God's creation Timeline refutes evolution

[RealityCheck01]

False, since that is the dating given by Archbishop James Ussher of Armaugh, Ireland in the mid 1600s. ..

15 August 2018 Aman777: Ignorance that the date I gave from James Ussher is not supported by Scripture or science or history.
The estimates (plural) of the date of the Biblical creation include around 6 pm on 22 October 4004 BC (by Archbishop James Ussher of Armaugh, Ireland in the mid 1600s). That estimate is used the generations listed in Scripture. The science used is basic (the average length of a generation where it is not stated in Scripture). The history is there but dubious: count back from Jesus when his dates are not well established.

The context was Minky's imaginary "timeline". That timeline is imaginary because the estimates of the date of the Biblical creation are falsified by the empirical evidence that you trust as in your OP.

Take a person who trusted the 13.7 billion year age of the universe, 4.6 billion year age of the earth, ~0.4 million year evolution of Homo Sapiens, etc. If they also have faith in the literal truth of the Bible then they have an enormous problem with the listed generations and Genesis. The generations only go back to ~4000 BC. The Bible states that Homo Sapiens has only existed for ~6000 years when the empirical evidence is ~400,000 years.

It gets worse! If that person also trusts in the current and historical length of generations then those generations make Homo Sapiens exist for< 6000 years (maybe 4000?).

 

[Aman777]

Years, you say? What has been their response?

Crickets....

 

[Aman777]

There is no anomaly... that's the point.

I don't believe you can support that view scientifically. If you could, you would have done it with an image of the northern part of Lake Van, Turkey. Still waiting.........

 

[RealityCheck01]

Nothing personal but all of your views are Un-Scriptural.
...

16 August 2018 Aman777: Please give the verse containing "23 Billion years ago" when God spoke from Scripture, e.g. what verse in Genesis?

16 August 2018 Aman777: A "satanic" assertion about evolution insulting the Christians who worked on evolution and trust the empirical evidence and theory of evolution.
The majority of scientists who took the enormous body of empirical evidence for evolution and formed the theory of evolution that explains that evidence were Christians. Even today, a good proportion of scientists are Christians.
Level of support for evolution

Nearly all (around 97%) of the scientific community accepts evolution as the dominant scientific theory of biological diversity.[1][2]

The Catholic Church does not reject evolution.

 

[Aman777]

15 August 2018 Aman777: Ignorance that the date I gave from James Ussher is not supported by Scripture or science or history.
The estimates (plural) of the date of the Biblical creation include around 6 pm on 22 October 4004 BC (by Archbishop James Ussher of Armaugh, Ireland in the mid 1600s). That estimate is used the generations listed in Scripture. The science used is basic (the average length of a generation where it is not stated in Scripture). The history is there but dubious: count back from Jesus when his dates are not well established.

Amen. Only the Christians of the last days before Jesus returns have the "increased knowledge" to unlock God's Truth in Scripture. Daniel 12:4

The context was Minky's imaginary "timeline". That timeline is imaginary because the estimates of the date of the Biblical creation are falsified by the empirical evidence that you trust as in your OP.

False since God has but 7 Days/Ages in the creation of the perfect Heaven. We live today at Genesis 1:27 on the 6th Day because God the Trinity is STILL creating people in His Image, which is to be born again Spiritually and Eternally in Christ. The prophecy of Gen 1:28-31 is yet to be fulfilled and happens AFTER Jesus returns at the Rapture.

Take a person who trusted the 13.7 billion year age of the universe, 4.6 billion year age of the earth, ~0.4 million year evolution of Homo Sapiens, etc. If they also have faith in the literal truth of the Bible then they have an enormous problem with the listed generations and Genesis. The generations only go back to ~4000 BC. The Bible states that Homo Sapiens has only existed for ~6000 years when the empirical evidence is ~400,000 years.

It's because the lineage is not based on physical qualities since flesh is dead to God. The only listings are of those people who have been born Spiritually in Christ. Since the lost are not listed, it's impossible to truly understand God's dating of the ancestors of Jesus.

It gets worse! If that person also trusts in the current and historical length of generations then those generations make Homo Sapiens exist for< 6000 years (maybe 4000?).

