Ten Reasons I'm a Sabbatarian [moved thread]

[SabbathBlessings]

This was naturally not included,


Strong's Exhaustive Concordance
rest.
From a derivative of sabbaton; a "sabbatism", i.e. (figuratively) the repose of Christianity (as a type of heaven) -- rest.

This is the actual definiton from the actual book sitting right in front of me from the exhaustive Strong's Concordance. It is not Sabbaton which is the word for the actual weekly Sabbath which never seems to interest you guys when that's what you observe.

Because it is not what it is translated into.

This is Sabbaton

the institution of the sabbath, the law for keeping holy every seventh day of the week

This is Sabbatismos

4520. sabbatismos ►
Strong's Concordance
sabbatismos: a sabbath rest
Original Word: σαββατισμός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: sabbatismos
Phonetic Spelling: (sab-bat-is-mos')
Definition: a sabbath rest
Usage: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from a derivation of sabbaton
Definition
a sabbath rest
NASB Translation
Sabbath rest (1).

One means the Sabbath day, the other means the keeping of the Sabbath. Both are related which is why sabbatismos is a derivation of sabbaton

Colossians 2:14-17 is not referring to the Sabbath commandment and if read in proper context, it makes that case clearly.

The first step is understanding if commandments are ordinances.

Nehemiah 9:13
“You came down also on Mount Sinai, And spoke with them from heaven, And gave them just ordinances and true laws, Good statutes and commandments.

Colossians 2:14
Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

So we know this from Colossians 2:14:
1. They are handwritten
2. They are ordinances
3. They are contrary.

Does this fit the Sabbath commandment in any way? Absolutely not.
1. The Sabbath was finger-written by God Exodus 31:18
2. The Sabbath is a commandment of God. Exodus 20, Exodus 34:28
3. God said the Sabbath is holy and blessed Exodus 20:8-11

2 Chronicles 33:8
Neither will I any more remove the foot of Israel from out of the land which I have appointed for your fathers; so that they will take heed to do all that I have commanded them, according to the whole law and the statutes and the ordinances by the hand of Moses.

There is more than one Sabbath in scripture there is the weekly Sabbath that is a commandment of God and the annuals sabbath(s) feast days that is an ordinance handwritten by Moses. The context in Colossians 2:14 makes it clear which it is referring to.

Colossians 2:14 certainly does not fit with the Sabbath commandment so not sure why so many people try to force this to fit despite the facts clearly showing it is not referring to the weekly Sabbath commandment.

 

[JulieB67]

Because it is not what it is translated into.

Thank's but I'll take James Strongs work over your online usage

Both Sabbatimos and Sabbaton are listed.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Thank's but I'll take James Strongs work over your online usage

Both Sabbatimos and Sabbaton are listed.

You seem to be knocking the same source you’re using.

4520. sabbatismos ►
Strong's Concordance
sabbatismos: a sabbath rest
Original Word: σαββατισμός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: sabbatismos
Phonetic Spelling: (sab-bat-is-mos')
Definition: a sabbath rest
Usage: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from a derivation of sabbaton
Definition
a sabbath rest
NASB Translation
Sabbath rest (1).


Perhaps you can point to where in scripture that says we no longer have to obey the commandments of God or the Sabbath commandment. You keep indicating that we don’t have to, but you have yet to provide that text. One would think if something as important as no longer having to obey one of God’s commandments, wouldn’t there be clear scriptures saying so? Please do not say Hebrews 4 says this, because we both know thats not the case or Colossians 2:14-17. The Ten Commandments are a unit of Ten Exodus 34:28 placed together by God, that no man can undo. Revelation 11:19

 

[JulieB67]

You seem to be knocking the same source you’re using.

No, just the online usage of the Strong's and any others that is so far removed from the actual definition. Which was at the very bottom. But in the world we live in today I am not suprised. It's the same way with traditions of men. They too are far removed from the actual word of God.

