Predestination

[akmom]

The church I have attended for years got a new pastor a few years ago, and he preaches a hard-line predestination theology. That’s the only thing I have ever heard him preach. He literally talks about nothing else except God’s grace and how touched we should be by it.

I grew up in a baptist church all my life and never even heard the terms Calvinist or Armenian until this guy. I was familiar with the concepts, but only vaguely. It seemed like splitting hairs. I am not exaggerating this guy’s position when I say that all who are predestined will accept salvation, inevitably, there’s no resisting it. And the rest, they’re burning in hell no matter what. It seems to be a well received position in the church, and everyone of a different persuasion left early on.

So I’m kind of left wondering why I am even still there. It’s all gibberish to me. I mean I pray and attend, and yet everything he says... I don’t even get it. If salvation is really for the “elect” only, and I’ve been seeking God for 20+ years and none of this resonates with me at all, wouldn’t it be safe to say I’m not part of the elect? So... what exactly is the purpose of the rest of us?

I was always taught that salvation was for everyone, and everyone could accept it. But oddly, I never did relate to others’ testimonial experiences of being born again, so I’m not entirely skeptical of the concept that some people don’t get to be. And honestly I’m not real convinced on the nature of hell either, but if it’s all predestined then it really doesn’t matter what I believe about anything. Just wondering where to go from here. Attend church for another 30 years? Maybe I’ll have that experience eventually? Or maybe I am born again, just blind and deaf to God?

Is this not an experience? I only hear people who say salvation is for everyone, so if you ask God, you can consider yourself saved. Or you’re predestined and you’ll definitely know because God seeks you. I guess I’m rooting for the Armenian position, but honestly it feels pretty hollow when the Calvinists around me seem to have something. What’s going on here?

 

[royal priest]

 

[HTacianas]

The church I have attended for years got a new pastor a few years ago, and he preaches a hard-line predestination theology. That’s the only thing I have ever heard him preach. He literally talks about nothing else except God’s grace and how touched we should be by it.

I grew up in a baptist church all my life and never even heard the terms Calvinist or Armenian until this guy. I was familiar with the concepts, but only vaguely. It seemed like splitting hairs. I am not exaggerating this guy’s position when I say that all who are predestined will accept salvation, inevitably, there’s no resisting it. And the rest, they’re burning in hell no matter what. It seems to be a well received position in the church, and everyone of a different persuasion left early on.

So I’m kind of left wondering why I am even still there. It’s all gibberish to me. I mean I pray and attend, and yet everything he says... I don’t even get it. If salvation is really for the “elect” only, and I’ve been seeking God for 20+ years and none of this resonates with me at all, wouldn’t it be safe to say I’m not part of the elect? So... what exactly is the purpose of the rest of us?

I was always taught that salvation was for everyone, and everyone could accept it. But oddly, I never did relate to others’ testimonial experiences of being born again, so I’m not entirely skeptical of the concept that some people don’t get to be. And honestly I’m not real convinced on the nature of hell either, but if it’s all predestined then it really doesn’t matter what I believe about anything. Just wondering where to go from here. Attend church for another 30 years? Maybe I’ll have that experience eventually? Or maybe I am born again, just blind and deaf to God?

Is this not an experience? I only hear people who say salvation is for everyone, so if you ask God, you can consider yourself saved. Or you’re predestined and you’ll definitely know because God seeks you. I guess I’m rooting for the Armenian position, but honestly it feels pretty hollow when the Calvinists around me seem to have something. What’s going on here?

The notion of strict predestination, or individual election - that God has "made up His mind" as to who will get to heaven - is false. It is embarrassingly false.

To say that God chose every individual He wanted to choose for salvation before time, we have to examine the case of the Israelites while they were in bondage in Egypt. Surely God chose them from before all time to build them into a "mighty nation", else He wouldn't have gone through the trouble with them. Right?

But when the Israelites chose to build and worship the golden calf, God swore to destroy them all and build His nation from the descendants of Moses.

That is what we read in the bible. See Exodus 32.

Now, if God had chosen the Israelites -had predestined them- how could He have then swore to destroy them all and choose another group, and then change His mind about it?

We mentioned before "individual election". This leads to another term known as "corporate election", meaning that God has predestined a group of people to salvation. The members of that group are not individually predestined, but the group is. Just as God wanted the Israelites to build His nation, when they then rebelled, He chose the descendants of Moses instead.

Strict predestination comes from Calvinism. Calvinism doesn't survive the second book of the bible.