What Science has misunderstood is that the sons of God (prehistoric people) were NOT Humans (descendants of Adam) until Noah's grandsons, with NO other Human to marry, married and produced children with prehistoric women. It happened on Adam's Earth the same way. Genesis 6:4

The problem is NOT with what the Bible actually says, but seeing it through the eyes of ancient men is NOT what God wrote. It's what ancient men, who lived thousands of years before Science, THOUGHT it said. God hid His scientific Truth in Genesis in front of everyone's eyes, knowing only the Christians of the last days, would have the increased knowledge to understand God's intelligence level. It's proof of the literal God IF you have the proper interpretation which AGREES with Science and History. That's because there is but ONE Truth and it's God's Truth. God Bless you

 

[RealityCheck01]

I don't believe you can support that view scientifically. If you could, you would have done it with an image of the northern part of Lake Van, Turkey. Still waiting.........

You have the burden of proof reversed,
Aman777: I have a unsupported Adam's firmament story.
Others: Support your story with evidence.
Still waiting........
15 August 2018 Aman777: Give the Biblical statement of the size of the firmament being only 75 miles wide.

Your full story is:

Adam's firmament was only miles wide since it fit into Lake Van, Turkey, which is only 75 miles wide. When the windows on top of the solid firmament were opened, it rained for 40 days and nights and the bottom of the firmament sank, leaving the 450 ft long covered Ark in the Lake. I picture the firmament more like a Submarine instead of an Aircraft since it protected Adam's Earth for billions of years from the water which totally surrounded Adam's firmament. Genesis 1:6-7

The next posts suggest that your story includes the firmament is still in the lake.
16 August 2018 Aman777: Give your scientific evidence that a firmament is in Lake Van, Turkey.

16 August 2018 Aman777: Give the Biblical verse stating that the Ark is in Lake Van, Turkey.

16 August 2018 Aman777: Give your scientific evidence that the Ark is in Lake Van, Turkey.

16 August 2018 Aman777: How did a firmament 75 miles wide protect "Adam's Earth" (the same size as the Earth?).

 

[Aman777]

16 August 2018 Aman777: Please give the verse containing "23 Billion years ago" when God spoke from Scripture, e.g. what verse in Genesis?

Sure. It is based on the Scriptural Fact that Jesus made our cosmos on the 3rd Day Gen 2:7 AND today is the 6th Day. Science agrees that our cosmos began 13.8 Billion years ago, in man's time. Divide 13.8 Billion years by 3 and you can round it off to be 4.5 Billion years, in man's time for EACH of God's Days/Ages. This formula fits the timeline of Genesis, so add 9 Billion years for the first 2 Days of creation and you get God's Time in man's years at some 23 Billion years ago, in man's time, for the first Day when Jesus came forth into the physical world.

16 August 2018 Aman777: A "satanic" assertion about evolution insulting the Christians who worked on evolution and trust the empirical evidence and theory of evolution.
The majority of scientists who took the enormous body of empirical evidence for evolution and formed the theory of evolution that explains that evidence were Christians. Even today, a good proportion of scientists are Christians.

I don't mean to insult anyone BUT evolution is nothing more than changes in genetics in a population over time or descent with modification within His and Their kinds. Just because someone changed the names doesn't change God's Truth. God told us this more than 3k years ago and evolutionists theorized their view less than 200 years ago.

The Catholic Church does not reject evolution.

Some people also bow before a graven image and some worship stumps, trees and even Cows. Amen?

 

[Aman777]

The next posts suggest that your story includes the firmament is still in the lake.

16 August 2018 Aman777: Give your scientific evidence that a firmament is in Lake Van, Turkey.

You will have to wait until Science or some TV Evangelist finds it.

16 August 2018 Aman777: Give the Biblical verse stating that the Ark is in Lake Van, Turkey.

Sure, but there are two of them. Genesis 7:20 states that the Ark was above the mountains on Adam's Earth....AND.....resting upon the mountains of Ararat on the SAME 150th day after the flood began. Genesis 8:4 IOW, Adam's Earth disappeared on the same 24 hour period the Ark appeared in the mountains of Ararat. Give us YOUR view of HOW that could happen. Amen?

16 August 2018 Aman777: Give your scientific evidence that the Ark is in Lake Van, Turkey.

Where did the Raven go since he didn't return to the Ark?

