The Rule of faith and practice is not scripture "alone"

[LoveofTruth]

The Rule of faith and practice
is not scripture alone

PART 1 (Contnued in part 2)

A correction to the “sola scriptura” teaching, which says “scripture ALONE”.

Now, at first glance some may think that I am teaching that scripture is not a rule of faith and practice. I am not quite saying this, I am saying that scripture is not the first primary rule of faith and practice, even though I would say it is the secondary rule. The primary rule of faith and practice is to live and walk and move in the power of the Spirit (Gal. 5:16, 25 Rom. 8:2,5,6,9-16 KJV), in Christ in the new creation (Gal. 6:15,16 KJV) where God dwells in all believers (1 Cor. 3:16, 1 John 4:15 KJV) and where he works in us to will and to do and to make us perfect unto every good work, working in us that which is well pleasing through Jesus Christ (Heb. 13:20,21 Phil 2:13 KJV).

It is the anointing that teaches us all things, (1 John 2:27 KJV) and if any man have not the Spirit of Christ he is none of his (Romans 8:9) and if he does not have the Spirit he cannot know the things of God or the scriptures (1 Cor 2 KJV) . The scriptures were given by the Spirit (2 Timothy 3:16) and no man can even know the scriptures unless they are in the first rule which is to be in the Spirit (Romans 8:9 KJV). If any man have not the Spirit of Christ they are none of his (Romans 8:9 KJV). The Holy Spirit is the one who guides us into all truth (John 16:13 KJV). It is the grace of our Lord that is with our spirit (Philemon 1:25 KJV).

No man can even know the Son of God except the Father reveals him. This inner witness in our spirit is vital to knowing God and living in the spirit.

“no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him.”(John 10:22 KJV)

So, for a man to say “I know who the Son of God is” by scripture "alone" without a spiritual revelation is not accurate. Yes, scripture testifies of the Son of God and Jesus work for salvation and the gospel is according to the scriptures and many prophecies and much more. However, the scriptures were given by the Spirit to the men who testified and who were led to write them. But to know who Jesus is as the Son of God is a revelation of the Father and to know the Father is a revelation of the Son.

It is not the scriptures that give an inner witness of themselves, but it is the Spirit that bears witness. The scriptures are able to help us as we have faith in Christ Jesus.

“The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:”(Romans 8:16 KJV)

Christianity is new life the Spirit of Christ (2 Cor. 3:6, Gal 615,16, John 15.:1-6,2 Cor 13:5 KJV) And true worship is to worship in spirit and in truth (John 4:23 KJV). Unless Jesus is in us and we in him we can do nothing, as Jesus said,

“4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. 5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.”(John 15:4,5 KJV)

As highly as I regard the holy scriptures and see them as the secondary rule. I cannot say that they are “alone” the only rule for believers. However, if a man is in Christ he will be led by the Spirit into all truth and this would include the scriptures of truth and the true believer who now is in the Spirit and the faith which is in Christ Jesus can understand the scriptures. We even see this in a favorite verse many quote to teach “sola scriptura”

“5 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”(2 Timothy 3:15,16 KJV)

Here we see that it is by faith in Christ Jesus that any can understand the scriptures. Again the first primary rule is the spirit and to live in faith in Christ.

Paul said

“11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”(1 Cor 2:11-14 KJV)

Yet today many think they can know the things of God without His immediate revelation and Spirit leading them to all truth. Or even if they acknowledge the Holy Spirit guiding them, they still say “sola” scriptura” or scripture alone. I wonder how a person thinks they can know anything of the Spirit unless they are born again and live and move in the spirit. Jesus said ,

“Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”(John 3:3 KJV)

The pharisees had scripture and studied it and could quote many things yet they did not know Jesus in front of them and they did not come to him to have life. They could not see spiritual things. But they could read scripture and study languages and try to understand with their natural carnal mind. They thought (like some today seem to imply,) that they had eternal life in the scriptures but Jesus said,

“Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. “(John 5:39 KJV)

Jesus also said they did not know the scriptures or the power of God (Matt. 22:29 KJV) even though they might have thought they did. They also did not have His word abiding in them

“And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.”(John 5:38 KJV)

The seed is the word of God sown in the hearts of all (Luke 8 Gal.3 1 John 3:9) and is near all (Acts 17 Romans 10: Hebrews 4:12,13 KJV), though not in them or in union with them until they receive him at salvation, this is a great attainment where they will be born again, born from above by the Spirit of God (John 6:63, 1 Peter 1:23, James 1:18 KJV). This inward life is the first rule of Christianity and by which we understand the scriptures. The anointing teaches us all things, and yes all things would include the secondary witness or rule of the scriptures as we are taught by the Spirit.

“ But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.”(1 John 2:27 KJV)

Jesus one time opened the believers hearts to understand the scriptures. This is still the way men understand scripture

“ And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself....32 And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures?”(Luke 24:27,32 KJV)

Many today try to take out the spiritual aspects of Christianity and reduce it to a intellectual attainment or carnal reasoning with the wisdom of men and excellency of speech. Paul as led by the Spirit rebuked such thinking

“And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God....4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man’s wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power: 5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God... we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery,...But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”(1 Cor 2:1,4-6, 11-14 KJV)


The Primary Rule

To clarify what this first rule is, here are some scriptures.

“15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. 16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.”(Galatians 6:15,16 KJV)

The word “rule” means - “sphere, standard, rod, boundary.”

To live in Christ as a new creation is to live in spiritual life with Jesus Christ in you and the spirit of God leading you and teaching you all things. This is the primary rule, as Paul said. We are to walk according to this rule. And except a man be born again he cannot see spiritually anything of the kingdom.

“For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.” (Romans 8:14 KJV)

“Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.”(John 16:13 KJV)

But some seem to say regardless of this,

“We can know all about the things of God by our study of Greek and Hebrew and with our human wisdom in reading other commentaries and with all our human intellect and books."

The issue they deal with, is that God said they cannot know the things of God unless they are spiritual ( 1 Cor 2 etc) . So again how do they think to understand spiritual scripture if they are not being led by the Spirit of God which is the first primary rule. If they can admit this then they should not use the expression “sola scriptura” or scripture ALONE.

Jesus also showed a difference of the Old Testament worship and the worship God seeks after.

“But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.”(John 4:23,24 KJV).

PART 1 (Contnued in part 2 and 3)

 

[LoveofTruth]

Part 2 continued...

THE PERFECTING OF THE SAINTS

In scripture we SEE different ways that God makes believers perfect.

1. God works in them to make them perfect

“Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, 21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.”Hebrews 13:20, 21 JV)

This is the first primary rule of faith and practice to have God in us and working in us and this is where we have the anointing that teaches us all things (1 John 2:27) and Jesus Christ in us ( 2 Cor 13:5 KJV). Without this rule of God in us we cannot know anything.

“15 And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. 16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you...”(Colossians 3:15, 16 KJV)

The word “rule” here means "to govern" And who cannot say this is the primary rule in our heart in the spirit.?

2. The body of Christ and ministry for the perfecting of the saints.

I showed above, it is God working by the first rule in all believers, then by this rule the body can function and work and Christ effectually worketh in all

“11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: ...15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: 16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.”(Ephesians 4:11-16)

Notice, that Christ works effectually in every part of the body. This is the first rule of God working in individuals and then the body

God works by his spirit in the body of Christ also and this is how he edifies the body and
perfects the saints

3. The scriptures are able to make us perfect unto every good work
THROUGH FAITH which is in Christ Jesus.

“16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.”( 2 Timothy 3:16 KJV)

So in these three ways we see the MORE complete UNDERSTANDING OF THE RULE.

- The primary rule of God is by His Spirit working in us to make us perfect.
- The work of God in the body of believers and the gifts in ministry to each other to perfect the saints
- The Holy scriptures which are able to make us perfect through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

All these work together to make us perfect.

But nothing can happen unless we are in the primary rule of the Spirit and life.

The scriptures don’t of themselves lead us into an action unless we are in faith in Christ. The anointing teaches us of all things and believers are to be led by the Spirit, then the scriptures will work in us, for the word of God works in those who believe (1 Thess 2:13 KJV).