I am not going to go over Hebrews 4 and other verses again, we see the words Sabbatimos and Sabbaton differently. So we are not going to change one another's mind.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

No, just the online usage of the Strong's and any others that is so far removed from the actual definition. Which was at the very bottom. But in the world we live in today I am not suprised. It's the same way with traditions of men. They too are far removed from the actual word of God.

I am not going to go over Hebrews 4 and other verses again, we see the words Sabbatimos and Sabbaton differently. So we are not going to change one another's mind.

Are you really trying to make a case that keeping the Sabbath day holy per the commandment of God Exodus 20:8-11 is a tradition of man and not a commandment- the opposite of what God said? Exodus 20, Exodus 20:8-11, Exodus 34:28. It’s certainly not a teaching of Jesus who teaches we are to obey the commandments of God over mans traditions Matthew 15:3-9.

Even if we took your definition of Sabbatimos, that there remains a response to Christianity and will be a heavenly rest, do you really think that deletes our moral obligation to obey one of God’s personally written commandments now despite no scripture saying so?

No, just the online usage of the Strong's and any others that is so far removed from the actual definition.

I’m sorry, this makes no sense, the same source is only right when it agrees with you, but becomes not a valid source when it states otherwise to your view? If its the same source regardless if it is online or in a book and there are 3 sources who interprets that word correctly which fits the scriptures exactly how they read without any extra input of trying to force it to fit, when it doesn’t in context to Hebrews 4:4, Hebrews 4:10 which there is no getting around.

I just noticed you are using Strong’s exhaustive concordance which includes possibilities.

An exhaustive concordance is a stand-alone book that lists every single word in the Bible. (Exhaustive means “thorough” or “including all possibilities.”)

The source I used is Strong’s concordance which gives the literal translation and primary definition, why it reconciles with the other sources who all translated the word correctly.

4520. sabbatismos ►
Strong's Concordance
sabbatismos: a sabbath rest
Original Word: σαββατισμός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: sabbatismos
Phonetic Spelling: (sab-bat-is-mos')
Definition: a sabbath rest
Usage: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from a derivation of sabbaton
Definition
a sabbath rest
NASB Translation
Sabbath rest (1).

No, just the online usage of the Strong's and any others that is so far removed from the actual definition. Which was at the very bottom.

The opposite seems to be the case…from the source you provided.

Strong's Greek: 4520. σαββατισμός (sabbatismos) -- a sabbath rest

The definition you choose to use is at the very bottom because it is not the primary definition and instead a “possibility” “figuratively”. The literal translation is what we should be using and what reconciles in context with Hebrews 4 and the entire bible despite peoples objection to the Sabbath commandment.

 

[JulieB67]

Are you really trying to make a case that keeping the Sabbath day holy per the commandment of God Exodus 20:8-11 is a tradition of man and not a commandment- the opposite of what God said? Exodus 20, Exodus 20:8-11, Exodus 34:28. It’s certainly not a teaching of Jesus who teaches we are to obey the commandments of God over mans traditions Matthew 15:3-9.

No, I'm talking about Easter, calling the Lord's Day a day of the week and so on. I think Christ fulfilled the Sabbath which is why we have Sabbatimos at this time. Not a day of the week. So when we that believe enter into Sabbatimos (the rest in Christianity) we are keeping the commandment by being filled with the Holy Spirit and putting our rest in Christ 24/7- Sabbatimos. You believe otherwise and worship only on Saturdays. I guess that's where you only put your rest in as well. I guess we'll find out in the end....

hat there remains a response to Christianity

Again, it's repose of Christianity, not response

Repose simply means rest. And the repose/rest of Christianity is that rest we have in Christ. It says Christianity. It does not say the day of the weekly Sabbath remained. That once again is Sabbaton.

So translated back to the original word would be " a sabbatimos remained" in Hebrews 4. Meaning the repose/rest of Christianity remained. That's not my words or meaning it's the Greek meaning of the word sabbatimos. And the Sabbath keeping regardless is that we have in Christ. As I said we'll see in the end....

