Ten Reasons I'm a Sabbatarian [moved thread]

[bbbbbbb]

I don’t think you fully understand that when you tell people they should keep the 7th day commandment because it was given by God in Sinai (Exodus 20) you're telling people to follow the "letter" or "written code" of the law only given to Israel in Sinai through a covenant..

The great irony, of course, is that by insisting that people must keep the Sabbath, the SDA certainly does not mean the actual Sabbath as given by God to the Israelites on Mount Sinai, but the Sabbath invented by Mrs. White in the nineteenth century.

Likewise, by their insistence that Jesus demands that people keep the commandments of God, they ignore virtually all but ten of the actual commandments given by God in the Old Testament.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Now we are talking! Thankfully, we are both in agreement that neither of us follows God's commandments by the letter. You do your nineteenth-century Protestant church practices on Saturday and I do mine on Sunday. Neither of us is following God's commandment to the Israelites to the letter.

Please quote me where I said the letter didn't need to be kept? If you truly keep the Spirit of the law, you are keeping the letter. Jesus didn't say murder begins in the heart so it's okay if we literally murder someone as long as we don't have anger in the heart. Jesus came to magnify the law of God Isaiah 42:21 which means makes greater not lesser.

Maybe you can show me where Sunay keeping is a commandment of God, or a day that God blessed, made holy for Him or for us? Jesus warns us that if we obey traditions of man, which is Sunday keeping over obeying the commandments of God, which is Sabbath keeping Exodus 20:8-11 you are worshipping in vain. Matthew 15:3-9 these are not my words, so you don't need to convince me on your choices. We all answer to a Higher Savior and Redeemer.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

The great irony, of course, is that by insisting that people must keep the Sabbath, the SDA certainly does not mean the actual Sabbath as given by God to the Israelites on Mount Sinai, but the Sabbath invented by Mrs. White in the nineteenth century.

Maybe you can find in your bible where the SDA church wrote these Words?

Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

This is what the bible says:

Exodus 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He [God] wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

God personally spoke and personally wrote His holy laws, now written in our hearts and minds. Hebrews 8:10, Jer 31:33

Psalms 89:34 My covenant I will not break,
Nor alter the word that has gone out of My lips.

You don't need to convince me that you don't have to obey, but the Sabbath commandment that God promised is eternal Exodus 31:16 we see fullfed Isaiah 66:23 because we can trust what God tells us.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Please quote me where I said the letter didn't need to be kept? If you truly keep the Spirit of the law, you are keeping the letter. Jesus didn't say murder begins in the heart so it's okay if we literally murder someone as long as we don't have anger in the heart. Jesus came to magnify the law of God Isaiah 42:21 which means makes greater not lesser.

Maybe you can show me where Sunay keeping is a commandment of God, or a day that God blessed, made holy for Him or for us? Jesus warns us that if we obey traditions of man, which is Sunday keeping over obeying the commandments of God, which is Sabbath keeping Exodus 20:8-11 you are worshipping in vain. Matthew 15:3-9 these are not my words, so you don't need to convince me on your choices. We all answer to a Higher Savior and Redeemer.

Your first sentence in Post #577 reads as follows:

Please quote me where I have ever stated that we should only follow God's laws by the letter.

If what you said is true and you have never stated that we should only follow God's laws by the letter, do you or do you not believe that we should only follow God's laws by the letter?

A simple yes or no will answer the question.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Your first sentence in Post #577 reads as follows:

Please quote me where I have ever stated that we should only follow God's laws by the letter.

If what you said is true and you have never stated that we should only follow God's laws by the letter, do you or do you not believe that we should only follow God's laws by the letter?

A simple yes or no will answer the question.

I'm sorry, I am wonder if you comprehended my post. What you quoted does not say we should only follow God's law by the letter. Not sure what you're doing here but to make it as clear as possible, if we truly follow the Spirit of the Law of God, we will be following the letter. You cannot break the letter and be in the Spirit which is given to those who obey the commandments. John 14:15-18, Acts 5:32. Sin does not come from God and God does not want us to sin. When we sin willfully after knowing the truth there is no more sacrifice according to scripture Hebrews 10:26. We have time now to repent and turn from sin, but Jesus is coming back and it will be like the days of Noah. Not many people believed Noah, we should trust God, when He tells us to do something.

