Do you have to be a good servant to be saved?

[renniks]

No such thing as a former believer. I just showed you the lord himself saying salvation is eternal.

I suspect there are literally millions of former believers. And the verse you quoted said: Whosoever believes has eternal life, just as I said. Not whoever once believed in grade school or high school or for five days once.

 

[Daniel C]

I suspect there are literally millions of former believers. And the verse you quoted said: Whosoever believes has eternal life, just as I said. Not whoever once believed in grade school or high school or for five days once.

Scripture please.

I have been showing how people are saved and eternal security,so it's only fair you provide Biblical proof of your claim-how people can lose their salvation.

 

[Daniel C]

I have understood ”saved” means one is saved from the judgment that comes because of sin. That forgiveness is offered freely for all people. But, eternal life is for righteous. Therefore, if after forgiveness one doesn’t repent and reject sin and become righteous, forgiveness is not useful.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

This definition of saved is incorect.

By Jesus' own words:''For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.''

Faith Salvation through Christ=being saved

 

[renniks]

Scripture please.

I have been showing how people are saved and eternal security,so it's only fair you provide Biblical proof of your claim-how people can lose their salvation.

I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit;apart from me you can do nothing. 6 If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned.
John 15:5-6

 

[☦Marius☦]

No such thing as a former believer. I just showed you the lord himself saying salvation is eternal.

Everlasting life is permenantly given after the final judgement. We've literally posted at least 30 verses showing the possibility of losing salvation. Read the beatitudes.

 

[Daniel C]

I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit;apart from me you can do nothing. 6 If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned.
John 15:5-6

Well that has been debunked already in this thread. Feel free to view post #58 where the vine parable stated. Do you have to be a good servant to be saved?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

This definition of saved is incorect.

By Jesus' own words:''For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.''

Faith Salvation through Christ=being saved

Everlasting life is permenantly given after the final judgement. We've literally posted at least 30 verses showing the possibility of losing salvation. Read the beatitudes.

It is readily apparent , I think, that Daniel's definitions (of 'saved'/ 'salvation'/ etc ) are useful to support his own ideas, and appear to be thus used to avoid believing what the Truth in Scripture is.(which requires Yahuweh's Revelation of Yahuweh's Own definitions/ meanings/ purpose in and throughout all Scripture to be accepted)

 

[Daniel C]

Everlasting life is permenantly given after the final judgement. We've literally posted at least 30 verses showing the possibility of losing salvation. Read the beatitudes.

Your assessment on the timing of everlasting life or being saved is misplaced.

We can know now we have eternal life,not at the last judgement,if we have faith:

1 John 5 13
''These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.''

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Your assessment on the timing of everlasting life or being saved is misplaced.

We can know now we have eternal life,not at the last judgement,if we have faith:

1 John 5 13
''These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.''

Yet in the Word of God, the Bible, it is written that on JUDGMENT DAY (however long AFTER "we can know now") ,
MULTITUDES find out that they ARE NOT SAVED,
even though they once were in that crowd that "know now we have eternal life" ....
they find out
horrendously? !
on JUDGMENT DAY, that WHAT THEY "KNOW NOW" is wrong.... and they perish eternally....

 

[renniks]

To ''abide'' in Christ is to dwell or believe in Christ. Of course non-believers are condemned,again not a loss of salvation but referring to the unsaved who are not abiding in Christ.

That's ridiculous in context. He's specifically talking about believers In this passage, do you want me to think he suddenly switches to speaking of people that were never saved, and then switches back to believers again for the rest of the passage?

 

[zoidar]

Scripture please.

I have been showing how people are saved and eternal security,so it's only fair you provide Biblical proof of your claim-how people can lose their salvation.

Here is scripture that says that elect can fall away. God bless!

Matthew 24:24
For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Here is scripture that says that elect can fall away. God bless!

Matthew 24:24
For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect.

Sorry, no.
While all Scripture shows clearly the risk believers have daily of falling away and being left without repentance any more,

this Scripture does not say that the elect can fall away.

 

[zoidar]

Sorry, no.
While all Scripture shows clearly the risk believers have daily of falling away and being left without repentance any more,

this Scripture does not say that the elect can fall away.

What does it say then?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

What does it say then?

Matthew 24:24
For false Christs and false prophets will arise and will show great signs and wonders, so as to mislead, if possible, even the elect.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

MOUNCE
For false messiahs and false prophets will appear, and they will perform great signs and wonders so as to lead astray, if that were possible, even the elect.

VOICE
False liberators and false prophets will appear, and they will know a few tricks—they will perform great miracles, and they will make great promises. If it were possible, they would even deceive God’s elect.


OJB
For meshichei sheker (false Moshiachs) will arise, and neviei sheker (false prophets), and they will give otot gedolim (great signs) and moftim (wonders), so as to deceive, if possible, even the Bechirim (Chosen ones).

 

[zoidar]

MOUNCE
For false messiahs and false prophets will appear, and they will perform great signs and wonders so as to lead astray, if that were possible, even the elect.

VOICE
False liberators and false prophets will appear, and they will know a few tricks—they will perform great miracles, and they will make great promises. If it were possible, they would even deceive God’s elect.


OJB
For meshichei sheker (false Moshiachs) will arise, and neviei sheker (false prophets), and they will give otot gedolim (great signs) and moftim (wonders), so as to deceive, if possible, even the Bechirim (Chosen ones).

Matthew 24:24 Interlinear: for there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and they shall give great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, also the chosen.

 

[BNR32FAN]

You are quoting a parable that uses goats, you want to use the parable literally.......apart from the bit that references goats.

And yet when Jesus speaks plainly you deny him. So that's inconsistent.

What do you mean when Jesus speaks plainly? Which verse are you referring to?

 

[BNR32FAN]

You are quoting a parable that uses goats, you want to use the parable literally.......apart from the bit that references goats.

And yet when Jesus speaks plainly you deny him. So that's inconsistent.

And I don’t understand what you mean about my reference to the goats.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I suspect there are literally millions of former believers. And the verse you quoted said: Whosoever believes has eternal life, just as I said. Not whoever once believed in grade school or high school or for five days once.

Yes, in English, in the Western World Churches especially, it seems that the reality of
faith / belief being something every day in a person trusting in and relying on the heavenly Father , always listening to and following the Good Shepherd Jesus (and running from other 'voices') , is not comprehended.

 

[zoidar]

MOUNCE
For false messiahs and false prophets will appear, and they will perform great signs and wonders so as to lead astray, if that were possible, even the elect.

VOICE
False liberators and false prophets will appear, and they will know a few tricks—they will perform great miracles, and they will make great promises. If it were possible, they would even deceive God’s elect.


OJB
For meshichei sheker (false Moshiachs) will arise, and neviei sheker (false prophets), and they will give otot gedolim (great signs) and moftim (wonders), so as to deceive, if possible, even the Bechirim (Chosen ones).

"that were" is not in the Greek. That was my point.