Gen 8:7 And he sent forth a raven, which went forth to and fro, until the waters were dried up from off the earth.

How long does it take for some 5 miles of water to go into space? and why is there no evidence of this happening. The raven flew to shore and so did the Dove a week later and brought back an Olive leaf which obviously germinated, grew limbs and then leaves for the Dove to pick off in only 7 days? Something is wrong with the interpretation of the flood. Can you tell us WHY?

16 August 2018 Aman777: How did a firmament 75 miles with protect "Adam's Earth" (the same size as the Waeth.

Adam's entire universe was placed under water on the 2nd Day. Gen 1:6-8
The miles wide firmament protected the flat Earth of Adam from the water which was above and below the firmament. God brought Adam's firmament to Lake Van, Turkey in the mountains of Ararat in order to bring Human civilization to our Earth. Noah's grandsons married and spread Humanity over the whole face of our Planet from Babel. Adam's Earth was totally destroyed BUT his superior intelligence, which is like God's, Gen 3:22 was inherited by the prehistoric people (sons of God) on our Earth. Today, there are some 7 Billion Humans (descendants of Adam) on our Earth. God's Truth agrees with every discovery of Science and History. Amen?

 

[RealityCheck01]

Contrary to popular belief, radiometric dating may not be entirely accurate. Here's why:

16 August 2018 Minky: Obvious AIG lies about radiometric dating.
That is AIG stupidity about an "unobserved past", geologists have to exist when rocks form, and obvious lies.

1. A lie that lava has to have its eruption age.
   A volcano ejects existing magma from deep in the Earth, not newly created rock. An eruption today will have lava that can have an age of millions of years.
2. A "no contamination" assumption lie.
   Geologists look at contamination as in the first sentence in that section ("The problems with contamination, as with inheritance, are already well-documented in the textbooks on radioactive dating of rocks") !
   Contamination is especially considered in radiocarbon dating.
3. A "Constant Decay Rate" assumption lie.
   Physicists have tested decay rates for the last 100 year and found them to be constant.
   That has been verified by carbon dating samples with known ages, e.g. trees dated via tree rings that go back 8,000 years.
   There is general assumption that the laws of physics are constant until evidence shows that they are not. Physicists look for evidence that the laws governing physics such as decay rates, have been different in the past and find not big changes for billions of years ! Oklo natural nuclear reactor. Time-variation of fundamental constants.

Radiometric dating is accurate enough date terrestrial samples from decades to 4.374 ±0.006 billion years.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Since we STILL live on the 6th Day/Age of creation .....

Nothing to do with:
15 August 2018 Aman777: A "yown" is billions of years fantasy when the full context in Genesis gives 24 hour days.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Be nice or I will report you calling me a liar. ...

I did not call you a liar, your post contains an obvious lie. Where you got that lie from is unknown. It may be parroting from another resource. It may be a fantasy that Adam and his descendants (us ) are not human. It may be a fantasy that Adam was a chimp or human/chimp hybrid or something else. It may be an fantasy that the Bible lies when it states Adam was the first man.

In any case, the empirical evidence is that we and chimpanzees are "cousins". Thus:
15 August 2018 Aman777: A "sons of God (Prehistoric people) diverged from Chimps" lie (we are "cousins").

 

[RealityCheck01]

...You are confusing Adam's Earth, which was totally destroyed in the flood, 2Pet 3:6 with the present Earth.

Yet another unsupported fantasy so:
16 August 2016 Aman777: Give the Biblical verse that states "Adam's Earth" was totally destroyed in the flood and replaced with another "earth".

That is not what Noah's story says. There are fairy stories that the flood remade the surface of the Earth but how does Eden, etc. get described using post-flood rivers and countries?

Peter was not present during the flood (2 Peter 3). Peter writes "By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed". That is a flood destroying the world of man, not a total destruction of the Earth or replacement with another.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Not according to Scripture and Astronomy since the FIRST Stars did NOT appear until the 4th Day, which was millions of years AFTER the Big Bang.

16 August 2018 Aman777: A "Not according to Scripture" fantasy since the Bible does not say the first stars appeared 200 billion years after the Big Bang.
Genesis 1
God created the Earth on day 3 and made the Sun, Moon and stars on day 4.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Sure it does since God created air, dust and water BEFORE the first day. Gen 1:1 Everything which was made by Jesus was made from these 3 creation elements. Try again?

