Teen's Interaction With Transgender Woman in YMCA Locker Room Sparks Heated Debate

[ThatRobGuy]

Blair White shouldn't be undressing in front of either sex.

So for one specific group of people, they're not allowed to change or shower at the gym?

That doesn't seem like a legal expectation that's likely to succeed.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

So for one specific group of people, they're not allowed to change or shower at the gym?

That doesn't seem like a legal expectation that's likely to succeed.

I have no problem with that as long as I am in the group that has the rights.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Most likely because she was identified as a tansgendered person and that made her a target for the girls attacks.

Or, it's what I mentioned...which is that (despite some people pretending that this aspect doesn't exist), not every trans person is equally "passable" as the gender they seek to identify with.

The person in this news story:

Janet Mock:

There's a difference there with regards to how well they pass for the gender they identify with.


And rather than addressing that aspect, or even acknowledging that aspect exists and creates some challenges, people want to play naive and just go with the approach of a blanket "you wouldn't have known if nobody told you".

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Who do you suppose is qualified to police gender segregated areas based upon peoples perceptions and discomfort?

This is a story about someone causing a scene and lying because of their personal ideological discomfort with a transgender woman.

Yes it makes them a bigot, because what makes us what we are is our actions. Hopefully she will learn.

Nobody...which is why I'm not suggesting that we police this, tend to error on the side of more freedom unless there's a particularly compelling reason not to.

I've simply stated in this thread that I understand the murky waters and dynamics on both sides of the argument, and have pointed out that there's some disingenuousness in both camps.

 

[SilverBear]

Or, it's what I mentioned...which is that (despite some people pretending that this aspect doesn't exist), not every trans person is equally "passable" as the gender they seek to identify with.

The person in this news story:
View attachment 327263
View attachment 327266


Janet Mock:
View attachment 327265

There's a difference there with regards to how well they pass for the gender they identify with.


And rather than addressing that aspect, or even acknowledging that aspect exists and creates some challenges, people want to play naive and just go with the approach of a blanket "you wouldn't have known if nobody told you".

Here is an actual picture of her

 

[variant]

Nobody...which is why I'm not suggesting that we police this, tend to error on the side of more freedom unless there's a particularly compelling reason not to.

I've simply stated in this thread that I understand the murky waters and dynamics on both sides of the argument, and have pointed out that there's some disingenuousness in both camps.

If someone comes to me with a problem and can't suggest an equitable solution to it...

In this case the girl is wrong and probably mean spirited, and so are the people who wanted to use the incident to harass the transgender person and those like her for political purposes.

 

[variant]

Or, it's what I mentioned...which is that (despite some people pretending that this aspect doesn't exist), not every trans person is equally "passable" as the gender they seek to identify with.

The person in this news story:

And rather than addressing that aspect, or even acknowledging that aspect exists and creates some challenges, people want to play naive and just go with the approach of a blanket "you wouldn't have known if nobody told you".

One of the reasons we're not talking about it is because to do so would be similar to suggesting we have different rules in society for ugly people.

 

[rjs330]

So for one specific group of people, they're not allowed to change or shower at the gym?

That doesn't seem like a legal expectation that's likely to succeed.

Look it it means exposing your breasts to boys or exposing your penis to girls then yes. She shouldn't be doing either. She CHOOSE to do this. She is trans and CHOOSE to alter her body to have breasts and a penis. It shouldn't come as a surprise to not be allowed to expose her breasts to boys or her penis to girls. There are consequences to your actions. And that should be one of them.

This is the problem. A man shouldn't be allowed to be in a woman's locker room and expose himself to them. Then suddenly he get boobs and now he can? What kind of insanity is that?

 

[rjs330]

These aren't the sorts of things that are well kept secrets.

Why not? I certainly don't know all the transgendered persons in my community. Has she announced.to her entire community that she is trans? How did the girl know.

If some trans man came into my locker room and had all the surgeries would I automatically know hea trans cause I saw his behind?

 

[variant]

Why not? I certainly don't know all the transgendered persons in my community. Has she announced.to her entire community that she is trans? How did the girl know.

If some trans man came into my locker room and had all the surgeries would I automatically know hea trans cause I saw his behind?

True, they could be in certain cases. In this case it would have been obvious, and usually people talk was my point.

 

[rjs330]

Most likely because she was identified as a tansgendered person and that made her a target for the girls attacks.

Identified how? Did she walk into the locker room and start telling everyone she trans? Did she put an add in the paper? I don't know all the trans people.in my community and certainly wouldn't know they are just by seeing their behind.

