Bible and science?

[nolidad]

I am coming from the opposite direction. From childhood, I was told to believe in the YEC and in my 30's I realized its not needed for anything.

Do you also reject the world wide flood and the tower of babel and the dispersion of all humanity across the globe from there?

 

[trophy33]

Do you also reject the world wide flood and the tower of babel and the dispersion of all humanity across the globe from there?

I do not believe in the YEC interpretation of the flood.

 

[nolidad]

I do not believe in the YEC interpretation of the flood.

See now you are impugning the honesty of God the Son!

Matt. 24:

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Also Peter was dishonest in his teaching:

2 Peter 2:4-6 King James Version (KJV)
4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;

 

[trophy33]

See now you are impugning the honesty of God the Son!

Matt. 24:

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Also Peter was dishonest in his teaching:

2 Peter 2:4-6 King James Version (KJV)
4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;

They are working with the text in Genesis, nothing against that.

As I said, I do not believe in the YEC interpretation of it.

 

[nolidad]

They are working with the text in Genesis, nothing against that.

As I said, I do not believe in the YEC interpretation of it.

What do you think that YEC interpretation if it is?

A young earth created in six 24 hour days as it is written? And the world was destroyed by a global flood as is plainly written.

Do you think God incapable of telling Adam that the world was made long long long ago?

Was Jesus intentionally being dishonest because the Jews were too stupid?

 

[trophy33]

What do you think that YEC interpretation if it is?

Literal, wrong reading, not understanding ancient worldview and vocabulary. Creating absurd conditions like some ocean of waters above firmanent, planetary cataclysm, one large continent etc. And all this only few thousands years ago together with dinosaurs etc.

A young earth created in six 24 hour days as it is written?

It is not written.

And the world was destroyed by a global flood as is plainly written.

Only if you do not understand what the writer meant.

Do you think God incapable of telling Adam that the world was made long long long ago?

No.

Was Jesus intentionally being dishonest because the Jews were too stupid?

No, using stories was common in ancient cultures. No dishonesty about it, this is pushing modern scientific journal style of teaching into totally different background.

 

[The Barbarian]

Do you believe that Jesus is equal in His divinity with His Father?

He's only one God. You're confusing the three persons in God, with three Gods. That's wrong.

Remember, the Trinity is just one God; the only God there is, not the many gods dad thinks exist.

dad said: ↑
There are many gods.

 

[The Barbarian]

A young earth created in six 24 hour days as it is written?

"Six 24 hour days" is your revison of God's word. It never says that.

And the world was destroyed by a global flood as is plainly written.

Luke 2:1 And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world should be taxed.

So, in the Bible 'world' means 'the Roman Empire.' And of course, the Bible never says there was a global flood. That's your attempt to make the Bible more acceptable to you.

Do you think God incapable of telling Adam that the world was made long long long ago?

Why do you think God needed to tell Adam how old the world is? Again, why not just be happy with His word as it is?

Was Jesus intentionally being dishonest because the Jews were too stupid?

Jesus never said how old the world is. And why would you consider Jews to be stupid? Maybe they're smarter than you think they are.

 

[The Barbarian]

I am talking about Christians as a whole. Whether one does individually I cannot say with certainty. I can only look at churches in general and see where churches have compromised the truth of Genesis as written have generally decayed in many other doctrines!

As you learned, divorce, violence and racism is more common among evangelicals than among Americans generally. So maybe their revision of Genesis wasn't such a good idea.

Believe me- as one who was once a staunch evolutionist,

I would like to believe you. But since you've repeatedly demonstrated that you don't know even the most basic things about evolution or evolutionary theory, that's very hard to believe.

 

[dad]

For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus.
1Tm 2:5

A mediator, however, implies more than one party; but God is one.
Gal 3:20

You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe—and shudder!
Jm 2:19

You learnt something new today


They were inspired theologically, but God did not correct their scientific knowledge or their agricultural language.

Not sure what you think your point was. There are many gods and demons and false gods. There is only One true God...Jesus.

 

[dad]

I do not know, I do not live in the USA. I know that liberal countries like Canada or the EU countries are more safe, however.

So, again, what is the supposed theological or moral problem with allegorical reading of Gen 1 and 2?

It makes God a lying nincompoop who can't get His word right.

 

[dad]

The Founders installed the Bill of Rights in 1791. But it didn't kick God out of education or government; it merely kicked government out of the religion business. My daughter was an officer in the Fellowship of Christian athletes. They prayed by the flagpole on a regular basis, and met to pray during the school day. They were free to do so, but the school was not free to initiate religious practices. Which is the way it should be. Jesus told us that God neither wants nor needs government support.

The child sacrificing, Christ rejecting, pagan governments simply are not preaching or even allowing the gospel for the most part. Now if you find that 'christian' fine, I don't really care what people who wave away the bible think.

