesus and the apostles in the New Testament encourage us be sarcastic alone?
If so, please give us the chapter and verse.
Where does Jesus and the apostles encourage us to be sarcastic alone towards the brethren?
Are we not supposed to be building each other up in love?

Second, again, you are providing no proof biblically to support your position here.
Am I just supposed to take your word for it?

Anyways, we can agree to disagree in love of course.
But I was hoping for a biblical response.
In any event, may the Lord Jesus Christ and His good ways shine upon you greatly this fine day.

 

[GenemZ]

First, while the apostle Paul was sarcastic at times, he was not doing so without providing any truth from Scripture involving a point of discussion with others and without demonstrating love.
While the apostle Paul was sarcastic at times, we are not apostles.
Does Jesus and the apostles in the New Testament encourage us be sarcastic?
If so, please give us the chapter and verse.
Where does Jesus and the apostles encourage us to be sarcastic towards the brethren?
Are we not supposed to be building each other up in love?

Second, again, you are providing no proof biblically to support your position here.
Am I just supposed to take your word for it?

Sorry to have to say it...

I need to put you on Ignore.

................