LDS Celestial Marriage...100% false.

[mmksparbud]

There is no verse that relates that Jesus used water for the sacrament.

So when JS and the church was confronted with the inability to obtain grape juice (I think they did get some, but it was poisoned), JS turned to the Lord and asked him what they should do, and it is then that the Lord authorized the use of water for the sacrament of the Lords supper. So since it was the Lord that did the authorizing, I am good with that.

Where is this vial attitude come from. Have you ever read anything that JS did that did not make your puke? I would like to hear just one thing JS did that did not anger you. Thank you. Do you have such an attitude towards you founding prophetess?

It isn't vial. Just plain isn't true. None of it makes me puke---all of it makes me angry. If our prophetess had ever said anything such as we are to be thankful to Satan for the fall and for us having children, that God was human before becoming a God and so will we, that God demands men to take plural wives under penalty of the first wife's death if she doesn't comply, that Jesus is a brother to Christ instead of His creator, that Jesus did not create everything and what He did create was out of existing matter, that only those men who have these wives and kept all the commandments will have their own planet to populate and that he then has to save those children as Jesus Himself did, that…….I would not be an SDA!!!
Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

 

[mmksparbud]

I probably wouldn't get so angry at all this if it weren't for the fact that my very intelligent, beautiful step-daughter is a Mormon. I've mentioned it several times. It is upsetting as I feel they took advantage of her vulnerability. She was searching for stability, for a feeling of home. And I do agree that your church offers that---it is what gangs and cults do---give that impression of home sweet home, of belonging. But her own home disintegrated. You do not offer "meat", it is not based on the bible--you know by now my saying about it---it is at best veggie-meat.


PLEASE UNDERSTAND---I AM NOT ANTI-MORMON. I LOVE MORMONS--IT IS THEIR TEACHINGS I AM TOTALLY OPPOSED TO. IT IS JS. IT'S NOT THE SAME THING AS BEING ANTI-MORMON.
I loved my now dead brother---but I was totally opposed to and hated his drug addicted lifestyle.

 

[Ironhold]

There is no verse relating to this ordinance that refers to water being used---Jesus never said water---only the fruit of the vine--of which He would not drink of it until the new earth.

Mat_26:29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

JS made this up as no one wanted to sell them grape juice or wine. We use unfermented grape juice as no leavening was allowed during this time and it represents the pure blood of Christ, fermented wine is what the harlot in Rev is drinking.
JS HAS NO "WONDERFUL SCRIPTURE" about anything---except those that he actually took right from the KJV.

In Doctrine & Covenants 27, Joseph records revelation indicating that the specific substance isn't as important as the spirit the communion is performed in.

Doctrine and Covenants 27

The revelation was originally given as a warning that enemies of the church were willing to poison whatever wine the church sought to buy, but has in no way been rescinded.

 

[Rescued One]

It is neither derogatory or completely untrue. Like I said, I have been involved in the church for since 1956, and when I was a teenager, I was chosen to work with people who were not signing up for seminary.

I repeat: Your comments were derogatory and untrue.

Some times even active kids did not want to sign up. But most of the times it was kids who had inactive parents, who didn't care if their kids went to Seminary or not. But they were not just ignored.

What has that to do with me?

So I know the program, if you did not get an invite to seminary,something was very wrong in your ward, and you may have slipped through the cracks, but then teenage leaders usually are very vigil about their students, especially active kids, like you say you were. Very unusual.

Why would I have a teenage leader after high school? We were young adults who went to work five days a week.

"You became an M Man (or a Gleaner, for girls) when you turned 18, or graduated from high school, or (in the event you weren't able to graduate) your age peers ..."
Master M Men and Golden Gleaners | LDS Living

I don't care whether it was usual or unusual. It was what I said it was! Not every Mormon lived in Utah. Nothing was wrong in the multiple wards I lived in except that they taught Mormonism.

 

[Peter1000]

I repeat: Your comments were derogatory and untrue.



What has that to do with me?



Why would I have a teenage leader after high school? We were young adults who went to work five days a week.

