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MARK OF THE BEAST - REVELATION 13-14; 17; 18

Valletta

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You are correct Valletta.

The Vulgate is a late-4th-century Latin translation of the Bible (wiki)

At least the Vulgate used the Septuagint version of the Old Testament. Unlike the Protestant Bibles that use the Masoretic version of the Old Testament.

During the rise of Christianity in the 1st century CE, new scriptures were written in Greek about the life and teachings of Jesus Christ, who Christians believed was the messiah prophesized in the books of the Hebrew Bible. Two collections of these new scriptures – the Pauline epistles and the Gospels – were accepted as canon by the end of the 2nd century CE. A third collection, the catholic epistles, were canonized over the next few centuries. Christians called these new scriptures the "New Testament", and began referring to the Septuagint as the "Old Testament".[22]
(wiki)

I think that the early Christian, Gentile churches, never changed from Saturday to Sunday. The earliest church letters indicate that the Sunday gathering to break the bread. Has always been the day the the Gentile Christians gathered. So I would strongly oppose anyone who claimed that any Christian church, changed the day from Saturday to Sunday.
Yes, and the Catholic Church used the Septuagint because that's what the Apostles taught from--roughly two thirds of the OT references in the NT are found in the Septuagint. It's interesting, the first converts were Jews and they did not quickly discard their practices.
 
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Douggg

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Hi LGW,

The Mark of the Beast in more detail - ``And he causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast or the number of his name.` (Rev. 13: 16 & 17)

So we see the Mark is related to buying and selling and that everyone will have it who wants to be in the Global Economy. Thus the World will have brought together all the nations finances and institutions to be able to have control over them. This is coming together now through the central banks digital currencies & finally connected to the IMF, (International Monetary Fund).

THE MARK – Gk. `charagma,` a distinguishing sign as a badge of servitude.

This I see as a chip implanted under the skin with all the details of that person`s life, health, medical, finance, etc. Information of that individual that is presently available on our chips, on our cards or in our phones. Information that separates you from every other person on the planet. Information that is needed to connect you into man`s new order. Then finally it is information that means allegiance to the Global Leader.



THE NAME – Gk. `onoma,` a `name,` (lit. or fig.) authority, character.

This I see as the authority of the world leader. If you desire to `buy or sell` then you will need this authority. Today we need to have all sorts of authority to work in opportunity shops to working with children, to doing business etc. The world system requires their authority for you to transact & do business. The world system believes it has the power & authority to regulate people`s buying & selling.

It will be the authorisation from the IMF, (International Monetary Fund) and will be stored on the chip, (the Mark) also.



THE NUMBER – Gk. `arithmos,` a number, from `airo,` reckoned, accounted, computored.

`Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is 666.` (Rev. 13: 18)

I believe the number of the `beast,` the Global Leader is his numbering system for every person on the planet and stored on the Mark. It will be a number within 6 digits, 6 digits, 6 digits.
Hi Marilyn, I disagree with the specifics you are making, but at least you are thinking trying to figure it out.

To me, which I don't have it figured out either, the critical point is his name. To me, it is about identity of who the person is. Need God's help for sure in solving these things.

1. his name.
2. the number of his name .
3. the mark of his name.
 
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Marilyn C

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Hi Marilyn, I disagree with the specifics you are making, but at least you are thinking trying to figure it out.

To me, which I don't have it figured out either, the critical point is his name. To me, it is about identity of who the person is. Need God's help for sure in solving these things.

1. his name.
2. the number of his name .
3. the mark of his name.

Hi Douggg,

Check out the word `name` in Greek - `onoma,` a `name,` (lit. or fig.) authority, character.

I think that says it all - AUTHORITY, to buy and sell.
 
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Douggg

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Hi Douggg,

Check out the word `name` in Greek - `onoma,` a `name,` (lit. or fig.) authority, character.

I think that says it all - AUTHORITY, to buy and sell.
I don't think the person's name will be authority.
 
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Berean Tim

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Mark of the beast refers to Nero's time.
Nero never went to Judea, much less sat in the Temple. Who was Nero's False Prophet ? He didn't have a healed fatal head wound. No FP caused people to build/make an image of him that speaks.
 
