Except for the church teaching God desires our happiness (which is not the same as "blessed" since Jesus said "blessed" are those have qualities that match those of God such as suffering, not generally a mark of happiness) most of this is true but if this is what a person embraces as the sole motive of God, they are not going to remain following Jesus for long. His goal is not that we feel personal happiness in our life and well-being. His goal is that we learn to love Him and love others as we love ourselves. The above message appeals right to the selfishness we can embrace and feeds it. It would be like telling a new groom that his wife is there to meet his needs and help him through life leaving out the bit that he will called upon to do the same for her, laying aside his selfish desires at time.
Love and happiness are ultimately intrinsically connected, as selfishness and misery are connected in the end, even as we may
think we’ve found happiness on this earth, temporarily, by pursuing selfish interests.
I have lost two children and am no strange to the above. The above is true but rather surfacey.
We’re here to learn of God-to gain “the knowledge of God”: that He exists, that He’s trustworthy, true, and good, that we need Him. These are items that Adam missed, but these are things we can learn here with the help of experience and grace. For example, rich people aren’t hated by God, they just have a harder time loving Him because they feel no need, falsely secure as they are in their wealth. But God can cut through that stony heart, and sometimes hardships/ suffering are used for that purpose. “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible”. It’s very simple, not particularly surfacey or anything else; “surfacey” having more to do with a faith that’s been tested little, in fact.
Well, the church never preached personal happiness is God's life goal for us. That is actually deeply selfish. But yes, many make choices based on obtaining personal happiness at the expense of the happiness of others. IT is true but the chruch does not teach it as a valid goal in life.
It’s not at all selfish; eternal life isn’t meant to be merely eternally
endured by a bunch of holy boors; it has to do with w
ho God is to begin with. Happiness is a goal of everyone without giving it any thought; we don’t generally go out of our way to experience
suffering; we feed ourselves and our children when they’re hungry; we clothe ourselves to stay warm; we shield or protect ourselves from humiliation; we do these things all the time in order to satisfy basic needs and maintain a modicum of happiness in this world. Selfishness involves wanting
more than we need: becoming a glutton, or being a clothes-horse, or seeking glory, forsaking moderation.
Don't you see that the above is completely selfish? Wanting what is good and right for ourselves (no matter what it costs others) is completely selfish. I know of this catchy phrase and it is not how God works. One needs to add what we let go of, our selfish pursuit for our own happiness, and let God tell work on us to love the happiness of others as much as our own.
No one mentioned seeking happiness at the cost of others. IOW it’s possible to love and also be happy. In fact it's impossible to be truly happy and
not love, acknowledging that love always involves doing no harm to God and neighbor.
Why do you think selfish pursuit of personal happiness at the expense of the happiness is the teaching of the church and yet say at the end the opposite? (Some of us do know it as well as God desires us to, btw.)
You called the pursuit of happiness selfish-I called it normal-and only selfish if it involves harming others.
He who turns away from evil for fear of punishment is better than he who does evil fearing no punishment at all. If a man has ever been truly discipled or punished by God, he would know the foolishness of the above statement. It sounds lofty and noble but the human heart is such that punishment is a motivation that teaches a man to do good. Eventually he will do good for other reasons but at least he is still doing good along the way. Waiting for the right motive to do good will embed doing evil all along the way quite nicely.
Yes, meaning fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom. But, as we genuinely come to know God, fear is little by little
cast out by love. Sheez, Dorothy, you seem to be adamantly bent on remaining in a stifled frame of mind on this IMO
I personally know a man who stole a monitor at work and because he was about to be taken to court, he returned it. He was not doing it out of love but fear of punishment. The people who got their monitor returned did not care the motive. They just wanted their stolen property back.
If he had loved as he should, he would never have stolen to begin with. God prefers that. Gee, I wonder why?
So from before Augustine, and including him, it’s been acknowledged just from a psychological and philosophical viewpoint alone that humans desire happiness. What do you think the reason might be that humans would actually
want to exist eternally, and what would could keep that desire lit? Do you think God would have us simply
gut eternity out? God
is our happiness, ultimately. His mere presence produces sheer, unbridled bliss inside of a human.
Augustine realized that his own failure to find happiness here on earth was because he loved earthly things more than God. We’re all here to learn that same lesson. He affirmed: "all persons want to be happy; and no persons are happy who do not have what they want." “What they want”, however, isn’t necessarily what they need. Adam thought he could find a greater
something: fulfillment, happiness, whatever, apart from God. Jesus tells us the truth we need to hear in John 15:5, “Apart from Me you can do nothing.”
So the church teaches:
27 The desire for God is written in the human heart, because man is created by God and for God; and God never ceases to draw man to himself. Only in God will he find the truth and happiness he never stops searching for:
The dignity of man rests above all on the fact that he is called to communion with God. This invitation to converse with God is addressed to man as soon as he comes into being. For if man exists it is because God has created him through love, and through love continues to hold him in existence. He cannot live fully according to truth unless he freely acknowledges that love and entrusts himself to his creator.
"1718 The Beatitudes respond to the natural desire for happiness. This desire is of divine origin: God has placed it in the human heart in order to draw man to the One who alone can fulfill it:
'We all want to live happily; in the whole human race there is no one who does not assent to this proposition, even before it is fully articulated. How is it, then, that I seek you, Lord? Since in seeking you, my God, I seek a happy life, let me seek you so that my soul may live, for my body draws life from my soul and my soul draws life from you.'(Augustine)
'God alone satisfies.' (Aquinas)"
"1723 The beatitude we are promised confronts us with decisive moral choices. It invites us to purify our hearts of bad instincts and to seek the love of God above all else. It teaches us that true happiness is not found in riches or well-being, in human fame or power, or in any human achievement - however beneficial it may be - such as science, technology, and art, or indeed in any creature, but in God alone, the source of every good and of all love:
'All bow down before wealth. Wealth is that to which the multitude of men pay an instinctive homage. They measure happiness by wealth; and by wealth they measure respectability. . . . It is a homage resulting from a profound faith . . . that with wealth he may do all things. Wealth is one idol of the day and notoriety is a second. . . . Notoriety, or the making of a noise in the world - it may be called "newspaper fame" - has come to be considered a great good in itself, and a ground of veneration.' (John Newman)"
"2548 Desire for true happiness frees man from his immoderate attachment to the goods of this world so that he can find his fulfillment in the vision and beatitude of God. "The promise [of seeing God] surpasses all beatitude. . . . In Scripture, to see is to possess. . . . Whoever sees God has obtained all the goods of which he can conceive."