"You became an M Man (or a Gleaner, for girls) when you turned 18, or graduated from high school, or (in the event you weren't able to graduate) your age peers ..."
Master M Men and Golden Gleaners | LDS Living

I don't care whether it was usual or unusual. It was what I said it was! Not every Mormon lived in Utah. Nothing was wrong in the multiple wards I lived in except that they taught Mormonism.

We are talking around in circles, so not productive. I will just end this discussion.

 

[Peter1000]

In Doctrine & Covenants 27, Joseph records revelation indicating that the specific substance isn't as important as the spirit the communion is performed in.

Doctrine and Covenants 27

The revelation was originally given as a warning that enemies of the church were willing to poison whatever wine the church sought to buy, but has in no way been rescinded.

The grape juice was being poisoned and so JS as a prophet of God went to Jesus for an answer. Jesus gave it to him, and told him he could use water as well as well as grape juice.

It is nice to get answers from a reliable source, Jesus. There is no need to rescind it because Jesus left it open to whether you wish to or not. The only condition was that the grape juice was to come from ourselves, if we chose to use it. Water just happens to be plentiful everywhere, so we have stuck with water, which is just fine with Jesus. And if it is fine with Jesus, it ought to be fine with all.

 

[Rescued One]

We are talking around in circles, so not productive. I will just end this discussion.

I'm not surprised.

 

[mmksparbud]

The grape juice was being poisoned and so JS as a prophet of God went to Jesus for an answer. Jesus gave it to him, and told him he could use water as well as well as grape juice.

It is nice to get answers from a reliable source, Jesus. There is no need to rescind it because Jesus left it open to whether you wish to or not. The only condition was that the grape juice was to come from ourselves, if we chose to use it. Water just happens to be plentiful everywhere, so we have stuck with water, which is just fine with Jesus. And if it is fine with Jesus, it ought to be fine with all.

It can only be fine with those who believe that Jesus said anything at all to your prophet. And to believe in your prophet, you have to set aside the bible and I, for one, will not do that.

 

[Rescued One]

I probably wouldn't get so angry at all this if it weren't for the fact that my very intelligent, beautiful step-daughter is a Mormon. I've mentioned it several times. It is upsetting as I feel they took advantage of her vulnerability. She was searching for stability, for a feeling of home. And I do agree that your church offers that---it is what gangs and cults do---give that impression of home sweet home, of belonging. But her own home disintegrated. You do not offer "meat", it is not based on the bible--you know by now my saying about it---it is at best veggie-meat.


PLEASE UNDERSTAND---I AM NOT ANTI-MORMON. I LOVE MORMONS--IT IS THEIR TEACHINGS I AM TOTALLY OPPOSED TO. IT IS JS. IT'S NOT THE SAME THING AS BEING ANTI-MORMON.
I loved my now dead brother---but I was totally opposed to and hated his drug addicted lifestyle.

In Mormon churches, there are two groups of people, the temple endowed and the not-temple endowed. The close friends are the temple endowed. Even Visiting Teachers can be rude.

"Why do you need five cookbooks on your table?"
" Why do you follow pattern directions when sewing a dress? There's a better way."
" She's going to ruin her health staying in bed so she won't lose the baby; she should have gotten pregnant."
"Why isn't your house clean?"
"You shouldn't buy fried chicken to feed your friends on Sunday! It's the Sabbath!"

 

[Rescued One]

"Only through celestial marriage can one find the straight way, the narrow path. Eternal life cannot be had in any other way. The Lord was very specific and very definite in the matter of marriage."
President Spencer W. Kimball, Marriage --- The Proper Way,
From an address given at the Stockholm, Sweden, Area Conference, August 1974

Marriage—The Proper Way

 

[mmksparbud]

"Only through celestial marriage can one find the straight way, the narrow path. Eternal life cannot be had in any other way. The Lord was very specific and very definite in the matter of marriage."
President Spencer W. Kimball, Marriage --- The Proper Way,
From an address given at the Stockholm, Sweden, Area Conference, August 1974

Marriage—The Proper Way

1Co_7:28 But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.
1Co_7:36 But if any man think that he behaveth himself uncomely toward his virgin, if she pass the flower of her age, and need so require, let him do what he will, he sinneth not: let them marry.
1Ti_5:11 But the younger widows refuse: for when they have begun to wax wanton against Christ, they will marry;

" Why do you follow pattern directions when sewing a dress? There's a better way."

