Sexual Chastity and Liberals

[joshua 1 9]

The Lord taught us to be sexually chaste, but liberals seem to be promoting a message of sexual permissiveness. What do you think the Lord thinks of this?

Rehab was a prostitute and the scarlet thread points to the Blood line of Jesus.

James 2:25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction?

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God before you. 32 For John came to you in a righteous way and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and prostitutes did." Matthew 21:31

 

[Dave-W]

I believe there is more proof that a celibate person can serve a better role in Christianity than a married one.

Depends on the role. How can a single person be the picture of Christ and the Church that Paul wrote about?

 

[Paidiske]

If you're going to introduce people to the love of God, you're also responsible for telling them what God despises, and offering them the best possible way to live their lives (which God has given us).

I'm not sure I agree. Growing as a Christian is a process. I don't think it is helpful to start people off on that process with a list of things God despises; on the whole, I think it's better to start people off with things that will draw them closer to God; developing a prayer life, learning to be part of a Christian community, beginning to read the Scriptures for themselves. It's my experience that as they grow, God will convict them about what they need convicting about.

I have honestly never, ever met a gay person who hasn't heard that Christians believe they're going to hell. I don't need to tell them that. I need to tell them that that's not actually what God wants for them, and that there is another way; and helping them start on that way. Once they have a relationship with God, I can trust God to be at work in that. I don't need to be condemnatory.

 

[Dave-W]

That celibacy is preferable if one is in control of their passion.

No - it is preferable ONLY if God gave you that supernatural gift.

 

[TuxAme]

Rehab was a prostitute and the scarlet thread points to the Blood line of Jesus.

James 2:25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction?

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God before you. 32 For John came to you in a righteous way and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and prostitutes did." Matthew 21:31

Do you think that God is going to allow unrepentant prostitutes and tax collectors into the kingdom of God? Or does being welcomed into the Kingdom require repentance and obedience to the Commandments?

 

[Sam91]

I wonder if celibacy can become a source of pride? I am celibate for the record. I do not desire nor want a future relationship.

However, there are many benefits to a Christian in learning to love another and both of them serving and praying as a unit. They learn tolerance, so many things a single Christian can only learn at a slower pace and through more trials.

Even in a not so ideal marraige it can be an impetous to make someone cling to the Lord.

 

[TuxAme]

I'm not sure I agree. Growing as a Christian is a process. I don't think it is helpful to start people off on that process with a list of things God despises; on the whole, I think it's better to start people off with things that will draw them closer to God; developing a prayer life, learning to be part of a Christian community, beginning to read the Scriptures for themselves. It's my experience that as they grow, God will convict them about what they need convicting about.

I have honestly never, ever met a gay person who hasn't heard that Christians believe they're going to hell. I don't need to tell them that. I need to tell them that that's not actually what God wants for them, and that there is another way; and helping them start on that way. Once they have a relationship with God, I can trust God to be at work in that. I don't need to be condemnatory.

"Growth is a process" isn't an excuse for someone to remain in sin until they're
"personally convicted" that they need to change, and that doesn't excuse you or anyone else from telling them that they need to change.

How are they going to grow at all if you, someone mature in the faith, won't offer them correction? They won't- as long as you hide the Truth from them, their spiritual life will be stunted.

 

[Yarddog]

The Lord taught us to be sexually chaste, but liberals seem to be promoting a message of sexual permissiveness. What do you think the Lord thinks of this?

Liberals message of sexual permissiveness? Conservatives fail to practice what they preach. Trump is the poster boy for sexual permissiveness. Lol

 

[TuxAme]

Liberals message of sexual permissiveness? Conservatives fail to practice what they preach. Trump is the poster boy for sexual permissiveness. Lol

Was it theological conservatism that resulted in birth control becoming largely acceptable in protestantism last century, or theological liberalism? Was it a desire to adhere to the "old ways" that led to sexual promiscuity, or a desire to embrace a "new way"?

 

[Paidiske]

"Growth is a process" isn't an excuse for someone to remain in sin until they're
"personally convicted" that they need to change, and that doesn't excuse you or anyone else from telling them that they need to change.

How are they going to grow at all if you, someone mature in the faith, won't offer them correction? They won't- as long as you hide the Truth from them, their spiritual life will be stunted.

And how many people are you pastorally responsible for, that you speak with such vast personal experience?