For example, the scriptures teach the various qualifications of an overseer (Bishop) in 1 Timothy 3. But many believers can see such a list and say they meet them. The list itself does not tell you or make you an overseer. Yet, we can know those who are called of God to such a function by examining the sc ripture list there and other places. This is done as we also see them manifest the gifts and call of God. They also hold fast the faithful word and “have the rule” in this respect and have spoken the word of God.

But the scripture in 1 Timothy doesn't itself make them an overseer or "bishop".

We read in scripture that the Holy Ghost made them overseers (Acts 20:28 KJV) This is as believers follow the primary rule of God’s Spirit calling, giving life, empowering, witnessing to our spirit, directing, leading and teaching us all things

So we see that God makes us perfect directly in our hearts, He works in the entire body to perfect the saints and he uses scripture to make us perfect unto every good work. All these work together as the rule of faith and practice. But each in the proper place.

But if some say “sola scriptura” with no clarification, this can led many to deny God’s immediate work and revelation to the heart and the leading of the Spirit in all things. Some may go as far as to say God does not speak in any believer today and we can only know God by the scriptures.

Some may think they can know the things of God by simply studying scripture and Greek and Hebrew and human reasoning alone. While it is important to study (2 Timothy 2:15 KJV) this kind of study is to follow the leading of the Spirit and anointing (1 John 2:27, John 16:13 KJV) and what things are freely given to us of God (1 Cor 2:10,12 KJV).

Studying Greek and Hebrews will tell you the meaning of words (and that is good) but it will not tell you the real spiritual meaning of what Jesus is saying. No man knows this but by the Spirit as we read (2 Cor. 2:13,14 KJV).

For example, Jesus said

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.”(John 12:24)

A person can study the meaning in Greek of each word and still not know what Jesus is talking about. They may say “well, the word “Verily” in Greek means “firm, trustworthy, etc” or the word “corn” means, “kernal or seed”, or the word, “ground” meaning “earth, land, the solid part of whole terrene globe”. But to know this does not tell you what spiritual truth Jesus is speaking. If we do not see the spiritual we may think Jesus is simply giving advice about farming etc.

I like when Jesus said this and I think it is very applicable today as well,

"In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.”(Luke 10:21 KJV)

If a person could simply study Greek and Hebrews and read the bible and think he is fit for ministry, then any unbeliever could do as much and simply take other men’s words from commentaries or his own speculations and reasonings and piece together a few text and comments and be a minister in an assembly. But this is not the way Christians are to walk, nor the rule of faith and practice.

We see some today who are very similar to the pharisees who seem to deny Gods immediate voice and His Spirit in the heart leading and giving gifts and revelation. From such men we may get many false doctrines and error. In fact, all false doctrine has come out of the men who do not listen to the Spirit and who have not been given things from God and who have been misled by the fleshly mind, doctrines of devils or traditions and commandments of men.

Yes, all spiritual leading and every aspect of our walk must be tried and examined and yes we must appeal to all three aspects of the rule. To God directly, to the body of Christ and the holy scriptures. The witness of all three must be in harmony. But, we do not eliminate God’s Spirit directly and immediately working in us, or the body of Christ and cling to scripture alone. The word “alone” or “sola” is what troubles me, because the pharisees had scripture alone yet were without Jesus. It is true they added to scripture many of their own traditions and commandments as many do today as well. But they did not have Jesus word in their hearts. He was not in them and they were not in him for the most part.

But, if we rightly use scripture and the way it is to be understood and applied then it is very profitable and needful.

And remember that no prophecy of scripture is of any private interpretation, but holy men of God spoke) as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

So, to understand the spiritual things they wrote all must be in the Spirit and led by the Spirit.

Continued in part 3...

 

[LoveofTruth]

Part 3 continued from part 2...

Objections:

Some will object and say, that Paul is saying that only scripture is able to make us perfect unto every good work and they will quote 2 Timothy 3:16, where it says that the Holy scriptures are able to make us perfect unto all good works. They will stress that there is nothing else.

Answer: I agree that holy scripture is able to work in those that BELIEVE. But even in the letter to Timothy we read that this is effectual only in those that have faith . Without faith it is impossible to please God. And Christ dwells in the heart by faith. Faith is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen and Christ in you is the hope of glory (Hebrews 11, Colossians 1)

We also read that the primary rule is that God works in us to will and to do and to make us perfect unto every good work, working in us through Jesus Christ (Hebrews 13:20,21 Phi. 2:13 KJV)

So, while scripture (the word of God that is written down when given to men by the Spirit) bears witness with the seed or word sown in the heart ie. Christ the true Light that lighteth every man that cometh into the world, then we see that scripture alone does not make a person perfect unless they are in faith. The word only works in those that believe. Otherwise all the pharisees would have been made perfect by simply reading the scriptures and trying in their best human effort to walk in them and understand them. But they did not do this and they did not hear Jesus voice in their hearts or have His word abiding in them. Jesus also said they did not know the scriptures nor the power of God and they were inwardly ravening from the Spirit though they outwardly appeared righteous to men. They thought they had eternal life in the scriptures, but they did not.

Objection 2

Some will say, that to put the Spirit of God as the first rule we open up to all sorts of heretics who will say that they hear from God and even though what they say is contrary to scripture.

Answer: No, we can hear what any man says as he claims to be led, but all must be judged. It is judged by the Spirit in our hearts that bears witness, and the body of Christ as a whole who can judge all things that are said (1 Cor 14:29, 1 John 4:1, 1 Cor 5:12, 1 Thess 5:21 KJV)and by the scriptures as well, that will never contradict a person who is truly led by the Spirit. If they do claim spiritual revelation and leadings all must be judged.
If a man is found to be a heretic, reject after the first and second admonition (Titus 3:10 KJV). And yes, all three aspects of the rule are needed. God leading in the anointing which teaches us all things, the body of Christ and the holy scriptures.

Objection 3:

But if you claim an immediate leading of the Spirit and God working in you, you would have to add any words and leading of men today to the scriptures.

Answer: No, this is not the case. Many things were said by Jesus that are not written down and many had prophecies that are not written down and other words from God and leading's in their life. If we are led by the Spirit we are the sons of God, if not we are in darkness. If we live in the Spirit let us also walk in the Spirit.

We do not add to scripture . God only chose certain men to write scripture and certain words to put in scripture. But God has spoke though all believers and works in all believers..

Even the closed canon we believe by faith.

Objection 4:

But the church has taught for a long time “sola scriptura” and how can you say they are wrong.

Answer: The very scriptures I quoted in this discussion say they are wrong. If a person does not have the Spirit of Christ he is none of His and he can know nothing.

The churches through history have had many errors and issues to deal with, this is nothing new. We could go over the many issues in the reformation times, or even in the times of the early church we see many issues as well.

The scriptures were given by the Spirit of God and only known by the Spirit. How can we say otherwise. Can any man claim to know the things of God in the scriptures unless he is in the spirit? Unless he has God reveal them to him.?

The sad thing is that many do not seek God's leading in this or to hear His voice and so they go about in carnal apprehension and human reasoning thinking to know the things of God. This is part of the problem. They can be distant from God and inwardly ravening even though outwardly appearing righteous unto men (Matthew 7:15 KJV).

It doesn’t mean that all who are believers will always understand certain things easily. But to be led by the Spirit and have the anointing teach us all things is safer than man’s human reasoning and endless human wisdom in trying to know the things of God.

A summary

The scriptures testify of Jesus and are given by the Spirit, but they are not Jesus himself. Just by reading the scriptures doesn’t mean a person hears God’s word or have the Spirit revealing spiritual things to them.

The Pharisees thought they were right with God and they thought they had eternal life in the scriptures but they didn’t (John 5:39 KJV). Jesus said they did not know the scriptures or the power of God . They did not even know the Lord in front of them, the Word made flesh. They also did not have his word abiding in them (John 5:38 KJV).

Men all through history have often missed the spiritual understanding of things. This is obvious in many of the things they say and do and in their understanding the doctrine. They often cling to the natural and human reasoning. But, If just reading scriptures with the natural mind made someone hear God’s word and be a minister then all the Pharisees would have heard and known God’s word by their reading scripture alone.

But instead we read

John 8 :43,47 KJV “ Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.. He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.”