 

[bbbbbbb]

I'm sorry, I am wonder if you comprehended my post. What you quoted does not say we should only follow God's law by the letter. Not sure what you're doing here but to make it as clear as possible, if we truly follow the Spirit of the Law of God, we will be following the letter. You cannot break the letter and be in the Spirit which is given to those who obey the commandments. John 14:15-18, Acts 5:32. Sin does not come from God and God does not want us to sin. When we sin willfully after knowing the truth there is no more sacrifice according to scripture Hebrews 10:26. We have time now to repent and turn from sin, but Jesus is coming back and it will be like the days of Noah. Not many people believed Noah, we should trust God, when He tells us to do something.

Thanks for the clarification. Thus, as I understand you, the bottom line is that people will, perforce, obey God's commandments to the letter. Am I correct?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Thanks for the clarification. Thus, as I understand you, the bottom line is that people will, perforce, obey God's commandments to the letter. Am I correct?

We should obey because we love Jesus. Jesus asked us to obey the commandments John 14:15 and the commandments are not burdensome 1 John 5:3.

The commandments are a little like driving. There is the speed limit that you are aware of, but do you spend every second thinking about the speed limit? We are aware of the speed because we don’t want to break the law, but that doesn’t mean you spend every second thinking about the speed limit when you drive.

We want to be aware of God’s law so we don’t break it literally, but Jesus came to make the law of God greater Isaiah 42:21 and wants to change our thoughts so we not only literally not break the law, but we change our thoughts and feelings as shown Matthew 5:21-30. It’s starts with changing us from the inside out, God writes His laws in our hearts and we obey not because its a commandment, we obey out of LOVE. God wrote His laws in our minds because He wants us to remember to do them. Don’t be hearers of the Word of God, be doers. James 1:22. Revelation 22:14

 

[bbbbbbb]

We should obey because we love Jesus. Jesus asked us to obey the commandments John 14:15 and the commandments are not burdensome 1 John 5:3.

The commandments are a little like driving. There is the speed limit that you are aware of, but do you spend every second thinking about the speed limit? We are aware of the speed because we don’t want to break the law, but that doesn’t mean you spend every second thinking about the speed limit when you drive.

We want to be aware of God’s law so we don’t break it literally, but Jesus came to make the law of God greater Isaiah 42:21 and wants to change our thoughts so we not only literally not break the law, but we change our thoughts and feelings as shown Matthew 5:21-30. It’s starts with changing us from the inside out, God writes His laws in our hearts and we obey not because its a commandment, we obey out of LOVE. God wrote His laws in our minds because He wants us to remember to do them. Don’t be hearers of the Word of God, be doers. James 1:22. Revelation 22:14

So, why is it that you and other members of your denomination do "break God's Law literally" and not just figuratively?

You did not answer my question, by the way. Is my understanding which I posted in #586 correct or not?

A simply yes or no will suffice.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

So, why is it that you and other members of your denomination do "break God's Law literally" and not just figuratively?

You did not answer my question, by the way. Is my understanding which I posted in #586 correct or not?

A simply yes or no will suffice.

Are you claiming to be all knowing and know what over 20 million people do or don’t do? I would leave the judging to God, that is what is taught in scripture. I answered your question, you are free to disagree. God bless, its been nice chatting with you.

 

[pasifika]

I'm sorry, I am wonder if you comprehended my post. What you quoted does not say we should only follow God's law by the letter. Not sure what you're doing here but to make it as clear as possible, if we truly follow the Spirit of the Law of God, we will be following the letter. You cannot break the letter and be in the Spirit which is given to those who obey the commandments. John 14:15-18, Acts 5:32. Sin does not come from God and God does not want us to sin. When we sin willfully after knowing the truth there is no more sacrifice according to scripture Hebrews 10:26. We have time now to repent and turn from sin, but Jesus is coming back and it will be like the days of Noah. Not many people believed Noah, we should trust God, when He tells us to do something.

If you claim to follow the Spirit by means of following the letter or "written code" then you still following the letter Not the Spirit...

Notice, Romans 7:6...we serve in the "NEW WAY" of the SPIRIT, Not the "OLD WAY" of the "Written Code"...

The "new way" of the Spirit is Not the same as the "old way" of the "letter" or "written code"...Paul clearly explains it...

