America is the Best, Most Free, and Most Prosperous Country on Earth: Change My Mind

[Sparagmos]

In some places what you call freedom means you can shoot people if you are feeling scared whatever the threat is real or not. You define it as freedom. I would call it psychosis.

Cops shooting innocent people on their living rooms and yoga teachers in nightgowns because freedom ?

Yeah the Wild West was the most “free,” then.

 

[Sparagmos]

Speaking of slaves to the state, we have literally more of them in prison than any other country in the world, not raw number.... but per capita.

Now, whether their imprisonment is justified or unjustified, either way it speaks to something insanely wrong going on here.

Wait - that’s the opposite of freedom!

 

[Speedwell]

Yeah the Wild West was the most “free,” then.

It says a lot about conservative ideology that it requires militant armed defenders and exemption from the rules of civil discourse that everybody else abides by voluntarily.

 

[DamianWarS]

As I was told this was a debatable topic, I figured I'd post here to let the debate ensue.

Definitions:

Best: most productive of good : offering or producing the greatest advantage, utility, or satisfaction

Free: enjoying personal freedom : not subject to the control or domination of another

Prosperous: marked by success or economic well-being

there are 3 areas where you are claiming victory over

1. Best (whatever that means)
2. Most free (not sure if you really want this)
3. Most Prosperous

are you suggesting it is ranked the highest in all these categories or that the combined total scores the highest over any other country?

well according to the ranking from U.S. News & World Report the best country ranking in the world in 2019...

1. Switzerland
2. Japan
3. Canada
4. Germany
5. United Kingdom
6. Sweden
7. Australia
8. United States

United States isn't even the best country in North America. Are you convinced... probably not. There is a good deal of people that believe the best country in the world is right where their feet are planted and there is nothing that can change that. So "best" is not objective at all and I expect no different than an American to say America is the best.

moving on to "Most free". many people think the more freedom the better. This is not true, and what we really mean is a desire for more freedom in the things I like to do. Freedom is about equality among all people with regards to age, sex, sexual orientation, gender (or gender freedom), religion and race to name a few and it can get pretty messy. I'm a Canadian and do you know if I wanted a sex change the government would pay for it as a right of my freedom to choose my gender. Regardless they actually measure these things in the Liberty Index scale and although the United States is in the top tier it's not in the top 10. the tops are:

1. New Zealand
2. Switzerland
3. Ireland
4. Australia
5. Canada
6. Netherlands
7. Finland
8. Norway
9. Luxembourg
10. Sweden

(not sure where the US is)

Most Prosperous... hey guess what... there is also a Prosperity Index and again although United States ranks high... it's not in the 10 top. the top 10 are:

1. Norway
2. New Zealand
3. Finland
4. Switzerland
5. Denmark
6. Sweden
7. United Kingdom
8. Canada
9. Netherlands
10. Ireland

(United States ranks 17)

As a Canadian I like to see it rank higher than the US in these categories but based on "best" (the first ranking), freedom and prosperity it seems Switzerland gets that honour scoring with the combined total highest marks in all categories and in individual categories consistently higher than the United States.

 

[Halbhh]

You said, verbatim: You're right, freedom isn't free, but freedom does indicate that a citizen is not a slave to their state. (my bolding)

Thats what I responded to.

The data I have in mind is here: List of countries by incarceration rate - Wikipedia

#1 United States -- 655 (incarceration rate per 100,000)
#2 El Salvador -- 604
#3 Turkmenistan -- 552

Ouch!

 

[durangodawood]

#1 United States -- 655 (incarceration rate per 100,000)
#2 El Salvador -- 604
#3 Turkmenistan -- 552

Ouch!

I know! And in Turkmenistan you go to prison just for insulting the president's horse.

 

[Halbhh]

there are 3 areas where you are claiming victory over

1. Best (whatever that means)
2. Most free (not sure if you really want this)
3. Most Prosperous

are you suggesting it is ranked the highest in all these categories or that the combined total scores the highest over any other country?

well according to the ranking from U.S. News & World Report the best country ranking in the world in 2019...

