How Does Salvation WORK

[FreeGrace2]

Your argument is with Jesus (not me)
Jesus said there are "wheat and tares" in the "Kingdom of Heaven"
that means (1) they are in the church or (2) they are in heaven.

Since we know that no unsaved "tare" goes to heaven,

And that means they were NEVER Christian. Regardless of what they may claim, or even what you may claim.

that means (in this passage) on the "Kingdom of Heaven"
represents the church. You can't have it both ways...

You're the one who can't have it both ways. Jesus NEVER spoke of the NT church. It wasn't even in existence yet.

As I said: Your argument is with Jesus (not with me)[/QUOTE]
You have no argument at all. You only think so.

There are only 2 kinds of people in the human race. Saved and unsaved.

People either go to heaven (saved) or to hell (unsaved).

There is no third group, as you fantasize.

 

[FreeGrace2]

As I have already explained to you many times...
Your argument is with JESUS (not with me)

It was JESUS who said the "Kingdom of Heaven" contains
BOTH "wheat and tares".

If you say the "Kingdom of Heaven" is NOT the Christian church
then you are teaching that HEAVEN contains unsaved "tares".
It's as simple as that. You can't have it both ways unless
you want to say Jesus was lying...

Mat 13:24-25
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying,
The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed
good seed in his field: But while men slept, his enemy came
and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.

There are only 2 kinds of people in the human race; saved and unsaved.

The saved will go to heaven, and the unsaved will go to hell.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I said:
"The passage is clearly about who won't be saved. This passage is very similar to Matt 7:21-23. In both passages, the crowd bases their appeal to entering heaven on what they have done. And nothing about believing (trusting) in Christ for salvation."

In both passage they call Him "Lord, Lord"

So what? That doesn't make them a Christian, by any stretch. These are only religious people, protestants who think they are saved by what they DO. There is NO indication that any of them ever believed in Christ alone for salvation.

It seems you really don't understand the difference between religious people who have never believed in Christ for salvation, and Christians who HAVE.

Do you think Moslems call Jesus Lord?
Do you think Buddhists call Jesus Lord?
Do you think Hindus call Jesus Lord?
Do you think Atheists call Jesus Lord?
Do you think Agnostics call Jesus Lord?
Do you think Humanists call Jesus Lord?
Do you think Pagans call Jesus Lord?
Do you think Satanists call Jesus Lord?

Of course none of them would. So what?

\You are embarrassing yourself. You should stop.

How funny. You are the one who is embarrassing yourself.

You think there are unsaved Christians. This proves that you don't even understand what the word "Christian" means.

It should be obvious today that many people call themselves Christian, but have no idea what the Bible teaches about anything.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I wonder why all my posts have SCRIPTURE to support my words.

I wonder why you think they do. They sure don't.

But all your posts only express your "feelings".

You have it exactly backwards.

Send SCRIPTURE to support your "feelings" or don't bother posting.

I have supported my views (not feelings at all) with Scripture. But it is plain to me that you have no grasp of very much of the Bible.

 

[FreeGrace2]

The clue is they called Jesus their LORD.

It is apparent to all that you have no idea or clue as to the context of matt 7:21-23.

Jesus began with "on THAT day". What do you suppose Jesus was referring to? The Great White Throne Judgment, of course. And NONE of that crowd believed in Christ for salvation. Their whole appeal was based on what they DID, not what they believed. But it seems all that just goes way over your head.

When Jesus said, "I NEVER knew you", it is obvious that none of them were ever Christians. Jesus certainly knows His own. And he tells them He NEVER knew them.

So it doesn't make any difference what they call Him at the GWTJ.

btw, consider that context; they are standing obviously before the King of kings, and Lord of lords. You'd better believe they have their knee bowed before Him, and are calling Him Lord.

Do Moslims call Jesus their Lord?
Do Buddhists call Jesus their Lord?
Do Hindus call Jesus their Lord?
Do Atheists call Jesus their Lord?
Do Agnostics call Jesus their Lord?
Do Humanists call Jesus their Lord?
Do Pagans call Jesus their Lord?
Do Satanists call Jesus their Lord?

You need to stop asking such ridiculous questions. We already know how little you understand of the Scriptures.

WHO on earth calls Jesus their LORD besides
the "wheat and tares" in the church?
Please be specific.

With pleasure I'll be specific. EVERYONE who will stand before the Great White Throne Judgement, per Rev 20:11-15.

Their knees will be bowed, and they will all be shaking in their boots, so to speak. And all they have in their defense is their works. Which won't get them out of hell.

But I suspect that you haven't really thought any of this through.

 

[5thKingdom]

Jesus NEVER spoke of the NT church.

Then who was Jesus talking about here?

Mat 13:24-25
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying,
The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed
good seed in his field: But while men slept, his enemy came
and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.


Mat 13:47-50
Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net,
that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind:
Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down,
and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away.
So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come
forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, And shall
cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and
gnashing of teeth.


.

 

[5thKingdom]

With pleasure I'll be specific. EVERYONE who will stand before the Great White Throne Judgement, per Rev 20:11-15.

Their knees will be bowed, and they will all be shaking in their boots, so to speak. And all they have in their defense is their works. Which won't get them out of hell.
.

Read the passage CAREFULLY this time...
It says they PROPHESED IN HIS NAME (do Moslims do that?
do Buddhists do that? do Hindus do that? do Atheists do that"
do Agnostics do that? do Humanists do that? do Pagans do that?
do Satanists do that?


Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils?
and in thy name done many wonderful works?


.

 

[5thKingdom]

I wonder why you think they do. They sure don't.


You have it exactly backwards.


