Without goading, it's now 2022. What timetables proved incorrect?

[Hammster]

I see the nay sayers and the prophecy rejecters as the arrogant ones.
They make the people who do promote the Prophetic Word, to be unwise and unnecessarily vocal in their warnings.

Remember; it ISN'T a personal opinion to post the scriptures which tell us, very comprehensively, what the Lord intends to do.
And if we use hindsight and modern knowledge to help explain what the prophets wrote, is that personal opinion?

Actually, I feel sorry for those who have chosen to reject the end time Prophesies. They will be shocked and without a clue on the Day the Lord takes action.

One of my rules of debate is that when the opposition starts in with personal insults, the debate is over. Especially when straw men are used.

As a preterist, I don’t reject prophecies. I just see the fulfillment differently. The Olivet Discourse, for instance, was a prophecy that I don’t reject. I just see that it took place already.

So if you are looking to have any sort of meaningful discussion, it’s best not to use insults and to just discuss the arguments.

 

[keras]

As a preterist, I don’t reject prophecies. I just see the fulfillment differently. The Olivet Discourse, for instance, was a prophecy that I don’t reject. I just see that it took place already.

So if you are looking to have any sort of meaningful discussion, it’s best not to use insults and to just discuss the arguments.

No one is making personal insults. The main perpetrators of vehement rejection of another's beliefs, are those with fixed beliefs of a 'rapture' to heaven or that Bible Prophecy is all over; we just await Jesus to Return and line up to receive immortality.

We DO have a future and it will be a testing time for all. 1 Peter 4:12
Most people, sadly; will fail and become members of a One World Govt, but we who hold firm to our faith in the Lord, will be protected and great Blessings are promised to us. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26

 

[keras]

Actually, the only disadvantage is on the futurists side, because they constantly lose their credibility with all the hysterical and wrong predictions

Making predictions of when the Lord will do a similar reset of our civilization as He did in the days of Noah, is a mistake. We are plainly told that no one knows that Day.
However, to reject or ignore what He has told us, by His Prophets; what He intends to do; is a worse mistake.

 

[Hammster]

No one is making personal insults. The main perpetrators of vehement rejection of another's beliefs, are those with fixed beliefs of a 'rapture' to heaven or that Bible Prophecy is all over; we just await Jesus to Return and line up to receive immortality.

We DO have a future and it will be a testing time for all. 1 Peter 4:12
Most people, sadly; will fail and become members of a One World Govt, but we who hold firm to our faith in the Lord, will be protected and great Blessings are promised to us. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26

And you are wrong on how things play out. Is it fair to say that I feel sorry for you for rejecting end time prophecies? And by that I mean how scripture actually says how things play out.

 

[trophy33]

Making predictions of when the Lord will do a similar reset of our civilization as He did in the days of Noah, is a mistake. We are plainly told that no one knows that Day.
However, to reject or ignore what He has told us, by His Prophets; what He intends to do; is a worse mistake.

Rejecting futurism is not rejecting or ignoring what He has told us. Its rejecting what futurists think He has told us.

 

[keras]

Rejecting futurism is not rejecting or ignoring what He has told us. Its rejecting what futurists think He has told us.

But what I post is the Prophetic Word. As given to us in our Bibles.

Do you have any real answer to Isaiah 30:26-30? Has what we are told there happened yet? If so: when?

 

[Hammster]

But what I post is the Prophetic Word. As given to us in our Bibles.

We don’t disagree that it’s prophetic words. The question comes down to who it was for.

 

[claninja]

So you contend that any unfulfilled prophecy, as Written in our Bibles, is untrue?

not at all. Your prediction did not come to pass. Therefore, according to Deuteronomy 18, it wasn’t from the Lord, and I don’t need to heed YOUR interpretation of the prophetic word.

Deuteronomy 18:21-22 21You may ask in your heart, “How can we recognize a message that the LORD has not spoken?” 22When a prophet speaks in the name of the LORD and the message does not come to pass or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. The prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him.

 

[trophy33]

Do you have any real answer to Isaiah 30:26-30? Has what we are told there happened yet? If so: when?

According to commentaries, it happened in the 7th century BC, during the reign of Sennacherib.
Sennacherib - Wikipedia

But we can say that some of the words can be applied also to final judgement of Israel and to glory of the church, in that case it was also fulfilled since the 1st century AD.

