The evidence for evolution for Kenny'sID thread

[Kenny'sID]

I am curious if you have come up with any answers to my questions in the last almost 3 years?
Do you understand the empirical evidence for common descent now?

I'll answer just that one post because I'm guessing if just one of you would take my challenge, and succeed there would be no need at all for any of your today's posts here.

The answer, I haven't looked into it, you all have given me no good reason to take evolution that seriously. However, if you would like to try to do that, you may use that or whatever you choose in your presentation to prove evolution.

 

[pitabread]

No, not in this area, you, and if so, was what you learned so complicated the average person cannot grasp it?

I was asking about your educational background in general. Have you attended high school? Graduated school? Attended college? Graduated college? If so, in what?

These are simple questions.

As to your first question, I think as much of it as I did the comment, it's good for a laugh, if that.

I've noticed you tend to avoid answering questions people ask you. This is one of the reasons it is so difficult to have any type of conservation with you.

Whether you are doing this on purpose or not, I don't know.

 

[pitabread]

I'm sorry I already spent time one of your pointless posts today, and reading something that probably attempts to convince me I was wrong on any thing in that post would just be more of as waste of time.

Oh, this is par for the course. You don't read off-site material, you don't read posts here. I'm not sure what you do.

So why are you here? Does your creator give you points for internet trolling?

 

[Kenny'sID]

I was asking about your educational background in general. Have you attended high school? Graduated school? Attended college? Graduated college? If so, in what?

These are simple questions.

I've noticed you tend to avoid answering questions people ask you. This is one of the reasons it is so difficult to have any type of conservation with you.

Whether you are doing this on purpose or not, I don't know.

What part of "no" do you not consider an answer? There may have been a misunderstanding, but to say I tend in that direction is simply not true. I was thinking HS was a given, and because I'm a bit uncomfortable with the question, lets just for the sake of argument leave it at that and assume non after that. Your point?

Was my question towards you not a simple one as well?

Oh, this is par for the course. You don't read off-site material, you don't read posts here. I'm not sure what you do.

Concerning your untrue post that brought all this on, where you made comment about my not wanting to discuss evolution when in reality I've been trying to get you all to do just that/grt right down to the details, forever now. Then saying I don't read posts here? And I tend to not answer questions? There was a poster here who was constantly and blatantly lying when he replied to my posts. I had to make a long and tedious post to point out several of them, and show that it was undeniable what he was doing and why I had to stop replying to him altogether. I'm just not interested in debating with someone who feels they can gain lost ground by being untruthful.

So why are you here? Does your creator give you points for internet trolling?

To curb the spread of the major lie here...evolution. Sorry it hurt your feelings I didn't answer your post.

 

[pitabread]

What part of "no" do you not consider an answer? There may have been a misunderstanding, but to say I tend in that direction is simply not true. I was thinking HS was a given, and because I'm a bit uncomfortable with the question, lets just for the sake of argument leave it at that. Your point?

I ask because your responses to the idea of education seem overly defensive and confrontational. That is why I am curious about your own experience with education and in particular if you've undertaken any higher (e.g. post high school) education.

And no, I wouldn't necessarily assume high school is a given. I had in friends in high school that never graduated. For all I know, you could be a high school drop-out.

Was my question towards you not a simple one as well?

Fair is fair.

My own education background includes a community college diploma in software development, a year of computer in science in university and a 4-year business degree (bachelor of commerce). In university I also took a number of science courses including physics, genetics and evolution, and paleontology. At one point I even considered majoring in biology, although it didn't seem as financially lucrative a path as a commerce degree.

Insofar as understanding biology and evolution, I think that yes, an average should be able to grasp the fundamentals. That said, there is still the onus on said person to make the effort to do so. Learning doesn't come for free; people have to work at it.

Concerning your untrue post that brought all this on, where you made comment about my not wanting to discuss evolution

Correction: I said that I tried to engage you in a discussion of the scientific method. And part of that discussion I repeatedly asked for your understanding of the scientific method. From what I recall, you repeatedly stone walled and wouldn't explain your understanding.

when in reality I've been trying to get you all to do just that/grt right down to the details, forever now.