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Marilyn C

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I don't think the person's name will be authority.

Think about the `names` we have to have in our lives to give us access to certain things - Police check (name/authority) to work in places with children, Bank name/authority to withdrawl or deposit, etc, health care name for authority to receive medical assistance, a `v` card (name of register of `v`) to have authority to go to certain places, etc etc.

Our lives are full of `names,` that we need to have their authority to do things.
 
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eclipsenow

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Nero never went to Judea, much less sat in the Temple. Who was Nero's False Prophet ? He didn't have a healed fatal head wound. No FP caused people to build/make an image of him that speaks.
Doesn't have to work like that.
People just collect various verses and make them prescriptive - like some kind of huge checklist - that such and such a figure or event 'must' have to qualify. It doesn't work like that. As I've shared before,
first of all, Rev 13: Weirdly - we have to go to Deuteronomy's 'Shema' - the prayer of devotion to God - to understand the mark of the beast.

Deuteronomy 6:4-8 "Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength. These commandments that I give you today are to be on your hearts. Impress them on your children. Talk about them when you sit at home and when you walk along the road, when you lie down and when you get up. Tie them as symbols on your hands and bind them on your foreheads."

Then when we come to Revelation 13, we have Military power represented in the first beast and the propaganda machine for Economic power in the second beast. Now, what's with the 666? First, the Hebrew number symbolism is significant, in that 6 is the number of a man. It's the number of the day we were created on, the days of the week we work, and short of God's perfect 7. There's also another potential twist - the gematria (taking Hebrew letters as numbers) for both "BEAST" and / or "Nero Caesar" apparently both equal 666 when added up from the Hebrew.

In other words, don't bind your politics and materialism to your hands and forehead. Don't worship your leader or money. Stay true to Christ - no matter what happens. Jesus is worth it. Instead - be one of those in the very next Chapter that have their Father's name written on their foreheads! This rings far more true than some silicon chip implant. I mean, are we really going to give someone like the head of Microsoft MORE power than Jesus? Jesus died and rose again for all those who trust in him, and then Satya Nadella comes along and sticks a chip in your hand and forehead and suddenly you've lost your salvation?

I don't think so!

This video explains more - 11 minutes for the second half of Revelation - well worth it. Share at church!

Now, over to my mate Dr Greg Clarke on the AntiChrist....


John writes that “many antichrists have come”, reminding us that there has been great opposition to Christ ever since he was born (remember how Herod killed all the babies in Bethlehem trying to get to Jesus?). Throughout the whole Bible, we find characters who are ‘anti’ God’s plans—wicked men, foreign kings, false prophets and ‘the beast’ who features in Revelation 13. Even in Deuteronomy, there are warnings about the rise of prophets who lie and preach rebellion against the true God.
But is there going to be one mega-evil ruler who will deceive the world and lead millions astray and do things like brand ‘666’ on their foreheads?
Probably not. There are passages in the Bible which talk about a particular being who is Christ’s foe (e.g., “the man of lawlessness” in 2 Thessalonians 2 or the dragon of Revelation 12-13 who is identified as the Devil). But this kind of symbolic language is used to describe an attitude or spirit of evil rather than a single evil person. The fact that some parts of Scripture bring ultimate evil to a head by using an individual character to identify it probably says more about how dramatic literature operates than it does about predicting history.
The worst thing about antichrists is that they have come from within the church! The apostle John wrote that they “went out from us, but they did not really belong to us”. This is what antichrists do. They get among believers and try to deceive them, persuading them to believe lies and getting people to follow them and their deceptions rather than Jesus and his truth. They teach that Christ did not come in the flesh (1 Jn 4:1-3); they say it doesn’t matter whether you sin or not (1 Jn 1:5-10); and they neglect their Christian brothers and sisters (1 Jn 4:19-21).