 

[SabbathBlessings]

No, I'm talking about Easter, calling the Lord's Day a day of the week and so on. I think Christ fulfilled the Sabbath which is why we have Sabbatimos at this time. Not a day of the week. So when we that believe enter into Sabbatimos (the rest in Christianity) the rest that remained we are keeping the commandment by being filled with the Holy Spirit and putting our rest in Christ 24/7. You believe otherwise and worship only on Saturdays. I guess we'll find out in the end....



Again, it's repose of Christianity, not response

Repose simply means rest. And the repose/rest of Christianity is that rest we have in Christ. It says Christianity. It does not say the day of the weekly Sabbath remained. That once again is Sabbaton.

So translated back to the original word would be " a sabbatimos remained" in Hebrews 4. Meaning the repose/rest of Christianity remained. That's not my words or meaning it's the Greek meaning of the word sabbatimos. And the Sabbath keeping regardless is that we have in Christ. As I said we'll see in the end....

You are using the figurative and the possibility meaning and not the primary meaning shown by your own reference, which does not reconcile with Hebrews 4:4 or Hebrews 4:10 or this entire passage which is a call to obedience Hebrews 4:6 Hebrews 4:1, Hebrews 4:11 and the primary and literal translation fits well, which is what remains- the Sabbath rest for the people of God. Hebrews 4:9 and why no edits or insertions are needed.

Strong's Greek: 4520. σαββατισμός (sabbatismos) -- a sabbath rest

Thanks for the correction of repose.

No scripture shows any change to our moral obligation to obey God’s commandments including the Sabbath commandment that we are told to keep holy on the seventh day. Exodus 20:8-11. I agree this will get resolved soon enough and we should always caution on the side of obedience to what God asks, especially one of His divinely written commandments.

 

[Bob S]

It was God who brought the knowledge of Sabbath to Israel and knew Israel would not spread the Sabbath requirement to all nations.
Even before there is a word on my tongue,
Behold, O Lord, You know it all. Psalms 139:4

If God had wanted to inform the remainder of the World about the Sabbath requirement, He could have easily informed everyone just as He did Israel. The fact is that God gave only His chosen a special day to rest. He didn't give this command to any other nation. The following question remains for someone to answer. When did God require all mankind to observe the day he gave only to Israel?

 

[Cornelius8L]

Hi JulieB67,

You can't just say, "Look at Hebrews 4:2" to the exclusion of those verses in the direct context of this discussion which refute your conclusion. It seems to me that you are the one who is ignoring the context. How would you like to suggest that verse 4 is integrated into your apparently myopic consideration of context?

For somewhere he has spoken about the seventh day in these words: “On the seventh day God rested from all his works.”

Icy, can you share your view about verse 8? Thanks.

 

[Cornelius8L]

Colossians 2:14 certainly does not fit with the Sabbath commandment so not sure why so many people try to force this to fit despite the facts clearly showing it is not referring to the weekly Sabbath commandment.

Sabbath day’s journey is mentioned in Acts 1:12 after Mary rested on the Sabbath (Luke 23:56). What is your view about this instruction being removed (with the scripture's support) if not by Colossians 2:16-17?

 

[Icyspark]

Sabbath day’s journey is mentioned in Acts 1:12 after Mary rested on the Sabbath (Luke 23:56). What is your view about this instruction being removed (with the scripture's support) if not by Colossians 2:16-17?

Hi Cornelius8L,

Please supply the biblical law, statute, ordinance, regulation, or commandment which authorizes and provides instructions for implementing this premise. Otherwise it is merely one of the myriad hedges which the Jews self-erected around the Sabbath which Jesus went out of His way to tear down. But strangely after many encounters with Jewish authorities in which He challenged, confronted and contradicted their misunderstandings of the Sabbath supposedly Jesus surreptitiously (as in no one, not even His own disciples were aware of any intended change) abolished the day He "made for the good of human beings" and which He said should be called "a delight." Don't you find that a bit far-fetched? Don't you find that unbelievable? Don't you find that unbiblical? I do.

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[Icyspark]

Icy, can you share your view about verse 8? Thanks.