 

[Small Fish]

The church I have attended for years got a new pastor a few years ago, and he preaches a hard-line predestination theology. That’s the only thing I have ever heard him preach. He literally talks about nothing else except God’s grace and how touched we should be by it.

I grew up in a baptist church all my life and never even heard the terms Calvinist or Armenian until this guy. I was familiar with the concepts, but only vaguely. It seemed like splitting hairs. I am not exaggerating this guy’s position when I say that all who are predestined will accept salvation, inevitably, there’s no resisting it. And the rest, they’re burning in hell no matter what. It seems to be a well received position in the church, and everyone of a different persuasion left early on.

So I’m kind of left wondering why I am even still there. It’s all gibberish to me. I mean I pray and attend, and yet everything he says... I don’t even get it. If salvation is really for the “elect” only, and I’ve been seeking God for 20+ years and none of this resonates with me at all, wouldn’t it be safe to say I’m not part of the elect? So... what exactly is the purpose of the rest of us?

I was always taught that salvation was for everyone, and everyone could accept it. But oddly, I never did relate to others’ testimonial experiences of being born again, so I’m not entirely skeptical of the concept that some people don’t get to be. And honestly I’m not real convinced on the nature of hell either, but if it’s all predestined then it really doesn’t matter what I believe about anything. Just wondering where to go from here. Attend church for another 30 years? Maybe I’ll have that experience eventually? Or maybe I am born again, just blind and deaf to God?

Is this not an experience? I only hear people who say salvation is for everyone, so if you ask God, you can consider yourself saved. Or you’re predestined and you’ll definitely know because God seeks you. I guess I’m rooting for the Armenian position, but honestly it feels pretty hollow when the Calvinists around me seem to have something. What’s going on here?

The way I understand it is that earth would have been populated by perfect sons and daughters of God had Adam and Eve not fell.

See, every son and daughter of God already existed in God's Mind even before the fall of man. They were pre-planned. Just think of some Bible characters. Moses did not arrive by accident, did he? Nor David, Esther, Jesus Himself or any of the prophets. Jesus's coming had been prophesied long before He arrived.

If earthly parents can plan their families then How much more God Who even have your hair numbered.

Look at this verse... God speaking to Job...

Job 38:4-7
Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

According to these verses the sons of God shouted for joy when God laid the foundations of the world. Job was there in God's Mind. Perhaps not manifested yet but in God's sovereign plan and knowledge Job was already there.

But, with the fall, a "bad seed" manifested as we can see from Cain's behavior. The following Scriptures points to this bad seed.

1 John 3:12
12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.

And also... God said to the serpent...

Genesis 3:15
15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

This is where predestination comes in. It's the same as a father looking for His biological child. He is not responsible for other peoples children.

So this is what the Gospel is about. God coming for His Own and making a way back for them in restoration.

Get it, He comes to restore back to what He had in His Mind from before the foundation of the world.

The very word redeem means to bring back.

 

[SkyWriting]

The church I have attended for years got a new pastor a few years ago, and he preaches a hard-line predestination theology. That’s the only thing I have ever heard him preach. He literally talks about nothing else except God’s grace and how touched we should be by it.

I grew up in a baptist church all my life and never even heard the terms Calvinist or Armenian until this guy. I was familiar with the concepts, but only vaguely. It seemed like splitting hairs. I am not exaggerating this guy’s position when I say that all who are predestined will accept salvation, inevitably, there’s no resisting it. And the rest, they’re burning in hell no matter what. It seems to be a well received position in the church, and everyone of a different persuasion left early on.

So I’m kind of left wondering why I am even still there. It’s all gibberish to me. I mean I pray and attend, and yet everything he says... I don’t even get it. If salvation is really for the “elect” only, and I’ve been seeking God for 20+ years and none of this resonates with me at all, wouldn’t it be safe to say I’m not part of the elect? So... what exactly is the purpose of the rest of us?

I was always taught that salvation was for everyone, and everyone could accept it. But oddly, I never did relate to others’ testimonial experiences of being born again, so I’m not entirely skeptical of the concept that some people don’t get to be. And honestly I’m not real convinced on the nature of hell either, but if it’s all predestined then it really doesn’t matter what I believe about anything. Just wondering where to go from here. Attend church for another 30 years? Maybe I’ll have that experience eventually? Or maybe I am born again, just blind and deaf to God?

Is this not an experience? I only hear people who say salvation is for everyone, so if you ask God, you can consider yourself saved. Or you’re predestined and you’ll definitely know because God seeks you. I guess I’m rooting for the Armenian position, but honestly it feels pretty hollow when the Calvinists around me seem to have something. What’s going on here?