This was spoken to those who had scriptures and read them and who had even heard His voice audibly, but did not hear His word...

Obviously by their simply by reading scripture did not mean they heard Gods word .


I welcome any discussion on this and comments.

God bless

 

[redleghunter]

Now, at first glance some may think that I am teaching that scripture is not a rule of faith and practice. I am not quite saying this, I am saying that scripture is not the first primary rule of faith and practice, even though I would say it is the secondary rule. The primary rule of faith and practice is to live and walk and move in the power of the Spirit (Gal. 5:16, 25 Rom. 8:2,5,6,9-16 KJV), in Christ in the new creation (Gal. 6:15,16 KJV) where God dwells in all believers (1 Cor. 3:16, 1 John 4:15 KJV) and where he works in us to will and to do and to make us perfect unto every good work, working in us that which is well pleasing through Jesus Christ (Heb. 13:20,21 Phil 2:13 KJV).

Yet you quoted Scripture to provide evidence for you OP.

Sola Scriptura according to the Reformers meant Holy Scriptures are the only infallible rule to test truth claims.

 

[LoveofTruth]

Yet you quoted Scripture to provide evidence for you OP.

Sola Scriptura according to the Reformers meant Holy Scriptures are the only infallible rule to test truth claims.

I did quote scripture. But I was wondering if you really read all of it slowly and considered what I said.

The reformers were right about some things but not all things.

And unless a person has the the new birth and is spiritual and has the Spirit of God teaching him and guiding him he cannot know the scriptures, read what i wrote again.

 

[redleghunter]

I did quote scripture. But I was wondering if you really read all of it slowly and considered what I said.

The reformers were right about some things but not all things.

90% of what you wrote was quoting Holy Scriptures. You derived your précis and argument is derived from Holy Scriptures. Just thought that was interesting.

I posted that Holy Scriptures were the only infallible standard to test truth claims. Not the only source. Any source of doctrine or tradition or revelation must be tested by Holy Scriptures. That’s the real definition of Sola Scriptura.

 

[LoveofTruth]

90% of what you wrote was quoting Holy Scriptures. You derived your précis and argument is derived from Holy Scriptures. Just thought that was interesting.

I posted that Holy Scriptures were the only infallible standard to test truth claims. Not the only source. Any source of doctrine or tradition or revelation must be tested by Holy Scriptures. That’s the real definition of Sola Scriptura.

No man knows the scriptures unless he has the first primary rule of faith and practice which is to be led by the Spirit. Read 1 Cor 2 again and Paul is clear in that section.

My premise here is that the expression "Solo scriptura" is not accurate. It is not scripture alone. Without the Spirit of God no man can know scripture. The pharisees had scripture alone and did not understand or know the scriptures.

 

[LoveofTruth]

I posted that Holy Scriptures were the only infallible standard to test truth claims. Not the only source. Any source of doctrine or tradition or revelation must be tested by Holy Scriptures. That’s the real definition of Sola Scriptura.

I agree that we can use the scripture in Christ through faith for doctrine and correction etc. The scriptures were given by the Spirit and even the men who wrote them had to have the first primary rule of God revealing them to them. So to understand them we need the Spirit. The anointing teaches us all things.

If a man says I do not need to hear God's voice immediately or have revelation I can simply study the Greek and Hebrews and logic and use my natural wisdom and intellect to understand the things of God using the scriptures that way. He can not know them or the things of God rightly.

Now study is good as we are led by the Spirit and the anointing teaches us all things. The Spirit of God will guide us into all truth and the scriptures are of truth.

 

[AACJ]

.

 

[Albion]

LoveofTruth,

I see that, in the Original Post, SolO Scriptura was mentioned almost immediately. Is it SolO Scriptura rather than SolA Scriptura that is the proposed subject for discussion? It appears not to be, but then I wonder why it was mentioned several times as though the two are the same.​

 

[LoveofTruth]

LoveofTruth,

I see that, in the Original Post, SolO Scriptura was mentioned almost immediately. Is it SolO Scriptura rather than SolA Scriptura that is the proposed subject for discussion? It appears not to be, but then I wonder why it was mentioned several times as though the two are the same.​

I will adjust the expression to Sola scriptura.

"Sola Scriptura (Latin: by scripture alone) is a theological doctrine held by some Christian denominations that the Christian scriptures are the sole infallible rule of faith and practice."

 

[1213]

...
I welcome any discussion on this and comments....

I think the important thing is to understand that God’s Spirit and Bible speak the same message. And if you have contradiction with the Bible, I believe Bible is correct.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

GOD Reveals Himself To Us By His Word:
(GOD is connected (ever presently working) with Scripture & One Cannot Cut GOD out of His own Word (the Bible)).

A person can have their experiences today to trust in by sight, but I prefer to trust the words of Jesus that says: "blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed." (John 20:29).

A person may prefer to walk by their senses or special experiences, but I prefer to walk by faith and not by sight. For without faith, it is impossible to please GOD (Hebrews 11:6).

A person may seek to point to their miracles, but I will point them to Jesus Christ by faith in my Bible.

For Paul says, "For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified." (1 Corinthians 2:2). The gospel (1 Corinthians 15:1-4). Salvation in Christ's death and resurrection. Jesus is the light of my salvation (that I have learned from the Bible) and not something else.

For does the Bible talk about the absence of God when we act upon the Bible?

No.

This means God will act in harmony with His Word by what it says.
The Bible is a book of promises and conditions.
If you belief this and do this, this will happen involving God.

Can the voice of God be separated from God?
The Bible is a form of communication.
The Bible is the voice of God for today.
Sort of like a love letter.
It is the thoughts of God for us to act upon.
God Himself is spirit.
But we know this because His word tells us this and not some secret voice or inner feeling alone.

God is the One who changes our heart ultimately but it is only by His Word (the Bible). The thoughts of God within Scripture is a part of God. You cannot cut them out and say they are not of God which leads us to have faith in Him.

Could we have the Bible without God?

No.

If a person acts on the Bible, can they be saved and walk with God by faith?

Yes, because God abides with His Word always.

Scripture is God-breathed, and hence represents God’s very voice speaking,

If a person has never had an experience with the Bible, then they may not regard God’s Word as being any different than say the works of Shakespeare.

Some may have forgotten how the Word has changed their life.

Some may not realize that the Scriptures are not just dead words on a page all by themselves. Others may simply prefer an experience or some vision or miracle first over what the Word says to rule their life.

But I can prove to you that the Word of God is divine in origin.
Check out this blogger article here.
This proves indeed the Bible are not simply words alone that have no power.
Others may seek another outside source of communication in addition to the Scriptures.
A still small voice or an inner feeling, etc.

The Bible are words of life that God always abides by and seeks to convict the hearts of men with.
It is only by His Word He does this.
Anything that conflicts with God’s Word is to be questioned and looked at with suspicion. For our faith is built upon the Word of God.

God and the Bible go together like wetness and rain. You cannot separate the two. When you talk about the Bible, you talk about God. When you talk about salvation we are talking about the Bible and God. God is the author of Scripture.

One cannot separate the author of Scripture from Scripture. God does illumine Scripture to His people, but that is because they obeyed or listened to His Word. Yes, no man can come to Christ, unless the Father draws Him, but Christ draws all men unto Himself (John 12:32). But we would not know this unless Scripture told us.

Peter said to Cornelius, "Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons." (Acts of the Apostles 10:34). So God desires that all men are to be saved. God sent Peter to tell Cornelius of the good news. Cornelius was not converted without hearing about salvation through Jesus Christ. For God is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance (2 Peter 3:9).

Hebrews 1:1-2 says that God in these last days has spoken to us by his Son (Note: The words of Jesus are immortalized in Scripture). So it is not some inner voice or feeling. It is Scripture. The words of Jesus in Scripture. That is how God speaks to us today. There is no still small voice separate from Scripture and or a feeling alone. God makes clear His words within Scripture (Which also works in harmony with His Spirit). You cannot separate the Spirit from Scripture. They breath together in harmony. Where there is one there is the other. It's how God has chosen to communicate with us today.

Note: To see how God has spoken to us through out time, click on the following spoiler button.