Kenny, it's abundantly clear you have zero interest in discussing the topic of evolution. Just this thread is a prime example. At no point in this thread have you addressed anything that was posted in the OP, other than a glib dismissal of it. Here we are three years later and that hasn't changed.

So stop lying about your feigned interest in evolution. Remember, you're going to stand in judgement for that one day. You better hope your creator isn't overly concerned with honesty.

Then saying I don't read posts here?

Sure, you just said so. And you've said this in prior discussions we've had as well.

To curb the spread of the major lie here...evolution.

At no point do you appear to have convinced anyone of that view. I would say you've failed at that.

 

[Kenny'sID]

I ask because your responses to the idea of education seem overly defensive and confrontational.

You dreamed that up, and it's completely without merit. My response? educate me. Now how can i be any more undefensive than that? and that's what I've been asking all along. You know perfectly well it is you all who is defensive over my trying to get you to prove evolution. Once again...bizarre.

And no, I wouldn't necessarily assume high school is a given. I had in friends in high school that never graduated.

I know, that was the misunderstanding I mentioned.

Insofar as understanding biology and evolution, I think that yes, an average should be able to grasp the fundamentals. That said, there is still the onus on said person to make the effort to do so.

I've all but begged you all to show me, and you now seem to be saying your stance is, you won't tell me because you think I need to go through all this trouble and pay a price to learn it, something you know i won't be doing, and that way you can continue to claim it's my fault. Hey, maybe i can take up a collection and pay one or more of you if you really believe we need to pay something/make more effort for the knowledge. I'm sorry but a cop out is a cop out, and there is no excuse. You all spend more time arguing this than you would to simply do as I asked, much much more actually, so none of that makes any sense at all.

No one is responsible for our education but it's not like people don't explain things to others like this all the time yet you all make such a huge deal of nothing...well *shrug. With as much sense as it makes for you all to just explain it, a very reasonable expectation, especially when there is an ongoing disagreement such as this. So when you refuse to do something so sensible I have to conclude you simply cannot, a very very logical conclusion.

Correction: I said that I tried to engage you in a discussion of the scientific method. And part of that discussion I repeatedly asked for your understanding of the scientific method. From what I recall, you never explained what you understood about it.

Thee were two quotes I posted in my gargantuan post yesterday, that of you answering USingog, and what you say here is just not how it went at all. Go look for yourself.

Kenny, it's abundantly clear you have zero interest in discussing the topic of evolution.

See my 3rd post here. Is it any wonder I laugh so much at some of the claims you all make? I've done nothing BUT try to discuss it. Seriously, what do I say to someone who has gone into complete denial? IDK.

At no point do you appear to have convinced anyone of that view.

Anyone? Never thought too much about it because swaying a few seekers is all I can hope for, but you know that how? Also, what brings you conclude I'm trying to convince you, and others like you when it never even crossed my mind to do so? Oh, that's right, you completely illogically read it into my last comment so you could set up that remark.

 

[Larniavc]

The question had nothing to do with the bible. Actually i'm very curious how you managed to even come up with that as answer to the question?

I described how I made it a point to read the Bible to learn about the overly complicated explanation of creation (that you implied I would not do as a vague defence for you not doing the same in this instance) it claims to be factual.

Similar to what Ophilite said.

 

[pitabread]

You dreamed that up, and it's completely without merit. My response? educate me. Now how can i be any more undefensive than that? and that's what I've been asking all along.

Sure.

Here are two comprehensive courses on the subject of biological evolution. They are completely free and can be taken at ones own pace:

Principles of Evolution, Ecology and Behavior | Open Yale Courses
Introduction to Genetics and Evolution | Coursera (this one is highly similar to a course I took in University)

There is also a basic biology course available here (audio lectures) if you want a primer on biology to start with: General Biology I — UMass Boston OpenCourseware

If you have any questions or need clarifications you can always post them in a thread on this forum. People here would be more than willing to help you out on your path to learning about biological evolution.

 

[VirOptimus]

Sure.

Here are two comprehensive courses on the subject of biological evolution. They are completely free and can be taken at ones own pace:

Principles of Evolution, Ecology and Behavior | Open Yale Courses
Introduction to Genetics and Evolution | Coursera (this one is highly similar to a course I took in University)

There is also a basic biology course available here (audio lectures) if you want a primer on biology to start with: General Biology I — UMass Boston OpenCourseware

If you have any questions or need clarifications you can always post them in a thread on this forum. People here would be more than willing to help you out on your path to learning about biological evolution.

