Biden Drops the Hammer on Unvaccinated

[Desk trauma]

When there's thosands of stories it might be time to start listening.

Indeed, time to accept alien abductions and Sasquatch as fact.

 

[renniks]

There are thousands of stories featuring a killer with a hook.

But that's different, because one of those actually happened to a friend of a friend...

What if it happened to someone in my family?
How close to you does it have to be to be believable?

 

[renniks]

Indeed, time to accept alien abductions and Sasquatch as fact.

What motivation is there to lie about it?
It sure doesn't make a person popular.

 

[Desk trauma]

What motivation is there to lie about it?
It sure doesn't make a person popular.

I know, hence why the probing stories must be taken at face value and the protection of our precious bodily cavities made priority one for Space Force!

 

[muichimotsu]

What motivation is there to lie about it?
It sure doesn't make a person popular.

Because no one makes money from lies...oh wait, that's half of business in America

 

[Aldebaran]

Because no one makes money from lies...oh wait, that's half of business in America

We're not talking about "half of business in America". We're talking about individuals who have suffered serious repercussions for taking a "safe and effective" drug while the majority of people scoff at them about it for describing what they've had to endure.

 

[muichimotsu]

We're not talking about "half of business in America". We're talking about individuals who have suffered serious repercussions for taking a "safe and effective" drug while the majority of people scoff at them about it for describing what they've had to endure.

Dishonest strawmanning as if anyone claimed this was perfect, because the safe and effective is not claiming there cannot be side effects, same with ANY medical involvement whatsoever.

What they endure is an acceptable risk so we can return to a sense of normalcy from a crippling disease that, while not necessarily as fatal, is not as simple as reducing it to a mere number that ignores other factors in calculating mortality in an overall pandemic we're not remotely done with, especially not with willful fools that want to rush to their death while claiming they're "free"

 

[muichimotsu]

We're not talking about "half of business in America". We're talking about individuals who have suffered serious repercussions for taking a "safe and effective" drug while the majority of people scoff at them about it for describing what they've had to endure.

Also, you seem to ignore that a capitalist society is not antithetical to people exploiting others and their gullibility without a measure of 1) regulation and 2) education for the general public so they aren't nearly as likely to be exploited by con artists that sell snake oil, etc

 

[Vylo]

What motivation is there to lie about it?
It sure doesn't make a person popular.

politics and the refusal to be wrong. Trump managed to make masks and the vaccine political, despite him being a large part of implementing and getting the latter.

This is simply one of those cyclical things in politics and culture. Witness the rebirth of the "know-nothings"

 

[KCfromNC]

I agree. All I am saying is that this should not be acceptable. Lets find a way to fix the problem without violating someone rights.

What do you propose?

 

[KCfromNC]

Ok, then why do you resist trying to change this reality?

What's it called when a question is asked which is actually a misleading summary of another person's posts?

Why is the goal that we treat all people not a good goal to have?

It is great to have lofty idealized goals. But just as important back here in reality is a way to achieve them. What do you propose we do to connect your goal with the reality that some places are running out of health care resources?

 

[KCfromNC]

Can I monitor any of their other medical decisions?

Actually, yes - 5 Things Women Need to Know About the Hobby Lobby Ruling

Maybe we just have to pretend that companies have religious beliefs about vaccines and mandates will change from tyranny to religious freedom.

 

[KCfromNC]

But we don't even know yet. The side effects could show up years down the road and be devastating.

What medical treatments in use today are known to be 100% free of potential long term unknown side effects? Seems like exactly zero of them - any day we could discover something new about pretty much any drug or vaccine.

Imagined hypotheticals aren't really a reason to ignore the data we do have that current vaccines are overwhelmingly safe, and certainly far less risky than getting covid.

 

[KCfromNC]

Or maybe they just have enough common sense not to take an untested substance into their body, and politics has nothing to do with it...

Unless it is livestock dewormer ... although I guess that's been tested on horses so yay! Or maybe more like neigh!

 

[KCfromNC]

May have side effects years down the road, best avoid it along with the vaccination.

We can only talk about long term side effects if they're hypothetical, imagined ones for the vaccine, not actual observed ones from covid.

 

[pitabread]

But we don't even know yet. The side effects could show up years down the road and be devastating.

When has this actually occurred? How often do medications have long-term effects that don't show up for years or decades?

 

[whatbogsends]

When has this actually occurred? How often do medications have long-term effects that don't show up for years or decades?

Bextra was approved in 2001. In 2005, it was taken off the market due to causing heart problems and potentially fatal skin reactions. Those heart conditions weren't identified until 2004.

It was on the market for 3 years before problems being identified, and another year before it was officially pulled. Legal consequences for their actions didn't follow for another 4 years after that.

Drug Approval Package: Bextra (Valdecoxib) NDA #21-341 (fda.gov)

21-341 Bextra Approval (fda.gov)

Dec. 9, 2004 -- The FDA announced today new warnings for the arthritis drug Bextra.

The new warning states that Bextra should not be used in patients undergoing heart bypass surgery. In October, Bextra's manufacturer, Pfizer, announced results of a study showing an increase in heart problems in patients having heart bypass surgery. In that study, patients were receiving Bextra for treatment of pain following surgery.

The FDA is also strengthening warnings regarding a potentially fatal skin reaction from Bextra.

Heart Warning Added to Bextra Label (webmd.com)


In 2005, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration asked Pfizer to withdraw Bextra from U.S. drugstores, citing a possible risk of causing heart problems and reports of a potentially fatal skin reaction called Stevens-Johnson syndrome in people taking the drug.

Pfizer to settle Bextra, Celebrex lawsuits | Reuters

Pfizer plead guilty to felony misrepresentation of the drug.

WASHINGTON – American pharmaceutical giant Pfizer Inc. and its subsidiary Pharmacia & Upjohn Company Inc. (hereinafter together "Pfizer") have agreed to pay $2.3 billion, the largest health care fraud settlement in the history of the Department of Justice, to resolve criminal and civil liability arising from the illegal promotion of certain pharmaceutical products, the Justice Department announced today.

Pharmacia & Upjohn Company has agreed to plead guilty to a felony violation of the Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act for misbranding Bextra with the intent to defraud or mislead. Bextra is an anti-inflammatory drug that Pfizer pulled from the market in 2005. Under the provisions of the Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act, a company must specify the intended uses of a product in its new drug application to FDA. Once approved, the drug may not be marketed or promoted for so-called "off-label" uses – i.e., any use not specified in an application and approved by FDA. Pfizer promoted the sale of Bextra for several uses and dosages that the FDA specifically declined to approve due to safety concerns. The company will pay a criminal fine of $1.195 billion, the largest criminal fine ever imposed in the United States for any matter. Pharmacia & Upjohn will also forfeit $105 million, for a total criminal resolution of $1.3 billion.

Justice Department Announces Largest Health Care Fraud Settlement in Its History | OPA | Department of Justice

While stories of finding serious issues with drugs years after market is rare, it is not unique to Bextra.

 

[renniks]

Because no one makes money from lies...oh wait, that's half of business in America

How are random people saying they had side effects making money off it?

 

[renniks]

What they endure is an acceptable risk

We should all be free to decide what is an acceptable risk for ourselves.

 

[renniks]

When has this actually occurred? How often do medications have long-term effects that don't show up for years or decades?

Medications often have effects we don't know about initially. Why else do medicines get recalled?