Does willful sin separate the elect from God?

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Jesus gives those who He gives His Spirit to, eternal life. They are no longer a slave to sin, but to righteousness. No slave of sin has eternal life.

None of us have anything to boast about. We have nothing that we have not received from God. We are nothing in ourselves. If we think we are something, then we are lifted up in pride and God resists us. He gives grace to the humble person who knows that there is nothing good in self, and ascribes everything to God's mercy and grace and the working of the Holy Spirit within.

 

[def]

Jesus gives those who He gives His Spirit to, eternal life. They are no longer a slave to sin, but to righteousness. No slave of sin has eternal life.

A believer is no longer a slave to sin because there is now a competing force, the born-again spirit. It is the born-again spirit that has eternal life.

 

[CharismaticLady]

All our sins past present and future are forgiven at the cross, period for those who are in Christ.

That is not in scripture. What IS in scripture is that all our PAST sins are cleansed.

 

[CharismaticLady]

None of us have anything to boast about. We have nothing that we have not received from God. We are nothing in ourselves. If we think we are something, then we are lifted up in pride and God resists us. He gives grace to the humble person who knows that there is nothing good in self, and ascribes everything to God's mercy and grace and the working of the Holy Spirit within.

Who's boasting. Don't you know that we can do nothing righteous apart from the Spirit? Anytime someone agrees with Jesus that He takes away our sin, there will always be someone who accuses them of boasting. Always. Paul says we establish the law, but it is not by our power, but by His. To be a light to the world, our lives need to confirm the Word, not contradict it.

 

[Pepper77]

Paul talks about the war between the flesh and the spirit (Galatians 5), two separate forces. To win, Paul tells us to set our minds on the things the Spirit desires. So, it is not about replacing but overcoming the desires of the flesh.

Our nature changes with the new birth, no longer a sinful nature, no longer sinner but saint is our identity. We do struggle with the flesh, but that is not who we are. As Romans 8 says, we are no longer in the flesh but in the spirit, because the spirit of God dwells in us. We are new creations, joined to Christ who is our life. The old man is dead. Now we are instructed to walk in the truth if who we are.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Our nature changes with the new birth, no longer a sinful nature, no longer sinner but saint is our identity. We do struggle with the flesh, but that is not who we are. As Romans 8 says, we are no longer in the flesh but in the spirit, because the spirit of God dwells in us. We are new creations, joined to Christ who is our life. The old man is dead. Now we are instructed to walk in the truth if who we are.

This is correct. But do you see from this that saying our present and future sins are forgiven means you will be committing them? Why, when you have the Spirit of God in you? Especially since it is not in scripture that it is a foregone conclusion that we will always sin. There are whole segments of denominations that believe the lie. Just check everything by scripture.

 

[def]

That is not in scripture. What IS in scripture is that all our PAST sins are cleansed.

When you examine the New Covenant, you will find that the forgiveness of sins is the last item (term) of the Covenant, and you have to wonder why it is the last item - the term propitiation of sins needs to be understood.

 

[CharismaticLady]

When you examine the New Covenant, you will find that the forgiveness of sins is the last item (term) of the Covenant, and you have to wonder why it is the last item - the term propitiation of sins needs to be understood.

If you don't understand it, you may become a Universalist. Yikes!

 

[def]

Our nature changes with the new birth, no longer a sinful nature, no longer sinner but saint is our identity. We do struggle with the flesh, but that is not who we are. As Romans 8 says, we are no longer in the flesh but in the spirit, because the spirit of God dwells in us. We are new creations, joined to Christ who is our life. The old man is dead. Now we are instructed to walk in the truth if who we are.

The concept of a new birth must be understood - Jesus said: the flesh gives life to the flesh, the Spirit gives life to the spirit, the spirit lives but the desires of the flesh remain, and as you said 'we do struggle with the flesh'.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Our nature changes with the new birth, no longer a sinful nature, no longer sinner but saint is our identity. We do struggle with the flesh, but that is not who we are. As Romans 8 says, we are no longer in the flesh but in the spirit, because the spirit of God dwells in us. We are new creations, joined to Christ who is our life. The old man is dead. Now we are instructed to walk in the truth if who we are.

If the old man is dead already, then why do we have to die physically?

 

[def]

If you don't understand it, you may become a Universalist. Yikes!

You may not like it, but it is an objective observation, it is there for everyone to see. That is why I did not elaborate on the term propitiation, which has been replaced by some Bibles.

 

[CharismaticLady]

You may not like it, but it is an objective observation, it is there for everyone to see. That is why I did not elaborate on the term propitiation, which has been replaced by some Bibles.

Just as the Israelites had to willingly apply the blood to the door frame, Christ's blood must be applied to us symbolically.

 

[def]

Just as the Israelites had to willingly apply the blood to the door frame, Christ's blood must be applied to us symbolically.

More than that, we have to eat His flesh and drink His blood (otherwise we have no life).

 

[def]

Just as the Israelites had to willingly apply the blood to the door frame, Christ's blood must be applied to us symbolically.

Christ's blood, I take it to mean Christ death, should not be just symbolic. His death is necessary for His resurrection, which conquered death and take away the consequence and curse of Adam's sin. Death is conquered, and the gospel teaches us how we can benefit from it.

 

[Phil W]

The Loaded Question (Philippians 2:13)

"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." (Phil 2:12)
I see no connection between this verse and..."Paul had the Spiritual noogies ... to admit His works of the flesh... Even After Salvation... were trash.".

Philippians 3:8

Context, context, context.

 

[Grip Docility]

"Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." (Phil 2:12)
I see no connection between this verse and..."Paul had the Spiritual noogies ... to admit His works of the flesh... Even After Salvation... were trash.".


Context, context, context.

Context is on my side. (Hear to tune of “time is on my side”)

Philippians 3:1-3

NO Confidence in the flesh.

 

[Phil W]

OK. What about a New Covenant example?

As nobody's judgement has yet occurred, no, I can't show an example of a person who has saving faith in the NT.
Stephen would be a good bet though.

 

[Grip Docility]

As nobody's judgement has yet occurred, no, I can't show an example of a person who has saving faith in the NT.
Stephen would be a good bet though.

Acts of the Apostles 8:37 ???? What?!?

 

[Phil W]

All our sins past present and future are forgiven at the cross, period for those who are in Christ.

That POV seems to go against Rom 3:25..."Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;"
More sin after repentance from sin shows the repentance from sin was a lie.
You can't forge a relationship with God that is based on a lie.

 

[Phil W]

The concept of a new birth must be understood - Jesus said: the flesh gives life to the flesh, the Spirit gives life to the spirit, the spirit lives but the desires of the flesh remain, and as you said 'we do struggle with the flesh'.

How can the desires of the flesh remain when scripture says..."And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts." (Gal 5:24)