According to God’s word, the antichrist might have sat next to you in the church pew. This isn’t a scene from a horror movie; quite the opposite-it is an everyday event. In this final age before Jesus returns, plenty of opponents of Jesus will arise. And they may even be in church, trying to deceive us and lead us into error. But Christians can be confident and at peace, because there will be a day when all ‘antichristness’ will be done away with.

It’s a bit of a waste of time trying to work out whether the antichrist is Boris Yeltsin, the Dalai Lama, Bill Gates or the Pope. It’s just as likely to be your granny or your next door neighbour, if they are promoting lies about our Lord.

Just make sure it isn’t you …

See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. If it does, you also will remain in the Son and in the Father. And this is what he promised us—even eternal life. (1 John 2:24-25)
The devil you know
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Hi LGW,

The Mark of the Beast in more detail - ``And he causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast or the number of his name.` (Rev. 13: 16 & 17)

So we see the Mark is related to buying and selling and that everyone will have it who wants to be in the Global Economy. Thus the World will have brought together all the nations finances and institutions to be able to have control over them. This is coming together now through the central banks digital currencies & finally connected to the IMF, (International Monetary Fund).

THE MARK – Gk. `charagma,` a distinguishing sign as a badge of servitude.

This I see as a chip implanted under the skin with all the details of that person`s life, health, medical, finance, etc. Information of that individual that is presently available on our chips, on our cards or in our phones. Information that separates you from every other person on the planet. Information that is needed to connect you into man`s new order. Then finally it is information that means allegiance to the Global Leader.



THE NAME – Gk. `onoma,` a `name,` (lit. or fig.) authority, character.

This I see as the authority of the world leader. If you desire to `buy or sell` then you will need this authority. Today we need to have all sorts of authority to work in opportunity shops to working with children, to doing business etc. The world system requires their authority for you to transact & do business. The world system believes it has the power & authority to regulate people`s buying & selling.

It will be the authorisation from the IMF, (International Monetary Fund) and will be stored on the chip, (the Mark) also.



THE NUMBER – Gk. `arithmos,` a number, from `airo,` reckoned, accounted, computored.

`Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is 666.` (Rev. 13: 18)

I believe the number of the `beast,` the Global Leader is his numbering system for every person on the planet and stored on the Mark. It will be a number within 6 digits, 6 digits, 6 digits.

Hi Marilyn, thanks for joining us.

I think you are heading in the right direction with some things in this post in regards to the number of His name. I posted on this earlier in the thread but will post it again here although it needs to be considered in context with some other studies that identify the beasts of Daniel and Revelation, the little Horn, Babylon, the mother of harlots, and the mark of the beast that ends up pointing to the Roman Catholic Church (not the people) system and teachings...

The number of the beast is the number of a man. These are the various names in Latin, Hebrew and Greek of the Pope of the Roman Catholic Church and the church itself...

VICARIUS FILII DEI 666, The Number of the Beast in Greek, Latin and Hebrew

Rev 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Note that according to verse 17, there are three different characteristics that distinguish the beast:
  • his mark (of authority)
  • his name
  • the number of his name (666).
It might be argued by some that 666 must be applied to one man's name, and that this will then help identify him as the antichrist. I would offer the following verse to show that 666 need not apply solely to a man's name:

Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

The same Greek word translated as name (onoma: G3686) that appears in Revelation 13:17-18 is also used in chapter 19:16, so clearly the word can also apply to a title, and not just one man's name. Now, we are told that it takes a certain understanding and wisdom to discern just how this number is actually applied. Based on the fact that 666 can apply to a title, below are several words and phrases that have been put forth over the centuries as probable solutions to the enigma of 666.

GREEK
The numeric equivalents of Greek letters can also be found in the Encyclopedia Britannica under "Languages of the World", Table 8.

The ancient Greek word for "the Latin speaking man" is LATEINOS

L = 30 lambda
A = 1 alpha
T = 300 tau
E = 5 epsilon
I = 10 iota
N = 50 nu
O = 70 omicron
S = 200 sigma
------------
666

NOTE: Latin is the official language of the Roman Catholic Church. Church Documents are usually published first in Latin, and then translated from the Latin into other languages. The association of "Lateinos" with 666 was first suggested by Irenæus (ca. 130-202 A.D.) who proposed in his Against Heresies that it might be the name of the fourth kingdom in Daniel 7:7.