Hi Cornelius8L,

I'll give it a shot, if you'll likewise share your view about verse 9.

God bless!

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Sabbath day’s journey is mentioned in Acts 1:12 after Mary rested on the Sabbath (Luke 23:56). What is your view about this instruction being removed (with the scripture's support) if not by Colossians 2:16-17?

There is no scripture stating we can't go out on the Sabbath day as shown in Acts. The Sabbath is about communion with God Isaiah 58:13, the day to keep holy Exodus 20:8, I know I can be in communion with Him through His nature. The apostles were peaching the Word of God to Jews and Gentiles every Sabbath Acts 18:4, Acts 13:44, Acts 13:42. If we rest according to the commandment Exodus 20:8-11 there is nothing stating we can't go outside but are told to keep the Sabbath holy and to rest from work and labors.

 

[Icyspark]

I don't celebrate Easter. Easter is a mistranlation of the word Pascha which is Passover. I observe the true Passover and take communion in Christ's name. as he said to do in rememberance of him. As for Christmas, Christ was likely born in September if we go by the course of Abia and that fact that Elizabeth was 6 months pregnant with John. But that's another topic...

And the Lord's Day is not Saturday or Sunday it's another way of stating Day of the Lord which is when Christ returns. The disciples never called the 7th or 1st day of the week the Lord's Day. The church has changed that to mean a day of the week.
But John was in the spirit on the Lord's Day and told to write about the past, present and future of that time period -the Lord's Day.That's the key to understanding Revelation but that's not for this thread as well...

When I stated I dropped many doctrines I was speaking the truth. As I always state one could spend a lifetime sitting on a pew listening to 5 minutes of the Word of God and 30 minutes of a personal sermon that will leave you only being fed milk for the most part. And fed false doctrines in the process.

I will agree that traditions make void the true word of God.

Hi JulieB67,

This is encouraging to read!

I mostly agree with your response about the Lord's day, although a case can be made that it is more likely the Sabbath than Sunday due to the fact that the Lord specifically lays claim to the seventh day, calling it "My holy day."

Isaiah 58:13-14
“If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath and from doing as you please on MY HOLY DAY, if you call the Sabbath a delight and the Lord’s holy day honorable, and if you honor it by not going your own way and not doing as you please or speaking idle words, then you will find your joy in the Lord, and I will cause you to ride in triumph on the heights of the land and to feast on the inheritance of your father Jacob.” For the mouth of the Lord has spoken.​

That said I tend to believe that it is more likely speaking of the Lord's second coming.

Yes, that's the example but it doesn't change the fact that the rest that remains is Sabbatimos not Sabbaton which is the day you are talking about. When we enter that rest (Sabbatimos, the repose of Christianity)we cease from our own works. When we enter that rest we are fufilling the commandant which Paul states was a shadow of the things to come and these verses in Hebrews proves it. Our rest today is Sabbatimos that's what remains and some did not enter into that rest when the gospel was first preached because of lack of faith.

We can go on and on but as I said we are going to change either one's mind.

In post #1415 SabbathBlessings responded to your posting of the Strong's Concordance entry for sabbatismos. She used your own reference to provide a more fully orbed review of the word in question (see below).

◄ 4520. sabbatismos ►
Strong's Concordance
sabbatismos: a sabbath rest
Original Word: σαββατισμός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: sabbatismos
Phonetic Spelling: (sab-bat-is-mos')
Definition: a sabbath rest
Usage: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from a derivation of sabbaton
Definition
a sabbath rest
NASB Translation
Sabbath rest (1).



Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 4520: σαββατισμός

σαββατισμός, σαββατισμου, ὁ (σαββατίζω to keep the sabbath);
1. a keeping sabbath.

