Evidence on the Deep State

[cow451]

Donald is a businessman. He had business deals with the Russians both before and during his campaign. What did he offer them?

And what did they offer him?

 

[DaisyDay]

I think most people recognize the Russians were messing around in the election. Like I said they've probably been doing it for years! What most of us are questioning is the Trump Russian collusion to affect the election.

The special prosecutor was appointed - by Donald's own DOJ - to investigate if members of Donald's campaign were colluding with the Russian government or its agents, not necessarily Donald himself (only if evidence pointed to him). One might think have thought that Donald would want to know if people that were working for him or had worked on his campaign were in cahoots, but instead he took it as a personal insult and has been raging ever since.

 

[DaisyDay]

Donald is a businessman. He had business deals with the Russians both before and during his campaign.

And possibly after.

 

[KCfromNC]

Perhaps I misunderstand you. Are you saying that the investigation had nothing to do with a Trump/Russia collusion issue?

As I said, it is an investigation into Russian interference into the 2016 election. The fact that Trump supporters immediately jump to that being an investigation into candidate Trump himself is quite curious.

 

[KCfromNC]

Donald is a businessman. He had business deals with the Russians both before and during his campaign. What did he offer them?

Donald Trump just loosened sanctions against Russian intelligence agents
https://www.chron.com/news/politics/article/Texas-Republicans-defect-en-masse-as-Trump-13542610.php
Trump Discussed Pulling U.S. From NATO, Aides Say Amid New Concerns Over Russia

And so on. Quite an interesting set of coincidences.

 

[rjs330]

Kudos. Some of your fellow travelers think it's fine if foreign powers interfere with our elections because "we do it too".

Well I don't think anyone thinks it's fine. I believe people think it's a reality. We mess with other countries and other countries mess with ours. Its a reality. But I don't believe that anyone thinks it's okay to do so.

 

[rjs330]

The Mueller investigation is about Russian interference in the election and the possible involvement of Americans in it, including members of Trump's campaign. Have you never read Mueller's orders?
https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-release/file/967231/download
It never was specifically about Trump himself.

Yes I have. And even though there isn't a specific "let's get Trump" statement in there it's obvious what they are after. The Trump campaign is to elect Trump and people are hoping that the investigation will get Trump. You've been reading the posts haven't you? What about the headlines? Man I could post article after article about this. The Trump/Russian collusion is the big hope for everyone. It's everywhere. It"s all over this thread alone. You'd have to be blind or in willful denial not to see it.

 

[Belk]

Yes I have. And even though there isn't a specific "let's get Trump" statement in there it's obvious what they are after.

Who makes up "they"?

The Trump campaign is to elect Trump and people are hoping that the investigation will get Trump. You've been reading the posts haven't you? What about the headlines? Man I could post article after article about this. The Trump/Russian collusion is the big hope for everyone. It's everywhere. It"s all over this thread alone. You'd have to be blind or in willful denial not to see it.

Very well. Since it is so obvious perhaps you would be kind enough to point out a couple of examples from this thread?

 

[Speedwell]

Yes I have. And even though there isn't a specific "let's get Trump" statement in there it's obvious what they are after. The Trump campaign is to elect Trump and people are hoping that the investigation will get Trump. You've been reading the posts haven't you? What about the headlines? Man I could post article after article about this. The Trump/Russian collusion is the big hope for everyone. It's everywhere. It"s all over this thread alone. You'd have to be blind or in willful denial not to see it.

No, it's not. If you were paying attention you would have seen on this board alone many "lefties" (including me) express disbelief at the idea of "collusion." The notion that the Mueller investigation is nothing but a "witch hunt" to "get Trump" for "collusion" is pure, unadulterated right-wing misdirection.

Not to say that Trump's peculiar behavior hasn't attracted suspicion that he is guilty of something else, probably financial crimes in concert with the Russian oligarchs he is in hock to.

 

[RDKirk]

I think so. The "Trump Right" is all about ideological loyalty and they can't imagine the rest of us being any other way.

Actually, I don't think it's even ideological loyalty--those folk took a step away from Trump long ago. It's at the personality cult level, now.

