I changed my stance on gun control!!!

[Aldebaran]

No, they are simply in another realm when it comes to damage done. But if that is the case you should have no complaints at all if hot rounds that have such high velocities are banned. After all, it makes not difference according to you.

The difference is that AR owners would end up converting to .308, and then watch what happens.

 

[ArmenianJohn]

Is homosexuality encouraged in God's Word? If you believe so, I'd be interested in any bible verses that supposedly support it.

What does that have to do with this discussion?

 

[Subduction Zone]

That's not all it's good for, first off. And making a round illegal makes all the guns that people already own in that caliber illegal. Why? There's no reason for it. It does nothing but make law-abiding gun owners into instant criminals. It would not stop a single shooting.

And yet that has been shown to be wrong in country after country.

 

[Subduction Zone]

That's not all it's good for, first off. And making a round illegal makes all the guns that people already own in that caliber illegal. Why? There's no reason for it. It does nothing but make law-abiding gun owners into instant criminals. It would not stop a single shooting.

Or they would simply have to use rounds of much lower power. They might have to adapt the mechanism for semi-automatics at the most. Many years ago I had a .22 semi-auto that could take anything from shorts to long rifle ammo and it had no problem. And there is far more powder behind a LR .22 cartridge than you find in a short.

 

[Aldebaran]

What does that have to do with this discussion?

It is a question in response to your comment, and therefore a continuation of the discussion.
Still waiting for an answer to my question....

 

[ArmenianJohn]

It is a question in response to your comment, and therefore a continuation of the discussion.
Still waiting for an answer to my question....

It's not a question that has anything to do with the discussion, though. There is the answer to your question.

My question now in response to your comment is do you believe that God's Word encourages lying and stealing?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Those with criminal intent and live in areas with strict gun control have figured this out. That's why attacks and killings are up with knives. The result? Knife control: Knives taken off supermarket shelves in New Zealand after terrorist attack

Nice aim! You shot yourself in the foot. Please note that this appears to have been a spontaneous action by the store owner and also of several other stores. It was not a government mandate. Worse yet is that the attack that caused this only wounded six people only three of which were serious enough to require hospitalization. The man was still shot and killed by the police in very short time. Meanwhile here is your source's account of the incidence that led to severe gun control in New Zealand:

"In 2019, a white supremacist shot and killed 51 people at two Christchurch mosques. The incident was labeled as terrorism by Ardern following the deadly attack, which also injured 40 others, according to The Washington Post."

You just showed that gun control works amazingly well.

 

[Aldebaran]

It's not a question that has anything to do with the discussion, though. There is the answer to your question.

My question now in response to your comment is do you believe that God's Word encourages lying and stealing?

Your avoidance of the question is noted. So are you saying that God's Word does encourage homosexuality? You may post the book, chapter and verse that says in any way that God encourages it. If not, then I'll accept a passage of scripture that says the opposite. Either if fine.

 

[Aldebaran]

Nice aim! You shot yourself in the foot. Please note that this appears to have been a spontaneous action by the store owner and also of several other stores. It was not a government mandate. Worse yet is that the attack that caused this only wounded six people only three of which were serious enough to require hospitalization. The man was still shot and killed by the police in very short time. Meanwhile here is your source's account of the incidence that led to severe gun control in New Zealand:

"In 2019, a white supremacist shot and killed 51 people at two Christchurch mosques. The incident was labeled as terrorism by Ardern following the deadly attack, which also injured 40 others, according to The Washington Post."

You just showed that gun control works amazingly well.

Actually, you just showed how guns are more effective than knives at stopping criminal activity. I appreciate that!

 

[Subduction Zone]

The difference is that AR owners would end up converting to .308, and then watch what happens.

The size of the cartridge is not what would be banned. It is the amount of powder behind a round that would need to be limited. One is far less likely to over power a larger round since then one begins to have some serious problems with recoil. A small caliber gun with a very hot round, such as many current .223 cartridges are worrisome because they do allow multiple shots in quick succession without lost of control of the firearm. That along with huge clips can make "pray and spray" an effective method of attack. Try that with a .30-06. Regular rounds have a fairly high recoil.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Actually, you just showed how guns are more effective than knives at stopping criminal activity. I appreciate that!

The rest of us already knew that. What your article showed is that deaths from weapons other than guns would have a much much lower death rate. You cannot say that for the attacker, and I do not mind that one bit.

 

[renniks]

If you don't mind killing your neighbor maybe.
For home defense people would actually recommend #4 buckshot in a 12guage or #3 buckshot in a 20 guage, as it'll penetrate enough to be effective without overpenetrating with enough force to kill someone through exterior walls and going into another house... in an apartment where your walls are drywall between you and another apartment? Probably no firearm you can use that doesn't risk killing your neighbor while defending yourself, though hollowpoints/soft points will help because of the expansion helping to prevent overpenetration after hitting your intended target, but if you miss? That's going through dry wall easy.

as rdkirk said too, you still have to aim a shotgun. at 10 yards even using a 14 inch barrel on a shockwave or tac-14, you'd still get only a few inches of spread. Even with bird shot it's only about 6 inches of spread at that distance.. and that's a distance like across your entire house.

A few inches is still better than a single projectile.
I actually have turkey loads instead of buckshot but I don't have any close neighbors to worry about either.

 

[renniks]

And yet that has been shown to be wrong in country after country.

Other countries banned only .223 caliber bullets?

 

[renniks]

The size of the cartridge is not what would be banned. It is the amount of powder behind a round that would need to be limited. One is far less likely to over power a larger round since then one begins to have some serious problems with recoil. A small caliber gun with a very hot round, such as many current .223 cartridges are worrisome because they do allow multiple shots in quick succession without lost of control of the firearm. That along with huge clips can make "pray and spray" an effective method of attack. Try that with a .30-06. Regular rounds have a fairly high recoil.

Lol, I'd rather have a guy spraying then a sniper with a 30.06 any day. The guy who knows how to shoot isn't going to wound anyone, everyone would be dead. Recoil doesn't even register when you are on adrenaline, BTW.

 

[renniks]

The size of the cartridge is not what would be banned. It is the amount of powder behind a round that would need to be limited.

Facepalm!
You really should educate yourself.... it's embarrassing.

 

[ArmenianJohn]

Your avoidance of the question is noted.

I answered your question.

So are you saying that God's Word does encourage homosexuality? You may post the book, chapter and verse that says in any way that God encourages it. If not, then I'll accept a passage of scripture that says the opposite. Either if fine.

I said "that God's Word does encourage homosexuality?" Where? Why do you ask a question if you are just going to make up the answer yourself anyway?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Other countries banned only .223 caliber bullets?

Other countries do not have private ownership of guns in the same way that we do. I would hope that we do not have to go so far.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Facepalm!
You really should educate yourself.... it's embarrassing.

As usual, it is the other way around. Need I remind you that you were the one that conflated momentum with energy.

Tell me, what do you not like about my possible solution?

 

[renniks]

As usual, it is the other way around. Need I remind you that you were the one that conflated momentum with energy.

Tell me, what do you not like about my possible solution?

Everything about it. It's total nonsense.
It would render many rounds completely useless.
You apparently don't understand how bullets work.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Lol, I'd rather have a guy spraying then a sniper with a 30.06 any day. The guy who knows how to shoot isn't going to wound anyone, everyone would be dead. Recoil doesn't even register when you are on adrenaline, BTW.

Mass shooting incidents very rarely involve snipers. The only recent case I can think of were the Washington DC area killings by the pair where a kid was driven around by an older man.

Sniper's are best for selected individual targets. It is a waste to use them in general combat.