Predestination is impossible for humans to grasp.
But they keep trying different approaches.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The church I have attended for years got a new pastor a few years ago, and he preaches a hard-line predestination theology. That’s the only thing I have ever heard him preach. He literally talks about nothing else except God’s grace and how touched we should be by it.

I grew up in a baptist church all my life and never even heard the terms Calvinist or Armenian until this guy. I was familiar with the concepts, but only vaguely. It seemed like splitting hairs. I am not exaggerating this guy’s position when I say that all who are predestined will accept salvation, inevitably, there’s no resisting it. And the rest, they’re burning in hell no matter what. It seems to be a well received position in the church, and everyone of a different persuasion left early on.

So I’m kind of left wondering why I am even still there. It’s all gibberish to me. I mean I pray and attend, and yet everything he says... I don’t even get it. If salvation is really for the “elect” only, and I’ve been seeking God for 20+ years and none of this resonates with me at all, wouldn’t it be safe to say I’m not part of the elect? So... what exactly is the purpose of the rest of us?

I was always taught that salvation was for everyone, and everyone could accept it. But oddly, I never did relate to others’ testimonial experiences of being born again, so I’m not entirely skeptical of the concept that some people don’t get to be. And honestly I’m not real convinced on the nature of hell either, but if it’s all predestined then it really doesn’t matter what I believe about anything. Just wondering where to go from here. Attend church for another 30 years? Maybe I’ll have that experience eventually? Or maybe I am born again, just blind and deaf to God?

Is this not an experience? I only hear people who say salvation is for everyone, so if you ask God, you can consider yourself saved. Or you’re predestined and you’ll definitely know because God seeks you. I guess I’m rooting for the Armenian position, but honestly it feels pretty hollow when the Calvinists around me seem to have something. What’s going on here?

You are skeptical of those testimonies of those who say they are born again?
Did you not have an experience with Jesus Christ when you sought to be forgiven of your sins by Him?

As for Calvinistic Predestination: It is highly unbiblical. Calvinism attempts to make God into a cold and heartless being because He saves some and does not save others based on no conditions within the individual. He just does what He does. No rhyme or reason. But that is not the God of the Bible.

In fact, chances are, the church you attended (even before the change in Pastors) teaches a form of OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) or a Non-OSAS sin and still be saved type belief (Free Will Baptism). If this is the case, it is not a surprise that you doubt those who say they have been born again. Believers cannot commit willful sin and still be saved. Believers need to repent or confess of their sins and then forsake them. There needs to be a godly sorrow over one's sin or sins with the Lord. My encouragement is to re-dedicate your life to Christ by way or prayer with Him in all you do, and seek out intimate fellowship with other believers (Who do not believe they can sin and still be saved by having a mere belief on Jesus).

 

[Dave L]

If God wrote the names of the saved in the book of life before the foundation of the world, how can a random act or accident ever keep them from being born and coming to Christ?

 

[sdowney717]

Predestination is easy to grasp conceptually by scripture as it is written.
The natural carnal mind does not like the idea one bit that it is not in control of its own eternal fate.
But people do not have a naturally free will, they are bound by their sin to be sin's slave and all who sin God said shall die. So unless God has mercy and makes you born again as a new creation in Christ you will not be able to 'see' the kingdom of God.
John 3:3, the word 'see' does not mean enter, it means to perceive or want anything to do with the kingdom of God.

So yes it is God's choice who He will make born again as John 1:10-13 says, not the will of the man.
All those who receive Christ as Lord, believe in Christ because they have been taught by the Holy Spirit and drawn by the Father to Christ. So if your not interested in the kingdom, your not drawn, your not be born again and you will never come to Christ. On your own you will never believe except by the grace of God for by grace you have been saved, and this is not of yourself being the gift of God. The Father God must grant to you to come to Christ, and all He allows will be taught by Him and believe in His Son. John 6:64-66

Christ said 'all that the Father gives to me WILL come to me'. John 6:37

The work of God is that you believe in His Son. John 6:29

John 1
10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. 11 He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him.

12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

 

[Southernscotty]

Omniscience of God – God Knows All Things.