Evangelicals are having a crisis of behavior. They divorce more frequently than other people, even more than atheists. The view from one concerned evangelical Christian:
Scandalous behavior is rapidly destroying American Christianity. By their daily activity, most "Christians" regularly commit treason. With their mouths they claim that Jesus is Lord, but with their actions they demonstrate allegiance to money, sex, and self-fulfillment.

Guess they needed salvation eh? You are perfect?

The findings in numerous national polls conducted by highly respected pollsters like The Gallup Organization and The Barna Group are simply shocking. "Gallup and Barna," laments evangelical theologian Michael Horton, "hand us survey after survey demonstrating that evangelical Christians are as likely to embrace lifestyles every bit as hedonistic, materialistic, self-centered, and sexually immoral as the world in general."1

That means what, they go to movies?

Divorce is more common among "born-again" Christians than in the general American population. Only 6 percent of evangelicals tithe. White evangelicals are the most likely people to object to neighbors of another race. Josh McDowell has pointed out that the sexual promiscuity of evangelical youth is only a little less outrageous than that of their nonevangelical peers.
https://www3.dbu.edu/jeanhumphreys/SocialPsych/evangelicalmind.htm

Take it up with them. The discussion here is your unbelief of the bible basics.

Chasing the false doctrines of YEC and white nationalism has destroyed the integrity of many evangelicals.

Baloney.

Ironic you should realize that. There was a court decision, in which such "de minimus" violations of the Constitution were permitted, did so on the recognition that such official expressions of faith in God quickly become debased by use, and cease to mean anything to most people.

Like I care about godless court utterances or opinions??

You could see this coming, back when Buchanan declared a "culture war" on secular society. It must have seemed to him that a jihad would restore the world he knew before integration and pluralism in government.

Guess he though there was hope for most in the US to turn to God. Not my problem.

However believers are being groomed and trained to rule this planet forever with Jesus.

 

[dad]

I believe in one God, the Father, the almighty, Creator of Heaven and Earth.

You should, too.

Is that the one that forgot to mention that the world was created billions of years before Adam in a way totally unlike Genesis says?

 

[The Barbarian]

Is that the one that forgot to mention that the world was created billions of years before Adam in a way totally unlike Genesis says?

God doesn't say how long ago the world was created. Genesis is merely consistent with billions of years. As long as you keep nattering about the incidental things, and ignoring His message, you're going to be disappointed.

 

[nolidad]

As you learned, divorce, violence and racism is more common among evangelicals than among Americans generally. So maybe their revision of Genesis wasn't such a good idea.



I would like to believe you. But since you've repeatedly demonstrated that you don't know even the most basic things about evolution or evolutionary theory, that's very hard to believe.

Well I will not write a major paper here to show you about all the details. I am not a biologist but i know enough about it to know it cannot happen in the macro sense and that mutations cannot be a mechanism for bringing the massive change needed. Sorry but just because you make ex-cathedra pontifications about what I do or do nto know means little.

 

[dad]

God doesn't say how long ago the world was created. Genesis is merely consistent with billions of years. As long as you keep nattering about the incidental things, and ignoring His message, you're going to be disappointed.

I do not think six days of creation with a morning and evening in each is consistent with your imaginary years. Nor would plants created before the sun last millions of years till the sun was created. Nor could Adam have taken millions of years to form, since God made woman from him right away that day. Nor could Adam have waited millions of years for a woman to appear. Etc etc.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Is that the one that forgot to mention that the world was created billions of years before Adam in a way totally unlike Genesis says?

Multitudes call upon "god", with their lips, but their hearts are far from Him, He Says.

The timeline in the Scripture has been very very very well known for over 4000 years.

Nobody today has to accept that though - they all can believe what they want - though it may
well
lead to unbelief, and punishment, or scourging and discipline , as God decides/judges.

 

[nolidad]

God doesn't say how long ago the world was created. Genesis is merely consistent with billions of years. As long as you keep nattering about the incidental things, and ignoring His message, you're going to be disappointed.

But He does- you just wish to prostitute yourself to science falsely so called!


Genesis in its normative reading is totally inconsistent with billions of years or biological evolution, or astronomical evolution.

 

[dad]

Multitudes call upon "god", with their lips, but their hearts are far from Him, He Says.

The timeline in the Scripture has been very very very well known for over 4000 years.

Nobody today has to accept that though - they all can believe what they want - though it may
well
lead to unbelief, and punishment, or scourging and discipline , as God decides/judges.

If God be God, then we ought to serve Him. If science be god, then people ought to serve it. They need to choose this day whom they will serve and believe.

 

[nolidad]

As you learned, divorce, violence and racism is more common among evangelicals than among Americans generally. So maybe their revision of Genesis wasn't such a good idea.



I would like to believe you. But since you've repeatedly demonstrated that you don't know even the most basic things about evolution or evolutionary theory, that's very hard to believe.

And I have learned 0 from you.

You boast yourself some superior teacher because you can write a line.

I know more of the evangelical community probably far more than you do!