Can a Christian have a premature death is he keeps living in lawlessness

[Danigt22]

I agree with you in that sense. Works done in our own flesh do not result in our salvation. But after we become saved, our previous addictions do not have hold of us as they once did and good works out of obedience to God now become apparent in our lives as a result of being saved.

You are pushing your justification until the end of your life. You started from the end and finish it from the beginning

 

[Oldmantook]

We need to be save first, and the only way is trusting in the finish work of Christ. Then the holy ghost guides you. Some will do better, other will die before its to late if they dont repent of their sins. God will never lose anyone who he baptize in his spirit. Except maybe for king Saul.

Yes, saved first. But no, if you take the mark of the beast you will certainly not remain saved. You can try, but I wouldn't do it.

 

[Oldmantook]

You are pushing your justification until the end of your life. You started from the end and finish it from the beginning

That is why we are instructed to FINISH THE RACE and FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT. Problem is your starting line is already the finish line!

 

[Danigt22]

That is why we are instructed to FINISH THE RACE and FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT. Problem is your starting line is already the finish line!

You are aiming to win heavingly crown, this is something every Christian should do. Nevertheless Im not telling to quit the good fight. Im telling you to have more faith in the holy ghost that guides you. He was the one that guide you to Jesus, he will be the one that guides you into earning the imperishable crown.

 

[Danigt22]

Yes, saved first. But no, if you take the mark of the beast you will certainly not remain saved. You can try, but I wouldn't do it.

If the rapture hasnt happen and Im call to be a martir then be it. I trust the holy had a reason for me to die that way.

 

[Oldmantook]

You are aiming to win heavingly crown, this is something every Christian should do. Nevertheless Im not telling to quit the good fight. Im telling you to have more faith in the holy ghost that guides you. He was the one that guide you to Jesus, he will be the one that guides you into earning the imperishable crown.

He can guide but each believer chooses whether or not to follow and therein lies the distinction you fail to account for.

 

[Oldmantook]

If the rapture hasnt happen and Im call to be a martir then be it. I trust the holy had a reason for me to die that way.

Then you make the right choice but given your doctrinal belief if you did take the mark of the beast you would still be saved - as you only lose your rewards - which totally contradicts Rev 14:9-10.

 

[Danigt22]

Then you make the right choice but given your doctrinal belief if you did take the mark of the beast you would still be saved - as you only lose your rewards - which totally contradicts Rev 14:9-10.

I dont believe we gentiles will be alive at that time, we would already be rapture. I mean the mark of the beast is a type of apostasy if you can only get by freewill, but if they force it into you. Any real born again believer would just have to kill himself before they are force to get injected or chip or something. The tribulation dispensation of grace is so different, it is no longer an age of grace but mandatory works such as killing yourself.

 

[Danigt22]

Then you make the right choice but given your doctrinal belief if you did take the mark of the beast you would still be saved - as you only lose your rewards - which totally contradicts Rev 14:9-10.

Im more looking foward to see Jesus, say to him im thankful on what he did for me. Than to worry if I need to prove myself, when he already did so much for us. I only care about the blessed hope.

 

[Oldmantook]

I dont believe we gentiles will be alive at that time, we would already be rapture. I mean the mark of the beast is a type of apostasy if you can only get by freewill, but if they force it into you. Any real born again believer would just have to kill himself before they are force to get injected or chip or something. The tribulation dispensation of grace is so different, it is no longer an age of grace but mandatory works such as killing yourself.

So how did you deal with Rev 16:15-16 which states that Jesus comes as a thief (rapture) right before the battle of Armageddon? BTW killing yourself is murder. No forgiveness for that as suicided persons can't repent.

 

[Jamdoc]

Jesus was talking about the OT prophetic timetable in Matthew 24, where the Body of Christ did not exist and was a secret hidden in God, as Paul would later reveal only after that in Ephesians.

Think of the mystery of the grace dispensation as an interruption of that timetable. That was why the generation during that time did not see the Tribulation events that Jesus was talking about then. God himself interrupted it.

Jesus knew about the mystery dispensation in his first coming of course, but it was not time for it to be revealed yet, until he ascended to heaven, saved Paul, and revealed the mystery to him.

See.. you have to pull a magic trick out of a hat in order to try and justify pretrib rapture and dispensationalism.
If you dropped both of those concepts and took the bible as is you'd see that Matthew 24 corresponds to Revelation 6, and 1 Thessalonians 4. All 3 references to the rapture match up perfectly.

