I come to this sub forum now and then and want to participate, but when I go over the threads and postings, I find argumentation against predestination lacking in a way that I don't even feel compelled to reply back, let alone argue on and on.
In other words, I don't find argumentation against predestination serious enough. Quite a few times it has a flavour of tamper tantrum, or being emotionaly driven one way or another. Sometimes it's just basic, off the hip, reaction against the idea that God not only has power to control things but that He actually does control things, that it depletes my motivation to answer back.
Is this the experience of others who believe in predestination? (I stay away to label myself as calvinist because I didn't read what he wrote, and my belief in predestination didn't originate from preaching but from reading the Bible.)
Anyway, I was thinking about that. I don't know if I am having a prejudice that skews my way of seeing things, or is there really a different quality of understanding God's word and reality between those who see predestination and those who don't see it. Of course, I am talking in general terms, an average of sorts, not about each and every individual who believes for and against predestination.
Interesting starting difference is that basically no one truly believes in predestination right away. Everybody starts by believing in free will, as I did too. Then, some start seeing what looks like predestined nature of our reality being revealed in the Bible. And then, some start seeing predestination all over the Bible.
On the other hand, I would say that most who believe in free will start with free will. Some do take predestination as fact early on if they are part of the church that teaches it, but if they just take it on surface they might retreat back to what is intuitive position, a free will position, which I suspect does happen much more often than conversion of someone who has seriously studied and believed in predestination but later moved to free will.
It seems there's no way around seeing a different level of understanding of positions between the two groups. Basically all who believe in predestination have also truly believed in free will at some point, while basically all or most who believe in free will have never truly believed in predestination. Thus first can talk with more authority about free will than second can talk about predestination.
I don't know if that's the reason why, or not, but, again, I don't feel challenged to actually participate in an argument for or against predestination, because what I see that other side brings is usually rather lacking.
In other words, I don't find argumentation against predestination serious enough. Quite a few times it has a flavour of tamper tantrum, or being emotionaly driven one way or another. Sometimes it's just basic, off the hip, reaction against the idea that God not only has power to control things but that He actually does control things, that it depletes my motivation to answer back.
Is this the experience of others who believe in predestination? (I stay away to label myself as calvinist because I didn't read what he wrote, and my belief in predestination didn't originate from preaching but from reading the Bible.)
Anyway, I was thinking about that. I don't know if I am having a prejudice that skews my way of seeing things, or is there really a different quality of understanding God's word and reality between those who see predestination and those who don't see it. Of course, I am talking in general terms, an average of sorts, not about each and every individual who believes for and against predestination.
Interesting starting difference is that basically no one truly believes in predestination right away. Everybody starts by believing in free will, as I did too. Then, some start seeing what looks like predestined nature of our reality being revealed in the Bible. And then, some start seeing predestination all over the Bible.
On the other hand, I would say that most who believe in free will start with free will. Some do take predestination as fact early on if they are part of the church that teaches it, but if they just take it on surface they might retreat back to what is intuitive position, a free will position, which I suspect does happen much more often than conversion of someone who has seriously studied and believed in predestination but later moved to free will.
It seems there's no way around seeing a different level of understanding of positions between the two groups. Basically all who believe in predestination have also truly believed in free will at some point, while basically all or most who believe in free will have never truly believed in predestination. Thus first can talk with more authority about free will than second can talk about predestination.
I don't know if that's the reason why, or not, but, again, I don't feel challenged to actually participate in an argument for or against predestination, because what I see that other side brings is usually rather lacking.
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