Spoiler

 

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In John 14:23, Jesus says, "If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him."

Today, we know of this truth by Scripture.

No still small voice or inner feeling is needed before believing and or acting upon Scripture is needed to believe this truth. These would be the words of Jesus we read in Scripture. If we keep His words, the Father and Jesus will then come into us and make their home in us by our acting by faith on what His Word says here in Scripture.

If there is no Bible. Then there are no words of Jesus for us to have these instructions by Jesus in order for our Lord and the Father to dwell in us.

The Bible also says:

"And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart." (Jeremiah 29:13).

Again, we would not know about this truth if it was not for the Bible. GOD does not hide truth from us unless we truly are seeking Him. So if a person is truly seeking GOD and they have a Bible, they will find GOD because it has the gospel message and GOD abiding by that message to save them. This is only possible because GOD always abides by His Word.

All Scripture is profitable for doctrine and instruction in righteousness so that the man of God may be perfect unto every good work (2 Timothy 3:16-17). Some will say that this statement was only made for when Paul had written it. But this is not the case. ALL Scripture would include the Bible because it is ALL Scripture for today. So this passage has two fulfillments. The first fulfillment of this Scripture existed during Paul's time was sufficient to help believers during his time period and the second fulfillment of this Scripture would be the Scripture for our day. This ALL Scripture that is for our day is sufficient to help believers to be perfect unto every good work in doctrine and in training of righteousness for our day. GOD knows what exact knowledge we perfectly each need for each time period. To speak against 2 Timothy 3:16-17 is to speak against the Bible and to seek out some kind of outside form of communication that the Bible does not talk about. Yes, GOD does reveal His existence by the creation, and He can speak to us by life circumstances, etc., but this would involve His Word. If there is no Word of God involved it should be tossed aside as possibly being not from GOD. Today, many have false visions of Jesus and they believe things that are contrary to His Word. Many take an experience over what the Word of God says. I would rather have my Bible alone and walk righteously than have any miracle in my life. For the true miracle is honoring GOD by loving Him and loving my neighbor with every fiber of my being and soul by the working of GOD in my life according to the Bible. While I know GOD can work miracles today, I believe this to be by answered prayer. There is no need for men to uplift themselves by boasting in a power or an ability or a miracle that took place in their life. I would rather boast in Jesus Christ and what He has done for me alone. Sure, your power may be genuine. I do not have confirmation of that fact. I do have confirmation of the fact that my Bible is sufficient to lead to godliness in this life because GOD always abides by His Word (the Bible). They are inseparable. Where there is one, there is the other.

 

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Faith comes by hearing the word of God (Romans 10:17).

This would be both Jesus and the words of the Bible because they are one. Jesus is called the Word of God. Jesus always acts in accordance with His Word (Scripture).

In the parable of the weeds, we learn that the Sower is the Son of Man (Jesus) (Matthew 13:37).

In the Parable of the Sower: The Sower would still be the Son of Man and the seed is the word of God, i.e. the gospel message from the Scriptures (Luke 8:11) (For we are born of incorruptible seed, which is the word of God that endures forever, see: 1 Peter 1:23-25; Also the words of Jesus are spiritual and they are life - John 6:63).

Paul says, "I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase." (1 Corinthians 3:6). What was Paul and Apollos planting or watering? The communicated Word of God. So along with the communicated Word of God, it was God giving the increase along with the words they provided that were from GOD.

Being born of water in John 3:5 is talking about being born again by hearing (believing/acting upon) Scripture. Ephesians 5:25-27 talks about how Christ died for us to as to sanctify us by the washing of the water of the Word. For when we hear the gospel message and obey it by repenting (seeking forgiveness) of our sins to the Lord Jesus Christ, we have salvation. This would not be another Jesus outside of the Bible.

We know that being born not of incorruptible seed (1 Peter 1:23-25) is in reference to the communicated Word of God because in 1 Peter 2:2 (that follows) says, "As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby."

Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me (John 6:45). This is the context of John 6:44 that says no man can come unto me unless the Father draws them. Calvinists love to use John 6:44 (while ignoring John 6:45) to prove that a person cannot come to God unless God just chooses to reveal it to them. As if God is trying to hide all truth of His Word from man. What would be the purpose of the judgment then? How could God condemn man if He hid the truth from us to act upon the truth?

The Bible tells us to: "Study to show yourself approved unto God, a workman that needs not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." (2 Timothy 2:15).

No extra Biblical insight (not in Scripture) is given here. We are told to study. God is not going to spoon feed us. Yes, the Holy Spirit (the anointing we have received) can help teach us God's Word (1 John 2:27). No doubt about it. But this is proof that GOD is ever active and working in His Word. GOD is never separate from His Word. We study to show ourselves approved unto GOD and GOD will make sure His helper is there with us if we are honestly seeking the truth in His Word with a pure heart and with no intention to justify evil or sin or our own thing or way.

Jesus said: "the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit (spiritual), and they are life." (John 6:63). So when we talk about Sola Scriptura, we are talking about spiritual words that come from GOD that are life.

Jesus admits to the truth that if we love God and love our neighbor (According to Scripture), we will live (See Luke 10:25-28). No extra biblical vision, feeling, voice is needed. GOD is ever active and working with His Word. You talk about the Bible, and you are talking about the working of GOD. For GOD moves in people's lives by His Word.

It is sin that prevents a person's understanding on Scripture:

1 Timothy 6:3-4 says,
3 "If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing, ..."

A person closes their eyes to the truth because of their own wicked heart and preference towards sin.

"For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them." (Matthew 13:15).

"The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?" (Jeremiah 17:9).

Sin is what separates a person from God:

"But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear." (Isaiah 59:2).

The breaking of the Law is sin (1 John 3:4).

The Pharisees ignored the weightier matters of the Law (i.e. they broke God's laws) and they were not ignoring some kind of inner voice talking to them.

For Jesus says:
"Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone." (Matthew 23:23) (Also see Luke 11:42).

In John 8, Jesus asks the Jews why they do not understand His words, and then He says it is because they cannot hear His word because they are doing the lusts of their father the devil (i.e. sin).

43 "Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do." (John 8:43-44).

In other words, their preference to sin is blinding them to hear God's Word (Which is the communicated Word and not some inner secret voice, etc.).

John 3:19-21 says,
19 "And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God."

This is why they cannot see.

It is not about hearing an actual voice or working of God alone upon their hearts. A person is under condemnation because men loved darkness rather than the light because their deeds are evil according to John 3:19. For John 3:20 says all who do evil hate the light, unless their deeds are reproved (corrected). But some are not open to correction because they prefer their sins (or the lusts of their father, the devil).

A person today cannot be saved genuinely without hearing the Scriptures.

If they are not accepting the Jesus of the Bible, they are accepting a false Jesus. The Lord always abides with His Word today. We know that the Lord Jesus always quoted OT Scripture many times.

In all Jesus' teachings He referred to the divine authority of the Old Testament (Matthew 5:17-18; Matthew 8:17;Matthew 12:40-42; Luke 4:18-21; Luke 10:25-28; Luke 15:29-31; Luke 17:32; Luke 24:25-45; John 5:39-47). He quoted the Old Testament 78 times, the Pentateuch alone 26 times. He quoted from Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy, Psalms, Proverbs, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Daniel, Hosea, Amos, Jonah, Micah, and Malachi. He referred to the Old Testament as “The Scriptures,” “the word of God,” and “the wisdom of God.” Jesus defeated the devil by using Scripture. For three words, "It is written" was said 3 times by Jesus in Matthew 4:1-11. This is confirmed by Ephesians 6 with how the Sword of the Spirit is the Word of God which is a part of putting on the armor of God so that one can stand against the wiles of the devil (Ephesians 6:11, 16). For the Living Word (Jesus) is like a two edged sword that divides asunder the soul and the spirit because He always speaks the words of God because He is God (Hebrews 4:12).

Man shall not live by bread alone.

For Jesus said,
"It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God." (Matthew 4:4).

I used to think that this verse was exclusively talking about how we need to speak God's Word (the Bible) in order to live. While true to a certain extent, this would be talking about how we are to live (obey) the New Testament Holy Scriptures. It is talking about how we are to obey the commands that come from Jesus and His followers as found in NT Scripture. No still small voice or inner feeling alone is the source of our transmission here. We are to follow God's Word the Bible in order to live. Live = Eternal Life.

Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every Word of God. Man shall live eternally by obeying their Lord Jesus Christ according to the words found in the Bible and not some obedience to some vision we had or some inner still small voice that the Bible does not say for us to seek after. The words of the Bible are sufficient for us to be perfect unto every good work (2 Timothy 3:16).

After Jesus performed a miracle and fed a large crowd with bread and fish, the crowd later tracked down Jesus and they wanted more of that miracle bread. However, Jesus wanted to give them something far better. The spiritual bread of life (salvation in Him) which can only be received by Scripture (Because this is how we read about this event or moment in history). Jesus wanted to give these people the spiritual bread (Himself), but they wanted the miracles and or the physical bread. They wanted something they could see, touch, taste, or feel. They did not want Jesus.

God’s people are destroyed for lack of knowledge (Hosea 4:6).

This would not be some hidden knowledge of some inner voice or feeling or some vision or some other kind of thing outside of the Bible. Today, the knowledge of God is the Bible. We can be destroyed for lack of knowledge in not knowing the Bible. Yes, at one time, Hosea was in reference to the communicated Word for his time, but today, this verse would apply to us differently because our knowledge is not the same knowledge that the Israelites had but it is the Bible. Hosea 4:6 is not some verse that was only meant for the Israelites in the past. Hosea 4:6 can also be applied for the believer (God's people) today. For all Scripture is profitable.

Man made traditions can destroy God’s Word.

For Jesus says,

“Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?" (Matthew 15:3).

A tradition can be any man made thought or idea that is not specifically stated in God's Word. People can keep a man made tradition and not even realize it is violating His Word. If it happened in the past, it can happen again. So I would be careful not to listen to some voice or idea or thought outside of God's Word (the Bible).

For God speaks to us by His Word (Psalms 119:105) (2 Timothy 3:16-17) (Isaiah 8:20) (John 17:17) (1 Thessalonians 2:13).

We would not know about the following things without Scripture.

1 Trinity
2. God is spirit.
3. Justification.
4. Sanctification.
5. Glorification.
6. Substitutionary Atonement.
7. Being born again.
8. Repentance.
9. Jesus is the Only Way of Salvation.
10. God's proper order of the church (the body of Christ).
11. Forgivable Sins.
12. Unforgivable Sins.
13. The Old and New Covenants.
14. Satan, his minions, and hell.
15. The Rapture.
16. False doctrines.
19. The Tribulation.
20. God’s Commands.

These things are derived from the Bible and not a voice speaking to you today.

You cannot eliminate God from Scripture.

The author of Scripture is God, and God does not detach Himself from His own Word. God magnifies His word above all His name (Psalms 138:2).

The word of God (the Bible) are the thoughts of God for us. They are spiritual words that can transform your heart.

When we say Sola Scriptura, it is true. It is by Scripture alone because you cannot separate God from His Word. God always abides by His Word. Scripture gives us a proper faith and understanding of God and even salvation by our hearing the Bible (Romans 10:17). God will work by His Spirit to transform your heart, but it is according to His Word. Without that Word, it would not be possible to be saved. God is implied in Scripture. Jesus says if you obey my words, He and the Father will make their abode in you (John 14:23). So yes. It is Scripture alone that leads you to have a relationship with GOD because Scripture is a part of the voice of God. You cannot separate the two. You cannot squeeze God out of the Holy Bible or the Scriptures. They always work together. God always abides by His Word. So it is correct to say “Sola Scriptura” because God created Scripture, and because God moves in harmony with His word (or His voice) expressed in Scripture. When we receive a new heart it is because we acted upon His Word (the Bible). When we are able to walk by His Spirit, it is because we are acting upon His Word. You take away the Scriptures or the Bible, and you got nothing.

Sola scriptura is not a denial of the role of the Holy Spirit in guiding and enlightening the Church.

What then is sola scriptura?

The doctrine of sola scriptura, simply stated, is that the Scriptures and the Scriptures alone are sufficient to function as the regula fide, the “rule of faith” for the Church. All that one must believe to be a Christian is found in Scripture and in no other source. If you try to seek God without the Bible and or leave out the Bible in some way, you are chasing after another God. So it always comes back to the Bible. You cannot escape it. God abides by His Word. You speak of the Bible, you speak of God. The Bible is not a book on how to fix your car. The Bible can actually lead a person to God. But if you don’t have a Bible, you got no faith. You got nothing. Faith cannot be built without the Bible. God gave us the Bible and He wants us to listen to it. He is ever active and presently working with His Word.

A person who tries to make a case for faith without the Bible in some way is straying away from the Bible to seek some other form of communication. The Bible is all the communication we need today. All Scripture is profitable for doctrine. Is an outside voice profitable for doctrine? No. It says Scripture is (2 Timothy 3:16). Is an inner feeling profitable for doctrine? No. It says Scripture is (2 Timothy 3:16). Yes, in the early church: the Holy Spirit worked through men of God to write Scripture, but there are no more words to be added to Holy Scripture. The Bible is complete. The canon is closed. God abides by His Word always and is a part of God. It’s His voice for us today.

God always abides with His Word because He is the author of that Word.

God’s Word does not return unto Him void.


Source used:
Does The Bible Teach Sola Scriptura? | Alpha and Omega Ministries

 

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The point here is that there is no such thing as Scripture alone without God. God created Scripture and He always abides by His Word. His Word does not return void. His Word is a lamp unto my feet and a light unto my path. The Bible is not second place (or rule) in our faith because it reveals the thoughts of God in what He desires us to do. So when we say Scripture alone, God is naturally included in Sola Scriptura.

 

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The Rule of faith and practice
is not scripture alone

PART 1 (Contnued in part 2)

A correction to the “sola scriptura” teaching, which says “scripture ALONE”.

Now, at first glance some may think that I am teaching that scripture is not a rule of faith and practice. I am not quite saying this, I am saying that scripture is not the first primary rule of faith and practice, even though I would say it is the secondary rule. The primary rule of faith and practice is to live and walk and move in the power of the Spirit (Gal. 5:16, 25 Rom. 8:2,5,6,9-16 KJV), in Christ in the new creation (Gal. 6:15,16 KJV) where God dwells in all believers (1 Cor. 3:16, 1 John 4:15 KJV) and where he works in us to will and to do and to make us perfect unto every good work, working in us that which is well pleasing through Jesus Christ (Heb. 13:20,21 Phil 2:13 KJV).

For the church today after the close of the canon, there is no first and then second rule. Both God and Scripture breath together in harmony. The Bible is merely the thoughts of God.

It is the anointing that teaches us all things, (1 John 2:27 KJV) and if any man have not the Spirit of Christ he is none of his (Romans 8:9) and if he does not have the Spirit he cannot know the things of God or the scriptures (1 Cor 2 KJV) . The scriptures were given by the Spirit (2 Timothy 3:16) and no man can even know the scriptures unless they are in the first rule which is to be in the Spirit (Romans 8:9 KJV). If any man have not the Spirit of Christ they are none of his (Romans 8:9 KJV). The Holy Spirit is the one who guides us into all truth (John 16:13 KJV). It is the grace of our Lord that is with our spirit (Philemon 1:25 KJV).

It is true that a person cannot understand Scripture without the Spirit, but God is never leaving Scripture to fly away out into the wind for anyone. God abides by His Word and seeks to convict men of their sins by His Word.

No man can even know the Son of God except the Father reveals him. This inner witness in our spirit is vital to knowing God and living in the spirit.

“no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him.”(John 10:22 KJV)

So, for a man to say “I know who the Son of God is” by scripture "alone" without a spiritual revelation is not accurate.

But Scripture is never an empty dead set of words on a page. God always continues with His Word.

Yes, scripture testifies of the Son of God and Jesus work for salvation and the gospel is according to the scriptures and many prophecies and much more. However, the scriptures were given by the Spirit to the men who testified and who were led to write them. But to know who Jesus is as the Son of God is a revelation of the Father and to know the Father is a revelation of the Son.

