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Oncedeceived

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I know you need to believe this to keep your theology intact but it is not simply the case.

What if I said "You are too prideful to accept the evidence that supports Allah as the true God"?
I would say you are wrong and present the counter argument that supports why it is wrong.
 
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Oncedeceived

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No. My answer is I don't know. Please stop accusing me of being dishonest.
Interesting, I implied you were being honest and what we should expect from that. You seem to have somewhat of a chip on shoulder. You came to us, we didn't go to you.

So what is the criteria to tell if something is designed or not? If I have a rock, how do I know if it is designed or got here naturally?
A rock is a far cry from information in a cell. Why do you think the majority of Scientists claim the appearance of design is not "really" design? The biologists that discovered the information in DNA Watson and Crick even recognized the appearance of design and Crick remarked, biologists must “constantly keep in mind that what they see was not designed, but rather evolved.” Atheist Scientists claim the appearance is an illusion but no one in that field would disclaim the appearance of design that I am aware of at this time.
 
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miknik5

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Of course, I am not denying that they happened. In both of these events there was only one person that saw something and others in the same room did not. I am not saying these events did not happen only that there is insufficient evidence to believe that they did.

This is cherry picking isn't it. I have prayed thousands of time for my wife's chronic condition and the only people that have ever helped were doctors through scientists/engineers etc. If you want to claim that this prayer to God worked is evidence of gods existence then you also must believe the unanswered prayers is evidence against his existence.
the one person who saw it was you.

Keep praying...and make sure that in your heart you are directing your prayers to THE ONE AND ONLY GOD and FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST.

Many profess to have god(s), but deny THE SON..
He who denies THE SON, denies THE ONE and ONLY GOD and FATHER....
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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Interesting, I implied you were being honest and what we should expect from that. You seem to have somewhat of a chip on shoulder. You came to us, we didn't go to you.
You said this:

If you are being honest we should be able to assume that those things that are convincing to a Christian don't convince you because you have more sufficient evidence to counter those.

Because I don't agree with you here then the implication is that I am being dishonest. I did not make you respond to me either.

A rock is a far cry from information in a cell. Why do you think the majority of Scientists claim the appearance of design is not "really" design? The biologists that discovered the information in DNA Watson and Crick even recognized the appearance of design and Crick remarked, biologists must “constantly keep in mind that what they see was not designed, but rather evolved.” Atheist Scientists claim the appearance is an illusion but no one in that field would disclaim the appearance of design that I am aware of at this time.
Again, you did not answer the question. Why do you think a rock does not appear designed and a cell does appear designed?

I am not arguing against the appearance of design, that is a subjective assessment. I want to know how we can know something is designed.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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I would be glad to when you start doing the same.
The answer is that I cannot show you that I am not prideful and neither can you. But your question is the same as asking me to prove I don't beat my wife and believing I do until I do that.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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the one person who saw it was you.

Keep praying...and make sure that in your heart you are directing your prayers to THE ONE AND ONLY GOD and FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST.

Many profess to have god(s), but deny THE SON..
He who denies THE SON, denies THE ONE and ONLY GOD and FATHER....
It is interesting to me that you believe my stories are true just on my word and without any other evidence. The events happened as best I can remember them but what evidence do you have that they were supernatural?
 
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miknik5

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It is interesting to me that you believe my stories are true just on my word and without any other evidence. The events happened as best I can remember them but what evidence do you have that they were supernatural?
If you made up such a story sir, then even your words here are not to be trusted. How can you be taken seriously sir? How?
 
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Oncedeceived

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You said this:

If you are being honest we should be able to assume that those things that are convincing to a Christian don't convince you because you have more sufficient evidence to counter those.
I was asking you for counter evidence that supports your position of only believing something if it has sufficient evidence...that by reading my post would assure you that I was saying if I am right in assuming your honesty, you would be inclined to answer my questions.

Because I don't agree with you here then the implication is that I am being dishonest. I did not make you respond to me either.
No, again see above. I has nothing to do with agreeing with me but in supporting the reason for this conversation which is for you to have sufficient evidence to believe in God.

Again, you did not answer the question. Why do you think a rock does not appear designed and a cell does appear designed?
Information. I have repeated that several times.

I am not arguing against the appearance of design, that is a subjective assessment. I want to know how we can know something is designed.
Is it subjective? If you were to go to the beach and in the sand near a low lying tree there were scratches in the sand. Subjectively, it could be someone playing with a branch, scratching around or it could be the tree itself making the marks by the wind. However, if we go to the beach and there in the sand is a message, "George was here". Now do we think this was made by a branch blowing in the wind or do we think someone named George was writing in the sand? We would be correct in concluding that an intelligent being wrote in the sand.
 
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Oncedeceived

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The answer is that I cannot show you that I am not prideful and neither can you. But your question is the same as asking me to prove I don't beat my wife and believing I do until I do that.
That is completely a strawman.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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What evidence do I have that they are supernatural? Actually sir, the very same evidence that YOU had, sir except my daughter was old enough to be frightened
Something that happened to you cannot be evidence for something that happened to me.
 
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Clizby WampusCat

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If you made up such a story sir, then even your words here are not to be trusted. How can you be taken seriously sir? How?
I am not saying that you should not believe the stories, but how can you believe that they were supernatural from my stories?
 
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miknik5

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Something that happened to you cannot be evidence for something that happened to me.
It is evidence that there are indeed spirits and a spiritual realm, sir...

your daughter was 4. She referenced a false, made up, mythical being and described what has been depicted of evil spirits...

Were you somehow teaching your 4 year old these things?

I do NOT think you were....
 
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miknik5

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On another note, in addition to what i posted in 709. I do not think that anyone can help you sir.
Because, if you can so easily say that maybe you made up this story, then it reasons that you do not trust that men speak truth to begin with. Therefore, why would you believe the testimony of others?
 
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miknik5

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GOD bless you sir.
Keep praying for your family and never cease from praying for them...
And in your heart, acknowledge the GOD and FATHER of our LORD JESUS CHRIST...

This will protect you from every lying spirit that whispers and mutters anything but THE TRUTH...
 
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