 

[rjs330]

Who makes up "they"?



Very well. Since it is so obvious perhaps you would be kind enough to point out a couple of examples from this thread?

Post 37, 49, 51, 61.

I think I'm done with this conversation. Like I said if you can't see it, then you are blind.

Here is just one of MANY MANY articles on the Trump/Russia collusion issue.

Mark Warner says there's 'enormous' evidence of Russia-Trump collusion

So, it's no "spin".

 

[Roger B]

Why does Donald have the symbol for the Holy Roman Empire on his Scottish Golf Course Crest at Turnberry?

The Russians have the same symbol on their national flag!

For more info on the Double Headed Eagle of the Holy Roman Empire see:

The Eagle Has Landed

 

[Belk]

Post 37, 49, 51, 61.

Why would you think that? Do you imagine some are so weak willed that uf "one of theirs" is on the screen they'll watch?

Patience, friend, patience.

Hear here!
In fact I think, that Mueller has the goods on 45 (in still sealed indictments pending before the courts). We will never see those indictments as they will be held to ensure that either Trump doesn’t run, my preference, or is convinced to eat a baby* on the campaign trial so that the only people who vote for him are investigated immediately!


*or some other equally horrific thing that will turn off “moderates”.

And what did they offer him?

I fail to see how any of these are evidence that people are out to get Trump via the Russian investigation. People believing there is evidence is the exact opposite of "Witch Hunt".

I think I'm done with this conversation. Like I said if you can't see it, then you are blind.

Here is just one of MANY MANY articles on the Trump/Russia collusion issue.

Mark Warner says there's 'enormous' evidence of Russia-Trump collusion

So, it's no "spin".

Yet again, this does not strike me as evidence people are fabricating evidence in order to "get Trump". Quite frankly it looks to me that you are seeing things that are not there which is why you think everyone else is blind.

 

[cow451]

Post 37, 49, 51, 61.

I think I'm done with this conversation. Like I said if you can't see it, then you are blind.

Here is just one of MANY MANY articles on the Trump/Russia collusion issue.

Mark Warner says there's 'enormous' evidence of Russia-Trump collusion

So, it's no "spin".

You clearly misinterpreted my post. I am saying the investigation is not finished. I have said in other posts that I am not in the “collusion” camp.

Interesting that you have already made up your mind about the investigation outcome while I have not, yet you complain.

 

[DaisyDay]

Post 37, 49, 51, 61.

I think I'm done with this conversation. Like I said if you can't see it, then you are blind.

Okay then.

Here is just one of MANY MANY articles on the Trump/Russia collusion issue.

Mark Warner says there's 'enormous' evidence of Russia-Trump collusion

The article is talking about evidence. It's really not a smear job.

“They offer that dirt. There is an acceptance of that offer in writing from the president’s son, Don Jr., and there is overt acts and furtherance of that… That to me is direct evidence," Schiff added.

Then Donald dictated the cover-up letter lying about it. How is that not evidence? Please note the difference between "evidence" and "proof".

So, it's no "spin".

 

[rjs330]

I fail to see how any of these are evidence that people are out to get Trump via the Russian investigation. People believing there is evidence is the exact opposite of "Witch Hunt".




Yet again, this does not strike me as evidence people are fabricating evidence in order to "get Trump". Quite frankly it looks to me that you are seeing things that are not there which is why you think everyone else is blind.

you guys all crack me up! You want Mueller to get Trump and hope he does. All those things I showed you you were veiled statements by the writers all hinting at Trump Russian collusion. Of course none of you have any power to get Trump. But you sure show your bias in believing there was collusion. The posts here proove it.

And I could spend a lot of time researching the news and TV commentary and posting links, but quite frankly it wouldn't do any good. People are just in blind denial. Oh well. I guess we'll just wait and see.

 

[Belk]

you guys all crack me up! You want Mueller to get Trump and hope he does. All those things I showed you you were veiled statements by the writers all hinting at Trump Russian collusion. Of course none of you have any power to get Trump. But you sure show your bias in believing there was collusion. The posts here proove it.