I don't think anyone is denying that a person needs God to open a person's eyes to the truth when they read Scripture. Most Christians believe God answers prayers, and gives them understanding. This is in harmony with what His Word says and it is not just a revelation alone.

It is not the scriptures that give an inner witness of themselves, but it is the Spirit that bears witness. The scriptures are able to help us as we have faith in Christ Jesus.

“The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:”(Romans 8:16 KJV)

While the Spirit can bear witness with our spirit that we are the children of God, we also can have an assurance in knowing the Lord if we find that we are keeping His commandments (1 John 2:3). There are certain Christians who say they are children of God, and believe they are abiding in the Spirit, but yet they expose themselves as being not true in the fact that they do not keep His commandments.

Christianity is new life the Spirit of Christ (2 Cor. 3:6, Gal 615,16, John 15.:1-6,2 Cor 13:5 KJV) And true worship is to worship in spirit and in truth (John 4:23 KJV). Unless Jesus is in us and we in him we can do nothing, as Jesus said,

“4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. 5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.”(John 15:4,5 KJV)

No doubt this is true. But we know this fact by Scripture, too.

As highly as I regard the holy scriptures and see them as the secondary rule. I cannot say that they are “alone” the only rule for believers. However, if a man is in Christ he will be led by the Spirit into all truth and this would include the scriptures of truth and the true believer who now is in the Spirit and the faith which is in Christ Jesus can understand the scriptures. We even see this in a favorite verse many quote to teach “sola scriptura”

Scripture is not a secondary rule. It is the one and only primary rule for faith for believers today. The thing is that GOD abides with His Word and seeks to move in a believer's life when they take action upon His Word.

“5 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:”(2 Timothy 3:15,16 KJV)

Here we see that it is by faith in Christ Jesus that any can understand the scriptures. Again the first primary rule is the spirit and to live in faith in Christ.

No. The passage proves that it is the Scriptures that made him wise unto salvation to have faith in Christ Jesus. Nothing about the Spirit alone here.

Paul said

“11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”(1 Cor 2:11-14 KJV)

Yet today man think they can know the things of God without His immediate revelation and Spirit leading them to all truth. Or even if they acknowledge the Holy Spirit guiding them, they still say “sola” scriptura” or scripture alone. I wonder how a person thinks they can know anything of the Spirit unless they are born again and live and move in the spirit. Jesus said ,

Sola Scriptura is not conflict with God revealing His Word to us. God abides with Scripture and He cannot be separated from His Word because they are His thoughts and He seeks to make His Word not to return void. So God is ever present and active in making His Word to come to pass in the hearts of men (When they read it and act upon it). When a person takes action in seeking forgiveness with God, then God transforms their heart spiritually. If the Bible played second fiddle, the Bible would not always be necessary. But God's Word is necessary. It is how we have faith.

“Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”(John 3:3 KJV)

The pharisees had scripture and studied it and could quote many things yet they did not know Jesus in front of them and they did not come to him to have life. They could not see spiritual things. But they could read scripture and study languages and try to understand with their natural carnal mind. They thought (like some today) seem to imply, they had eternal life in the scriptures but Jesus said,

“Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Jesus actually explained to Nicodemus that he was not talking in physical terms but he was speaking in spiritual terms in regards to being born again. So Jesus did not hide this truth from Nicodemus.

40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. “(John 5:39 KJV)

Jesus also said they did not know the scriptures or the power of God (Matt. 22:29 KJV) even though they might have thought they did. They also did not have His word abiding in them

“And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.”(John 5:38 KJV)

The seed is the word of God sown in the hearts of all (Luke 8 Gal.3 1 John 3:9) and is near all (Acts 17 Romans 10: Hebrews 4:12,13 KJV), though not in them or in union with them until they receive him at salvation, this is a great attainment where they will be born again, born from above by the Spirit of God (John 6:63, 1 Peter 1:23, James 1:18 KJV). This inward life is the first rule of Christianity and by which we understand the scriptures. The anointing teaches us all things, and yes all things would include the secondary witness or rule of the scriptures as we are taught by the Spirit.

“ But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.”(1 John 2:27 KJV)

Okay, it is true that a person needs to be born again spiritually to full comprehend God's Word, but Christ draws all men unto Himself so that they can either accept or reject the gospel message of their own free will. The reason they did not believe because the word did not abide in them is to say that they were not obeying God (according to His Word or Scripture).

Jesus one time opened the believers hearts to understand the scriptures. This is still the way men understand scripture

“ And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself....32 And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures?”(Luke 24:27,32 KJV)

Again, there is no denial that God opens understanding of the Scriptures for a person. This was new revelation being revealed about the Son. This event was recorded or immortalized in Scripture that we are reading now. Without this record, we would not know about it. But this is not in conflict with Sola Scriptura because God cannot be cut out or detached from His Word.

Many today try to take out the spiritual aspects of Christianity and reduce it to a intellectual attainment or carnal reasoning with the wisdom of men and excellency of speech. Paul as led by the Spirit rebuked such thinking

“And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God....4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man’s wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power: 5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God... we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery,...But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”(1 Cor 2:1,4-6, 11-14 KJV)

Paul was an apostle. We are not apostles.
Are all who do not demonstrate by the Spirit in power then false brethren? Do all have the same operations of the gifts?

The Primary Rule

To clarify what this first rule is, here are some scriptures.

“15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. 16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.”(Galatians 6:15,16 KJV)

The word “rule” means - “sphere, standard, rod, boundary.”

To live in Christ as a new creation is to live in spiritual life with Jesus Christ in you and the spirit of God leading you and teaching you all things. This is the primary rule. As Paul said. We are to walk according to this rule. And except a man be born again he cannot see spiritually anything of the kingdom.

This is talking about being renewed in your mind and not sinning (See Ephesians 4:23-25). For there is no condemnation to those who in Christ Jesus who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit (Romans 8:1-4). The walking according to the new man or new life is obeying the commandments of Jesus Christ as given to us in Scripture.

“For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.” (Romans 8:14 KJV)

“Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.”(John 16:13 KJV)

This is written for us in Scripture. This showing that the Spirit will guide us into all truth within the Bible (truth). But we first had to act upon the Word (Scripture) in order to be forgiven and given more truth. God can initially give light for a person to see the gospel (in Scripture), but it is up to them if they accept it or not. The rule of faith is their acting upon Scripture. God makes it possible for man to know about His salvation and it is up to man to choose Him according to His Word.

But some seem to say regardless of this,

“We can know all about the things of God by our study of Greek and Hebrew and with our human wisdom in reading other commentaries and with all our human intellect and books."

Yes, I do see that as a problem with certain Christians. But then there are others who claim to have knowledge of the Spirit and yet they also are equally clueless to what a text in the Bible says, too.

The issue they deal with, is that God said they cannot know the things of God unless they are spiritual ( 1 Cor 2 etc) . So again how do they think to understand spiritual scripture if they are not being led by the Spirit of God which is the first primary rule. If they can admit this then they should not use the expression “sola scriptura” or scripture ALONE.

Again, Scripture is never absent from GOD or the working of His Spirit. A person cannot separate GOD from His Word. It's impossible. So when we speak of Scripture, we are automatically by default talking about GOD and His working, too. God's Word will not return void. So it is not wrong for a Christian to claim that they believe in Sola Scriptura (unless they believe that they receive no anointing of the Holy Spirit when it comes to understanding the Scripture).

Jesus also showed a difference of the Old Testament worship and the worship God seeks after.

“But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.”(John 4:23,24 KJV).

PART 1 (Contnued in part 2 and 3)

We abide in His love if we keep His commandments according to His Word (Scripture). This is how we worship God in Spirit and in truth.

 

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Part 2 continued...

THE PERFECTING OF THE SAINTS

In scripture we SEE different ways that God makes believers perfect.

1. God works in them to make them perfect

“Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, 21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.”Hebrews 13:20, 21 JV)

This is the first primary rule of faith and practice to have God in us and working in us and this is where we have the anointing that teaches us all things (1 John 2:27) and Jesus Christ in us ( 2 Cor 13:5 KJV). Without this rule of God in us we cannot know anything.

“15 And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to the which also ye are called in one body; and be ye thankful. 16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you...”(Colossians 3:15, 16 KJV)

The word “rule” here means "to govern" And who cannot say this is the primary rule in our heart in the spirit.?

