Some random discussion on evolution...

[dad]

I believe you, but still you have no way of objectively identifying intelligent design. You might just as well say that everything is "designed" even those objects which were produced by natural forces.

But then, of course, you are no longer an IDist, merely a theist.

How could a creation believer look at ANY of the wonders of creation, and workings and not see the hand of God!?

 

[Speedwell]

God is not a barely detectable insignificant dull witted designer. His creation yells out in wonder. I think the issue is that some folks who like to omit Him from their lives and knowledge want to attribute the wonders of creation to fluke and evolution and happenstance etc.

That is their privilege, but the science itself makes no such statement.

 

[Speedwell]

How could a creation believer look at ANY of the wonders of creation, and workings and not see the hand of God!?

I don't know. I see the hand of God in conceiving the marvelous process of evolution

 

[dad]

That is their privilege, but the science itself makes no such statement.

Staements are seen in the sum package of words and claims offered. Rather than seek to explore the wonders of creation, they have sought to bury them with witty invented 'anything BUT God' wild scenarios and possibilities.

 

[dad]

I don't know. I see the hand of God in conceiving the marvelous process of evolution

Me too, but in doing so I do not cast off the obvious truth of Scripture and creation. and give ALL the credit/glory to His gift of the ability to adapt.

 

[Speedwell]

Staements are seen in the sum package of words and claims offered. Rather than seek to explore the wonders of creation, they have sought to bury them with witty invented 'anything BUT God' wild scenarios and possibilities.

No, that is just offensive. the theory of evolution itself says nothing about whether God is the cause of it all or not.

 

[Speedwell]

Me too, but in doing so I do not cast off the obvious truth of Scripture and creation. and give ALL the credit/glory to His gift of the ability to adapt.

Yes, the discussions on this board are rarely, if ever, about the existence of God and his authorship of our being. Most often they are about the Bible and how a particular minority Protestant sect insists upon reading it.

 

[pitabread]

Rather than seek to explore the wonders of creation

Do creationists really do this though? Creationism seems to begin and end with "Goddidit", so what "exploring" is actually taking place?

 

[Kylie]

sure. you dont?

I've yet to see the evidence that gears can't arise naturally.

 

[Kylie]

Nothing circular about observing objectively what is unequivocally designed!

You assume that gears must be designed so you can say, "All gears must have been designed," which leads you to assume that gears must have been designed, so you conclude that all gears must have been designed...

Nah, that's not circular at all, is it...?

 

[dad]

No, that is just offensive. the theory of evolution itself says nothing about whether God is the cause of it all or not.

It eliminates THE God of the bible. It makes Genesis seem untrue. If God created man and then woman from the man (you believe that yes or no?) then obviously all evolving that mankind underwent was after that fact.

 

[Kylie]

It eliminates THE God of the bible. It makes Genesis seem untrue. If God created man and then woman from the man (you believe that yes or no?) then obviously all evolving that mankind underwent was after that fact.

And we can't have that, can we?

 

[Speedwell]

It eliminates THE God of the bible. It makes Genesis seem untrue.

No, not untrue, just not literal history.

 

[dad]

Yes, the discussions on this board are rarely, if ever, about the existence of God and his authorship of our being. Most often they are about the Bible and how a particular minority Protestant sect insists upon reading it.

Evolution of life can't be read in to it.

 

[dad]

And we can't have that, can we?

That depends on the 'we'. As for me and my house...no flippin way.

 

[dad]

Do creationists really do this though? Creationism seems to begin and end with "Goddidit", so what "exploring" is actually taking place?

Yes we look up in wonder at God and His amazing power. Evos look up and feel equal to bugs and see a fluke universe with no reason or rhyme.

 

[pitabread]

Yes we look up in wonder at God and His amazing power.

That's not what you said though. You said this, "Rather than seek to explore the wonders of creation...".

What is the "exploring" that is happening here?

 

[dad]

You assume that gears must be designed so you can say, "All gears must have been designed," which leads you to assume that gears must have been designed, so you conclude that all gears must have been designed...

Nah, that's not circular at all, is it...?

Not at all. Unless sanity and common sense and intelligence is circular inside your mind?

 

[dad]

That's not what you said though. You said this, "Rather than seek to explore the wonders of creation...".

What is the "exploring" that is happening here?

Well, it can be many things. Exploring patterns in stars. Exploring how stars can guide us on the sea or land. Exploring how beautiful it all is. Exploring how orbiting bodies are not crashing into one another in chaos. Exploring how the Christmas star must have been unlike the stars up there we see. Exploring the claims so called science makes about the things they actually know something about, comets meteors, the planets etc. Exploring how birds migrate great distances accurately and in a timely way. Exploring how salmon find their way and how they cycles work. etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc.

 

[dad]

No, not untrue, just not literal history.

Not anything at all. It is either true or not. It was not given as some secret coded message. It was echoed throughout the bible.