The Inspiration of Scripture

[redleghunter]

It's not about what I know but about who I have decided to trust. Jesus the Christ.

Who introduced you to Jesus?

 

[redleghunter]

The same God revealed in scriptures is also revealed to us in prayer and also revealed to us through the other means of grace if only we but listen for his voice. There is only one God and he is living and active today and is not withdrawn from us. Meaningful prayer does not mean praying to a book but praying to, conversing with, and listening to a living and active God who is in relationship with us.

Why are you creating a dichotomy?

 

[bekkilyn]

Wesley is neither being ambiguous nor cryptic. These are clear proclamations needing no interpretation.

However, they do need context outside of a 21st century lens.

I’ve studied Wesley. Especially his view on imputed righteousness.

Which has nothing to do with Wesley's supposedly agreeing that infallibility as he used it as an 18th century Anglican means exactly the 21st century view that God possessed a bunch of humans and forced them to write every word he literally dictated to them, and then called all those writings God.

 

[redleghunter]

However, they do need context outside of a 21st century lens.

I believe you are applying that lens. Apparently he did not really say what he said.

His words are clear. There’s no equivocation in his statements.

It just does not fit your opinion of him.

Which has nothing to do with Wesley's supposedly agreeing that infallibility as he used it as an 18th century Anglican means exactly the 21st century view that God possessed a bunch of humans and forced them to write every word he literally dictated to them, and then called all those writings God.

There it is. The straw man no one argued.

No one suggested the Apostles were robots writing the Scriptures. If you can point out where that was said or even hinted I would be interested in seeing it. I have not seen anyone argue what you suggest.

 

[bekkilyn]

Who said study alone? We are to meditate on the Scriptures. When we worship as a body the Scriptures are part of our worship of the pastor is preaching from expository exaltation.

So when you pray to God, you are just quoting one of David's psalms or something like that? You don't ever go out into the woods and sit in silence and listen for God's voice, or just talk to him on your way to or from somewhere? You never hear that still, small voice speaking to you when you have gotten turned around and become lost in the middle of the night on a strange, rural road? You don't look at something beautiful that God has created and sense his presence?

You are saying that the ONLY way God speaks to you is if you are studying scripture, meditating on scripture, hearing preaching specifically from scripture, or praying from scripture?

 

[bekkilyn]

Because there are no contradictions.

That's a really good gospel witness to an unbeliever who has a brain. Hint: They aren't going to buy it.

 

[bekkilyn]

Who introduced you to Jesus?

My parents.

 

[bekkilyn]

Why are you creating a dichotomy?

I didn't realize that "One God" was a dichotomy.

I believe you are applying that lens. Apparently he did not really say what he said.

His words are clear. There’s no equivocation in his statements.

It just does not fit your opinion of him.

Of course he said what he said, but in the context of being sufficient for salvation.

There it is. The straw man no one argued.

No one suggested the Apostles were robots writing the Scriptures. If you can point out where that was said or even hinted I would be interested in seeing it. I have not seen anyone argue what you suggest.

When the claim is that God literally wrote (or breathed) every last word in the bible onto the pages without any infallibility or error, and that it is the bible itself who is God's Word, then not only do we have "robot" mediums providing the bodies and hands to hold the pens for this automatic writing to occur, but also a bible that takes the place of Christ as the center of one's faith.

(And no, this is is not what John Wesley believed no matter how many cherry-picked quotes are posted.)

 

[redleghunter]

So when you pray to God, you are just quoting one of David's psalms or something like that?

How did you get that from what I wrote?

 

[Strong in Him]

How can one meet the requirement of husband of one wife if one is not married?

It's not a requirement.
Since when did the fertility of someone's wife affect their ability, gifts and God given calling to lead a church?

 

[redleghunter]

You are saying that the ONLY way God speaks to you is if you are studying scripture, meditating on scripture, hearing preaching specifically from scripture, or praying from scripture?

Those are all solid ways as Psalm 119 painfully teaches us.

God’s answered prayer and His will working in our lives is living and active. He builds faith, challenges us, forges us and as a Good Father chastises us. This is in the living walk in the Holy Spirit. St Paul says to the Ephesians “be filled with the Holy Spirit.”

 

[redleghunter]

That's a really good gospel witness to an unbeliever who has a brain. Hint: They aren't going to buy it.

Of course they won’t. The cross is foolishness to those not in Christ.

 

[redleghunter]

My parents.

And you trusted their witness alone?

 

[GingerBeer]

This has come up several times.

The Bible says that Satan told Adam and Eve that God is a liar. Does this mean if the Bible is the very words of God that God says that God is a liar? Of course not!

God says that Satan lied to Adam and Eve in telling them that God is a liar.

So did Satan really lie to Adam and Eve? Yes.
How do we know that? Because God says.
Where does God say this? Genesis 3.

Genesis 3 is very much the words of God, even though it is also an account of the words of Satan. In other words, just because the Bible says that Satan said something, does not mean that the Bible says what Satan says.

But there's no text in the bible that claims that every word in the bible is God retelling history or doctrine or whatever. Being inspired does not imply human authors acting as a recording of what they were told.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

 

[redleghunter]

I didn't realize that "One God" was a dichotomy.

You created a dichotomy in which studying the Bible was at odds with a prayer life. Which just compounds the straw man.

 

[redleghunter]

Of course he said what he said, but in the context of being sufficient for salvation

Read the quotes again. He actually said in the big things and small.

 

[redleghunter]

When the claim is that God literally wrote (or breathed) every last word in the bible onto the pages without any infallibility or error, and that it is the bible itself who is God's Word, then not only do we have "robot" mediums providing the bodies and hands to hold the pens for this automatic writing to occur, but also a bible that takes the place of Christ as the center of one's faith.

So what you have taken from this thread is that some have claimed God literally breathed on a piece of papyrus and that’s “God breathed?”

 

[redleghunter]

And no, this is is not what John Wesley believed no matter how many cherry-picked quotes are posted.)

Well of course not. No one fits your straw man.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You created a dichotomy in which studying the Bible was at odds with a prayer life. Which just compounds the straw man.

Indeed. The Bible tells us about prayer.

Jeremiah 33:3.