So...Biden Also Took Private Documents

[Pommer]

I hadn't heard that multiple agents came forward. Do you have a source for that?

Off the top of my head I think it was “Rudy knew a guy” and Rudy working the media that was the primary source for NYFBI “leaks”; I recall the “multiple agents” saying “yeah, that happened” but only the one main source.
Point.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Trump’s entire spiel could be condensed down to one sentence: “The wrong people are making the decisions where government money should go! That’s why we want to be the ‘deciders’!”

I'd agree with that but honestly...I think a cogent political view wasn't gonna come from Trump.

That’s not sarcasm or ridicule: that’s actually a cogent political philosophy, “I want the best for my tribe” and there’s nothing wrong with that at all unless one’s “tribe” is smaller than the Nation as-a-whole.

Who is his tribe?

Once it’s “our side and your side are going to ‘duke-it-out’!”, we will have already lost.

Who will pick up the bigger pieces? Xi or Putin?

Well...try not to get too down. There's a few ways it can play out.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I am not sure who the "they" is as in they didn't want him because he might talk about corruption. I am going to summarize here, but "people' didn't want him president because of the exact reasons Trump enacted to prove why he shouldn't be president.

Well...I thought it was obvious I was speaking about politicians who succeeded through the traditional methods. Not people who ran for President and just won out of the blue.

It's a problem. You can see it happen different ways to any outsider. Consider AOC and uhhhh...Greene. Both spoke directly to their bases, both understand basically nothing, both aspire to fix the system.

Now....they may not sound exactly the same. They sort of mirror each other though. The only real difference is that I would say AOC had some usefulness on social media and brought some positive attention to the party....Greene doesn't. AOC has essentially been deradicalized and folded into the establishment....Greene is kept on the outside of party business.

Both more or less ran on an element of a problem in their party. Greene doesn't like the Republicans....AOC didn't like the Democrats. I don't think Greene will last, and AOC won't change anything.


Each party deals with outsiders differently....but I don't know if they understand why or even want to keep them from continuing to pop up.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Off the top of my head I think it was “Rudy knew a guy” and Rudy working the media that was the primary source for NYFBI “leaks”; I recall the “multiple agents” saying “yeah, that happened” but only the one main source.
Point.

If you want to make Hillary look bad....just read the explanation of her nomination. Sanders didn't have a chance....she could have told him.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

This should happen with the opening of every Congress, elect the Speaker, set the “rules”, (which is what the Laws that govern how the Houses of Congress run, are), and impeach the President (even if the majority’s guy is in the While House!)
C-Span will carry it like a history professor’s 4am interview.

This era of “politics as entertainment”, has about run its course.
Enjoy the finale!

It is the new standard.

 

[Valletta]

I do not know how to connect anything written here to what I actually said. But I will tell you this again. It may be better if you actually sought validity to your statements before just making them. As exampled by your claim Trump declassified the documents. He did not. The DOJ and the special master flushed that false claim out, and nor was it an argument any of Trump's lawyers argued in court. You know why? Ask Rudy and that gang of Trump clown car lawyers who have been sanctioned and lost their license to practice for making false claims in court.

False. President Trump had full authority to declassify documents, neither the DOJ nor special master has been able to prove he did not. They can try and prove their claim in court if they wish. Why do you think they have not brought charges against Trump? Where is there proof? Joe's attorneys have admitted he possessed classified documents, classified documents which he had no right nor authority to have in his unsecured private office. The Biden Penn center was funded by the Chinese, over 52 million dollars of which Joe took in at least $900,000 a year. Over twenty million was from ANONYMOUS Chinese sources. Garland was aware of the facts of Joe's illegal activities before the mid-term elections, but suppressed that information from the American people. The House of Representatives is investigating, but we need a grand jury to investigate the money trail to the Bidens from the Chinese and to decide what charges to bring against Joe.

