How to choose between creation and evolution.

[driewerf]

This is as applicable today as when first written.

Hosea 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

To review how we are still destroyed just visit prisons, nuthouses, poorhouses, hospitals, etc. We are a mess.

The production of knowledge is out of control, like a runaway train.

And the answer to that is not the rejection of knowledge, as you proposed multiple times in this thread, but study, study, study.
Just for your edification:
here are some links to educational Youtube channels
https://www.youtube.com/user/scishow
https://www.youtube.com/user/crashcourse
slightly different, but please give it a look:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-GiI_5U-WkPIKqsq056wvg

There are outstanding sites dedicated to latest science news:
ScienceDaily: News, Videos & Articles in Science, Health, Technology & Environment
Breaking Science News | Sci-News.com
SciTechDaily | Science, Space and Technology News 2019


There are sites that offer entire textbook for free; like
Science Books Online
200 Free Textbooks: A Meta Collection | Open Culture
You are being redirected...

@EVERYONE: if you know valuable resources for learning, please post.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

And the answer to that is not the rejection of knowledge, as you proposed multiple times in this thread, but study, study, study.
Just for your edification:
here are some links to educational Youtube channels
https://www.youtube.com/user/scishow
https://www.youtube.com/user/crashcourse
slightly different, but please give it a look:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-GiI_5U-WkPIKqsq056wvg

There are outstanding sites dedicated to latest science news:
ScienceDaily: News, Videos & Articles in Science, Health, Technology & Environment
Breaking Science News | Sci-News.com
SciTechDaily | Science, Space and Technology News 2019


There are sites that offer entire textbook for free; like
Science Books Online
200 Free Textbooks: A Meta Collection | Open Culture
You are being redirected...

@EVERYONE: if you know valuable resources for learning, please post.

I only reject knowledge as it is applied to support the ToE.

I strongly recommend the Bible as one's most important source of knowledge.

 

[driewerf]

never mind

 

[Deanos]

If you study evolution, with an open mind, you will likely believe in evolution.

If you study human, animal, and plant anatomy, with an open mind, you will likely believe in creation.

That is a very valid point. Creation was before, start, during and completion for shall we the call earth or universe a project. As evolution progresses for earth creation is required for the changing environment, for input and output of life.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

And the answer to that is not the rejection of knowledge, as you proposed multiple times in this thread, but study, study, study.

Most of the time I spend on the internet is studying subjects that are of use or of interest to me. Very little if any scientific subjects however. Lots of 'how to' stuff. Right now I'm boning up on coyote hunting strategies.

 

[driewerf]

Most of the time I spend on the internet is studying subjects that are of use or of interest to me. Very little if any scientific subjects however. Lots of 'how to' stuff. Right now I'm boning up on coyote hunting strategies.

That's fine. Most of the links I posted are science related (except one, did you spot it?) But of course beside science there are many other subjects to study.
I actually have a very big respect for people who during their entire life try to improve themselves. Be it an academic study, a foreign language, mastering a music instrument or any other skill.

 

[coffee4u]

So you can make a case for creation with hard solid scientifically sound arguments and without any reference to religion?
No argument from ignorance? No appeal to authority?

You completely miss the point.

You can't talk about a supernatural event without any supernatural references.

The world is not just the physical that you can see, there is equal parts physical and spiritual. When you ignore the spiritual you are ignoring half of the facts. Creation was a miracle, a supernatural event, it wasn't a natural event.

 

[SelfSim]

The world is not just the physical that you can see, there is equal parts physical and spiritual. When you ignore the spiritual you are ignoring half of the facts.

Translation (if I may):
‘Reality', (or ‘the physical'), can be conceived either by way of belief, or the scientific (objective) method. This observation is objectively evidenced, so it makes no sense to ignore the evidence of one, or the other, conception method.

Creation was a miracle, a supernatural event, it wasn't a natural event.

Rephrasing (if I may):
‘I believe Creation was a miracle, by way of belief. I conceptualise that belief as being real, (even though its not objectively testable using the scientific objective method)'.