I'm not saying that I'd tell people they don't need to change; quite the opposite. What I'm saying is that starting a baby Christian off with a list of demands they don't yet feel competent to meet isn't helpful. (After all, if someone were to hand you a list of your sins today, and tell you that to be a Christian, you must have them all sorted by tomorrow, how would you feel?) That way often leads to despair and hopelessness. It's better to encourage what's good, to offer a little correction at a time as I discern is appropriate and helpful for this person, rather than to go in with a predetermined list of what I expect this person to change immediately. It just doesn't work like that for most people.

 

[dreadnought]

Well, that wouldn't be my approach either. But you asked what I thought, so I told you what I thought; we obsess too much about sex, and too little about proclaiming the good news.

If other pastors are preaching a message I consider poor, my job isn't to condemn them but to continue to be faithful to my own task.

It isn't an obsession. Preachers are going in front of congregations and saying there is nothing wrong with homosexuality. Indeed, they are vilifying those of us who stand by the Lord's commandments. In February they meet to decide the fate of the United Methodist Church because of this one issue.

 

[JackRT]

I believe there is more proof that a celibate person can serve a better role in Christianity than a married one.

I'm not convinced of that.

 

[dreadnought]

If all could do that the Church would have been fewer in number and all the devout would have had no offspring.

So rather those who are set apart to be so should be.

Another point. In having a partner one learns how to love others when they are at there most difficult. They can learn how to co-operate. They can learn how to keep focus on the Lord through distraction etc.

I was just responding your comment that "I, however, consider how much more a husband and wife could do."

 

[dreadnought]

Rehab was a prostitute and the scarlet thread points to the Blood line of Jesus.

James 2:25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction?

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God before you. 32 For John came to you in a righteous way and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and prostitutes did." Matthew 21:31

Are you then saying that chastity is an evil thing?

 

[Sam91]

And how many people are you pastorally responsible for, that you speak with such vast personal experience?

I'm not saying that I'd tell people they don't need to change; quite the opposite. What I'm saying is that starting a baby Christian off with a list of demands they don't yet feel competent to meet isn't helpful. (After all, if someone were to hand you a list of your sins today, and tell you that to be a Christian, you must have them all sorted by tomorrow, how would you feel?) That way often leads to despair and hopelessness. It's better to encourage what's good, to offer a little correction at a time as I discern is appropriate and helpful for this person, rather than to go in with a predetermined list of what I expect this person to change immediately. It just doesn't work like that for most people.

You have a point from a human perspective but Jesus did say 'go sin no more'. He also gave us a Helper in order to empower us do that. (Not that we do). However, when walking still in continual, willful sin how are they going be able to pray, walk in the Spirit? I know I can't when disobedient to God.

It is like having one hand on the plough and looking back. When are they reborn?

 

[Paidiske]

It isn't an obsession. Preachers are going in front of congregations and saying there is nothing wrong with homosexuality. Indeed, they are vilifying those of us who stand by the Lord's commandments. In February they meet to decide the fate of the United Methodist Church because of this one issue.

The Anglicans have their own version of this issue.

Neither you nor I can bend an entire denomination to our will. Each of us must learn to be faithful in whatever circumstances we find ourselves.

 

[Paidiske]

You have a point from a human perspective but Jesus did say 'go sin no more'. He also gave us a Helper in order to empower us do that. (Not that we do). However, when walking still in continual, willful sin how are they going be able to pray, walk in the Spirit?

I'm saying it's a process. I can trust God to be at work in that process. I don't have to try to control it.

 

[dreadnought]

No - it is preferable ONLY if God gave you that supernatural gift.

First, I wouldn't call it "supernatural."

Second, you ignored the part of my statement stating "if one is in control of their passion."

 

[Stabat Mater dolorosa]

Sure. But I guess my point is, what should we focus on? Introducing people to the love of God, or worrying about what they do in bed? I'd suggest that if we spend too much time and energy on the latter, we'll miss opportunities for the former.

You need to work on your perception of what constitutes the Christian faith, I think your lack of a holistic understading of the faith is quite stunning.

There is a reason catechumens were teached the faith prior to their baptism in the early church and still does so in the Catholic Church as well as the Orthodox Church.

Ethics cannot be separated from a life in Christ. There is one faith, one Lord and creed. The faith is metaphysical and should be the cornerstone of any believers actions and life as a whole. It cannot be fractured as to only apply to parts of our lives.
It a package deal.

 

[dreadnought]

Liberals message of sexual permissiveness? Conservatives fail to practice what they preach. Trump is the poster boy for sexual permissiveness. Lol

Yes, liberals are promoting homosexuality.