He knew you before you were formed in the womb
He had a plan before the foundations of the earth. Romans 8:29, Eph 1:4, Psalm 139:13-16

Romans 9:21 Has not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honor, and another unto dishonor?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Predestination is easy to grasp conceptually by scripture as it is written.
The natural carnal mind does not like the idea one bit that it is not in control of its own eternal fate.
But people do not have a naturally free will, they are bound by their sin to be sin's slave and all who sin God said shall die. So unless God has mercy and makes you born again as a new creation in Christ you will not be able to 'see' the kingdom of God.
John 3:3, the word 'see' does not mean enter, it means to perceive or want anything to do with the kingdom of God.

So yes it is God's choice who He will make born again as John 1:10-13 says, not the will of the man.
All those who receive Christ as Lord, believe in Christ because they have been taught by the Holy Spirit and drawn by the Father to Christ. So if your not interested in the kingdom, your not drawn, your not be born again and you will never come to Christ. On your own you will never believe except by the grace of God for by grace you have been saved, and this is not of yourself being the gift of God. The Father God must grant to you to come to Christ, and all He allows will be taught by Him and believe in His Son. John 6:64-66

Christ said 'all that the Father gives to me WILL come to me'. John 6:37

The work of God is that you believe in His Son. John 6:29

John 1
10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. 11 He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him.

12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

What you say is simply not true.

The Bible clearly teaches that we have free will to serve Him or not.

#1. Joshua 24:15 KJV -
"Choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve"

#2. Matthew 11:28 KJV -
"Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest."

#3. John 7:17 KJV -
"If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God."

#4. John 7:37 KJV -
"If anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink."

#5. Acts of the Apostles 2:38 KJV -
"Repent, and let everyone of you be baptized"

#6. Acts of the Apostles 3:19 KJV -
"Repent therefore and be converted"

#7. Acts of the Apostles 16:31 KJV -
"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved"

#8. Acts of the Apostles 17:30 KJV -
"but now commands all men everywhere to repent"

#9. Revelation 22:17 KJV -
"Whoever wills, let him take the water of life freely."

#10. Genesis 4:7 KJV -
"If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him."

If a person did not choose or reject God at any point, then the wicked could not be blamed for their actions at a Judgment because they had no choice in the matter and God just made them to be evil. But this would be impossible because there is no darkness in the Lord; And God is good.

Also, just being born again does not mean you will not fall into sin (or become a slave to it for a time). Not being ruled by sin is something you have to work at. Just saying you are one of the elect does not mean you have magically stopped sinning or have rule over your sin in this life.

In reality, there are different ways to overcome sin by God's Word and with the help of Jesus.

1. Remove yourself from sinful environments (if possible) and or get rid of things that cause you to sin. In Genesis: Joseph had literally ran away from the temptation of sexual sin.
   
   
2. Pray to God so as not to be tempted. It is part of the Lord’s prayer for you to pray so as not to be tempted into sin. God will guide and protect you if you are serious in praying for this. In fact, fasting will help you with this, as well.
   
   
3. Obey God’s righteous ways. The more you love God and love others and obey His Word and stay in His Word and pray, the more you will not even have a chance to sin or do the wrong thing. But the more you walk in God's Word by the Spirit you will not fulfill the lusts of flesh.
   
   
4. When you are tempted, quote Scripture. When Jesus was tempted by the devil, He quoted Scripture to defeat the devil. So when some specific sin is bothering you, find all the verses you can that are victory verses over that particular sin. A good general verse is, “The Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want.” You can say these verses to yourself silently under your breath (with nobody hearing).
   
   
5. Ask for prayer from other God fearing Christians or Godly Christians to help you to overcome certain sins. The Scriptures say, bear ye one another's burdens and thus fulfill the Law of Christ. So seek true fellowship and ask for their help.
   
   
6. Hide God’s Word in your heart. Memorize Scripture. David said he hid God’s Word within his heart so that he may not sin against the Lord.
   
   
7. Confess of your sins. 1 John 1:9 says if we confess our sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

God being aware of future events or what we would do is not the same as God enforcing a destiny upon us that we cannot refuse (no matter what we do). God gives us free will to decide if we want to follow Him or not.

 

[Southernscotty]

God being aware of future events or what we would do is not the same as God enforcing a destiny upon us that we cannot refuse (no matter what we do). God gives us free will to decide if we want to follow Him or not.

But in reality He still knows the outcome. "Already"

 

[Bible Highlighter]

But in reality He still knows the outcome. "Already"

But God knowing what will happen, does not mean He does not deal with us in real time. The Ninevites are a perfect example of this. It wasn't until they forsaken their evil ways until God decided to not bring wrath or judgment upon them. Yet, God's wrath and judgment were a very real threat to the Ninevites. When Jonah said that their city was going to be overthrown, it was a very real threat. Judgment was going to happen if they did not repent.