2. the blessed rest from toils and troubles looked for in the age to come by the true worshippers of God and true Christians (R. V. sabbath rest): Hebrews 4:9. (Plutarch, de superstit. c. 3; ecclesiastical writings.)

see GREEK sabbaton

Forms and Transliterations
σαββατισμος σαββατισμός σαββατισμὸς sabbatismos sabbatismòs
Links
Interlinear Greek • Interlinear Hebrew • Strong's Numbers • Englishman's Greek Concordance • Englishman's Hebrew Concordance • Parallel Texts
Englishman's Concordance
Hebrews 4:9 N-NMS
GRK: ἄρα ἀπολείπεται σαββατισμὸς τῷ λαῷ
NAS: there remains a Sabbath rest for the people
KJV: therefore a rest to the people
INT: Then remains a sabbath rest to the people
Strong's Greek 4520
1 Oc

I may be wrong but I find this entry doesn't support your viewpoint. Then too it appears to me that while you make an appeal to context, that you are not embracing the context yourself. The context of sabbatismos is in direct relation to "the seventh day" and the creation of the world (Hebrews 4:3-4). From what I recall, Hebrews 4 is the only instance in the Bible where sabbatismos is used and to place the sort of unbalanced significance you are attaching to it I believe is not warranted. If this singular and unique word does all the amazing gymnastic twists and turns you are attributing to it then it does so in a vacuum of information. All that one can truly and biblically ascertain from the main and plain meaning of this passage is that "there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God" and that this "Sabbath rest" is explicitly tied to "the seventh day" and the creation of the world.

Hebrews 4:9-10
... there still remains for God's people a rest like God's resting on the seventh day. For those who receive that rest which God promised will rest from their own work, just as God rested from his.​

Let's break it down:
Something still remains (what could it be?)
Something still remains for God's people (iow Christians).
What still remains for God's people is a rest
What is this rest like? "like God's resting"
When did this "God resting" take place? "on the seventh day."
What are God's people admonished to do? "rest from their own work"
Who are God's people to emulate in their resting? "God"

I just wonder how a plain reading of Hebrews 4 is substantially different from a plain reading of Genesis 2:1-3 and Exodus 20:8-11?

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

 

[JulieB67]

. From what I recall, Hebrews 4 is the only instance in the Bible where sabbatismos is used and to place the sort of unbalanced significance you are attaching to it I believe is not warranted.

I try and take the Bible as a whole as well and of course chapter by chapter and verse by verse when and letting context settle in.

And it's because this is the only time this is used and it reads in my Strong's as "the repose of Christianity which means "rest' of Christianity that it tells me this rest is something entirely different than the seventh day rest which is Sabbaton.

Both are listed in the Strong's one right after the other showing they have two entirely different meanings. Sabbaton which is the day of weekly repose is listed all thoughout the NT but it's not in the Hebrew 4 verses. That's why I take Sabbatimos as the rest we have in Christ. Not only because it specifically states that it is but because it's for a fact not the day of weekly repose/rest.

This verse that some of you claim doesn't have to do with the day of weekly Sabbath is the very definiton of the weekly Sabbath days.

It is Sabbaton

Colossians 2:16 "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:"

Colossians 2:17 "Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ."


Sabbath in verse 16 is 4521 Sabbaton -the Sabbath, or day of weekly repose from secular avocations (also the observance or institution itself)

There's no denying then what that means. No one should be judged for these days. We can't just state these are different meaning days when the very definition is still Sabbaton and that's the same Sabbaton all through the NT. We are told don't be judged for holydays which are the feast or festival days or the day of weekly repose from secular avocations -Sabbath/Sabbaton. It covers them all in this verse. When we realize this then we can tie together Christ telling us to put our rest in him and in Hebrews 4 we can fully realize the subject is the gospel being preached and some not entering in that rest because of lack of faith. It's his rest -Sabbatimos (the rest of Christianity that's being talked about, not a day of the week.) that one has to enter. When one does that, you are fulfilling the commandment of keeping the Sabbath Holy by letting the Holy Spirit dwell in you. Which therefore lets us cease from our works as God did from his. It doesn't get any better than that. That's why Christ tells us that all who labour and are heavy laden to come to him and he will give us rest.

Again, we won't agree I realize that but that's how I see the context and those separate words and how they're utilized.