 

[FreeinChrist]

False. President Trump had full authority to declassify documents, neither the DOJ nor special master has been able to prove he did not. They can try and prove their claim in court if they wish. Why do you think they have not brought charges against Trump? Where is there proof? Joe's attorneys have admitted he possessed classified documents, classified documents which he had no right nor authority to have in his unsecured private office. The Biden Penn center was funded by the Chinese, over 52 million dollars of which Joe took in at least $900,000 a year. Over twenty million was from ANONYMOUS Chinese sources. Garland was aware of the facts of Joe's illegal activities before the mid-term elections, but suppressed that information from the American people. The House of Representatives is investigating, but we need a grand jury to investigate the money trail to the Bidens from the Chinese and to decide what charges to bring against Joe.

What an amazing diatribe promoting all the unsubstantiated claims by Trump.

First, it is the Penn Biden Center not the The Biden Penn center.

Second, Trump claimed on Truth Social that the center was funded by the Chinese but any proof provided? Nope. The Center is funded by the University. Wild funding claims need to be supported by credible sources. Trump just spews what he wants.

Third, ex Presidents cannot declassify anything. Presidents can but there is a process for it. It can't be done in his mind. There is NO documentation that he declassified anything that he had. AND Trump did not own those documents. The National Archives tried for a year to get Trump to return the documents and finally had to involve the DOJ and the FBI to get them. Trump never understood his role and responsibilities and limits. A letter written by the leader of a nation (North Korea or example) sent to the President belongs to the country and not Trump personally. Trump had many boxes of documents that the National Archives wanted back.

In contrast to Trump and those documents, the handful of documents found in Biden's office at the Penn Biden Center were in a locked closet with other papers. Biden's personal attorney found them when packing up the office in order to vacate it. He call the National Archive the day he found them and they were returned to the National Archive the next day. There has been full cooperation from Biden.

 

[essentialsaltes]

The raid resulted from Trump's penchant to chose to do the wrong thing without hesitation.

Just to flesh this out a little. The raid didn't result from Trump's character flaws. It resulted from a search warrant, obtained because the DOJ provided a Judge with solid evidence that Trump still had documents that didn't belong to him, and where they were kept.

 

[SimplyMe]

I hadn't heard that multiple agents came forward. Do you have a source for that?


Well I think he would have announced that the investigation was over anyway.

It was my understanding that the press had been saying her investigation was already over. Then either more evidence was acquired or Comey felt obligated to correct them.

I sincerely hadn't heard that agents were coming forward. I'd like to see a source for that.

Okay, to be fair, an investigation found that multiple FBI agents were talking to the press, the journalists these agents talked to wrote articles about the Clinton investigation, but the FBI could find no evidence that the agent provided information on the investigation to the reporter. I'm sure you'll find that believable.

Polls predicted a Hillary win by a landslide. The reason polling has been wildly off since 2016 is this sort of hyperpartisan smear of the right. If someone knows they are going to be called a Nazi or white supremacist for voting for 1 of 2 candidates....well, they're either not going to answer polls or just lie.

Same thing happened in the last two midterms I think.



Polls still had her winning. Look if you can't vote for someone without being painted as the death of democracy (this goes for both sides) your polls will always be badly off.

Yes, polls showed her ahead in the popular vote and Clinton did win the popular vote; the polls were off by the margin of error that they claim. Again, a five percent swing in the last couple of weeks in the election would have changed the results in the Electoral College; about what Hillary lost after the FBI announcement.

Corrupt?

I didn't say that was corrupt. He probably was investigating. He was smart enough not to reveal any details to Trump or the press. That's why he's still sitting there. He's smart, not corrupt.

Now...you could say that by not revealing details of the investigation he's corrupt now...but it would just get him fired anyway if it was serious. He sort of has to wait for the correct opportunity.

Now, you can say that's not in the interest of the people, the nation, either party....and a host of other things and I'll point out that he didn't get there in the first place by principles or being dumb. He's got some smarts at least.