What??? I' ve been sewing since I was 9--and I make my own patterns. What better way? My mother was an extraordinary woman, she could just cut out a dress without any pattern--no she wasn't Mormon!
What did they expect you to do?

What's wrong with 5 cookbooks? I have bookshelves of them.

 

[Ironhold]

In Mormon churches, there are two groups of people, the temple endowed and the not-temple endowed. The close friends are the temple endowed. Even Visiting Teachers can be rude.

"Why do you need five cookbooks on your table?"
" Why do you follow pattern directions when sewing a dress? There's a better way."
" She's going to ruin her health staying in bed so she won't lose the baby; she should have gotten pregnant."
"Why isn't your house clean?"
"You shouldn't buy fried chicken to feed your friends on Sunday! It's the Sabbath!"

Sounds like someone needs to have a talk with the bishop.

 

[Peter1000]

"Only through celestial marriage can one find the straight way, the narrow path. Eternal life cannot be had in any other way. The Lord was very specific and very definite in the matter of marriage."
President Spencer W. Kimball, Marriage --- The Proper Way,
From an address given at the Stockholm, Sweden, Area Conference, August 1974

Marriage—The Proper Way

Do you believe that celestial marriage = plural marriage?

 

[Rescued One]

Do you believe that celestial marriage = plural marriage?

That depends on the number of wives the man was sealed to! You know that and I know that.

 

[Rescued One]

1Co_7:28 But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.
1Co_7:36 But if any man think that he behaveth himself uncomely toward his virgin, if she pass the flower of her age, and need so require, let him do what he will, he sinneth not: let them marry.
1Ti_5:11 But the younger widows refuse: for when they have begun to wax wanton against Christ, they will marry;



What??? I' ve been sewing since I was 9--and I make my own patterns. What better way? My mother was an extraordinary woman, she could just cut out a dress without any pattern--no she wasn't Mormon!
What did they expect you to do?

What's wrong with 5 cookbooks? I have bookshelves of them.

It wasn't more than one person and it had nothing to do with Mormon expectations. It's just that visiting teachers aren't always thoughtful and kind.

Five cookbooks on a table might indicate research. Following pattern directions doesn't prove that another way is better.

Criticizing someone for not wanting to lose a baby doesn't seem right either.

 

[He is the way]

I believe in celestial marriage because the Bible states:
(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 11:11)

11 Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.

 

[Peter1000]

I believe in celestial marriage because the Bible states:
(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 11:11)

11 Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.

Good scripture, and there is no time constraint on the saying. IOW it is an eternal principle, not just for this life. Thank you.

 

[Peter1000]

It wasn't more than one person and it had nothing to do with Mormon expectations. It's just that visiting teachers aren't always thoughtful and kind.

Five cookbooks on a table might indicate research. Following pattern directions doesn't prove that another way is better.

Criticizing someone for not wanting to lose a baby doesn't seem right either.

No it doesn't, no wonder you left the church. Your whole experience with Mormons seems like one mess after another. I hope you are happy now.

 

[Peter1000]

That depends on the number of wives the man was sealed to! You know that and I know that.

No it does not. One wife is the way of the Lord, unless commanded otherwise. If a man has just 1 wife "in the Lord" his and her celestial marriage is good.

 

[mmksparbud]

I believe in celestial marriage because the Bible states:
(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 11:11)

11 Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.

The whole of 1 Cor 11: 1-16 is about head coverings! And it was Paulo who wrote Corinthians. PAUL WAS NOT MARRIED. Some say he could be a widower, but there is no prove of that.
"To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is well for them to remain single as I do. But if they cannot exercise self-control, they should marry. For it is better to marry than to be aflame with passion." (1 Corinthians 7:8-9 RSV)