2Corinthians 3:6..."New covenant NOT OF THE "LETTER" But of the "SPIRIT"...

The Spirit, will fulfill the letter but the way of the Spirit is Not by the way of the letter..

 

[SabbathBlessings]

If you claim to follow the Spirit by means of following the letter or "written code" then you still following the letter Not the Spirit...

Notice, Romans 7:6...we serve in the "NEW WAY" of the SPIRIT, Not the "OLD WAY" of the "Written Code"...

The "new way" of the Spirit is Not the same as the "old way" of the "letter" or "written code"...Paul clearly explains it...

2Corinthians 3:6..."New covenant NOT OF THE "LETTER" But of the "SPIRIT"...

The Spirit, will fulfill the letter but the way of the Spirit is Not by the way of the letter..

So when you lust for someone that is not your spouse are you allowed to literally commit adultery? I don’t think there is anywhere in scripture that literally allows you to break the law of God.

When you follow the Spirit you are obeying the literal laws. If you find yourself sinning and breaking God’s laws, the Holy Spirit is not guiding you, that is a another spirit. Jesus tells us we receive the Holy Spirit when we keep the commandments of God, not break them. John 14:15. Acts 5:32. The disciples tell us to test ourselves to ensure we are following God. Sin does not come from God.

I am not the one you need to convince that it’s okay to break God’s laws. There is plenty of scripture warning of this very thing, but unfortunately not every hears.

Gods bless!

 

[bbbbbbb]

Are you claiming to be all knowing and know what over 20 million people do or don’t do? I would leave the judging to God, that is what is taught in scripture. I answered your question, you are free to disagree. God bless, its been nice chatting with you.

I politely disagree. You did not confirm whether or not my understanding of your position is correct. Please do so and please cease obfuscating our discussion.

 

[pasifika]

So when you lust for someone that is not your spouse are you allowed to literally commit adultery? I don’t think there is anywhere in scripture that literally allows you to break the law of God.

When you follow the Spirit you are obeying the literal laws. If you find yourself sinning and breaking God’s laws, the Holy Spirit is not guiding you, that is a another spirit. Jesus tells us we receive the Holy Spirit when we keep the commandments of God, not break them. John 14:15. Acts 5:32. The disciples tell us to test ourselves to ensure we are following God. Sin does not come from God.

I am not the one you need to convince that it’s okay to break God’s laws. There is plenty of scripture warning of this very thing, but unfortunately not every hears.

Gods bless!

Do you think the Spirit will lead people to lust? Or commit evil acts?

You follow a written law, but the law has no power to change the sinful nature.

Hebrews 7:19...for the law made "nothing" perfect...

so by claiming that you follow God's law by means of the "letter" shows lack of knowledge..

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Do you think the Spirit will lead people to lust? Or commit evil acts?

You follow a written law, but the law has no power to change the sinful nature.

Hebrews 7:19...for the law made "nothing" perfect...

so by claiming that you follow God's law by means of the "letter" shows lack of knowledge..

Please quote me where I said I only follow the letter of the law? If you can’t quote me saying that than I suggest you stop trying to pretend you know what I do or how I think and lets focus on scripture.

No I do not think the Spirit will lead people to lust or evil acts so if you find yourself sinning, which means breaking the law of God 1 John 3:4, Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7 you are not following the Spirit of God. That’s why we are to test ourselves to make sure we are in the faith and if you find yourself sinning i.e. breaking the law of God its best to repent and turn from sin, because the Spirit is given to those who obey. John 14:15, Acts 5:32

The law of God IS perfect and reflects the nature of our Creator. Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul; The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple;


There are different laws in the Bible, God only personally wrote the Ten Commandments with His own finger and personally spoke the Ten with His own voice. God’s covenant He will not break Psalms 89:34 which the ark of the covenant that carries the Ten Commandments is also revealed in heaven Revelations 11:19. If we are led by the Spirit, we will be keeping the letter, not breaking it.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Please quote me where I said I only follow the letter of the law? If you can’t quote me saying that than I suggest you stop trying to pretend you know what I do or how I think and lets focus on scripture.