I have supported my views (not feelings at all) with Scripture. But it is plain to me that you have no grasp of very much of the Bible.

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your Post #164
because you did not offer any Scripture.

.

 

[5thKingdom]

I said:
"The passage is clearly about who won't be saved. This passage is very similar to Matt 7:21-23. In both passages, the crowd bases their appeal to entering heaven on what they have done. And nothing about believing (trusting) in Christ for salvation."

So what? That doesn't make them a Christian, by any stretch. These are only religious people, protestants who think they are saved by what they DO. There is NO indication that any of them ever believed in Christ alone for salvation.

It seems you really don't understand the difference between religious people who have never believed in Christ for salvation, and Christians who HAVE.


Of course none of them would. So what?


How funny. You are the one who is embarrassing yourself.

You think there are unsaved Christians. This proves that you don't even understand what the word "Christian" means.

It should be obvious today that many people call themselves Christian, but have no idea what the Bible teaches about anything.

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your post #163
because you did not offer any Scripture
You only expressed "feelings"

.

 

[5thKingdom]

There are only 2 kinds of people in the human race; saved and unsaved.

The saved will go to heaven, and the unsaved will go to hell.

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your Post #162
because you did not offer any Scripture..
only your "feelings"

/

 

[5thKingdom]

And that means they were NEVER Christian. Regardless of what they may claim, or even what you may claim.


You're the one who can't have it both ways. Jesus NEVER spoke of the NT church. It wasn't even in existence yet.

You have no argument at all. You only think so.

There are only 2 kinds of people in the human race. Saved and unsaved.

People either go to heaven (saved) or to hell (unsaved).

There is no third group, as you fantasize.

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your Post #161
because you did not bother to offer any Scriptures.
You only expressed your personal "feelings"


.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Then who was Jesus talking about here?

Short answer: "the kingdom of heaven".

Mat 13:24-25
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying,
The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed
good seed in his field: But while men slept, his enemy came
and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.

Since the NT church hadn't begun yet, it certainly isn't the church. However, the Bible agrees with me. There are only 2 categories of people; saved and unsaved. And "wheat" and "tares" reflects that fact.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Read the passage CAREFULLY this time...
It says they PROPHESED IN HIS NAME (do Moslims do that?
do Buddhists do that? do Hindus do that? do Atheists do that"
do Agnostics do that? do Humanists do that? do Pagans do that?
do Satanists do that?

Let me ask you: have YOU done any of that?

You keep focusing on what people DO, or CLAIM. It all means nothing. What matters is what a person BELIEVES, the ONE THING you seem totally unconcerned with.

Yet, the Bible is clear. Salvation is by grace THROUGH FAITH. Why do you miss that?

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils?
and in thy name done many wonderful works?

You might benefit by understanding what Jesus told them:
"Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’"

Does that sound like a Christian? Really?

The FACT that Jesus says He NEVER knew them means they NEVER had a personal relationship with Him. They were NEVER Christians.

btw, there was no such term as Christian in the OT, the timeframe when Jesus lived on earth.

Your theories are quite confused.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I pointed out this:
"There are only 2 kinds of people in the human race; saved and unsaved.

The saved will go to heaven, and the unsaved will go to hell."

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your Post #162 because you did not offer any Scripture.

Quite interesting comment, given that you believe there are 3 categories of people, two of which are "Christian" yet one category isn't saved.

Ridiculous beyond belief.

 

[5thKingdom]

Short answer: "the kingdom of heaven".
Since the NT church hadn't begun yet, it certainly isn't the church. However, the Bible agrees with me. There are only 2 categories of people; saved and unsaved. And "wheat" and "tares" reflects that fact.

Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you,
The kingdom of God shall be TAKEN from you,
and GIVEN to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

.

 

[5thKingdom]

I pointed out this:
"There are only 2 kinds of people in the human race; saved and unsaved.

The saved will go to heaven, and the unsaved will go to hell."

Quite interesting comment, given that you believe there are 3 categories of people, two of which are "Christian" yet one category isn't saved.

Ridiculous beyond belief.

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your post #174
because you did not offer any SCRIPTURE
you only expressed you "feelings"

,

 

[5thKingdom]

Let me ask you: have YOU done any of that?

You keep focusing on what people DO, or CLAIM. It all means nothing. What matters is what a person BELIEVES, the ONE THING you seem totally unconcerned with.

Yet, the Bible is clear. Salvation is by grace THROUGH FAITH. Why do you miss that?


You might benefit by understanding what Jesus told them:
"Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’"

Does that sound like a Christian? Really?

The FACT that Jesus says He NEVER knew them means they NEVER had a personal relationship with Him. They were NEVER Christians.

btw, there was no such term as Christian in the OT, the timeframe when Jesus lived on earth.

Your theories are quite confused.

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your post #173 because
once again you offer no SCRIPTURE... only your "feelings"
And your "feelings" can not substitute for Scripture..

.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you,
The kingdom of God shall be TAKEN from you,
and GIVEN to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

God doesn't take the church away from a nation and given to other nations. You need to study the meaning of "kingdom of God/heaven".

 

[5thKingdom]

Short answer: "the kingdom of heaven".


Since the NT church hadn't begun yet, it certainly isn't the church. However, the Bible agrees with me. There are only 2 categories of people; saved and unsaved. And "wheat" and "tares" reflects that fact.

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your post #172 because,
once again, you offer not SCRIPTURE and your "feelings"
mean LESS than nothing. You need Scripture child.

.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I am sorry, I cannot respond to your post #174
because you did not offer any SCRIPTURE
you only expressed you "feelings"

1 Cor 13:11 applies here. And to every post where you copy and paste.