 

[keras]

We don’t disagree that it’s prophetic words. The question comes down to who it was for.

Most Prophecy remains unfulfilled, despite the preterists attempts to biff it all into the past.
Therefore; most is still future and is very likely to happen in our time.

Whether this is right or not, doesn't matter as; if the end times don't come before we die, we will have been prepared with the knowledge of what God has planned to do to the world and for His people.

not at all. Your prediction did not come to pass.

Actually 2012 wasn't my prediction, I just got caught up in the general thought at that time, of possible dramatic events then.
Of course the Mayan prophesies were never going to happen then, as the end of the world is more than a thousand years away as yet.

I don’t need to heed YOUR interpretation of the prophetic word.

But you do need to heed what the Bible prophets tell us, as I quote in my posts. Your attitude is to 'throw the baby out with the bathwater'.

According to commentaries, it happened in the 7th century BC, during the reign of Sennacherib.

The Commentators couldn't possibly be correct in their interpretation of the Prophesies, Jesus said so: I thank You Father for hiding these truths from the wise and learned and revealing them to the simple. Matthew 11:25

But we can say that some of the words can be applied also to final judgement of Israel and to glory of the church, in that case it was also fulfilled since the 1st century AD.

The Judgment of Jewish Israel remains to be fulfilled. They are back in the holy Land, but in apostasy. They now face the Lord's wrath, as over 20 prophesies vividly describe. Isaiah 22:1-14, Zephaniah 1:1-18, Romans 9:27, +

The Lord's Blessings and His Promises to His faithful people; the Church, also remain to be fulfilled. We will be gathered and are destined to be the people God always wanted in all of the holy Land. Isaiah 62:1-5

 

[trophy33]

The Commentators couldn't possibly be correct in their interpretation of the Prophesies, Jesus said so: I thank You Father for hiding these truths from the wise and learned and revealing them to the simple. Matthew 11:25

Meaning you are the simple one and they are the learned. Got it.

The Judgment of Jewish Israel remains to be fulfilled.

Poor Israel. How many total disasters do you wish for them? What can be more severe that to cease to exist as a country for 2,000 years and your religion to be destroyed?

They are back in the holy Land, but in apostasy. They now face the Lord's wrath, as over 20 prophesies vividly describe. Isaiah 22:1-14, Zephaniah 1:1-18, Romans 9:27, +

They are doing quite fine, modern Israel is a developed democratic country.

The Lord's Blessings and His Promises to His faithful people; the Church, also remain to be fulfilled. We will be gathered and are destined to be the people God always wanted in all of the holy Land. Isaiah 62:1-5

Its so sad that you use only your physical eyes.

 

[Hammster]

Most Prophecy remains unfulfilled, despite the preterists attempts to biff it all into the past.

I can make the argument, with far more evidence than you can supply, that most prophecy has been fulfilled. I don’t need to claim victory with every post, though. I can show it. The evidence of fulfillment, in most cases, is right in scripture.

 

[claninja]

But you do need to heed what the Bible prophets tell us, as I quote in my posts. Your attitude is to 'throw the baby out with the bathwater'.

You’re presenting a Straw man argument. I never argued one does not need to heed the prophets In scripture. My argument is that I don’t need to heed YOUR interpretation of the prophets in scripture because of your failed prediction. Based on Deuteronomy 18:21-22, as your prediction did not come to pass, I know your understanding wasn’t from the Lord.

 

[Timtofly]

OK! So there are a few. This might be a useful exercise every year - to try and bring some much needed humility into the futurist community.

You don't understand humility.

Humility is not pointing out other people's weakness. Humility is not weakness. Humility is knowing what is coming, and not making some big deal about it. Perhaps the no goading part of the thread is a start.

Taking the wind out of the sails in your point to "correct" the futurist paradigm is not giving them humility. Humility is not given. Humility is a personal understanding.

Futurism is not just about setting dates. That is prognostication. Futurism is the new knee jerk reaction to preterism, or the label preterist place on people who do not agree with them. All these labels keep popping up like fruit trees in bloom.

Pointing out people's mistakes can never force humility on them. A false prophet used to be stoned to death. Certainly that is not humility.

 

[keras]

Meaning you are the simple one and they are the learned

Just maybe; I am.
Having left school at age 15 and having never had any higher education, such as Bible College, I have not been brainwashed into anyones doctrines.
The Methodist Church that I was brought up in, never even mentioned Bible Prophecy.