But why wouldn't he have released the information to Barr or Trump -- he could have ensured his guys reelection. You have to really want to believe this conspiracy theory you've created to believe it.

I actually thought Comey was treated a little too harshly.

Trump was notorious for firing staff and replacing them with sycophants and loyalists. You either did what he wanted or got replaced. It's not a great cabinet and that's part of his cavalcade of mistakes. As an outsider...he really needed smart people and he needed to listen when they disagreed.

He didn't. Even Pence wouldn't go along with him at the end.



It really shouldn't be. You work for the president though....he sets the agenda.


Is that a tradition, rule, policy, contract?

The federal government is a hierarchy....President sits at the top.

I was under the impression they get a 10 year appointment but rarely make it through one. They can be fired.


I don't think that's why it was a big deal.

Nope, only two FBI directors, total, have ever been fired -- Comey was the second one. The first to be fired was William Sessions, who was found by an internal DoJ investigation to be guilty of ethics violations, including having used agents to do personal errands, used government funds to pay for his wife's travel, and used $10,000 to build a fence around his home; he wasn't fired for political reasons.

I have admissions from the CEO of Facebook itself he was warned about the story and should consider it Russian propaganda.

No, this is not true, though the lie keeps making the rounds through right wing talking heads, so I'm not surprised you believe it to be true. If you actually read, the FBI warned social media companies to beware of Russian propaganda that sought to influence the election. Shortly after that warning, the Hunter Biden story was published by the NY Post -- but both the Wall Street Journal and Fox News refused to run the story because (as you can see in the article) they found no credible claims that Joe Biden was involved. With Right Wing media claiming it was a non-story, there was good reason for social media to decide they should suppress the story.

Are you under the impression that the DOJ and FBI are the same thing?

No, though it is the principle investigative arm of the DoJ.

I don't know but when you consider some of people claiming to have copies and their lack of arrest... I wouldn't bet on it.

I think Gaetz said he had a copy....shortly before he was found completely uninvolved in those sex trafficking allegations.

Oh, so Gaetz putting the copy he had into the Congressional Record (which is public) was enough to get him out of charges? If that is the case, why is Rudy Giuliani still under investigation, since he is the only one who had a copy originally. In fact, when the FBI raided his home they intentionally didn't take that copy of the hard drive. If you recall, Rudy even complained about it and told them they should take it -- though I'm not sure why the FBI would need his copy when they had their own.

To believe your claim about Gaetz, it would seem the FBI would have to completely dropped all investigations into Giuliani and would have tried to ensure they took all his copies when they "raided" (executed a search warrant) of his home.

Right. FBI put the word out.

Sorry, no. If you read the Wall Street Journal reporting, you will see they found, on their own, that the laptop -- to include the documents and testimony of Bobulinski -- do not support claims that Joe Biden was involved. There reporting had zero to do with the FBI.

Uh huh.

Feel free to investigated it.

I've seen little, heard less, but suspect much.

So you are acting on your personal incredulity and what you believe to be true. When you have any actual evidence, then you can start arguing it on forums. In the meantime, the evidence doesn't support your beliefs.

You'll see FBI directors are fired all the time...this one isn't. I honestly don't think Biden is making his own appointments....some are ridiculous. Count all the Trump appointees still working.

Again, this is false. Comey was only the second FBI director ever fired, and the first one in roughly 25 years (meaning the previous two directors served their full terms).

Yeah...


Well it's a bit misleading if the media says that it's over. I don't blame him for correcting the record. Seems like they could have asked him.

Again, the clear policy is that the FBI/DoJ does not comment. It doesn't say, don't comment unless asked or don't comment unless there is false reporting. It plainly says don't comment. Though, to be fair, the investigation had ended, back in July -- you remember, that was the statement that she had been careless with Classified information but, due to lack of intent, they were not charging her with a crime. Then, 11 days before the election, Comey released that the investigation into Clinton had reopened, due to emails found in their investigation into Anthony Wiener, though it later was found that the emails were nothing new.