 

[sdowney717]

Jesus Christ is the Great Shepherd of the sheep, Hebrews 13:20
If he has a 'hundred sheep' and one is lost, He will go and find that sheep and restore it to His sheepfold.
Christ is the owner of His sheep, and none of His sheep will be lost because He is the Good Shepherd and He lays down His life for the sheep.

Luke 15:3-5 New King James Version (NKJV)
3 So He spoke this parable to them, saying:

4 “What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the wilderness, and go after the one which is lost until he finds it? 5 And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing.

Christ does God's will always. God's will is Christ loses none of His sheep. So none of His sheep will be lost, they will all be raised up on the last day.

John 6:38-40 New King James Version (NKJV)
38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. 40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”

 

[Southernscotty]

But God knowing what will happen, does not mean He does not deal with us in real time. The Ninevites are a perfect example of this. It wasn't until they forsaken their evil ways until God decided to not bring wrath or judgment upon them. Yet, God's wrath and judgment were a very real threat to the Ninevites. When Jonah said that their city was going to be overthrown, it was a very real threat. Judgment was going to happen if they did not repent.

It is about conforming to HIS will. Our finite minds cannot fully grasp an infinite God.
His time and ways we do not fully understand, but yet we trust and this is faith.

 

[bcbsr]

The church I have attended for years got a new pastor a few years ago, and he preaches a hard-line predestination theology. That’s the only thing I have ever heard him preach. He literally talks about nothing else except God’s grace and how touched we should be by it.

I grew up in a baptist church all my life and never even heard the terms Calvinist or Armenian until this guy. I was familiar with the concepts, but only vaguely. It seemed like splitting hairs. I am not exaggerating this guy’s position when I say that all who are predestined will accept salvation, inevitably, there’s no resisting it. And the rest, they’re burning in hell no matter what. It seems to be a well received position in the church, and everyone of a different persuasion left early on.

So I’m kind of left wondering why I am even still there. It’s all gibberish to me. I mean I pray and attend, and yet everything he says... I don’t even get it. If salvation is really for the “elect” only, and I’ve been seeking God for 20+ years and none of this resonates with me at all, wouldn’t it be safe to say I’m not part of the elect? So... what exactly is the purpose of the rest of us?

I was always taught that salvation was for everyone, and everyone could accept it. But oddly, I never did relate to others’ testimonial experiences of being born again, so I’m not entirely skeptical of the concept that some people don’t get to be. And honestly I’m not real convinced on the nature of hell either, but if it’s all predestined then it really doesn’t matter what I believe about anything. Just wondering where to go from here. Attend church for another 30 years? Maybe I’ll have that experience eventually? Or maybe I am born again, just blind and deaf to God?

Is this not an experience? I only hear people who say salvation is for everyone, so if you ask God, you can consider yourself saved. Or you’re predestined and you’ll definitely know because God seeks you. I guess I’m rooting for the Armenian position, but honestly it feels pretty hollow when the Calvinists around me seem to have something. What’s going on here?

As you note, Calvinism first of all has virtually no applications. It's a passive puppet theology in which people are viewed as being inanimate objects devoid of free will, and no suprise when they treat others that way. To affirm their point they have to restrict themselves to certain scripture and avoid most of the rest of the scriptures, which is what he's doing.

In Acts 16 a man asked, "What must I do to be saved?" If they Calvinists answer to that man goes off script obsessing over their Calvinistic armchair theology rather than answering how the apostle does, then there's something wrong. Paul answer "Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved."

The best teachings come from a verse by verse study of the New Testament epistles, alongside a systematic and thorough teaching of the gospels. That forces the teacher to deal with every verse and not just some verses, and one is less likely to get away taking verses out of context. But you'll be hardpressed to find anyone, whether in a church or on the radio, who does that.

Best to stick with a non-Reformed Baptist church, or a non-demoninational church which hasn't pledged allegiance to a theological brand but teaches the scriptures thoroughly.

Better yet are discussion oriented Bible study groups which go verse by verse through the epistles.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Jesus Christ is the Great Shepherd of the sheep.
If he has a 'hundred sheep' and one is lost, He will go and find that sheep and restore it to His sheepfold.
Christ is the owner of His sheep, and none of His sheep will be lost because He is the Good Shepherd and He lays down His life for the sheep.

Luke 15:3-5 New King James Version (NKJV)
3 So He spoke this parable to them, saying:

4 “What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the wilderness, and go after the one which is lost until he finds it? 5 And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing.

