Premillennialism ignores the tenses in the original Greek in order to sustain its teaching

[power1]

The Body of Christ was a mystery that began with the apostle Paul. He is the first member of that Body (1 Timothy 1:16)

I see no mystery in that verse. He suffered and mentioned hot that was an example or pattern for believers who come later. That does not mean he was the first believer or first one to suffer or the start of the church, or the first one to obtain mercy, etc.
1 Timothy 1:16
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting

But there are others who were in Christ before Paul (Romans 16:7).

Of course there were.

So those who are in Christ are not the same as those who are in the Body of Christ.

You made that up.
You read way too much into a verse and then build a doctrinal house of cards on that premise.

Only the Body of Christ will be raptured into the heavens.

Ah, now you try to extend that made up notion all the way to the Rapture. Got it.

Those who are in Christ belongs to the nation Israel and they will be on the Earth during the millennial reign.

All who accept and ask and believe belong to Christ. That did not start or end with poor old Paul. There is neither Jew nor Greek in Him. The church does not 'belong to the nation Israel'. We belong to Him. Now the remnant that get saved in the end will also belong to Him. But they will also be Israelites!

 

[power1]

A Jew that believes in Paul's gospel of grace now will be in the Body of Christ, like any gentile.

In the Body of Christ, there is neither Jew nor gentile (Galatians 3:28)

That is what I thought. But being in Him does not mean that, after the Rapture is long over, Jews who get saved will not be restored to the land as promised.

 

[Guojing]

That is what I thought. But being in Him does not mean that, after the Rapture is long over, Jews who get saved will not be restored to the land as promised.

In the eyes of God now, Israel has fallen (Romans 11:11).

Everyone on Earth is seen as uncircumcised in the eyes of God.

So if you happen to be a Jew now, you are as uncircumcised as any gentile.

Any present Jews now, their responsibility is like anyone of us, to be reconciled with God thru the gospel of grace of God (2 Corinthians 5:11-21).

But don't worry, there will be more than enough Jews that will be saved during the Tribulation, when the nation of Israel regains her favored status in the eyes of God.

 

[jeffweedaman]

In the eyes of God now, Israel has fallen (Romans 11:11).

Everyone on Earth is seen as uncircumcised in the eyes of God.

So if you happen to be a Jew now, you are as uncircumcised as any gentile.

Any present Jews now, their responsibility is like anyone of us, to be reconciled with God thru the gospel of grace of God (2 Corinthians 5:11-21).

Nice post.



[ But don't worry, there will be more than enough Jews that will be saved during the Tribulation, when the nation of Israel regains her favored status in the eyes of God.]

The believing remnant within Israel, past / present , have already regained their favored status. They are gifted with the Holy Spirit and are seated in the heavenly. They have come to the city of God....,


Heb 12
18 For you have not come to a mountain that can be touched and to a blazing fire, and to darkness and gloom and whirlwind, 19 and to the blast of a trumpet and the sound of words, which sound was such that those who heard begged that no further word be spoken to them. 20 For they could not cope with the command, “If even an animal touches the mountain, it shall be stoned.” 21 And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, “I am terrified and trembling.”

22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels, 23 to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the Judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, 24 and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel.


When Jesus comes we will inherit it fully. Matt 25.

 

[power1]

Your millennium is clearly miss placed, as Jesus didnt guess as to when the H/E pass away. He said it would at his coming and that is clearly after the millennium lol.

Not the same twenty minutes He comes. Context. We already know when the new heaven and earth arrive. No issue at all.

Yes it is after the millennium and you have been furnished with plenty of scriptures by Jesus , Paul and Peter that clearly suggest the millennium must be now.

Not a one. All we have been furnished with is your obstinate clinging to some impossible and anti bible notion that the day of the Lord and all events in it, is all contained in a few hours.
Admit defeat

 

[power1]

In the eyes of God now, Israel has fallen (Romans 11:11).

Hence why it needs to be saved.

Everyone on Earth is seen as uncircumcised in the eyes of God.

So if you happen to be a Jew now, you are as uncircumcised as any gentile.

So what? Not if our heart is right with Him.

Any present Jews now, their responsibility is like anyone of us, to be reconciled with God thru the gospel of grace of God (2 Corinthians 5:11-21).

Great, and if they do that up up up in the air with us they will come. The saved remnant later will live right here and have that land.

But don't worry, there will be more than enough Jews that will be saved during the Tribulation, when the nation of Israel regains her favored status in the eyes of God.

That only happens when they get saved in the end.

 

[Guojing]

That only happens when they get saved in the end.

No worries about that since Paul predicted that would happen in Romans 11:25-29

 

[power1]

No worries about that since Paul predicted that would happen in Romans 11:25-29

Right I am not worried.

 

[Guojing]

Nice post.

The believing remnant within Israel, past / present , have already regained their favored status. They are gifted with the Holy Spirit and are seated in the heavenly. They have come to the city of God....,

Heb 12
18 For you have not come to a mountain that can be touched and to a blazing fire, and to darkness and gloom and whirlwind, 19 and to the blast of a trumpet and the sound of words, which sound was such that those who heard begged that no further word be spoken to them. 20 For they could not cope with the command, “If even an animal touches the mountain, it shall be stoned.” 21 And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, “I am terrified and trembling.”

22 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels, 23 to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the Judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, 24 and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel.


When Jesus comes we will inherit it fully. Matt 25.

Because you do not distinguish between the nation of Israel and the Body of Christ, you won't be able to accept that the 2 groups have different destinies, one on Earth, one in the heavens.

 

[power1]

Because you do not distinguish between the nation of Israel and the Body of Christ, you won't be able to accept that the 2 groups have different destinies, one on Earth, one in the heavens.