 

[Neogaia777]

It is like I said earlier, etc, and no one should ever be trying to police this, etc, or it borders on harassment that those people doing the harassment can then get in trouble for, etc, and there should always be a third room or option everywhere, etc, but whatever parts person still has currently should be the room they use, if they don't want to use the third room, etc, and if a person looks like a man, but is using the women's room, etc, then the assumption should automatically be that they just must still have those parts, but no one is to personally look into it ever in any kind of way personally, etc, and if you have to explain this to your kids, then you have to explain this to your kids, and it is just something you are going to have to deal with, etc, and in the case of one that has boobs, but is still using the men's room, etc, then the assumption is that they must still currently right now still, still have the downstairs parts still, etc, and that should be the end of it, etc, and again, if you have to explain this one to your boys, then you have to explain this one to your boys, because that is just the way it is, and you are just going to have to deal with it, etc, and no one should ever be policing or harassing anybody about any of it/this ever at all ever, etc, and the third room can be for all of those who maybe don't care about any of this "crud", etc, or identify as a mouse if they want to, etc, or otherwise just don't care, or would just prefer just to use the third room "just because", etc, and it can be labeled maybe both genders/non-gender/binary or non-binary, or just "don't really care or give a flip", etc, or "whatever", etc, and no one should ever be questioning or harassing anybody about any of it ever at all ever, etc, and then maybe as a society we can all learn to just "deal" on all of these issues for right now maybe, etc, but, if someone goes into the women's room having a man's downstairs parts, or vice-versa, etc, and they undress or get naked in front of other people that are using that room, and another person in there sees them, etc, and it is not because someone is purposely checking, etc, then it is breaking the law, and there should then be some consequences for it/that that the courts should then decide for it, etc, indecent exposure or something, etc, and it maybe should be a little bit heavier consequences if it's a child, or children are involved, etc...

Anyway,

God Bless!

 

[Aryeh Jay]

My God I am blessed to be so lucky to be so sheltered. I have never had another persons private parts intentionally exposed to me or have never had the urge to watch other people change in order to catch a glimpse.

 

[variant]

My God I am blessed to be so lucky to be so sheltered. I have never had another persons private parts intentionally exposed to me or have never had the urge to watch other people change in order to catch a glimpse.

You've never been in a changing room where people felt free to be naked?

That is a bit sheltered IMO.

I spent years going to a hotel gym where older men often felt somewhat offputtingly free to do so. I'm not really sure why people are acting like this sort of thing is so traumatic. It's a naked person, get over yourselves.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

You've never been in a changing room where people felt free to be naked?

That is a bit sheltered IMO.

I have been in changing rooms for the explicit purpose to change into or out of work out gear. I have never felt the need to get naked and walk around socializing with others and check out the competition.

 

[comana]

You've never been in a changing room where people felt free to be naked?

That is a bit sheltered IMO.

I spent years going to a hotel gym where older men often felt somewhat offputtingly free to do so. I'm not really sure why people are acting like this sort of thing is so traumatic. It's a naked person, get over yourselves.

I think, in general, people are uncomfortable changing or being naked in the presence of strangers. The ones walking around naked in the changing rooms are viewed as the oddballs.

 

[variant]

I think, in general, people are uncomfortable changing or being naked in the presence of strangers. The ones walking around naked in the changing rooms are viewed as the oddballs.

Yeah, I get that. "viewed as oddballs" is a bit more of a tepid response than trying to make a national news story out of it.

 

[rjs330]

I think, in general, people are uncomfortable changing or being naked in the presence of strangers. The ones walking around naked in the changing rooms are viewed as the oddballs.

That totally depends on where you are. For example in most school and public locker rooms where there are showers or in pool changing rooms there you will encounter naked people. No they aren't walking around the room naked. They usually have a towel. As they walk from the shower to the locker. But then they get naked to change out of clothes or into clothes. In most highschools and colleges the showers are open showers where you shower together. So there are lots opportunities to see others naked. It's something to get used to. It's really no big deal if you are the same sex. But if you are not and you have the parts of the opposite sex it's NOT acceptable.

 

[rjs330]

I have been in changing rooms for the explicit purpose to change into or out of work out gear. I have never felt the need to get naked and walk around socializing with others and check out the competition.

Yeah this is really unusual. I've been in a lot of men's lockerooms whether at school or during sporting events or at a pool. And there are always naked people there, changing into swimwear or out of swimwear, taking showers etc. So, yes you have been very sheltered.

 

[iluvatar5150]

I spent years going to a hotel gym where older men often felt somewhat offputtingly free to do so. I'm not really sure why people are acting like this sort of thing is so traumatic. It's a naked person, get over yourselves.

There was about a year where I went to a gym whose primary business was being the regional squash club. They also had saunas and large hot tubs in every locker room. Squash, if you're unfamiliar, is like racquetball, and mostly played by old rich white guys. I'm pretty sure I saw more old rich white guy genitalia in that year than I saw of my own.