 

[Bob S]

Once again, I ask those who are trying to impose the old Israelite Sabbath on all mankind to tell us when did God require all mankind to observe the day he gave only to old Israel? If this question cannot be answered then all the debating is for naught.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I try and take the Bible as a whole as well and of course chapter by chapter and verse by verse when and letting context settle in.

And it's because this is the only time this is used and it reads in my Strong's as "the repose of Christianity which means "rest' of Christianity that it tells me this rest is something entirely different than the seventh day rest which is Sabbaton.

Both are listed in the Strong's one right after the other showing they have two entirely different meanings. Sabbaton which is the day of weekly repose is listed all thoughout the NT but it's not in the Hebrew 4 verses. That's why I take Sabbatimos as the rest we have in Christ. Not only because it specifically states that it is but because it's for a fact not the day of weekly repose/rest.

This verse that some of you claim doesn't have to do with the day of weekly Sabbath is the very definiton of the weekly Sabbath days.

It is Sabbaton

Colossians 2:16 "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:"

Colossians 2:17 "Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ."


Sabbath in verse 16 is 4521 Sabbaton -the Sabbath, or day of weekly repose from secular avocations (also the observance or institution itself)

There's no denying then what that means. No one should be judged for these days. We can't just state these are different meaning days when the very definition is still Sabbaton and that's the same Sabbaton all through the NT. We are told don't be judged for holydays which are the feast or festival days or the day of weekly repose from secular avocations -Sabbath/Sabbaton. It covers them all in this verse. When we realize this then we can tie together Christ telling us to put our rest in him and in Hebrews 4 we can fully realize the subject is the gospel being preached and some not entering in that rest because of lack of faith. It's his rest -Sabbatimos (the rest of Christianity that's being talked about, not a day of the week.) that one has to enter. When one does that, you are fulfilling the commandment of keeping the Sabbath Holy by letting the Holy Spirit dwell in you. Which therefore lets us cease from our works as God did from his. It doesn't get any better than that. That's why Christ tells us that all who labour and are heavy laden to come to him and he will give us rest.

Again, we won't agree I realize that but that's how I see the context and those separate words and how they're utilized.

For reference this is the Sabbath commandment that we are told not to add or subtract from. Deuteronomy 4:2

Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who iswithin your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Happy Sabbath all!

 

[JulieB67]

Context of scripture trumps everything else. Colossians 2:14 is in no way referring to the seventh day Sabbath commandment as I previously proved.

I think the scriptures prove themselves. Have you ever taken the word sabbath back to the Greek? And see how it's utilized in all the verses in the NT like Colossians 2:14? If you do you'll see for yourself it is exactly referring to the day of weekly repose/rest. You can't change the meanings of words to suit a doctrine. Sabbath as utilized in this verse is Sabbaton

4521The Sabbath, or day of weekly repose from secular avocations (also the observance or institution itself).

There are no new moon festivals, food or drink offerings in the seventh day

Which is exactly why Paul separated them all. He separates each one specifically but has included all four subjects, -food and drink or holydays or new moon or sabbaths days. You can't just lump them all together and say he's only talking about the feast and festivals. That's what holydays are. He specifically states or of the sabbath days. He separates the two.

The Greek word for holyday is 1859- heorte -a festival-feast, holyday.

Colossians 2:16 "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:"

because the Lord has chosen Sabbath worship will continue forever in God’s New Earth and New Heaven. Isaiah 66:22-23

Isaiah 66:23 "And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord."

This is just another way of saying that worship will be constant. Unless you think we will only be worshipping on new moons as well. But time will be no factor that's just stating it so people will know that worship will not cease at that point. It doesn't just say sabbath to sabbath it states new moon to new moon as well. That's just stating month to month and week to week. Because that's how people saw time. Again unless you believe we will only be worshipping on new moons too.

Isaiah 66:22-23 The same word is used here Sabbaton.

Actually it's Shabbath in the Hebrew.