He will make excuses why he shouldnt make the effort and not follow through.

 

[pitabread]

He will make excuses why he shouldnt make the effort and not follow through.

Oh, I know. I'm not expecting a different response that the last five or six times I pointed him to these courses.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Yet no one seems to be able to sum it all up to something that even reasonably resembles proof, ...

That is an ignorant statement and blatantly wrong
Sceince has evidence, not proof.
The body of evidence is summed up in many sources that exist starting with high school biology textbooks. We do not have to sum up what you are unable to find with Google !
Some evidence has been given to you just in this thread which you have seemingly ignored for the last almost 3 years.
For example,
20 July 2016 Kenny'sID: Have you learned that there is no proof in science yet, just evidence?
20 July 2016 Kenny'sID: Common decent makes testable, falsifiable predictions that have been verified.
23 July 2016 Kenny'sID: Have you read and understand 29+ Evidences for Macroevolution The Scientific Case for Common Descent yet?
25 July 2016 Kenny'sID: Does DNA paternity testing work by basically looking for common bits of DNA between the sample and a proposed parent?
26 July 2016 Kenny'sID: What are these assumptions that scientists make?
The 'proof" misconception pops up again, common decent is evidence for evolution, you cannot answer simple questions about even if you have read about evolution!
The lack of responses is 1 reason why people may think that you want to be ignorant about evolution or at least to give that impression.

 

[RealityCheck01]

...Creationism makes much more sense than POOF! and eventually, heeeer's Johnny.

24 May 2019 Kenny'sID: Are you seriously stating that after almost 3 years all you know about evolution is "POOF! and eventually, heeeer's Johnny" nonsense?
For the umpteenth time: This is the scientific theory of evolution.

That "POOF" may expose deep ignorance of evolution because evolution starts with life existing.

Creationism is a religious belief, not science. It has no physical evidence to support it and cannot make testable, falsifiable predictions. It makes less sense that a scientific theory that is supported by massive physical evidence and many testable, falsifiable predictions that have been passed. To make this point clearer: What makes more sense in this hypothetical analogy, Kenny'sID?

1. Someone stating that there is a fire-breathing dragon in their garage.
2. Someone stating that there is a fire-breathing dragon in their garage with photos of that dragon, objects burned by that dragon and tissue samples of the dragon.

Ignoring the non-sense of a fire-breathing dragon, the more sensible scenario to me is having physical evidence supporting its existence in the garage.

 

[RealityCheck01]

The answer, I haven't looked into it, you all have given me no good reason to take evolution that seriously.

Your high school science biology classes would have already given you good reason to take evolution seriously.
I do not have to but did give you good reason about 3 years ago starting with 20 July 2016 Kenny'sID: Common decent makes testable, falsifiable predictions that have been verified. !

Anyone who learns about evolution can see that it is a serious scientific theory.

 

[RealityCheck01]

No one is responsible for our education but it's not like people don't explain things to others like this all the time yet you all make such a huge deal of nothing...well *shrug.

Not really true, Kenny'sID. You are definitely responsible for your education!
If you write posts suggesting that you have remained ignorant about the evidence for evolution presented in this thread (and perhaps evolution in general) after almost 3 years, then it is your fault for not educating yourself.

It is a waste of our time to explain to you what is available in better sources you should have read already such as high school textbooks, Wikipedia, etc. You are essentially asking that we write a textbook or Wikipedia article in this thread !
Instead we try to allow you to educate yourself by citing good sources. So far this has failed.

 

[VirOptimus]

Uh-huh.

I'm supposed to have a "burning sensation in my conscience" because I don't use your definition?

Do you have one because you don't use mine?

You are a YEC just like you are a homo sapiens and an ape because you fit the definition. You protesting makes no difference.

 

[Kenny'sID]

I described how I made it a point to read the Bible to learn about the overly complicated explanation of creation (that you implied I would not do as a vague defence for you not doing the same in this instance) it claims to be factual.

Similar to what Ophilite said.

Over complicated explanation of creation? I'd guess that's what threw me in understanding your comment. What's complicated about creation? We are told exactly what happened, a child can understand it.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Not really true, Kenny'sID. You are definitely responsible for your education!