I can make the argument, with far more evidence than you can supply, that most prophecy has been fulfilled. I don’t need to claim victory with every post, though. I can show it. The evidence of fulfillment, in most cases, is right in scripture.

I have read a lot of history, esp, authors like Herodotus, Tactius, Gibbon, John Bright; A History of Israel, etc.
Nowhere do they show when or where the graphically described prophesies happened. The example I presented recently, was in Isaiah 30:25-30. If you can't provide proof of when this cosmic and earth changing event, happened; combined with how the Lord will then Bless His faithful people, then you are wrong.
We DO have a future, the Prophetic Word tells us about it in great detail.

To not take note of what the Lord has warned us He intends to do, is a grave mistake and a loss for all who fail to understand the Prophesies.

Poor Israel. How many total disasters do you wish for them? What can be more severe that to cease to exist as a country for 2,000 years and your religion to be destroyed?

Jesus said: Those who were born to the Kingdom, will be thrown out into the dark, where there will be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Matthew 8:12
Over 20 other prophesies vividly describe the demise of ethnic Jewish Israel. Why can't you see them?

They are doing quite fine, modern Israel is a developed democratic country.

I described modern Israel and their fate, here recently and got a warning for it.
Because; people doctrines require an Israel here to be punished, while they skive off to heaven. Too bad this fanciful idea is not Biblical.

My argument is that I don’t need to heed YOUR interpretation of the prophets in scripture

Why don't you refute my, as you call it: 'interpretation'?
I consider that I 'interpret' no Prophecy. I merely present them as Written, [in a good modern translation] and use a few facts gained from modern knowledge, to help explain what the ancient prophets were trying to describe.

 

[claninja]

I consider that I 'interpret' no Prophecy. I merely present them as Written, [in a good modern translation] and use a few facts gained from modern knowledge, to help explain what the ancient prophets were trying to describe.

that’s called interpretation by it’s very definition.

Interpretation definition: “the action of explaining the meaning of something.”

You using modern knowledge to help “explain” what the ancient prophets describe, is you interpreting.

Why don't you refute my, as you call it: 'interpretation'?

God spoke to the prophets in riddles, visions and dreams, and not clear language like Moses.

Numbers 12:6-8 He said, “Hear now My words: If there is a prophet among you,
I, the LORD, will reveal Myself to him in a vision; I will speak to him in a dream.7But this is not so with My servant Moses; he is faithful in all My house.a8I speak with him face to face, clearly and not in riddles; he sees the form of the LORD.

the disciples had to have their minds opened to understand the scriptures.

luke 24:45 45Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures.

therefore, I disagree with your interpretative method, especially when your prediction, based on your interpretation, failed to come to pass.

 

[Hammster]

I have read a lot of history, esp, authors like Herodotus, Tactius, Gibbon, John Bright; A History of Israel, etc.
Nowhere do they show when or where the graphically described prophesies happened.

Have you ever heard if the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple?

 

[keras]

You using modern knowledge to help “explain” what the ancient prophets describe, is you interpreting.

Firstly; I am not a Prophet. Just a messenger.
Second, our modern knowledge about the cosmos and tectonic plates, etc, are all verifiable facts.

Denial of these truths is just 'head in the sand'.

Have you ever heard if the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple?

Sure: Jesus said that would happen, Matthew 24:2
But then He went on to prophecy about events past that; how in the latter days, there would be wars and the birth pangs of the new age. Matthew 24:8
Which is what we have experienced, in increasing intensity over the last century.

Jesus also said: Take care that you be not deceived....
Seems that many have been somewhat careless.

 

[Hammster]

But then He went on to prophecy about events past that; how in the latter days, there would be wars and the birth pangs of the new age. Matthew 24:8
Which is what we have experienced, in increasing intensity over the last century.

Jesus also said: Take care that you be not deceived....
Seems that many have been somewhat careless.

He’s still describing the destruction of the temple.

 

[parousia70]

The Judgment of Jewish Israel remains to be fulfilled. They are back in the holy Land, but in apostasy.

Since The people who today occupy the land of Israel today have no verifiable relationship to the pre desolation hebrews, not genetically, not politically, not religiously, it is demonstrably incorrect to make the claim "They are back", since "they who are there now" have no relation to the pre desolation people at all. "They" are not "back".