And I mean no offense I really don't. We just read things differently in the word.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

For those interested in understanding Colossians 2:14-17. While I am no expert on Greek or Hebrews, I have a friend who is who shared this information.

You need to know what Paul is quoting from in the old testament and look at the within scripture and chapter contexts and overall context and know what Paul is referring to from the old covenant scriptures. The Greek words used in Colossians 2:16 is in context to no judging others in regards to the **new moons,** **meat and drink offerings** and **the sabbaths** (**plural sabbaths are being referred to here as the Greek is genitive neuter plural application - GNP**) **in the annual feast days**. It is not talking about the weekly Sabbath. All of the above were shadows of things to come (Col 2:17). All the things listed in Col 2:16 were all shadows of things to come because they were all linked to the **old covenant Sanctuary laws of animal sacrifices and sin offerings and the Levitical Priesthood for atonement for sin that all pointed to Jesus as the promised Messiah and Gods' sacrifice for the sins of the world once and for all and Jesus as our true high priest that stands in the presence of God making intercession for us (see Hebrews** 7:1-25; Hebrews 8:1-13; Hebrews 9:1-27 and Hebrews 10:1-22). Its **impossible** for God's creation seventh day Sabbath which is a **memorial** (Remember - Exodus 20:8) of creation to be a shadow law of anything because** it was made before sin **not after sin when man was in perfect harmony with the creator and **points backward as a memorial not forwards to things to come**. All shadow laws were made in the old covenant as part of God's plan of salvation **after mankind had sinned** as a promise of God's salvation from sin and of things to come in the future through Jesus. The creation Sabbath was made **before sin so cannot be a shadow law of anything **which is why it is a memorial in Exodus 20:8-11 that points backward to creation in Genesis 2:1-3.

Many people do not know but Paul is quoting old testament scriptures (e.g compare Colossians 2:16 with Ezekiel 45:17-22; Numbers 28:9; Ezekiel 46:6; Numbers 28:9; Isaiah 1:10-14; Hosea 10:11 compare Hebrews 9:1-12; Hebrews 10:1-9)

The ceremonial sabbaths in the annual Feast days are different from God's creation weekly seventh day Sabbath that is Gods' 4th commandments and a memorial of creation pointing backwards to Genesis 2:1-3. The ceremonial sabbaths in the annual Feast days can fall on any day of the week depending on the yearly cycle and are linked directly to the Sanctuary and Levitical Priesthood through animal sacrifices and blood atonement for sin.

The **annual ceremonial sabbaths** (plural GNP not God's 4th commandment singular) include..

(1)Feast of Unleavened Bread (first and last day) Leviticus 23:6-8
(2)Feast of Trumpets Leviticus 23:24-25
(3)Day of Atonement *Leviticus 23:27-32
(4) Feast of Booths *Leviticus 23:34-36
(5) Feast of First Fruits *Leviticus 23:39
(6) Feast days of Holy convocation of **no work** (one of the meanings of sabbaton Colossians 2:16 *Leviticus 23:7-8; 21;24; 27; 35-36).

**Albert Barnes Notes on the Bible**

“... Or of the Sabbath days - Greek, “of the Sabbaths.” The word Sabbath in the Old Testament is applied not only to the seventh day, but to all the days of holy rest that were observed by the Hebrews, and particularly to the beginning and close of their great festivals. There is, doubtless, reference to those days in this place, since the word is used in the plural number, and the apostle does not refer particularly to the Sabbath properly so called. There is no evidence from this passage that he would teach that there was no obligation to observe any holy time, for there is not the slightest reason to believe that he meant to teach that one of the ten commandments had ceased to be binding on mankind. If he had used the word in the singular number - “the Sabbath,” it would then, of course, have been clear that he meant to teach that that commandment had ceased to be binding, and that a Sabbath was no longer to be observed. But the use of the term in the plural number, and the connection, show that he had his eye on the great number of days which were observed by the Hebrews as festivals, as a part of their ceremonial and typical law, and not to the moral law, or the Ten Commandments. No part of the moral law - no one of the ten commandments could be spoken of as “a shadow of good things to come.” These commandments are, from the nature of moral law, of perpetual and universal obligation. ...” - Albert Barnes, Colossians 2:16 Commentary. E-Sword App.