Then also Lateinos has the number six hundred and sixty-six; and it is a very probable [solution], this being the name of the last kingdom [of the four seen by Daniel]. For the Latins are they who at present bear rule: I will not, however, make any boast over this [coincidence].

Source: Against Heresies, by Irenæus, Book 5, chapter 30, paragraph 3.
St. Irenaeus biography online at the New Advent Catholic web site.

The ancient Greek for
"The Latin Kingdom" is

HE LATINE BASILEIA
BASILEIA is Strong's # G932 The ancient Greek for
"Italian Church" is
ITALIKA EKKLESIA EKKLESIA is Strong's # G1577 And in ancient Greek
the word APOSTATES And in ancient Greek
the word for "tradition"

PARADOSIS

Strong's # G3862
H = 0 (transliterated)
E = 8 eta

L = 30 lambda
A = 1 alpha
T = 300 tau
I = 10 iota
N = 50 nu
E = 8 eta

B = 2 beta
A = 1 alpha
S = 200 sigma
I = 10 iota
L = 30 lambda
E = 5 epsilon
I = 10 iota
A = 1 alpha
666

I
= 10 iota
T = 300 tau
A = 1 alpha
L = 30 lambda
I = 10 iota
K = 20 kappa
A = 1 alpha

E = 5 epsilon
K = 20 kappa
K = 20 kappa
L = 30 lambda
E = 8 eta
S = 200 sigma
I = 10 iota
A = 1 alpha
666


A
= 1 alpha
P = 80 pi
O = 70 omicron
ST = 6 stigma*
A = 1 alpha
T = 300 tau
E = 8 eta
S = 200 sigma
666

* Stigma is a now obsolete Greek character, but it appears in the New Testament in Rev 13:18 to give the value 666 (chi xi stigma - See Strong's Concordance, # G5516).

P = 80 pi
A = 1 alpha
R = 100 rho
A = 1 alpha
D = 4 delta
O = 70 omicron
S = 200 sigma
I = 10 iota
S = 200 sigma
666

LATIN

NUMERAL NAME VALUE
I unus 1
V quinque 5
X decem 10
L quinquaginta 50
C centum 100
D quingenti 500
M mille 1000

VICARIUS FILII DEI
THE LITERAL MEANING: VICARIUS - substituting for, or in place of
FILII - means son
DEI - means GOD

V = 5
I = 1
C = 100
A = no value
R = no value
I = 1
U/V = 5
S = no value
..............
112

F
= no value
I = 1
L = 50
I = 1
I = 1
--------
53

D = 500
E = no value
I = 1
--------
501

-------

112 + 53 + 501 = 666

................

DUX CLERI
translated means Captain of the Clergy LUDOVICUS
translated means Vicar of the Court
D = 500
U = 5
X = 10

C = 100
L = 50
E = no value
R = no value
I = 1
----------------
666

L
= 50
U = 5
D = 500
O = no value
V = 5
I = 1
C = 100
U = 5
S = no value
----------------
666
....................

HEBREW

The numeric equivalents of Hebrew letters can be found in the Encyclopedia Britannica under "Languages of the World", Table 50.

ROMIITH

means the Roman Kingdom

R = 200 resh
O = 6 waw (vav)
M = 40 mem
I = 10 yod
I = 10 yod
TH = 400 taw
--------------
666


ROMITI
means the Roman Man

R = 200 resh
O = 6 waw (vav)
M = 40 mem
I = 10 yod
T = 400 taw
I = 10 yod
----------
666


Note:

  • Lateinos, Ecclesia Italika, and Romith are cited as possible solutions by Johannes Gerhard (1582-1637), a Lutheran, in his Adnotationes in Apocalypsin, page 110.
  • Romith, Vicarius Filii Dei, Dux Cleri, Ordinarius Ovilis Christi Pastor, and Dic Lux are cited by the rector of Berlin, Andreas Helwig [or Helwich] (1572-1643) in his Antichristus Romanus, in proprio suo nomine, numerum illum Apocalypticum (DCLXVI) continente proditus, published in 1612 in Wittenberg.
  • Dux Cleri is cited by Walter Brute (or Britte), a fourteenth century follower of Wycliff, in his Registrum, page 356.
  • Ludovicus was proposed by James Bicheno (d. 1831), a British minister and author, applying it at the time to the French King Louis XIV, as the two-horned beast from the earth.
  • He Latine Basileia and Lateinos are cited by Alexander Campbell (1788-1866), founder of the Disciples of Christ, in A Debate on the Roman Catholic Religion of 1837.
See The PROPHETIC FAITH OF OUR FATHERS, The Historical Development of Prophetic Interpretation, by Le Roy Edwin Froom, Volumes II and IV, published by the Review and Herald Publishing Association, Washington D.C., Copyright 1948.

This relationship of 666 in Greek, Latin, and Hebrew is only one relatively small, yet important indicator that the Papacy is the Antichrist and the beast from the sea of Revelation 13. This association by itself proves little, as 666 can fit other people using the same methods. All the other biblical characteristics of the Antichrist must be considered and met as well, then this association becomes significant.

An objection has been raised that the method of gematria used above to calculate the Roman numeral value of phrases is incorrect. The word VICARIUS it is argued, must be calculated with letters grouped as follows: VI=6 C=100 A=0 R=0 IU= 4 S=0, for a value of only 110, instead of 112. This is patently incorrect. The value of each individual letter is to be added to yield a total value. It is totally irrelevant to the calculation if adjacent letters can be combined in groups to give a value. This assertion that letters must be grouped is nothing but sheer nonsense.

666 and CÆSAR NERO


Some will suggest that the book of Revelation was written only for those living at the time, and that 666 most probably applies to Cæsar Nero, who ruled Rome from 54 to 68 A.D., rather than someone from latter centuries. This point of view, which suggests Revelation had an immediate application to the first century, rather than being prophetic, is known as preterism, and is commonly held by the Catholic Church. So, just how is Nero linked to 666?

The preterist takes a relatively uncommon form of Nero's name, Nero Cæsar or Cæsar Nero, and adds an "n", resulting in Neron Cæsar. Next the Latin is transliterated into Aramaic, resulting in nrwn qsr, which when using the numeric equivalent of the letters, then adds up to 666 as follows:

Nun = 50
Resh = 200
Waw = 6
Nun = 50

Qoph = 100
Samech = 60
Resh = 200
...................
666

An example of this spelling has apparently been recently discovered in one of the Dead Sea scrolls. If you use the same process, but without the added "n" the result is 616. Interestingly, some early manuscripts have 616 rather than 666, but even scholars such as Irenæus [A.D. 120-202] attribute the 616 to only a copyist error (Against Heresies: Book V Chapter XXX.), "this number [666] being found in all the most approved and ancient copies" [of the Apocalypse] and asserts that "men who saw John face to face bearing their testimony" [to it - 666].

There is a problem though with the above calculation. According to the rules of Jewish numerology, known as gematria, when the letter Nun appears a second time in a word, it is known as a "Final", and takes the value of 700.* So to be precise, NRWN QSR actually adds up to 1316 and not 666.

*Source: Behind Numerology, by Shirley Blackwell Lawrence, copyright 1989, published by Newcastle Publishing Co., Inc., North Hollywood, California, ISBN 0-87877-145-X, page 41.

So the preterist calculation which attributes 666 to Nero, however, is nothing more than a rather desperate attempt to find some likely candidate for the Antichrist other than the Papacy. (source: to the above is from Biblelight by Michael Scheifer)

................

For me personally the popes of the Catholic church's adding up to 666 in three different languages is more than coincidence that in my personal view cannot be ignored because the probability that this can take place in three different languages by chance is extremely low

Take Care.
 
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Marilyn C

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I don't think the person's name will be authority.

So what is signing your NAME on a cheque all about?

It is not so much the name of the A/C but his authority over the Global Government.
 
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eclipsenow

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So what is signing your NAME on a cheque all about?