1. Switzerland
2. Japan
3. Canada
4. Germany
5. United Kingdom
6. Sweden
7. Australia
8. United States

United States isn't even the best country in North America. Are you convinced... probably not. There is a good deal of people that believe the best country in the world is right where their feet are planted and there is nothing that can change that. So "best" is not objective at all and I expect no different than an American to say America is the best.

moving on to "Most free". many people think the more freedom the better. This is not true, and what we really mean is a desire for more freedom in the things I like to do. Freedom is about equality among all people with regards to age, sex, sexual orientation, gender (or gender freedom), religion and race to name a few and it can get pretty messy. I'm a Canadian and do you know if I wanted a sex change the government would pay for it as a right of my freedom to choose my gender. Regardless they actually measure these things in the Liberty Index scale and although the United States is in the top tier it's not in the top 10. the tops are:

1. New Zealand
2. Switzerland
3. Ireland
4. Australia
5. Canada
6. Netherlands
7. Finland
8. Norway
9. Luxembourg
10. Sweden

(not sure where the US is)

Most Prosperous... hey guess what... there is also a Prosperity Index and again although United States ranks high... it's not in the 10 top. the top 10 are:

1. Norway
2. New Zealand
3. Finland
4. Switzerland
5. Denmark
6. Sweden
7. United Kingdom
8. Canada
9. Netherlands
10. Ireland

(United States ranks 17)

As a Canadian I like to see it rank higher than the US in these categories but based on "best" (the first ranking), freedom and prosperity it seems Switzerland gets that honour scoring with the combined total highest marks in all categories and in individual categories consistently higher than the United States.

Yes, that lines up with my post, in which I very carefully didn't try to claim the U.S. is the most rich per capita, etc., but I hope my main message: what really matters is love between people -- came across (to any who read it, if anyone did).

Again, probably not the best per capita, but...because we do ok, and have a large population, I would expect we have a lot of love in our nation, when summed up as a total. And that's something to be glad about. The U.S. isn't that bad, even though we are put up on a pedestal where our flaws are very, very...very visible to all the world....

 

[DamianWarS]

Yes, that lines up with my post, in which I very carefully didn't try to claim the U.S. is the most rich per capita, etc., but I hope my main message: what really matters is love between people -- came across (to any who read it, if anyone did).

Again, probably not the best per capita, but...because we do ok, and have a large population, I would expect we have a lot of love in our nation, when summed up as a total. And that's something to be glad about. The U.S. isn't that bad, even though we are put up on a pedestal where our flaws are very, very...very visible to all the world....

there are "love" ranks too and you will find in terms of countries that rank the most/least prosperous it gets flipped and the poorest countries feel the most love. The Philippines are the highest according to the Gallup World Poll.

 

[Halbhh]

there are "love" ranks too and you will find in terms of countries that rank the most/least prosperous it gets flipped and the poorest countries feel the most love. The Philippines are the highest according to the Gallup World Poll.

Now that would be a very interesting information! I would like to see that, and since you've already found it, would you offer some link(s)?

 

[brinny]

As I was told this was a debatable topic, I figured I'd post here to let the debate ensue.

Definitions:

Best: most productive of good : offering or producing the greatest advantage, utility, or satisfaction

Free: enjoying personal freedom : not subject to the control or domination of another

Prosperous: marked by success or economic well-being

Aynaz Anni Cyrus agrees with the OP (and more), and is fighting for America. She is from Iran originally and grew up under Sharia Law there. In the video titled "Sharia for Women: A Female Sharia Survivor Shares Her Story." she gives her own testimony of why she is fighting for America and why it is worth fighting for. (The video is on Youtube, as well as other videos where she speaks of her own experiences.)

 

[durangodawood]

Aynaz Anni Cyrus agrees with the OP (and more), and is fighting for America. She is from Iran originally and grew up under Sharia Law there. In the video titled "Sharia for Women: A Female Sharia Survivor Shares Her Story." she gives her own testimony of why she is fighting for America and why it is worth fighting for. (The video is on Youtube, as well as other videos where she speaks of her own experiences.)

Again, comparing the USA to countries like Iran is really scraping the barrel.

I do agree that our civil liberties are very strong and worthy of respect.

 

[RDKirk]

[Poe]'Murica is the best because the people who are supposed to be here speak English, just like I do. [/Poe]

 

[brinny]

brinny said: ↑
Aynaz Anni Cyrus agrees with the OP (and more), and is fighting for America. She is from Iran originally and grew up under Sharia Law there. In the video titled "Sharia for Women: A Female Sharia Survivor Shares Her Story." she gives her own testimony of why she is fighting for America and why it is worth fighting for. (The video is on Youtube, as well as other videos where she speaks of her own experiences.)

Again, comparing the USA to countries like Iran is really scraping the barrel.

I do agree that our civil liberties are very strong and worthy of respect.

Thank you. I agree with some of what you posted (as would Aynaz Anni Cyrus).

