Absolute Predestination

[YeshuaFan]

One must choose to put to death the deeds of the body, by the Spirit.



For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. Romans 8:13



JLB

We must agree with Goid that died in Christ, and are now made alive in him!

 

[YeshuaFan]

No, rather its paul telling us that even Christians must relying upon the Holy Spirit to be able to live as we ought to be now as saved!

Don't you know by now after reading posts that Romans 7 is about those UNDER the law BEFORE Christ? Read Romans 7 in context, starting with verse 7 at the latest and on through Romans 8:9. It is a contrast between the Law vs. Spirit. Ignorant people set on justifying their Spiritless struggle with sin choose to take Romans 7 out of context and just focus on verses 14-23.

Paul in Chapter 7 delighted in the law of God, wanted to keep it, but was powerless to do that, and no sinner delights in the law of God!@

 

[ChurchMilitant]

How is absolute predestination affirmed when there are many scriptures warning believers if they partake in works of the flesh, they will lose salvation, and when there are multiple passages that affirm the view that even those graced with faith will fall away?

 

[YeshuaFan]

How is absolute predestination affirmed when there are many scriptures warning believers if they partake in works of the flesh, they will lose salvation, and when there are multiple passages that affirm the view that even those graced with faith will fall away?

There NO passages in the scriptures that indicate real Christians can lose eternal life now have in Christ!

 

[EmSw]

The only reason we are not cannibals is because God withholds us from the depths of our sin.

Why would God ordain you to be a cannibal?

And, if He did ordain you to be a cannibal, why in the world do you pray for Him not to lead you into temptation? Are you trying to Him to change His mind?

 

[EmSw]

“Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.” (Romans 3:20)

Perhaps you need about the people justified in the OT.

Ezekiel 18
4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
5 But if a man be just, and do that which is lawful and right,
6 And hath not eaten upon the mountains, neither hath lifted up his eyes to the idols of the house of Israel, neither hath defiled his neighbour's wife, neither hath come near to a menstruous woman,
7 And hath not oppressed any, but hath restored to the debtor his pledge, hath spoiled none by violence, hath given his bread to the hungry, and hath covered the naked with a garment;
8 He that hath not given forth upon usury, neither hath taken any increase, that hath withdrawn his hand from iniquity, hath executed true judgment between man and man,
9 Hath walked in my statutes, and hath kept my judgments, to deal truly; he is just, he shall surely live, saith the Lord God.

 

[EmSw]

God created all things, but He did not cause/force satan or Adam to Fall!

So, you don't really believe God ordained all things.

 

[YeshuaFan]

Perhaps you need about the people justified in the OT.

Ezekiel 18
4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
5 But if a man be just, and do that which is lawful and right,
6 And hath not eaten upon the mountains, neither hath lifted up his eyes to the idols of the house of Israel, neither hath defiled his neighbour's wife, neither hath come near to a menstruous woman,
7 And hath not oppressed any, but hath restored to the debtor his pledge, hath spoiled none by violence, hath given his bread to the hungry, and hath covered the naked with a garment;
8 He that hath not given forth upon usury, neither hath taken any increase, that hath withdrawn his hand from iniquity, hath executed true judgment between man and man,
9 Hath walked in my statutes, and hath kept my judgments, to deal truly; he is just, he shall surely live, saith the Lord God.

The ONLY way that any sinner, in either OT/NT times, could be justified by God would be due to the Cross of Cgrist, as none will be justified by their own efforts/works!

 

[EmSw]

NONE of us can ever keep the law well enough to merit being saved by that!

Where do you find keeping the law 'well enough'?

Are you saying you covet your neighbor's wife just enough that you aren't keeping that commandment 'well enough'? How does one not murder 'well enough'?

 

[YeshuaFan]

So, you don't really believe God ordained all things.

Yes, but I do not see God being sovereign over all things mean that he directly determined and caused all things to happen!

 

[YeshuaFan]

Where do you find keeping the law 'well enough'?

Are you saying you covet your neighbor's wife just enough that you aren't keeping that commandment 'well enough'? How does one not murder 'well enough'?

The standard God establiished for keeping the law is perfectly, as well as jesus Himself did, and NONE can qualify on that basis!

 

[Dave L]

Perhaps you need about the people justified in the OT.

Ezekiel 18
4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
5 But if a man be just, and do that which is lawful and right,
6 And hath not eaten upon the mountains, neither hath lifted up his eyes to the idols of the house of Israel, neither hath defiled his neighbour's wife, neither hath come near to a menstruous woman,
7 And hath not oppressed any, but hath restored to the debtor his pledge, hath spoiled none by violence, hath given his bread to the hungry, and hath covered the naked with a garment;
8 He that hath not given forth upon usury, neither hath taken any increase, that hath withdrawn his hand from iniquity, hath executed true judgment between man and man,
9 Hath walked in my statutes, and hath kept my judgments, to deal truly; he is just, he shall surely live, saith the Lord God.

Keeping the law is the evidence of the new birth. Not the means of salvation.

 

[EmSw]

The ONLY way that any sinner, in either OT/NT times, could be justified by God would be due to the Cross of Cgrist, as none will be justified by their own efforts/works!

Why are you saying the OT, when what was written in Ezekiel means nothing to you?

 

[Dave L]

Why would God ordain you to be a cannibal?

And, if He did ordain you to be a cannibal, why in the world do you pray for Him not to lead you into temptation? Are you trying to Him to change His mind?

Our prayers are part of God's plan for us. They align us with all that God ordained for us.

 

[EmSw]

Yes, but I do not see God being sovereign over all things mean that he directly determined and caused all things to happen!

You are the first Calvinist I've seen who says God is not sovereign over everything.

 

[YeshuaFan]

Why are you saying the OT, when what was written in Ezekiel means nothing to you?

None have ever been justified by God that was not done thru the Cross of Christ!

 

[YeshuaFan]

You are the first Calvinist I've seen who says God is not sovereign over everything.

He is, but again, not an an absolute determined situation, as that would be Allah of the koran, not Yahweh of the Bible!

 

[EmSw]

The standard God establiished for keeping the law is perfectly, as well as jesus Himself did, and NONE can qualify on that basis!

Unbelievable! Where do you find God saying anywhere to keep the law 'perfectly'? Must you add to the Bible to justify your belief?

Are you desperately trying to find right now? Stop your searach; you won't find it.

 

[EmSw]

He is, but again, not an an absolute determined situation, as that would be Allah of the koran, not Yahweh of the Bible!

I guess most Calvinists believe in Allah then. Do they know God is not totally sovereign?

 

[EmSw]

Keeping the law is the evidence of the new birth. Not the means of salvation.

So a murderer who is put into prison, and does not murder anymore is born again?

So Dave, if you lie, does that show you aren't born again?