Yeah...sure.


Yes...it absolutely was.

Read the report on the investigation and what was found. And a quote from the report that verifies what I stated about emails sent to Hillary, "A typical security violation involves pre-marked classified information discovered contemporaneously with the incident. None of the emails at issue in this review were marked as classified."

Right. It's crime for me to mishandle classified information too.


Almost as if it's the norm.

Yeah...they're all following the rules now.




Huh?




Why destroy them?

Because they were set up for Clinton's time as Secretary of State. Once she was no longer Secretary of State, there is no longer a reason for that server, as such, it gets destroyed with a copy of the information on the server being retained by the State Department as required by law.

Must be difficult.

Search warrants can be difficult to obtain -- there must be credible evidence of a crime.

Like most things...I wouldn't be surprised if Trump didn't know that and no one told him.

I can just see this excuse in court -- my client didn't know that he was breaking the law. It tends to work so well in court, particularly in a case where the President is expected to learn these things and has advisors who are there to tell him these things.

Uh huh.




Iranian nuclear capabilities is on the search warrant?

Maybe the director isn't that smart.

That or on the list of documents seized. As a general rule, titles of Classified documents are intentionally not Classified.

 

[Hank77]

It's the exact same crime Trump is accused of in the Mar A Lago raid.

No, it's not Exactly the same. Trump isn't accused of just hiding documents in his home.

 

[Say it aint so]

Well...I thought it was obvious I was speaking about politicians who succeeded through the traditional methods. Not people who ran for President and just won out of the blue.

Thanks for the clarification. Just wanted to make sure because I find the idea that you, or you think people felt a person who has a long history of screwing contractors, investors, running multiple fraudulent entities, and just had his name sake organization ruled a criminal organization is going to expose people for their corruption. Excuse my rather lengthy sentence. Most people saw him for the sociopath conman he was and still is.

 

[Say it aint so]

False. President Trump had full authority to declassify documents, neither the DOJ nor special master has been able to prove he did not. They can try and prove their claim in court if they wish. Why do you think they have not brought charges against Trump? Where is there proof? Joe's attorneys have admitted he possessed classified documents, classified documents which he had no right nor authority to have in his unsecured private office. The Biden Penn center was funded by the Chinese, over 52 million dollars of which Joe took in at least $900,000 a year. Over twenty million was from ANONYMOUS Chinese sources. Garland was aware of the facts of Joe's illegal activities before the mid-term elections, but suppressed that information from the American people. The House of Representatives is investigating, but we need a grand jury to investigate the money trail to the Bidens from the Chinese and to decide what charges to bring against Joe.

Special Master Dearie: "If the government gives me prima facia evidence that they are classified documents, and you (Trump lawyers) don’t advance any claim of declassification, I’m left with a prima facia case of classified documents,” Dearie said, “and as far as I’m concerned, that’s the end of it.”​

Please stop and I ask again you just stop winging it.

 

[Hank77]

The Biden Penn center was funded by the Chinese, over 52 million dollars of which Joe took in at least $900,000 a year. Over twenty million was from ANONYMOUS Chinese sources.

As a research unit within the University of Pennsylvania, the Penn Biden Center will remain completely independent of the Biden administration, and the analysis and opinions of its staff and affiliated scholars will reflect their personal views alone, and not necessarily those of the University of Pennsylvania. The Penn Biden Center does not accept any contributions or gifts.[15]

Penn Biden Center for Diplomacy and Global Engagement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Like the Heritage Foundation, The Penn Biden Center for Diplomacy and Global Engagement is a think tank. Sheesh, you're going to have to do better than this one. This is a third striker.

 

[Say it aint so]

Just to flesh this out a little. The raid didn't result from Trump's character flaws. It resulted from a search warrant, obtained because the DOJ provided a Judge with solid evidence that Trump still had documents that didn't belong to him, and where they were kept.