It is not so much the name of the A/C but his authority over the Global Government.
Which was pretty much fulfilled in Rome and becomes a type for us today to watch out for any government that crosses the line and asks for our worship EG: North Korea, etc.
 
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Marilyn C

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Hi Marilyn, thanks for joining us.

Take Care.

Hi LGW,

I prefer to have God`s interpretation on H1s word.

THE NUMBER – Gk. `arithmos,` a number, from `airo,` reckoned.

`Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is 666.` (Rev. 13: 18)

I believe the number of the `beast` is a summary of him, his character & authority. (Daniel 11: 21 – 45 gives a good description.)

666 = 600 + 60 + 6.

6 - sinful man.

60 = 6 X 10 - sinful man disobeying God`s law.

600 = 6 X 10 X 10 – sinful man controlled by the spirit of complete lawlessness.


`the coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan with all power & signs & lying wonders.` (2 Thess. 2: 9)


This number describes the `beast` & his world system of control. Everyone in this system will have a number to identify them as different from others. People can be verified, tracked & controlled.
 
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Marilyn C

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Which was pretty much fulfilled in Rome and becomes a type for us today to watch out for any government that crosses the line and asks for our worship EG: North Korea, etc.

Not only worship but controlling the buying & selling through the Central Bank`s Digital Money connected through the IMF to the Global Financial Economy.
 
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eclipsenow

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Not only worship but controlling the buying & selling through the Central Bank`s Digital Money connected through the IMF to the Global Financial Economy.
It's just not what the passage says because in Chapter 1 John wanted his generation to hear and obey.


"blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it" (Verse 3)
That is, he wants them to meditate on it and obey it. How do you obey something written about and to people thousands of years later? Forget that - how do you even understand it? Imagine getting this message?

"On Mars most red in the year 4000 AD, the Zorg will Zazzle the Marines in Valles Marineris - and the smoke will rise to the heavens."

Now obey this! See, if the command is not to you or about you - you cannot obey it. Period. There's nothing to take to heart, nothing to understand about you and your suffering. So how on earth do you obey this? You can barely even comprehend it - and even if you could - it's not to your and your situation or even about you. John's generation couldn't obey it. Not only that, what good has it been for the church for the last 2000 years - it's not about or to them - so how do they benefit? If anything makes me reject futurist readings of Revelation it is that it would render the majority of Revelation as utterly useless to Christians across the last 2000 years - and do nothing except confuse us and make us argue. That's simply NOT in the mission statement of Scripture as we read it in 2 Timothy 3:16-17.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Hi LGW,

I prefer to have God`s interpretation on H1s word.

THE NUMBER – Gk. `arithmos,` a number, from `airo,` reckoned.

`Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man: His number is 666.` (Rev. 13: 18)

I believe the number of the `beast` is a summary of him, his character & authority. (Daniel 11: 21 – 45 gives a good description.)

666 = 600 + 60 + 6.

6 - sinful man.

60 = 6 X 10 - sinful man disobeying God`s law.

600 = 6 X 10 X 10 – sinful man controlled by the spirit of complete lawlessness.


`the coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan with all power & signs & lying wonders.` (2 Thess. 2: 9)


This number describes the `beast` & his world system of control. Everyone in this system will have a number to identify them as different from others. People can be verified, tracked & controlled.

Well if you prefer to have God's interpretation of his Word you should at least consider the post and the scriptures shared with you in post # 468 linked. The scripture says this in Revelation in regards to the number that identifies the beast....

Revelation 13:17-18 [17], And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the NUMBER OF HIS NAME. [18], Here is wisdom. LET HIM THAT HAS UNDERSTANDING COUNT (add up) THE NUMBER OF THE BEAST: FOR IT IS THE NUMBER OF A MAN; and his number is SIX HUNDRED THREE SCORE AND SIX (666).

From the scriptures we can see that we identify who the first beast of Revelation 13 is by identifying the number of a man that is associated with the beast and his number is 666. The scripture says "Let him that has understanding count (ψηφίζω; psēphízō; G5585). The Greek word here means add up "the number of the beast for it is the number of a man" This is what has been shown in post # 468 linked.