2. The body of Christ and ministry for the perfecting of the saints.

I showed above, it is God working by the first rule in all believers, then by this rule the body can function and work and Christ effectually worketh in all

“11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: ...15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: 16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.”(Ephesians 4:11-16)

Notice, that Christ works effectually in every part of the body. This is the first rule of God working in individuals and then the body

God works by his spirit in the body of Christ also and this is how he edifies the body and
perfects the saints

3. The scriptures are able to make us perfect unto every good work
THROUGH FAITH which is in Christ Jesus.

“16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.”( 2 Timothy 3:16 KJV)

So in these three ways we see the MORE complete UNDERSTANDING OF THE RULE.

- The primary rule of God is by His Spirit working in us to make us perfect.
- The work of God in the body of believers and the gifts in ministry to each other to perfect the saints
- The Holy scriptures which are able to make us perfect through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

All these work together to make us perfect.

But nothing can happen unless we are in the primary rule of the Spirit and life.

The scriptures don’t of themselves lead us into an action unless we are in faith in Christ. The anointing teaches us of all things and believers are to be led by the Spirit, then the scriptures will work in us, for the word of God works in those who believe (1 Thess 2:13 KJV).

For example, the scriptures teach the various qualifications of an overseer (Bishop) in 1 Timothy 3. But many believers can see such a list and say they meet them. The list itself does not tell you or make you an overseer. Yet, we can know those who are called of God to such a function by examining the sc ripture list there and other places. This is done as we also see them manifest the gifts and call of God. They also hold fast the faithful word and “have the rule” in this respect and have spoken the word of God.

But the scripture in 1 Timothy doesn't itself make them an overseer or "bishop".

We read in scripture that the Holy Ghost made them overseers (Acts 20:28 KJV) This is as believers follow the primary rule of Gods Spirit calling, giving life, empowering, witnessing to our spirit, directing, leading and teaching us all things

So we see that God makes us perfect directly in our hearts, He works in the entire body to perfect the saints and he uses scripture to make us perfect unto every good work. All these work together as the rule of faith and practice. But each in the proper place.

But if some say “sola scriptura” with no clarification. This can led many to deny Gods immediate work and revelation to the heart and the leading of the spirit in all things. Some may go as far as to say God does not speak in any believer today and we can only know God by the scriptures.

Some may think they can know the things of God by simply studying scripture and Greek and Hebrew and human reasoning alone. While it is important to study (2 Timothy 2:15 KJV) this kind of study is to follow the leading of the Spirit and anointing (1 John 2:27, John 16:13 KJV) and what things are freely given to us of God (1 Cor 2:10,12 KJV).

Studying Greek and Hebrews will tell you the meaning of words (and that is good) but it will not tell you the real spiritual meaning of what Jesus is saying. No man knows this but by the Spirit as we read (2 Cor. 2:13,14 KJV).

For example, Jesus said

“Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.”(John 12:24)

A person can study the meaning in Greek of each word and still not know what Jesus is talking about. They may say “well, the word “Verily” in Greek means “firm, trustworthy, etc” or the word “corn” means, “kernal or seed”, or the word, “ground” meaning “earth, land, the solid part of whole terrene globe”. But to know this does not tell you what spiritual truth Jesus is speaking. If we do not see the spiritual we may think Jesus is simply giving advice about farming etc.

I like when Jesus said this and I think it is very applicable today as well,

"In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.”(Luke 10:21 KJV)

If a person could simply study Greek and Hebrews and read the bible and think he is fit for ministry, then any unbeliever could do as much and simply take other men’s words from commentaries or his own speculations and reasonings and piece together a few text and comments and be a minister in an assembly. But this is not the way Christians are to walk, nor the rule of faith and practice.

We see some today who are very similar to the pharisees who seem to deny Gods immediate voice and His Spirit in the heart leading and giving gifts and revelation. From such men we may get many false doctrines and error. In fact, all false doctrine has come out of the men who do not listen to the Spirit and who have not been given things from God and who have been misled by the fleshly mind, doctrines of devils or traditions and commandments of men.

Yes, all spiritual leading and every aspect of our walk must be tried and examined and yes we must appeal to all three aspects of the rule. To God directly, to the body of Christ and the holy scriptures. The witness of all three must be in harmony. But, we do not eliminate God’s Spirit directly and immediately working in us, or the body of Christ and cling to scripture alone. The word “alone” or “solo” is what troubles me, because the pharisees had scripture alone yet without Jesus. It is true they added to scripture many of their own traditions and commandments as many do today as well. But they did not have Jesus word in their hearts. He was not in them and they were not in him for the most part.

But, if we rightly use scripture and the way it is to be understood and applied then it is very profitable and needful.

And remember that no prophecy of scripture is of any private interpretation, but holy men of God spoke) as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

So, to understand the spiritual things they wrote all must be in the Spirit and led by the Spirit.

Continued in part 3...

We are told in Scripture to abide in Jesus and His Words. There are instructions in the Bible in how to abide in God (1 John 2:3-6) (John 14:23). So yes, we do need to have God rule in our life. But this is according to His Word, the Bible. If we abide in God, it is only because we are following the instructions He has given to us by Scripture.

 

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Part 3 continued from part 2...

Objections:

Some will object and say, that Paul is saying that only scripture is able to make us perfect unto every good work and they will quote 2 Timothy 3:16, where it says that the Holy scriptures are able to make us perfect unto all good works. They will stress that there is nothing else.

God abides with His Word. So if one is acting upon His Word, God is going to then work in them and make them perfect along with them obeying His Word or Scripture. So 2 Timothy 3:16-17 is still true. You yourself are quoting Scripture to prove that we need God in our life to be perfect. Scripture covers this point and it was not by some extra biblical means.

Answer: I agree that holy scripture is able to work in those that BELIEVE. But even in the letter to Timothy we read that this is effectual only in those that have faith . Without faith it is impossible to please God. And Christ dwells in the heart by faith. Faith is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen and Christ in you is the hope of glory (Hebrews 11, Colossians 1)

We also read that the primary rule is that God works in us to will and to do and to make us perfect unto every good work, working in us through Jesus Christ (Hebrews 13:20,21 Phi. 2:13 KJV)

So, while scripture (the word of God that is written down when given to men by the Spirit) bears witness with the seed or word sown in the heart ie. Christ the true Light that lighteth every man that cometh into the world, then we see that scripture alone does not make a person perfect unless they are in faith. The word only works in those that believe. Otherwise all the pharisees would have been made perfect by simply reading the scriptures and trying in their best human effort to walk in them and understand them. But they did not do this and they did not hear Jesus voice in their hearts or have His word abiding in them. Jesus also said they did not know the scriptures nor the power of God and they were inwardly ravening from the Spirit though they outwardly appeared righteous to men. They thought they had eternal life in the scriptures, but they did not.

There is no primary rule and secondary rule. There is only one rule and it is the Bible and God operates through the Bible to communicate to us and to get us to surrender to Him and His will whereby we will abide in Him. A primary rule suggests that it is separate from the secondary rule. God does not operate alone outside of His Word, i.e. the Bible. The Bible is not a second on the food chain when it comes to us having faith in God. Everything we know about the faith is from the Bible. God does not give us any other information outside the Bible unless one has joined a cult whereby they have added a new holy book to the Bible.

Objection 2

Some will say, that to put the Spirit of God as the first rule we open up to all sorts of heretics who will say that they hear from God and even though what they say is contrary to scripture.

Answer: No, we can hear what any man says as he claims to be led, but all must be judged. It is judged by the Spirit in our hearts that bears witness, and the body of Christ as a whole who can judge all things that are said (1 Cor 14:29, 1 John 4:1, 1 Cor 5:12, 1 Thess 5:21 KJV)and by the scriptures as well, that will never contradict a person who is truly led by the Spirit. If they do claim spiritual revelation and leadings all must be judged.
If a man is found to be a heretic, reject after the first and second admonition (Titus 3:10 KJV). And yes, all three aspects of the rule are needed. God leading in the anointing which teaches us all things, the body of Christ and the holy scriptures.