**Adam Clarke, states on the same passage:**

There is no intimation here that the Sabbath was done away, or that its moral use was superseded, by the introduction of Christianity. I have shown elsewhere that, Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy, is a command of perpetual obligation, and can never be superseded but by the final termination of time. ...” - Adam Clarke, Colossians 2:16 Commentary. E-Sword App.

**Jamieson, Fausset and Brown Commentary states:**

“... the sabbath — Omit “THE,” which is not in the Greek (compare Note, see on Gal_4:10). “SABBATHS” (not “the sabbaths”) of the day of atonement and feast of tabernacles have come to an end with the Jewish services to which they belonged (Lev_23:32, Lev_23:37-39). The weekly sabbath rests on a more permanent foundation, having been instituted in Paradise to commemorate the completion of creation in six days. Lev_23:38 expressly distinguished “the sabbath of the Lord” from the other sabbaths. A positive precept is right because it is commanded, and ceases to be obligatory when abrogated; a moral precept is commanded eternally, because it is eternally right. If we could keep a perpetual sabbath, as we shall hereafter, the positive precept of the sabbath, one in each week, would not be needed. Heb_4:9, “rests,” Greek, “keeping of sabbath” (Isa_66:23). But we cannot, since even Adam, in innocence, needed one amidst his earthly employments; therefore the sabbath is still needed and is therefore still linked with the other nine commandments, as obligatory in the spirit, though the letter of the law has been superseded by that higher spirit of love which is the essence of law and Gospel alike (Rom_13:8-10). ...” - Jamieson, Fausset and Brown, Colossians 2:16 Commentary. E-Sword App.

Well the above is the short version proving that Colossians 2:16-17 is not a reference to Gods' 4th commandment and also that it is impossible for God's 4th commandment to be a Mosaic "shadow law" of anything because it was made before sin. All the shadow laws were only made after sin as part of Gods' plan of salvation

Hope this helps!

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I think the scriptures prove themselves. Have you ever taken the word sabbath back to the Greek? And see how it's utilized in all the verses in the NT like Colossians 2:14? If you do you'll see for yourself it is exactly referring to the day of weekly repose/rest. You can't change the meanings of words to suit a doctrine. Sabbath as utilized in this verse is Sabbaton

4521The Sabbath, or day of weekly repose from secular avocations (also the observance or institution itself).




Which is exactly why Paul separated them all. He separates each one specifically but has included all four subjects, -food and drink or holydays or new moon or sabbaths days. You can't just lump them all together and say he's only talking about the feast and festivals. That's what holydays are. He specifically states or of the sabbath days. He separates the two.

The Greek word for holyday is 1859- heorte -a festival-feast, holyday.

Colossians 2:16 "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:"



Isaiah 66:23 "And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord."

This is just another way of saying that worship will be constant. Unless you think we will only be worshipping on new moons as well. But time will be no factor that's just stating it so people will know that worship will not cease at that point. It doesn't just say sabbath to sabbath it states new moon to new moon as well. That's just stating month to month and week to week. Because that's how people saw time. Again unless you believe we will only be worshipping on new moons too.



Actually it's Shabbath in the Hebrew.

And I mean no offense I really don't. We just read things differently in the word.

I see, when the same greek word does not fit the way you like, you switch to Hebrews.

Isaiah 66:22-23 does not say we will worship before the Lord every day or constant.

Isaiah 66:23 and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

Just like I go to church from one Sabbath to another which does not translate into “everyday” or constant. The scripture says we will be working in heaven, so your ideas here seem to be in conflict with the text. Just like the idea that the Sabbath commandment is a heavenly rest and not the way God commanded us to keep today. I find it strange that one would think God made a mistake in His commandment when He said the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God. Exodus 20:10

Anyway, we will probably have to agree to disagree. God bless.