The scripture does not say anywhere that the number of this man that identifies the Beast of Revelation 13 is a summary of the beasts character because the beast is never a man in bible prophecy. To come up with that interpretation you have to read that into the scripture and disregard that the scripture says (not me) that "the number of the beast is a number of a man" and that number adds up to 666.

Scripture must interpret the scriptures (Isaiah 28:9-10) as the book is not of any private interpretations (2 Peter 1:20). Of course you are free to believe as you want. That is between you and God but beware of the warning given not to add to these words given in Revelation 22:18.

Take Care.
 
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eclipsenow

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Well if you prefer to have God's interpretation of his Word you should at least consider the post and the scriptures shared with you in post # 468 linked. The scripture says this in Revelation in regards to the number that identifies the beast....

Revelation 13:17-18 [17], And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the NUMBER OF HIS NAME. [18], Here is wisdom. Let him that has understanding count THE NUMBER OF THE BEAST: FOR IT IS THE NUMBER OF A MAN; and his number is SIX HUNDRED THREE SCORE AND SIX (666).

From the scriptures we can see that we identify who the first beast of Revelation 13 by identifying the number of a man that is associated with the beast and his number is 666.

The scripture does not say anywhere that the number of this man that identifies the Beast of Revelation 13 is a summary of the beasts character. To come up with that interpretation you have to read that into the scripture and disregard that the scripture says (not me) that "the number of the beast is a number of a man" and that number adds up to 666.

Scripture must interpret the scriptures (Isaiah 28:9-10) as the book is not of any private interpretations (2 Peter 1:20). Of course you are free to believe as you want. That is between you and God but beware of the warning given not to add to these words given in Revelation 22:18.

Take Care.
If this is about a figure in the future, what good has the whole Book of Revelation been for the last 2000 years?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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If this is about a figure in the future, what good has the whole Book of Revelation been for the last 2000 years?
For me, I believe very good eclipsenow. It outlines prophecy, the man of sin, the antichrist, last day events leading up to the second coming and beyond. It is a very interesting subject to prayerfully study. Though we should be careful not to add to Gods' Word here according to Revelation 22:18. Sadly there are as many man-made interpretation of the book of Revelation as there is Christian denominations in the world today. We cannot understand it without God being our guide and teacher.

Take Care.
 
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eclipsenow

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For me, I believe very good eclipsenow. It outlines prophecy, the man of sin, the antichrist, last day events leading up to the second coming and beyond. It is a very interesting subject to prayerfully study. Though we should be careful not to add to Gods' Word here according to Revelation 22:18. Sadly there are as many man-made interpretation of the book of Revelation as there is Christian denominations in the world today. We cannot understand it without God being our guide and teacher.

Take Care.

As I said above:

"blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it" (Verse 3)
That is, he wants them to meditate on it and obey it. How do you obey something written about and to people thousands of years later? Forget that - how do you even understand it? Imagine getting this message?

"On Mars most red in the year 4000 AD, the Zorg will Zazzle the Marines in Valles Marineris - and the smoke will rise to the heavens."

Now obey this! See, if the command is not to you or about you - you cannot obey it. Period. There's nothing to take to heart, nothing to understand about you and your suffering. So how on earth do you obey this? You can barely even comprehend it - and even if you could - it's not to your and your situation or even about you. John's generation couldn't obey it. Not only that, what good has it been for the church for the last 2000 years - it's not about or to them - so how do they benefit? If anything makes me reject futurist readings of Revelation it is that it would render the majority of Revelation as utterly useless to Christians across the last 2000 years - and do nothing except confuse us and make us argue. That's simply NOT in the mission statement of Scripture as we read it in 2 Timothy 3:16-17.
 
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Marilyn C

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It's just not what the passage says because in Chapter 1 John wanted his generation to hear and obey.


"blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it" (Verse 3)
That is, he wants them to meditate on it and obey it. How do you obey something written about and to people thousands of years later? Forget that - how do you even understand it? Imagine getting this message?