Christ does God's will always. God's will is Christ loses none of His sheep. So none of His sheep will be lost, they will all be raised up on the last day.

John 6:38-40 New King James Version (NKJV)
38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. 40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”

The word "if" is used in Matthew 18:13 in regards to him finding the one lost sheep.

"And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray." (Matthew 18:13).

The word "if" is not a guarantee. The word "if" suggests a possibility.

For example:
If Rick takes the local roads while it is raining, there is a chance he will get home safer. However, if Rick takes the locals roads there is still no guarantee in him getting home safe 100%. Something still could happen. The word "if" suggests a possibility.

As for John 6:

John 6 ...
37 All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day.

Notice the word "should" in there. Again, this does not suggest a guarantee.
For example: That would be like me saying, "I should be over your house tomorrow, but I have a lot of work to do." Would you take this as a promise or guarantee that I was coming over? No. Of course not. So why would you read a guarantee into the words in John 6?
Because of your preconceived beliefs (or what you prefer to see).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It is about conforming to HIS will. Our finite minds cannot fully grasp an infinite God.
His time and ways we do not fully understand, but yet we trust and this is faith.

While God may have plans for us, we have to do our part to be with God every day. We have free will to refuse God or to accept Him. Every day we have to choose this day in whom we will serve. God never forces us to be a certain way. God relates to us in real time. Yes, I believe God will strive to do things in our life to draw us to Him, because He is long-suffering towards us, but if some men keep slapping God away, there is going to be a point where He will let them go.

Again, the threat towards Nineveh was very real. God is not into false scare tactics. This is what destroys Calvinism.

 

[sdowney717]

As you note, Calvinism first of all has virtually no applications. It's a passive puppet theology in which people are viewed as being inanimate objects devoid of free will, and no suprise when they treat others that way. To affirm their point they have to restrict themselves to certain scripture and avoid most of the rest of the scriptures, which is what he's doing.

In Acts 16 a man asked, "What must I do to be saved?" If they Calvinists answer to that man goes off script obsessing over their Calvinistic armchair theology rather than answering how the apostle does, then there's something wrong. Paul answer "Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved."

The best teachings come from a verse by verse study of the New Testament epistles, alongside a systematic and thorough teaching of the gospels. That forces the teacher to deal with every verse and not just some verses, and one is less likely to get away taking verses out of context. But you'll be hardpressed to find anyone, whether in a church or on the radio, who does that.

Best to stick with a non-Reformed Baptist church, or a non-demoninational church which hasn't pledged allegiance to a theological brand but teaches the scriptures thoroughly.

Better yet are discussion oriented Bible study groups which go verse by verse through the epistles.

Again, John 3:3.
Jesus teaches a man must be born again before he will believe.
So what comes first, a person's belief in Christ without any prior change, or the change of the heart by God putting in them a new spirit which frees them from satan's hold and imposed blindness on their minds to believe in Christ?

2 Corinthians 4,
All who are perishing have their minds blinded by Satan, lest the gospel of Christ should shine on them.
But those who believe, v6.

3 But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4 whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.

5 For we do not preach ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord, and ourselves your bondservants for Jesus’ sake.

6 For it is the God who commanded light to shine out of darkness, who has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

 

[Albion]

It’s all gibberish to me. I mean I pray and attend, and yet everything he says... I don’t even get it. If salvation is really for the “elect” only, and I’ve been seeking God for 20+ years and none of this resonates with me at all, wouldn’t it be safe to say I’m not part of the elect? So... what exactly is the purpose of the rest of us?

I was always taught that salvation was for everyone, and everyone could accept it. But oddly, I never did relate to others’ testimonial experiences of being born again, so I’m not entirely skeptical of the concept that some people don’t get to be. And honestly I’m not real convinced on the nature of hell either, but if it’s all predestined then it really doesn’t matter what I believe about anything. Just wondering where to go from here. Attend church for another 30 years? Maybe I’ll have that experience eventually? Or maybe I am born again, just blind and deaf to God?

Is this not an experience? I only hear people who say salvation is for everyone, so if you ask God, you can consider yourself saved. Or you’re predestined and you’ll definitely know because God seeks you. I guess I’m rooting for the Armenian position, but honestly it feels pretty hollow when the Calvinists around me seem to have something. What’s going on here?

The problem appears to be your difficulty with understanding the pastors theology (which is not unusual, like it or not), so maybe you should just have a little talk with him and lay out for him the questions you put to us.