Agreed, but Trump had a choice of just doing the right thing and working with NARA and give the documents back. Give them back then no subpoena, no warrant, no raid. Of course Trump having no moral compass between right and wrong just constantly chooses the wrong thing. It's what he does. That is a sociopath character flaw.

 

[Valletta]

Special Master Dearie: "If the government gives me prima facia evidence that they are classified documents, and you (Trump lawyers) don’t advance any claim of declassification, I’m left with a prima facia case of classified documents,” Dearie said, “and as far as I’m concerned, that’s the end of it.”​

Please stop and I ask again you just stop winging it.

The special master simply does not have enough evidence to even charge President Trump. Who knows how any millions of dollars have been spent by Democrat attorneys trying to stop Trump from running? Believe you me,, if they had real proof they would have prosecuted him long ago.

 

[Valletta]

As a research unit within the University of Pennsylvania, the Penn Biden Center will remain completely independent of the Biden administration, and the analysis and opinions of its staff and affiliated scholars will reflect their personal views alone, and not necessarily those of the University of Pennsylvania. The Penn Biden Center does not accept any contributions or gifts.[15]

Penn Biden Center for Diplomacy and Global Engagement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Like the Heritage Foundation, The Penn Biden Center for Diplomacy and Global Engagement is a think tank. Sheesh, you're going to have to do better than this one. This is a third striker.

Foreign donations to the University of Pennsylvania more than tripled in the two years after the think tank opened, with most of the $61 million coming from China, the Washington Free Beacon reported in 2021. Republican lawmakers and foreign policy officials have warned about the Chinese government’s influence-buying operations on college campuses, while the Department of Justice has been cracking down on Chinese espionage at American universities.

Watchdog Calls on Biden Center to Disclose Foreign Donations As DOJ Investigates Classified Docs

After classified documents were found stored in a closet at the University of Pennsylvania’s Penn Biden Center, a watchdog group is calling for the university to disclose whether any of the foreign donations it was given were channeled into the think tank.

freebeacon.com

 

[Say it aint so]

The special master simply does not have enough evidence to even charge President Trump. Who knows how any millions of dollars have been spent by Democrat attorneys trying to stop Trump from running? Believe you me,, if they had real proof they would have prosecuted him long ago.

Please stop winging it.

 

[Ana the Ist]

No, it's not Exactly the same. Trump isn't accused of just hiding documents in his home.

My mistake...what else?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Foreign donations to the University of Pennsylvania more than tripled in the two years after the think tank opened, with most of the $61 million coming from China, the Washington Free Beacon reported in 2021. Republican lawmakers and foreign policy officials have warned about the Chinese government’s influence-buying operations on college campuses, while the Department of Justice has been cracking down on Chinese espionage at American universities.

Watchdog Calls on Biden Center to Disclose Foreign Donations As DOJ Investigates Classified Docs

After classified documents were found stored in a closet at the University of Pennsylvania’s Penn Biden Center, a watchdog group is calling for the university to disclose whether any of the foreign donations it was given were channeled into the think tank.

freebeacon.com

Don't worry....I'm sure Hunter's trip to China is completely unrelated. He just wanted to sample the crack and prostitutes.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Thanks for the clarification. Just wanted to make sure because I find the idea that you, or you think people felt a person who has a long history of screwing contractors, investors, running multiple fraudulent entities, and just had his name sake organization ruled a criminal organization is going to expose people for their corruption.

To save himself from jail?

Why wouldn't he? Sounds completely in character to me.

Excuse my rather lengthy sentence. Most people saw him for the sociopath conman he was and still is.

I always wonder if most people think most people are smart or realize if most people are average....not what we'd rightly call smart....and you'd agree with most people, then you're probably just average intelligence.

Anyway, let's just ignore your appeal to popularity and I'll let you know I really never cared much about what most people think...I occasionally find myself agreeing with a large group...but almost never for the same reasons.