What do you mean, "not really true"? Didn't the post you are replying to just say:

No one is responsible for our education but it's not like people don't explain things to others like this all the time yet you all make such a huge deal of nothing...well *shrug.

Is it any wonder I chose right off to not even read most of your posts. I do think you deserve an explanation why, they've been shown to contain, well, nothing, or more clearly untrue comments, just like your comment there. Sorry. But not to worry they all do that. Take the subject at the moment of not being responsible for my education. It means nothing, and is clearly an untrue reason/another cop out for not being able to prove evolution,. Hope you understand.

I'll tell you all what, if any one of you are naive enough to believe you're not proving evolution has anything at all to do with you not being responsible for my/our education, then it's best you don't even try. Why? Because anyone who really believes that is the actual reason to not proving evolution, I'd feel terrible letting you step into such an endeavor because you fall before you even got started. IOW, such naivety tells me a whole lot about what you have going on in the attic. And yes, I put that as kindly as I possible could.

So hey, if you can't prove it, fine, but please, lets not waste another post on such a silly defense,

 

[Kenny'sID]

Sure.

Here are two comprehensive courses on the subject of biological evolution. They are completely free and can be taken at ones own pace:

Principles of Evolution, Ecology and Behavior | Open Yale Courses
Introduction to Genetics and Evolution | Coursera (this one is highly similar to a course I took in University)

There is also a basic biology course available here (audio lectures) if you want a primer on biology to start with: General Biology I — UMass Boston OpenCourseware

If you have any questions or need clarifications you can always post them in a thread on this forum. People here would be more than willing to help you out on your path to learning about biological evolution.

OK, now we may be getting somewhere.

You are aware of the criteria. Just post it here, and explain how it proves evolution is the fact you all tout it as.

Why is that so tough to do? I'm making it as easy as I can in allowing you to pull from other sources, that way you needn't know a thing about evolution, but you will need to meet me part of the way and explain how that proves it, and do it here in front of everyone. I understand 6hat by pointing to a link/not doing it here, you cut your odds of others chiming in with their very fair disagreements along the way, but I'm not going to let you do that.

Also, we've done this in the past and from the very first attempt I honestly saw nothing that proved evolution in the link, and even an Atheist agreed the link was very poor for it's intended purpose. But, again you already know the criteria, yet I take the time to explain it all again, and again, and....

 

[VirOptimus]

What do you mean, "not really true"? Didn't the post you are replying to just say:



Is it any wonder I chose right off to not even read most of your posts. I do think you deserve an explanation why, they've been shown to contain, well, nothing, or more clearly untrue comments, just like your comment there. Sorry. But not to worry they all do that. Take the subject at the moment of not being responsible for my education. It means nothing, and is clearly an untrue reason/another cop out for not being able to prove evolution,. Hope you understand.

I'll tell you all what, if any one of you are naive enough to believe you're not proving evolution has anything at all to do with you not being responsible for my/our education, then it's best you don't even try. Why? Because anyone who really believes that is the actual reason to not proving evolution, I'd feel terrible letting you step into such an endeavor because you fall before you even got started. IOW, such naivety tells me a whole lot about what you have going on in the attic. And yes, I put that as kindly as I possible could.

So hey, if you can't prove it, fine, but please, lets not waste another post on such a silly defense,

In your own words, what would prove the ToE for you?

 

[VirOptimus]

He will make excuses why he shouldnt make the effort and not follow through.

OK, now we may be getting somewhere.

You are aware of the criteria. Just post it here, and explain how it proves evolution is the fact you all tout it as.

Why is that so tough to do? I'm making it as easy as I can in allowing you to pull from other sources, that way you needn't know a thing about evolution, but you will need to meet me part of the way and explain how that proves it, and do it here in front of everyone. I understand 6hat by pointing to a link/not doing it here, you cut your odds of others chiming in with their very fair disagreements along the way, but I'm not going to let you do that.

Also, we've done this in the past and from the very first attempt I honestly saw nothing that proved evolution in the link, and even an Atheist agreed the link was very poor for it's intended purpose. But, again you already know the criteria, yet I take the time to explain it all again, and again, and....

And... I was right!