And I could spend a lot of time researching the news and TV commentary and posting links, but quite frankly it wouldn't do any good. People are just in blind denial. Oh well. I guess we'll just wait and see.

Indeed. That would seem to be the case.

 

[thecolorsblend]

Secondly

I either missed or else totally forgot about the first.

Hannity is not a legitimate journalist, he is a talk show host, an entertainer as he acknowledges whenever he is caught lying.

His show is opinion-based. Many similar shows are. He's hardly unique in that respect.

Talk show hosts and entertainers are not reputable sources.

Even if they document their sources?

Did you catch the part where Hannity repeatedly says "breaking news" as if he is a news broadcaster?

That's a rather common turn of phrase in that business.

Did you catch the part where he says "according to my sources" as if he is an investigative reporter?

Are you suggesting he doesn't have sources?

He doesn't have any sources

Except he documents the sources he used for his presentation there.

he first regurgitates quotes from The Daily Caller(another documented disseminator of lies).

There's more than one meaning for the word "source". I trust you're aware of that and that you're not deliberately obfuscating the point.

Then Hannity claims to be quoting from the FISA application but proceeds to read from a guest editorial for The Hill.

Ah, so you did watch the video then?

Instead Hannity quotes from another opinion piece making the same distorted claim, while Hannity claims to be quoting the FISA application!

What did he claim was listed on the FISA application which isn't?

a dose of name-calling and innuendo

You've used quite a lot of name-calling and innuendo in your post here.

Strange that I'm somewhat speaking up for Hannity. I never watch or listen to his various shows. But when he has a valid point, I think it's fair to acknowledge that it's a valid point.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

I'm get back to you with more levels of your delusion and I'll leave you with this...

If you have so much inside info on what's really going under the surface, so much esoteric knowledge, such a penetrating intellect not to be duped like the masses, the sheep, then why are all your sources documented serial liars and talk show host jesters?

Is every legitimate journalist and academic on the planet part of the grand conspiracy to conceal and perpetuate the "deep state"... think about it...

I thought Fox News was still rated #1 and the most fair and balanced?
M-Bob

 

[LostMarbels]

If you have so much inside info on what's really going under the surface, so much esoteric knowledge, such a penetrating intellect not to be duped like the masses, the sheep, then why are all your sources documented serial liars and talk show host jesters?

Propaganda. If there is a 'world wide system of influence', then reason dictates it would have world wide affluence as well, and both their influence and their money would be used on a world wide stage to propagate a narrative that supports their own position. So anyone against that narrative, would be demonized on any world wide platform the establishment controls. Simple logic.

Is every legitimate journalist and academic on the planet part of the grand conspiracy to conceal and perpetuate the "deep state"... think about it...

No. No they are not. Many are deluded into believing a lie. Some of these people have classic systems of Stockholm syndrome where no matter what evidence is brought forward they are incapable of seeing those doing them harm as evil.

Minds can be broken. Masses of people can be lead into captivity by their own doing thru manipulation. By creating an illusion of free choice, the people will be resistant to change because they honestly believe it is the correct way.

Another factor is entire generations grew up never knowing any different. People like myself who grew up and can remember the late 70's-1980's onwards can see a stark difference from then to now. People that grew up in a liberally controlled PC culture know no difference.

Then there are those that want everyone to march to the same drum, and want totalitarian control over the masses. In some cases even over themselves as a collective.

 

[Speedwell]

Yes I have. And even though there isn't a specific "let's get Trump" statement in there it's obvious what they are after. The Trump campaign is to elect Trump and people are hoping that the investigation will get Trump. You've been reading the posts haven't you? What about the headlines? Man I could post article after article about this. The Trump/Russian collusion is the big hope for everyone. It's everywhere. It"s all over this thread alone. You'd have to be blind or in willful denial not to see it.

But discovering that some members of Trump's campaign may have had illicit dealings with Russia doesn't "get Trump."

Unless, of course, you live in Tinfoil Hatland and imagine a scenario in which Hillary's declares her election defeat fraudulent and on that bases seizes power from Trump. (and there are even people on this board who believe that to be a real possibility).