How many Gentiles and Samaritans could have been saved if Jesus would have sent some disciples there?

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Yes, I agree. This means that there were some who would be excluded.

Who was excluded?

 

[Hammster]

By doing it the way He did more Gentiles would be saved sooner. If the twelve wasted time going to the Gentiles there would be less time spent converting the Jews. The Jews were prepared for the Messiah, had the OT, strict moral tradition, and lots of knowledge about God, so you really only had to convince they that Jesus was the Messiah and you had a convert. The gentiles at that time would need lots of education. The Samaritans could be easy converts, but going to the Samaritans first would be a huge stumbling block for the Jews to even listen to the apostles teaching. The kingdom needed the prepared Jews first to have the quick strong converts who could than go after the Gentiles and Samaritans.

So like others, you see this as a numbers game.

 

[Hammster]

Who was excluded?

The Gentiles who died while waiting for the gospel to go to the Jews first.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

This is a question that begs more questions. What about all the gentiles who died while Jesus was working as a carpenter? What about all the gentiles who didn't live in Palestine? Like the ones throughout Africa, Asia and Europe? What about all the gentiles who died between the Mosaic Covenant and the arrival of Christ?

Sheol. What about all the Jews that lived in other areas? There is a clear dividing line before and after the resurrection for all...

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

The Gentiles who died while waiting for the gospel to go to the Jews first.

What about it? Everyone gets a chance. Before the resurrection they went to Sheol to wait...after the resurrection it is a different story, Sheol was emptied!

 

[Hammster]

What about it? Everyone gets a chance. before the resurrection they went to Sheol to wait...after the resurrection it is a different story, Sheol was emptied!

And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment,
— Hebrews 9:27

 

[bling]

So like others, you see this as a numbers game.

I see it as the very best way to do it, can you think of a better way?

 

[Hammster]

I see it as the very best way to do it, can you think of a better way?

Biblically. God saves His people.

 

[Clare73]

These twelve Jesus sent out after instructing them: “Do not go in the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter any city of the Samaritans; but rather go to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
— Matthew 10:5-6

So here we have Jesus deliberately telling His disciples to not go to the Gentiles nor the Samaritans. How many Gentiles and Samaritans could have been saved if Jesus would have sent some disciples there?

None. . .because the Holy Spirit was not at work there.

 

[d taylor]

Which is what?

That you build your beliefs around your theology, instead of The Bible.
This thread shows that, you believe God has elected certain people for eternal life.

So you pick a verse out, that when used like you used Matthew 10:5,6 and use only the part that you believe supports your beliefs.

But when the verse is used along with the rest of the accompanying verses.
It is plain to see 5,6 is not saying what you are trying to make it say to support your theology.
That Jesus again when addressing the disciples and sending them out it for a very specific purpose and that is not to tell people how to have eternal life salvation. But to tell Israel that the kingdom of God is here and being offered to the nation of Israel
And as you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is at hand.’

So why would the disciples need to go to gentiles about the kingdom of God being offered to the nation of Israel.

 

[Hammster]

That you build your beliefs around your theology, instead of The Bible.

Since that isn’t true, there’s no need to read further.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment,
— Hebrews 9:27

Yes everyone dies once. When is the judgement?? Where are people between death and the judgement? All are the same...death and then how long? a person died 1000 yrs ago and someone died last week. It is the same...there is no time in death...all are resurrected...

 

[Hammster]

Yes everyone dies once. When is the judgement?? Where are people between death and the judgement? All are the same...death and then how long? a person died 1000 yrs ago and someone died last week. It is the same...there is no time in death...all are resurrected...

It’s death, then judgment. It’s not death, some second, third or fourth chance, then judgment.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

I know that eventually He sent them to the Gentiles. But I’ve been repeatedly told that Jesus loves everyone the same and wants everyone saved. This shows that to not be true.

If Jesus sent them to the Gentiles first and not the Jews then you could argue He loves Gentiles more, but I think it shows priority more than Him not loving everyone the same.

 

[Hammster]

If Jesus sent them to the Gentiles first and not the Jews then you could argue He loves Gentiles more, but I think it shows priority more than Him not loving everyone the same.

Generally when prioritizing, you give the most important things priority.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

Generally when prioritizing, you give the most important things priority.

Would it be wrong to attend to God's chosen people first? Ultimately someone has to come first, the first one proselytized could have been Gentile or Jew, but that doesn't mean that the second is loved less. And unless we're trying to make Jesus to be someone who loves certain people less i see no point in making a bigger deal about who was proselytized first than it needs to be. It feels accusatory and
"But who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? “Shall what is formed say to the one who formed it, ‘Why did you make me like this?’ ”
Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for special purposes and some for common use?" Romans 9:20-21

 

[John Mullally]

Preaching to get people saved on a large-scale started on the day of Pentecost in Acts 2 where Peter promised salvation (remission of sins & receipt of the Holy Spirit) to those who would repent and be baptized in response to His preaching. That day started as a believers meeting with just 120 (in the Upper room) and added 3000 new believers.

This means that Jesus is more interested in numbers than actual people.

What is your response supposed to mean?

 

[Hammster]

Would it be wrong to attend to God's chosen people first? Ultimately someone has to come first, the first one proselytized could have been Gentile or Jew, but that doesn't mean that the second is loved less. And unless we're trying to make Jesus to be someone who loves certain people less i see no point in making a bigger deal about who was proselytized first than it needs to be. It feels accusatory and
"But who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? “Shall what is formed say to the one who formed it, ‘Why did you make me like this?’ ”
Does not the potter have the right to make out of the same lump of clay some pottery for special purposes and some for common use?" Romans 9:20-21

God can do things as He pleases, which is my point. The reason for the thread is because a lot of folks tell me that God loves everyone and wants all men saved, yet we see in scripture where Jesus doesn’t act that way. This is just one example. I can provide more.

 

[Hammster]

What is your response supposed to mean?

If what you said was true, then it’s not individuals that God is concerned with. He’s just using strategy to get the most people saved.

 

[John Mullally]

If what you said was true, then it’s not individuals that God is concerned with. He’s just using strategy to get the most people saved.

People are individuals - so I don't understand your distinction. Beyond that it is not "If what you said was true" - it is what scripture plainly states.

1 Timothy 2:3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. (NIV)​

That you build your beliefs around your theology, instead of The Bible.
This thread shows that, you believe God has elected certain people for eternal life.

I agree with d taylor.