She would, according to what she reports, take it much further, however, as what it boils down to from her own experiences (and others) is that it's literally a matter of "life and death", etc. That is why she makes it a point to say that she is fighting for America, and invites others to do the same, and says that America is worth fighting for.

 

[durangodawood]

[Poe]'Murica is the best because the people who are supposed to be here speak English, just like I do. [/Poe]

English is the best language!

(Mainly because invasions and migrants landing in Britain de-purified it over and over and made it a mongrel tongue)

 

[Halbhh]

Aynaz Anni Cyrus agrees with the OP (and more), and is fighting for America. She is from Iran originally and grew up under Sharia Law there. In the video titled "Sharia for Women: A Female Sharia Survivor Shares Her Story." she gives her own testimony of why she is fighting for America and why it is worth fighting for. (The video is on Youtube, as well as other videos where she speaks of her own experiences.)

America does have a special place in the world that isn't similar to any other nation.

Abraham Lincoln said --
"...We shall nobly save, or meanly lose, the last best hope of earth. Other means may succeed; this could not fail. The way is plain, peaceful, generous, just -- a way which, if followed, the world will forever applaud, and God must forever bless."
Abraham Lincoln's Annual Message to Congress -- Concluding Remarks

America is Not the ultimate last best hope -- that's from God, through Jesus Christ.

But...for this earth, for humans, this nation is the 'last best hope' of human effort of this earth. What humans can do. It's that last best hope.

And when it fails, the only true, ultimate last best hope, the true One, will be the only One left.

 

[durangodawood]

Thank you. I agree with some of what you posted (as would Aynaz Anni Cyrus).

She would, according to what she reports, take it much further, however, as what it boils down to from her own experiences (and others) is that it's literally a matter of "life and death", etc. That is why she makes it a point to say that she is fighting for America, and invites others to do the same, and says that America is worth fighting for.

Yes I agree. And its powerful how often we turn to the testimony of immigrants to remind us how great America is.

I do think America is great!

But at the same time, I think America is sick, with the prime -but not only- evidence being our incarceration rate.

 

[RDKirk]

Well, I certainly wouldn't want to be a Christian anywhere else.

Well, it's certainly more comfortable to call oneself a Christian in the US than most places, but I suspect the folks who call themselves Christians in China or North Korea more likely are.

 

[brinny]

America does have a special place in the world that isn't similar to any other nation.

Abraham Lincoln said --
"...We shall nobly save, or meanly lose, the last best hope of earth. Other means may succeed; this could not fail. The way is plain, peaceful, generous, just -- a way which, if followed, the world will forever applaud, and God must forever bless."
Abraham Lincoln's Annual Message to Congress -- Concluding Remarks

America is Not the ultimate last best hope -- that's from God, through Jesus Christ.

But...for this earth, for humans, this nation is the 'last best hope' of human effort of this earth. What humans can do. It's that last best hope.

And when it fails, the only true, ultimate last best hope, the true One, will be the only One left.

Aynaz Anni Cyrus, in escaping Iran (and sure death or disfigurement or rape or all mentioned and more), and coming to America, defends America now and says that America is worth fighting for, because it IS, as you posted in the quote from Abraham Lincoln, "the last best hope of earth", according to not only Aynaz Anni Cyrus, but other survivors as well. That is why she, and many others fight for America and believe that America is worth fighting for.

 

[brinny]

brinny said: ↑
Thank you. I agree with some of what you posted (as would Aynaz Anni Cyrus).

She would, according to what she reports, take it much further, however, as what it boils down to from her own experiences (and others) is that it's literally a matter of "life and death", etc. That is why she makes it a point to say that she is fighting for America, and invites others to do the same, and says that America is worth fighting for.

Yes I agree. And its powerful how often we turn to the testimony of immigrants to remind us how great America is.

I do think America is great!

But at the same time, I think America is sick, with the prime -but not only- evidence being our incarceration rate.

Aynaz Anni Cyrus gives her own experience with her own immigration process in the video i mentioned in an earlier post.

 

[Speedwell]

Aynaz Anni Cyrus, in escaping Iran (and sure death or disfigurement or rape or all mentioned and more), and coming to America, defends America now and says that America is worth fighting for, because it IS, as you posted in the quote from Abraham Lincoln, "the last best hope of earth", according to not only Aynaz Anni Cyrus, but other survivors as well. That is why she, and many others fight for America and believe that America is worth fighting for.

Do you think America has to be "best" in all the ways we have been discussing in order to be worth fighting for?