 

[Deanos]

Translation (if I may):
‘Reality', (or ‘the physical'), can be conceived either by way of belief, or the scientific (objective) method. This observation is objectively evidenced, so it makes no sense to ignore the evidence of one, or the other, conception method.
Rephrasing (if I may):
‘I believe Creation was a miracle, by way of belief. I conceptualise that belief as being real, (even though its not objectively testable using the scientific objective method)'.

I like the reasoning for creation, but creation was planned it was not a miracle. However it was a miracle at how successful organic matter and intelligence merge as one to become man. This is the path for the objective of the ultimate life form, invisible intelligence to you and me this is our soul.

 

[SelfSim]

I like the reasoning for creation, but creation was planned it was not a miracle. However it was a miracle at how successful organic matter and intelligence merge as one to become man. This is the path for the objective of the ultimate life form, invisible intelligence to you and me this is our soul.

Yikes!!
I should clarify: those weren't my beliefs .. I was translating and rephrasing what coffee4u said into a form I could digest/understand!

So, what I now understand from your post, (feel free to correct me), is that:
Because different humans conceptualise their beliefs differently, (heavily evidenced), your mind realises the miracle as being an entirely different event, ie: 'successful organic matter and intelligence merge as one to become man'.
You also realise the concept of 'invisible intelligence' as being 'our soul'.

All of the above is done by the process of conceptualising beliefs as being real .. and not by the way science creates its objective reality .. (ie: by the scientific method/process).

 

[Deanos]

Yikes!!
I should clarify: those weren't my beliefs .. I was translating and rephrasing what coffee4u said into a form I could digest/understand!

So, what I now understand from your post, (feel free to correct me), is that:
Because different humans conceptualise their beliefs differently, (heavily evidenced), your mind realises the miracle as being an entirely different event, ie: 'successful organic matter and intelligence merge as one to become man'.
You also realise the concept of 'invisible intelligence' as being 'our soul'.

All of the above is done by the process of conceptualising beliefs as being real .. and not by the way science creates its objective reality .. (ie: by the scientific method/process).

Organic matter (body) has never been intelligent from origin, intelligence was inserted after (mankind). The opposites come in to it as each section organic matter and intlligence collide or have difference of an opion. We must remember the brain is made up of organic matter and intelligence, originally without the intelligence the brain would not of functioned at all, this event is marked by the birth of man.

 

[Allandavid]

Organic matter (body) has never been intelligent from origin, intelligence was inserted after (mankind). The opposites come in to it as each section organic matter and intlligence collide or have difference of an opion. We must remember the brain is made up of organic matter and intelligence, originally without the intelligence the brain would not of functioned at all, this event is marked by the birth of man.

‘Intelligence’ is nothing more than the interaction of electrical activity within the brain. All animals that possess one express intelligence to varying levels. It isn’t an input that is “inserted”....it’s an output.

 

[AV1611VET]

I like the reasoning for creation, but creation was planned it was not a miracle.

It was both.

Creation is a series of miracles performed over a six-day period, that raised the level of mass/energy in the universe from zero to what it is today.

However it was a miracle at how successful organic matter and intelligence merge as one to become man.

What is "organic matter" in the first place?

The word "organic" used to pertain to the organs of the body, until scientists deemed it should mean something else: carbon-based and free of pesticides and fertilizers.

I like the term "inorganic," as it means: not arriving by natural growth.

And in that sense, Adam & Eve were inorganic.

Yet they had organs, so that makes them organic.

Rest assured, when science takes over Biblical terminology, confusion begins.

 

[AV1611VET]

‘Intelligence’ is nothing more than the interaction of electrical activity within the brain.

So does my light bulb run on intelligence? or is intelligence confined to the brain?

 

[SelfSim]

Organic matter (body) has never been intelligent from origin, intelligence was inserted after (mankind). The opposites come in to it as each section organic matter and intlligence collide or have difference of an opion. We must remember the brain is made up of organic matter and intelligence, originally without the intelligence the brain would not of functioned at all, this event is marked by the birth of man.