16 August 2018 Aman777: The cited Genesis 1:1 makes "created air, dust and water BEFORE the first day" wrong.
There are no actions before the first day. On day 1 a formless and void "earth" is created. Genesis 1 does not have God creating air or dust on specific days. Presumably created when God made "grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree" on day 3 because they need air and soil ("dust") to grow.
Try again after reading Genesis again.

But this is where your imaginary time line goes even more wrong! Fruit trees are flowering plants usually needing insects to pollinate them

Flowers are modified leaves possessed only by the angiosperms, which are relatively late to appear in the fossil record. The group originated and diversified during the Early Cretaceous and became ecologically significant thereafter.[114] Flower-like structures first appear in the fossil records some ~130 mya, in the Cretaceous.[115]

Evolution of insects shows they appeared 480 million years ago.

The OP has "3.77 Billion years ago Universal Common Ancestor appears in water Gen 1:21 Day 5".
16 August 2018 Aman777: Why does Genesis 1:11 have flowering fruit trees in day 3 while you have them late in day 5?

Another mistake in that part of the OP.
"3.77 Billion years ago Universal Common Ancestor appears in water Gen 1:21 Day 5".
A last universal common ancestor is the common ancestor of everything such animals, plants, and bacteria.
Genesis 1:21 is "And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good."
It seems whoever wrote Genesis did not know that bacteria exist and were the first life form. They could be added to day 2 but day 3 looks more likely.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Be more specific but remember that I support what I post with the agreement of Scripture, science and history. Can you?

No, you asserted all those things.

 

[Aman777]

In any case, the empirical evidence is that we and chimpanzees are "cousins". Thus:
15 August 2018 Aman777: A "sons of God (Prehistoric people) diverged from Chimps" lie (we are "cousins").

The empirical evidence has been misunderstood since Human blood was mixed with the blood of prehistoric people (sons of God). The sons of God had their origin in the SAME way as every other living creature that moveth, and that was from WATER.

Cain, on Adam's world and Cush Gen 10:8 on the present Earth, had NO other Human (descendant of Adam) to marry, YET both married and had children with the sons of God (prehistoric people). The evidence is clear since ALL of today's Humans have INHERITED the superior intelligence of Adam Gen 3:22 AND the genetics which lead to people who descended from WATER on the 5th Day. Genesis 1:21

Can you tell us who the "sons of God" were?

 

[Aman777]

Yet another unsupported fantasy so:
16 August 2016 Aman777: Give the Biblical verse that states "Adam's Earth" was totally destroyed in the flood and replaced with another "earth".

First Scripture speaks of Adam's world which was totally destroyed in the flood.
2Pe 3:6 Whereby the world (Greek-kosmos) that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: (Greek-destroyed totally utterly)

Now, the present world is shown. 2Pe 3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

With your understanding, please tell us your view of the world that THEN WAS and the heavens and earth, WHICH ARE NOW. Are they the SAME? Of course not.

That is not what Noah's story says. There are fairy stories that the flood remade the surface of the Earth but how does Eden, etc. get described using post-flood rivers and countries?

Easy, since Noah THOUGHT he had floated around and come down on the SAME Earth he left. He was so afraid he stayed in the Ark for months AFTER he knew the ground was dry until God commanded him to leave the Ark. Looks like you have the same view Noah had. The world that then was and the heavens and earth, which are now, should inform you of the two Earths of Genesis 1.

Peter was not present during the flood (2 Peter 3). Peter writes "By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed". That is a flood destroying the world of man, not a total destruction of the Earth or replacement with another.

Doesn't work unless you change the verse: 2Pe 3:6 Whereby the world that then was

It speaks of the firmament/universe of Adam, made the 2nd Day Gen 1:8 AND the heavens and earth which are now, which were made the 3rd Day. Gen 2:4 Try again?

 

[Aman777]

16 August 2018 Aman777: A "Not according to Scripture" fantasy since the Bible does not say the first stars appeared 200 billion years after the Big Bang.
Genesis 1
God created the Earth on day 3 and made the Sun, Moon and stars on day 4.