That is true. However I seem to recall hearing somewhere that after the millennium is over we will all be one big happy family

 

[Guojing]

That is true. However I seem to recall hearing somewhere that after the millennium is over we will all be one big happy family

I would conclude that you share some of the beliefs of dispensationalism, even though you are not one. =)

 

[jeffweedaman]

Not the same twenty minutes He comes. Context. We already know when the new heaven and earth arrive. No issue at all.

Peter, in 2 pet 3 ,puts things in context. The promise of the Lords coming delivers a NHNE where righteousness dwells in Peter's mind. This Appropriately is referred to as the DAY OF GOD. Peter's day of God is like that in Noahs day. That = the judgment and destruction of ungodly men. Jesus coming fullfills Gods day of final judgment.


10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar and the elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and its works will be burned up.

11 Since all these things are to be destroyed in this way, what sort of people ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness, 12 looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be destroyed by burning, and the elements will melt with intense heat!
13 But according to His promise we are looking for new heavens and a new earth, in which righteousness dwells.


3 Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts, 4 and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming?

For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.” 5 For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water, 6 through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water.

7 But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.

 

[sovereigngrace]

Heaven and earth will not pass away until after the millennium. The actual day when Jesus will return was not known. The time when heaven and earth passes is known! That is 1000 years after He returns.


The detail is that this is after the 1000 years and I already gave the verses for that.

And Revelation 20-22 is the 7th of 7 recaps that concludes with the coming of Christ, the general resurrection/judgment and the ushering the NHNE and perfection. You propose more of the same for another 1000 years. More sin, more sickness, more death, more funerals, more hatred, more rapes, more war, more divorce, more debt, more blood sacrifices, more terror. Amils accept what the Bible says. This all comes to end when Jesus comes at His one final future all-consummating Coming.

 

[sovereigngrace]

Of course if you mean when he is loosed for a bit after the thousand years. Hopefully you are not conflating that with the time he was cast to earth and had a short time in the last seven years!?

You must think if you keep repeating this error of an unprovable last seven years tribulation period that we will just accept it as biblical when you have not been able to show one single rapture passage that teaches a last seven years tribulation following it. That is because this is an extra-biblical theory invented in the 1800s. What is more where is your 3rd coming? Nowhere. This whole doctrine cannot be proved, as you have demonstrated by your continuous avoidance.

 

[sovereigngrace]

Not the same twenty minutes He comes. Context. We already know when the new heaven and earth arrive. No issue at all.

Not a one. All we have been furnished with is your obstinate clinging to some impossible and anti bible notion that the day of the Lord and all events in it, is all contained in a few hours.
Admit defeat

That is a bit brazen coming from someone who is totally unable to biblically prove their end-time theory in any way. Amazing!

 

[power1]

I would conclude that you share some of the beliefs of dispensationalism, even though you are not one. =)

Once again, not familiar with the terms.

 

[power1]

Peter, in 2 pet 3 ,puts things in context. The promise of the Lords coming delivers a NHNE where righteousness dwells in Peter's mind. This Appropriately is referred to as the DAY OF GOD. Peter's day of God is like that in Noahs day. That = the judgment and destruction of ungodly men. Jesus coming fullfills Gods day of final judgment.


10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, in which the heavens will pass away with a roar and the elements will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and its works will be burned up.

Yes and that day of the Lord includes His return as well as rule on up to the end of the 1000 years. It's all His day.

Does all this sound like something that happens over a lunch break?
2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.

3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

There are still nations! It takes time to do all that, get established, teach, etc etc.

In that day of the Lord this also happens..

Isaiah 11:11
And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea
It takes time to gather people from all over the world.

The world is not burned up at all yet.

Isaiah 19:19
In that day shall there be an altar to the Lord in the midst of the land of Egypt, and a pillar at the border thereof to the Lord .
You see no one puts up an alter when the world is burned up and everyone dead!

Look, there will even be cattle and pastures!

Isaiah 30:23
Then shall he give the rain of thy seed, that thou shalt sow the ground withal; and bread of the increase of the earth, and it shall be fat and plenteous: in that day shall thy cattle feed in large pastures.


And people lying down safely

Ho 2:18 And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field and with the fowls of heaven, and with the creeping things of the ground: and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth, and will make them to lie down safely.

Joel 3:18
And it shall come to pass in that day, that the mountains shall drop down new wine, and the hills shall flow with milk, and all the rivers of Judah shall flow with waters, and a fountain shall come forth out of the house of the Lord , and shall water the valley of [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]tim.
The world is not all burned and all dead, sorry.

Your misplaced coloured bible verse spamming is a waste of our time.

 

[power1]

You must think if you keep repeating this error of an unprovable last seven years tribulation period that we will just accept it as biblical when you have not been able to show one single rapture passage that teaches a last seven years tribulation following it. That is because this is an extra-biblical theory invented in the 1800s. What is more where is your 3rd coming? Nowhere. This whole doctrine cannot be proved, as you have demonstrated by your continuous avoidance.

The Rapture verses are not the ones that cover the final years and last week of years in history. This is news?

 

[power1]

That is a bit brazen coming from someone who is totally unable to biblically prove their end-time theory in any way. Amazing!

Why try to cover the crux of the matter with your position? Will you admit that you try to place all the events in the day of the Lord (also 'those days' in that day' etc) into one single day or not? Be honest.

 

[sovereigngrace]

The Rapture verses are not the ones that cover the final years and last week of years in history. This is news?

We all know this! Where do you get it then? It is clearly not in the Bible. Where is it?

If it is not in the Bible, it is a man-made invention. It is adding unto Scripture. It should therefore be rejected.