Ok .. so this (underlined) is almost the ID irreducibly complex argument.

I suggest you might try thinking of intelligence as being akin to the software on your computer and the computer hardware itself, being akin to the organic structures of the brain. There are differing successive levels of 'intelligence' a computer has, depending on successive layers of software sophistication. Even with only the 'dumbest' layers running, the computer can still perform basic logic and math functions and thus, it still functions.

Also, I think you'll find from the archaelogical record of the hominid species, going back in time, the earliest hominids had smaller cranial volumes and thus, correspondingly, less 'organic hardware' (brain matter) would have been needed to fill them compared with ours today ... and going forwards in time towards modern day, the tools found accompanying successive hominid species, demonstrates increasing complexity of tool manufacture and hence, increasing intelligence needed to accomplish that.

To sum up, the scientific objective process leads us to infer that both intelligence and the brain's organic matter increased gradually together over time and each successive species was each fully functional in its own right.

 

[Deanos]

‘Intelligence’ is nothing more than the interaction of electrical activity within the brain. All animals that possess one express intelligence to varying levels. It isn’t an input that is “inserted”....it’s an output.

I disagree, the brain does receive and send information whether it be physical, mental or spiritual. We come from organic matter, an intelligence system and water.

 

[Deanos]

So does my light bulb run on intelligence? or is intelligence confined to the brain?

intelligence isn't confined to the brain, when we pass over we take the soul with us which includes the intelligence but not the organic matter i.e. brain, body, etc.

 

[SelfSim]

It was both.

Creation is a series of miracles performed over a six-day period, that raised the level of mass/energy in the universe from zero to what it is today.What is "organic matter" in the first place?

The word "organic" used to pertain to the organs of the body, until scientists deemed it should mean something else: carbon-based and free of pesticides and fertilizers.

I like the term "inorganic," as it means: not arriving by natural growth.

And in that sense, Adam & Eve were inorganic.

Yet they had organs, so that makes them organic.

Rest assured, when science takes over Biblical terminology, confusion begins.

Inorganic chemistry is quite distinct from organic chemistry. Organic chemistry involves interactions amongst larger (heavier) molecules.
Rest assured, scientific chemists are very well aware of the differences between organic and inorganic chemistry.

 

[Deanos]

It was both.

Creation is a series of miracles performed over a six-day period, that raised the level of mass/energy in the universe from zero to what it is today.What is "organic matter" in the first place?

The word "organic" used to pertain to the organs of the body, until scientists deemed it should mean something else: carbon-based and free of pesticides and fertilizers.

I like the term "inorganic," as it means: not arriving by natural growth.

And in that sense, Adam & Eve were inorganic.

Yet they had organs, so that makes them organic.

Rest assured, when science takes over Biblical terminology, confusion begins.

The thing is science is based on fact, logic and conclusion, the way of life is opening up on the way forward and science interfacing and agreeing with religion, spiritualism, evolution, etc. It has opened the door and should be open more.

 

[Deanos]

Ok .. so this (underlined) is almost the ID irreducibly complex argument.

I suggest you might try thinking of intelligence as being akin to the software on your computer and the computer hardware itself, being akin to the organic structures of the brain. There are differing successive levels of 'intelligence' a computer has, depending on successive layers of software sophistication. Even with only the 'dumbest' layers running, the computer can still perform basic logic and math functions and thus, it still functions.

Also, I think you'll find from the archaelogical record of the hominid species, going back in time, the earliest hominids had smaller cranial volumes and thus, correspondingly, less 'organic hardware' (brain matter) would have been needed to fill them compared with ours today ... and going forwards in time towards modern day, the tools found accompanying successive hominid species, demonstrates increasing complexity of tool manufacture and hence, increasing intelligence needed to accomplish that.

To sum up, the scientific objective process leads us to infer that both intelligence and the brain's organic matter increased gradually together over time and each successive species was each fully functional in its own right.

Reading this was like music to my ears, I am already aware the human body is an organic matter with intelligence aka computer. In life there are opposites to everything and this is ours, a computer.