..... If anything makes me reject futurist readings of Revelation it is that it would render the majority of Revelation as utterly useless to Christians across the last 2000 years - and do nothing except confuse us and make us argue. That's simply NOT in the mission statement of Scripture as we read it in 2 Timothy 3:16-17.

The Book of Revelation is the unveiling of Christ as He is known in the heavenly realms, and that started when He ascended to the Father. All are blessed in any century by looking and taking to heart the Lord Jesus Christ.

THE FOUR VISIONS


The predominant aim of Revelation is the setting forth the splendours of the Son of Man, & to reveal His glorious person. There are four visions of the Son of Man as He is known in the heavenly realm & each vision in turn carries through to completion one aspect of the fourfold ministry of Christ which He exercised when on earth. His Kinship was expressed in Matthew, His Heirship in Mark, His Mediatorship in Luke, & His Judgeship in John.

Vision 1. CHRIST - Head of the Body. (Rev. 1 – 3)

This reveals the empowered Son of Man as the Sovereign Administrator.

`in His right hand He held 7 stars.`


Vision 2. CHRIST - HEIR (Rev. 4 – 7)

This reveals the enthroned Son of Man as the Supreme Executor.

`in His right hand He held the 7 sealed book.`



Vision 3. CHRIST - MEDIATOR (Rev. 8 – 13)

This reveals the exalted Son of Man as the Stately Mediator.

`in His hand is a sacred censor.`


Vision 4. CHRIST - JUDGE (Rev. 14 – 22)

This reveals the entitled Son of Man as the Sublime Adjudicator.

`in His hand is a sharp sickle.`


To reveal Christ to us in Revelation, there are three hundred & thirty references to the figures, shadows, symbols, types, patterns, persons, & buildings of the Old Testament.

This unveiling is the culmination of all the truths expressed from Genesis to Revelation, for all scripture is centered on one purpose and that is to reveal Christ to us in all His Glory.
 
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eclipsenow

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The Book of Revelation is the unveiling of Christ as He is known in the heavenly realms, and that started when He ascended to the Father. All are blessed in any century by looking and taking to heart the Lord Jesus Christ.

THE FOUR VISIONS


The predominant aim of Revelation is the setting forth the splendours of the Son of Man, & to reveal His glorious person. There are four visions of the Son of Man as He is known in the heavenly realm & each vision in turn carries through to completion one aspect of the fourfold ministry of Christ which He exercised when on earth. His Kinship was expressed in Matthew, His Heirship in Mark, His Mediatorship in Luke, & His Judgeship in John.

Vision 1. CHRIST - Head of the Body. (Rev. 1 – 3)

This reveals the empowered Son of Man as the Sovereign Administrator.

`in His right hand He held 7 stars.`


Vision 2. CHRIST - HEIR (Rev. 4 – 7)

This reveals the enthroned Son of Man as the Supreme Executor.

`in His right hand He held the 7 sealed book.`



Vision 3. CHRIST - MEDIATOR (Rev. 8 – 13)

This reveals the exalted Son of Man as the Stately Mediator.

`in His hand is a sacred censor.`


Vision 4. CHRIST - JUDGE (Rev. 14 – 22)

This reveals the entitled Son of Man as the Sublime Adjudicator.

`in His hand is a sharp sickle.`


To reveal Christ to us in Revelation, there are three hundred & thirty references to the figures, shadows, symbols, types, patterns, persons, & buildings of the Old Testament.

This unveiling is the culmination of all the truths expressed from Genesis to Revelation, for all scripture is centered on one purpose and that is to reveal Christ to us in all His Glory.

We probably agree on some bits - but I've not seen it divided up like this before, in this particular way. But are you saying it's not a future timetable but a theological sermon in all those symbols & shadows?
 
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jgr

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If this is about a figure in the future, what good has the whole Book of Revelation been for the last 2000 years?

The fulfillments in Revelation (and Daniel) identifying apostate Romanism began in the 5th century, and continued to their primary culmination in the Protestant Reformation of the 16th-17th centuries.

Primarily in the past, but of great prophetic relevance and significance to the true Church over those centuries, and to today.
 
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