But new revelations have ceased. The canon is closed. No new words are to be added. New revelation or prophecy would be words of God that should be written down as Scripture. But we do not need new revelation. We have the Bible and it is all that is necessary for doctrine, and instruction in righteousness.

Objection 3:

But if you claim an immediate leading of the Spirit and God working in you, you would have to add any words and leading of men today to the scriptures.

Answer: No, this is not the case. Many things were said by Jesus that are not written down and many had prophecies that are not written down and other words from God and leading's in their life. If we are led by the Spirit we are the sons of God, if not we are in darkness. If we live in the Spirit let us also walk in the Spirit.

We do not add to scripture . God only chose certain men to write scripture and certain words to put in scripture. But God has spoke though all believers and works in all believers..

Even the closed canon we believe by faith.

God chose not to write those things down for a reason. We have the knowledge that we need with the Holy Bible. Just as Adam and Eve were limited knowledge, and God did not want them to have the knowledge of good and evil, God is calling men of God to take comfort in not knowing more than what God has given them already. Besides, men have lost their voice because they added to Scripture or the Bible (See Revelation 22:18-19). This kind of plague was from other OT books and not Revelation.

A summary

The scriptures testify of Jesus and are given by the Spirit, but they are not Jesus himself. Just by reading the scriptures doesn’t mean a person hears God’s word or have the Spirit revealing spiritual things to them.

The Pharisees thought they were right with God and they thought they had eternal life in the scriptures but they didn’t (John 5:39 KJV). Jesus said they did not know the scriptures or the power of God . They did not even know the Lord in front of them, the Word made flesh. They also did not have his word abiding in them (John 5:38 KJV).

Men all through history have often missed the spiritual understanding of things. This is obvious in many of the things they say and do and in their understanding the doctrine. They often cling to the natural and human reasoning. But, If just reading scriptures with the natural mind made someone hear God’s word and be a minister then all the Pharisees would have heard and known God’s word by their reading scripture alone.

But instead we read

John 8 :43,47 KJV “ Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.. He that is of God heareth God’s words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.”

This was spoken to those who had scriptures and read them and who had even heard His voice audibly, but did not hear His word...

Obviously by their simply by reading scripture did not mean they heard Gods word .


I welcome any discussion on this and comments.

God bless

No. It was men's disobedience to the commands of our Lord that men did not hear. Sin blinded them to His Word because they were justifying sin in their life. If a person follows the Bible exactly, they will abide in Jesus. You are trying to separate God out of the Scriptures when they actually breath in harmony together. The Scriptures are the mind of God and they are our instructions to have a right relationship with Him.

 

[LoveofTruth]

"If the Bible played second fiddle, the Bible would not always be necessary. But God's Word is necessary. It is how we have faith.

Hello Jason God bless.

Lots to discuss. I will take smaller sections to look at. I am busy today I'll try to get back later.


I am by no means saying the holy scriptures are a second fiddle or not a rule or somehow not profitable today and all men should do is listen to God inwardly. Even a fiddler must have a ability to play the fiddle and some natural ability before he can play the sheet music of the fiddle.Some have played music and couldn't read sheet music.

I spoke of the use of scripture in my post and their importance and use along with the Primary rule of God working in men by His Spirit and through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All the three aspects of being made perfect work in harmony and do not contradict. That is, if men do indeed have the scriptures or the body of Christ then they can walk in harmony with them. If they do not have the scriptures and are not connected directly to the body of Christ God can still work in them and help them and they can have life as many scriptures testify to. Consider all the men who had no scriptures before Moses and beyond and even until to day. Do we say they were all lost and God could not reach then or work work in them? I think of a believer who is put in prison alone with no other believers till his death. Is he now not able to have faith and walk with God because he cannot read scriptures. Or, I think of a retarded person who cannot read or write and is alone somewhere. Or the many people who were on the earth before any scripture was written. But this is a long discussion of how God reaches the uneveangelized. It is connected to the mystery of Christ and for another post perhaps.

But the three ways God can makes us perfect I spoke of already 1. By God directly in us working (which is the primary rule) 2. by the body of Christ and Christ effectual working in every part and from whom came the scriptures of the New Testament, 3. By the Holy scriptures which are able to make us perfect through faith (first) which is IN CHRIST JESUS This is obvious or else the pharisees by simply reading the scriptures as they did would have heard God's voice and would have had faith. But they did not hear God's voice or His word or have faith and inwardly they were ravening from the Spirit (which is the first and initial rule and witness in their heart.

You know that I see the true Light that lighteh every man that cometh into the world (John 1:9) is the first rule or witness to all men from Adam and to all without the scriptures from Adam to Moses and beyond from Moses with scripture until today. All have this true Light which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. Though not all are in that Light or have the new birth until they receive him in their hearts. This true Light is the life and light of men, This true Light is the Word of God that is God. This is not speaking of the scripture here or else men would have to worship the Bible as God. This is not the case we do not worship the holy scriptures as God. I am not trying to separate God's word from scripture. But I am showing the truth of the word as a seed sown in the heart, this is the true Light that lighteth every man with or without scripture.

I see this true Light as the free gift that came upon ALL men everywhere on the Earth purchased for them in time by Jesus Christ and his death on the cross burrial and resurrection for all. God was able to give men this free gift before Christ came in the Old Testament but only because Jesus Christ would come in the future. God calls those things that aren't as though they were. But they could not enter into the fulness without us and they were in a place called Abraham's Bosom until Christ accomplished the work for them, then he led captivity captive.

Even the Gentiles God can reach and witness to by the primary rule ALL over the entire earth as we read in Romans 2:14,15 We see that God would judge the "secrets of men" one day. So even if they don't have scriptures or the law (scriptures) God is able to work in them in the secret part. David also spoke of God desiring truth in the inward and hidden parts (Psalm 51) I speak again of the mystery here, which is vital to this entire discussion But consider that the Gentiles did not have the law (or the written scriptures) and yet God is able to witness to them and speak to their hearts by His inner witness of the seed, word, true Light, the truth they hold in unrighteousness. This witness in their heart shines and is called the work of the law written in their hearts. This is the way God deals with all men both Jew and Gentile since the beginning. The word is nigh or close unto all men (Deuterononmy 30:9- with Romans 10).

But I am pointing to the first primary rule, which is The Spirit of God and to be in Christ walking and living in the new creation where God works in us to will and to do and to make us perfect unto every good work

Abraham and others were in the "primary rule" through faith and had no scripture yet

We see men like Abraham, Noah, and many others who God worked in and who had faith before and without scripture being written down yet. Paul even uses Abraham as an example of a man with faith before the law was given (before scripture was written) and before circumcision. Part of his reason for doing this was to point to the fact that a man can be justified without the works of the law and that it is a spiritual life in faith where believers live. If we say that without the bible no man can have faith and that it is necessary to be saved and have faith "alone". Then we miss the inner working of God by His true Light in all men and this is where men hear the word of God inwardly. The word is a seed sown in the heart Abraham also had this seed (Christ) in him as Galatians 3 speaks of. This is the same seed in all believers today. This would be the first and primary rule. Then from that life in Christ men spoke forth the scriptures by the Spirit of God and wrote them down. You cannot have the scriptures first before the Spirit of God was working in their hearts. This is the primary rule again as I have been showing. But in the case of Abraham and others before the law (scriptures) were written we see men having faith and salvation and Christ in them, Paul said,

"9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. 10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision. 11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also: 12 And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised. 13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect: 15 Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression. 16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,"(Romans 4:9-16)

We also read that Christ dwells in the heart by faith

Ephesians 3:17
That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith;..."

And so all Old testament saints who did not have scripture yet could still have faith and could still have the true Light which lighteth every man that cometh into the world in them and guiding them. This is the seed or word sown in their hearts which is Christ in them the hope of glory. Faith is the substance of things "hoped for" the EVIDENCE of things not seen. Christ in you is the hope of glory

Consider that some of these men did not have scriptures yet but they had faith (ie. Christ dwelling in their hearts)

Hebrews 11

"1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good report. 3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. 4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh. 5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God. 6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. 7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith. 8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. 9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: 10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God. 11 Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised. 12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable."(Hebrews 11:1-12 KJV)

Talk soon I have to step out

God bless