 

[Jamdoc]

At the judgment seat of Christ, one will either receive eternal life or spiritual death. Are you antinomian?

Judgement seat of Christ is separate from the great white throne of judgement. The Judgement seat of Christ is taken from a translation of the Greek word "bema" it's the same kind of platform that you give medals at the olympic games on, the bema seat is where *rewards* are given according to works. It takes place before the great white throne of judgement. The Bema is for those who are saved, it indicates that there is MORE than just eternal life that you can get in heaven and the new earth, you'll get other rewards as well that are on top of your salvation.
Paul talked about this in 1 Corinthians

 

[Guojing]

See.. you have to pull a magic trick out of a hat in order to try and justify pretrib rapture and dispensationalism.
If you dropped both of those concepts and took the bible as is you'd see that Matthew 24 corresponds to Revelation 6, and 1 Thessalonians 4. All 3 references to the rapture match up perfectly.

You call that a magic trick, I call that Romans 9 to Romans 11.

Paul explained very clearly in those 3 chapters how the OT program for Israel was put on hold.

Romans 11 sums it up well

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

 

[Jamdoc]

You call that a magic trick, I call that Romans 9 to Romans 11.

Paul explained very clearly in those 3 chapters how the OT program for Israel was put on hold.

Romans 11 sums it up well

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

You mean like Romans 10:12 ?
Cause I have always taken that to mean that "God's people" was no longer a thing of genetics, but of faith.
Romans 11 is basically a scriptural basis of the doctrine of adoption.

 

[Guojing]

You mean like Romans 10:12 ?
Cause I have always taken that to mean that "God's people" was no longer a thing of genetics, but of faith.
Romans 11 is basically a scriptural basis of the doctrine of adoption.

Romans 11 tells us that God will return for Israel, once the fulness of the Gentiles came in.

That is the OT prophecy of the Tribulation.

 

[Danigt22]

So how did you deal with Rev 16:15-16 which states that Jesus comes as a thief (rapture) right before the battle of Armageddon? BTW killing yourself is murder. No forgiveness for that as suicided persons can't repent.

I dont think you undestand how we get salavation, I care that you get save asap.

 

[Danigt22]

So how did you deal with Rev 16:15-16 which states that Jesus comes as a thief (rapture) right before the battle of Armageddon? BTW killing yourself is murder. No forgiveness for that as suicided persons can't repent.

Listen to Guojing, he seems better explaining it than me. And get save for once.

 

[Oldmantook]

Judgement seat of Christ is separate from the great white throne of judgement. The Judgement seat of Christ is taken from a translation of the Greek word "bema" it's the same kind of platform that you give medals at the olympic games on, the bema seat is where *rewards* are given according to works. It takes place before the great white throne of judgement. The Bema is for those who are saved, it indicates that there is MORE than just eternal life that you can get in heaven and the new earth, you'll get other rewards as well that are on top of your salvation.
Paul talked about this in 1 Corinthians

I agree. There are two resurrections; thus two judgments. The first occurs at Jesus' 2nd coming. The second occurs after the millennial age. However none of these judgments refer to "rewards."
The "bema seat" judgment you refer to occurs at Jesus' return and is described at John 5:28-29 & Acts 24:15. The bema judgment belief asserts that this particular judgment is for believers only however this is plainly contradicted by these texts which describe a resurrection and judgment of BOTH the righteous believers and unrighteous unbelievers at the same time. Furthermore the Johanine passage describes the "reward" as either a "resurrection of life" or a "resurrection of judgment." No mention whatsoever of any other rewards.

 

[Oldmantook]

I dont think you undestand how we get salavation, I care that you get save asap.

I asked you how you explain how Rev 16:15-16 fits in with your rapture belief since these verses demonstrate the Jesus himself taught that he will return as a thief (rapture) before the battle of Armageddon and not before the tribulation as you choose to believe. Thus if you live long enough, you will be forced to choose to accept the mark or not to accept it. According to your belief in eternal security you can accept the mark and still be saved. That about sums it up as to the fallacy of your belief.

 

[Oldmantook]

Listen to Guojing, he seems better explaining it than me. And get save for once.

He/she does not make sense to me either. I suggest you study and understand your Bible further.