Scripturally, God created Adam's Earth on Day 3. Gen 1:10
Then Lord God/Jesus made the present Earth at the end of the 3rd Day before the plants herbs and rain. Gen 2:4-7 We KNOW it was late on the 3rd Day because it was LESS THAN a billion years until the FIRST Stars appeared on the 4th Day. Gen 1:16

With your understanding, please explain HOW ancient man knew and correctly wrote that Scientific Fact, thousands of years ago. You cannot since it's proof of God.

 

[Aman777]

16 August 2018 Aman777: The cited Genesis 1:1 makes "created air, dust and water BEFORE the first day" wrong.
There are no actions before the first day. On day 1 a formless and void "earth" is created. Genesis 1 does not have God creating air or dust on specific days.

Correction: In your view everything seems to be a mystery. BEFORE the first Day:

1. God made the creation elements of air and the ground without form or dust. It had not been shaped because there was not a Physical Creator to mold them into physical form.
2. BUT something was dreadfully wrong since darkness or death was upon everything God had created apart from Himself, since only God is "good". Mar 10:18 To be apart from God leaves one subject to darkness/death. Anything made from the air, dust and water would be subject to Entropy and could not be Eternal as God demands. Mat 5:48
3. God said, Let there be Light and YHWH/Jesus came forth from within the invisible Spirit of God into the physical world. He will overcome death and He will make everything that exists physically. Jesus is the Light of the first Day and speaks of it just BEFORE His crucifixion.

Jhn 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify Thou Me with Thine own self with the glory (brightness) which I had with Thee before the world was.

The only Day BEFORE the world was, is the FIRST Day. Amen?

YHWH/Jesus is the ONLY God ever formed physically.
Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside Me there is no Saviour.

Presumably created when God made "grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree" on day 3 because they need air and soil ("dust") to grow.
Try again after reading Genesis again.

"Presumably" doesn't compute since Genesis is very specific. Chapter and verse please.

But this is where your imaginary time line goes even more wrong! Fruit trees are flowering plants usually needing insects to pollinate them

On the first world which you know nothing about? FYI, creeping things were made by Lord God/Jesus on the 6th Day. Gen 1:24 Trees were made the 3rd Day Genesis 1:12 to fill the Garden of Eden where Jesus put Adam. Genesis 2:8-9

Evolution of insects

shows they appeared 480 million years ago.

Amen. On the present Earth, You are correct. They descended from the last common universal ancestor which appeared 3.77 Billion years ago, in man's time. It was on the 5th Day to God or yesterday. Genesis 1:21 The big bang was on the 3rd Day, then 9 Billion years passed, and then our Earth formed, cooled and life came from water on the 5th Day on our planet which was less than 4.5 billion years ago, in man's time, which is the length of ONE of God's Days/Ages.

The OP has "3.77 Billion years ago Universal Common Ancestor appears in water Gen 1:21 Day 5".
16 August 2018 Aman777: Why does Genesis 1:11 have flowering fruit trees in day 3 while you have them late in day 5?

Trees grew on Adam's Earth on the 3rd Day. Gen 1:12
Later, on the 3rd Day, (13.7 billion years ago in man's time) Jesus caused the big bang of our Cosmos. Gen 2:4 Less than a billion years later the FIRST Stars of our world appeared the 4th Day. Gen 1:16 3.77 Billion years ago L.U.C.A. appeared on our planet.

Another mistake in that part of the OP.
"3.77 Billion years ago Universal Common Ancestor appears in water Gen 1:21 Day 5".
A last universal common ancestor is the common ancestor of everything such animals, plants, and bacteria.

Genesis 1:21 is "And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after Their kind, and every winged fowl after His kind: and God saw that it was good."

It seems whoever wrote Genesis did not know that bacteria exist and were the first life form. They could be added to day 2 but day 3 looks more likely.

Until you quit confusing Adam's world with the present world, you will continue to be confused as to what Genesis is actually saying. Amen?[/QUOTE]

 

[RealityCheck01]

First Scripture speaks of Adam's world which was totally destroyed in the flood.
...

So now we have:
17 August 2018 Aman777: A "Scripture speaks of Adam's world which was totally destroyed in the flood" fantasy (Peter's letter says destroyed by water, not annihilated and replaced).
Water flooding the surface of the earth will not destroy the Earth . Peter was not that stupid.