No I do not think the Spirit will lead people to lust or evil acts so if you find yourself sinning, which means breaking the law of God 1 John 3:4, Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7 you are not following the Spirit of God. That’s why we are to test ourselves to make sure we are in the faith and if you find yourself sinning i.e. breaking the law of God its best to repent and turn from sin, because the Spirit is given to those who obey. John 14:15, Acts 5:32

The law of Gods IS perfect Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul; The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple;


There are different laws in the Bible, God only personally wrote the Ten Commandments with His own finger and personally spoke the Ten with His own voice. God’s covenant He will not break Psalms 89:34 which the ark of the covenant that carries the Ten Commandments is also revealed in heaven Revelations 11:19. If we are led by the Spirit, we will be keeping the letter, not breaking it.

You have, thus far, obfuscated in answering the question regarding whether or not you think that people will, perforce, obey the letter of the law. Will they or will they not? Do you?

 

[pasifika]

Please quote me where I said I only follow the letter of the law? If you can’t quote me saying that than I suggest you stop trying to pretend you know what I do or how I think and lets focus on scripture.

No I do not think the Spirit will lead people to lust or evil acts so if you find yourself sinning, which means breaking the law of God 1 John 3:4, Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7 you are not following the Spirit of God. That’s why we are to test ourselves to make sure we are in the faith and if you find yourself sinning i.e. breaking the law of God its best to repent and turn from sin, because the Spirit is given to those who obey. John 14:15, Acts 5:32

The law of God IS perfect and reflects the nature of our Creator. Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul; The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple;


There are different laws in the Bible, God only personally wrote the Ten Commandments with His own finger and personally spoke the Ten with His own voice. God’s covenant He will not break Psalms 89:34 which the ark of the covenant that carries the Ten Commandments is also revealed in heaven Revelations 11:19. If we are led by the Spirit, we will be keeping the letter, not breaking it.

This is the letter of the law...2Corinthians 3:6,7....for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life...

...ministry that brought death, which was engraved in "letters" on stone,...

 

[SabbathBlessings]

This is the letter of the law...2Corinthians 3:6,7....for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life...

...ministry that brought death, which was engraved in "letters" on stone,...

Haven’t we been though this before?

It’s the condemnation of the law that kills, not God’s laws that was personally written by the hand of God ands kept in the ark of the covenant in the Most Holy of God’s Temple which is also revealed in heaven Revelation 11:19

God’s laws are written on the heart and mind Hebrews 8:10, Jer 31:33. The application of the law changed, not the law. We obey because we love. John 14:15, John 15:10, 1 John 5:3

We are BLESSED when we obey Revelation 22:14 I can’t speak for you, but I want God to bless me and obeying His laws are not burdensome because I love God with all my heart

We will have to agree to disagree. Take care.

 

[klutedavid]

Maybe you can find in your bible where the SDA church wrote these Words?

Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

This is what the bible says:

Exodus 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He [God] wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

God personally spoke and personally wrote His holy laws, now written in our hearts and minds. Hebrews 8:10, Jer 31:33

Psalms 89:34 My covenant I will not break,
Nor alter the word that has gone out of My lips.

You don't need to convince me that you don't have to obey, but the Sabbath commandment that God promised is eternal Exodus 31:16 we see fullfed Isaiah 66:23 because we can trust what God tells us.

You quoted this line, "the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments."

That covenant was the old covenant, an obsolete covenant. The very words of that old covenant, the book of the law, is an obsolete book.

We are in a new covenant now, a covenant of grace, a covenant based on Christ.

The Spirit has written the law of love upon our hearts.

 

[klutedavid]

Haven’t we been though this before?

It’s the condemnation of the law that kills, not God’s laws that was personally written by the hand of God ands kept in the ark of the covenant in the Most Holy of God’s Temple which is also revealed in heaven Revelation 11:19

God’s laws are written on the heart and mind Hebrews 8:10, Jer 31:33. The application of the law changed, not the law. We obey because we love. John 14:15, John 15:10, 1 John 5:3

We are BLESSED when we obey Revelation 22:14 I can’t speak for you, but I want God to bless me and obeying His laws are not burdensome because I love God with all my heart

We will have to agree to disagree. Take care.

The yoke of the law is a heavy yoke. I bet there were many Sabbath days when you did not want to go to church. I cannot imagine how much you suffered, sitting around all day on Saturday. While the people you knew were out and about.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

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