Faith in the living, resurrected Word (while the scriptures are only 50% historically accurate).

[public hermit]

Why, you don't grant the same to God Himself.

See, if I had feelings that would have hurt them. Do you have a position on the OP, or did you just drop by to try your hand at slander?

 

[jimmyjimmy]

See, if I had feelings that would have hurt them. Do you have a position on the OP, or did you just drop by to try your hand at slander?

I won't engage anyone who would refer to that as slander.

 

[public hermit]

I won't engage anyone who would refer to that as slander.

You called me an evangelical. I would appreciate you not tarnishing my good reputation.

 

[Saint Steven]

Why, you don't grant the same to God Himself.

That was a cheap shot.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

You called me an evangelical. I would appreciate you not tarnishing my good reputation.

LOL! My wording could have been better, I suppose.

I actually didn't call you an Evangelical. I meant, that you had something in common with Evangelicals, in that you think that everything but "going to Heaven" is superfluous.

 

[public hermit]

LOL! My wording could have been better, I suppose.

I actually didn't call you an Evangelical. I meant, that you had something in common with Evangelicals, in that you think that everything but "going to Heaven" is superfluous.

I don't understand how you got that from the OP.

 

[Saint Steven]

I won't engage anyone who would refer to that as slander.

Thanks for stopping by. Always so nice when you visit.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

I don't understand how you got that from the OP.

I don't understand how you don't understand how I got that from the OP.

 

[public hermit]

I don't understand how you don't understand how I got that from the OP.

Well, then we have mutual misunderstanding. I'm cool with that.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Well, then we have mutual misunderstanding. I'm cool with that.

You could take an alternate course and try to correct my misunderstanding.

 

[public hermit]

You could take an alternate course and try to correct my misunderstanding.

The OP was my attempt (as feeble as it might be) to show that the efficaciousness of Christ's work is not dependent on the scriptures being 100% historically accurate. They are thought experiments aimed at showing a flaw in the idea of biblical inerrantism. Do they work? I'm less confident than when I wrote the OP for reasons mentioned in the thread.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

The OP was my attempt (as feeble as it might be) to show that the efficaciousness of Christ's work is not dependent on the scriptures being 100% historically accurate. They are thought experiments aimed at showing a flaw in the idea of biblical inerrantism. Do they work? I'm less confident than when I wrote the OP for reasons mentioned in the thread.

Why? Which pages of the Bible would you like to rip out? The ones that offend Progressives? The ones that offend the Fundamentalists? The ones that offend the rich? The ones that offend the poor???

The Bible is because it is in fact wholly God's Word, offends EVERYONE, in some point.

 

[public hermit]

Why? Which pages of the Bible would you like to rip out?

I think you're still missing the point. It's not about particular passages, it's about the function of the scriptures and their relation to the gospel, or better, the salvific work of Christ. The scriptures are a means to an end.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

I think you're still missing the point. It's not about particular passages, it's about the function of the scriptures and their relation to the gospel, or better, the salvific work of Christ. The scriptures are a means to an end.

I am after the point underneath the point. That's the only thing worth discussing here. What's your motivation for the post?

 

[public hermit]

I am after the point underneath the point. That's the only thing worth discussing here. What's your motivation for the post?

My motivation is that the scriptures be treated appropriately and not as an idol. When they are treated as perfect, they are treated as an end and not a means. The scriptures are not God. Not everything we find in them is in line with what we know in Jesus Christ.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

My motivation is that the scriptures be treated appropriately and not as an idol. When they are treated as perfect, they are treated as an end and not a means. The scriptures are not God. Not everything we find in them is in line with what we know in Jesus Christ.

Okay. I thought as much. You want a Thomas Jefferson Bible.

Pro Tip: If you have a God who cannot confront you, you have no God but yourself.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Does this verse make the cut? "But the serpent said to the woman, “You will not surely die."

 

[Shrewd Manager]

Do you consider the God of the OT a different God of the NT?

No, that's my point. Jesus says suffer the little children come to me, and also blasphemy against him is a forgivable sin. Elisha (who was a type of Jesus) apparently curses the children without mercy.

So how do we harmonise these scriptures? I say the law/grace covenant distinction is insufficient. Also, for the law to operate, doesn't there need to be a trial?

That's why it's dangerous to rely too heavily on the Bible without the Spirit as revealed in Christ. It is too easily found to contain contradictions and disjunctions on a literal reading, and this is exactly what gives rise to errors, which has certainly happened historically due to a process of accretion of religious dogma and manipulation by sinful men and the devil. Or do you say theology has never been healthier than today?

Yes our sensibilities today would not to call for children to be mauled by bears.

So do our sensibilities today change what happened thousands of years ago, or do we just discard the Scriptures for not meeting our post modern sensibilities?

It's not merely a question of sensibilities. To say that is in effect to claim moral values are contingent, or that the fulfillment of the law in Christ means its partial abolition.

 

[Shrewd Manager]

Just wait until Christ's return when the blood will run in the streets, waist deep.

So Christ comes back with bloodlust and vengeance in his heart? Does he also spit swords at ppl, or could this be metaphorical/ symbolic language being used?

 

[redleghunter]

No, that's my point. Jesus says suffer the little children come to me, and also blasphemy against him is a forgivable sin. Elisha (who was a type of Jesus) apparently curses the children without mercy.

Don’t you see the different situations that the context brings to light? Elisha was facing a wicked generation. To the point even the children he encountered were speaking blasphemies to Elisha. These young lads or young boys obviously were not small children. They knew the ministry of Elijah especially how he defeated the prophets of Baal which made him undesirable number 1 with King Ahab and the kingdom of Israel.

They told Elisha go up you bald man go up. Which is get lost Elisha just as Elijah went up why don’t you get lost too. These youths were under the Law. Bethel was one of two centers of Idolatrous worship in the Kingdom.

2 Kings 2: NASB

23Then he went up from there to Bethel; and as he was going up by the way, young lads came out from the city and mocked him and said to him, “Go up, you baldhead; go up, you baldhead!”24When he looked behind him and saw them, he cursed them in the name of the LORD. Then two female bears came out of the woods and tore up forty-two lads of their number. 25He went from there to Mount Carmel, and from there he returned to Samaria. (NASB)

Verse 23 other Bible versions.

2 Kings 2:23 From there, Elisha went up to Bethel, and as he was walking up the road, a group of young men came out of the city and jeered at him, chanting, "Go up, you baldhead! Go up, you baldhead!"


Finally, do you see the difference in the children who came to Jesus to hear him and bless them. No comparison to punk idolatrous youth who mocked the anointed prophet of God.

Or shall we also throw out the entire annihilation of cities like Sodom and Gomorrah? Did the children escape that judgement? Only Lot and his daughters survived.

All the Canaanite cities laid waste? Women children and cattle? So let’s chuck that out as well.

Or you can just claim Marcionism and be done with it.