Hydroponics

[DavidaAC]

I had an idea a while ago that if I found cheaper ways to grow food that maybe I could help some people in the more poor countries grow their own food. I've done a few experiments with hydroponics and it is so much cheaper than using regular soil where I live. Not to mention that I don't have to deal with insect larvae destroying the roots of my plants anymore. The biggest problem I've had is with root rot, but that's easily correctable.
The dirt on the ground where I live is full of insect larvae and pesticides (to kill the insect larvae), so I wouldn't grow food in it. I know in some places food crops do really badly because of the type of soil they have, so that's one of the reasons why I like the idea of hydroponics.

So my question is, do you think using hydroponics would be a more efficient/cheaper way to grow plants than just using soil? It seems like it would be to me, but I would like to know what other people think, in case I'm wrong about that.
Also, by hydroponics I mean growing food in sand or gravel (I have done both, and it works, surprisingly) and adding some sort of fertilizer to it.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Interesting .....

The hydroponics I'm familiar with are growing in water, often with fish as part of a closed system to provide fertilizer.

I'm interested to know how taste is affected.

So you grow in sand or gravel? Do you find you must add a lot of fertilizer? What type? It seems I'd wonder about the balance between starving the plants and burning them. Sand and gravel probably result in fertilizer being washed quickly away?

I wonder if it's possible to combine fish with a sand or gravel system? Hmmmmmmmm .....

 

[~Anastasia~]

And whether or not it's cheaper depends on what the alternative is, and how much is necessary to set up hydroponics. But normally direct sowing, if effective, is the cheapest means.

 

[Humble me Lord]

First, Hello, glad you joined us. And I like your rat !
I grew up on a farm in the midwest, where the soil is very good, and they grow tons of food for animals and people. The sad fact is everything is being pushed to grow more corn for example in the same amount of acreage. So they now use pesticides to control bugs, herbicides to control weeds, and are changing the seeds with GMO science. Most of the fertilizers they use are not good for the environment. There are very few small farmers that grow things naturally. This is going to come back to haunt us in the future. We need great young people like you to come up with new ideas for growing food. They do use hydroponics now to grow food without any soil at all. Hydroponics are a great idea for areas with poor soil (like you said), or in deserts. Theres also aquaponics, that uses fish living in the water that provide fertilizer for the plants you might be interested in here,Recommended Plants and Fish in Aquaponics | Nelson & Pade, Inc.
Will try to help you any way I can
God Bless

 

[~Anastasia~]

First, Hello, glad you joined us. And I like your rat !
I grew up on a farm in the midwest, where the soil is very good, and they grow tons of food for animals and people. The sad fact is everything is being pushed to grow more corn for example in the same amount of acreage. So they now use pesticides to control bugs, herbicides to control weeds, and are changing the seeds with GMO science. Most of the fertilizers they use are not good for the environment. There are very few small farmers that grow things naturally. This is going to come back to haunt us in the future. We need great young people like you to come up with new ideas for growing food. They do use hydroponics now to grow food without any soil at all. Hydroponics are a great idea for areas with poor soil (like you said), or in deserts. Theres also aquaponics, that uses fish living in the water that provide fertilizer for the plants you might be interested in here,Recommended Plants and Fish in Aquaponics | Nelson & Pade, Inc.
Will try to help you any way I can
God Bless

Ah, aquaponics, yes, I got my words mixed up. Sorry!

 

[Joseph@HISbees]

I agree hydroponics and aquapontics do work in many 3rd world sinarios however if we grow food with one form of fertilizer whether it be of natural or chemical origins (chemical being far less beneficial) it still only contains one nutrient source. If Chemical the human body and the plants may view it as a foreign object (often chemical nutrient makeups are quite different from their natural state.) And natural (eg fish) it will only be as good as its producer. If however we were to cover the ground (and in the case of the pesticides, let it heal for a few years) With decaying matter it should be just as effective if not more than hydroponics. Look up backtoedenfilm.com for more ideas like this.

 

[Joseph@HISbees]

I have found that God did it best up front. Look at forests, for thousands of year they grow, and sustain life, and fight off their diseases on their own. They need no help from us. When we add pesticides into the matter it just takes more time for it to heal. I am a natural beekeeper and I know my bees cannot get away from pesticides... ...but if the hive I have prepared them with suits their needs and I keep it clean by removing the residues little by little they soon become naturally stronger agaist them. So If the soil is allowed to rest, and the covering is allowed to decompose (18 inches thick of it or more) the soil should be able to heal (as it is a living orgainism) and the plants able to thrive.

 

[DavidaAC]

Interesting .....

The hydroponics I'm familiar with are growing in water, often with fish as part of a closed system to provide fertilizer.

I'm really interested in that (aquaponics) too, because if you used fish like tilapia then you'd have both fish and plants to eat.

I'm interested to know how taste is affected.

I hadn't considered this, but I've eaten some plants I've grown using hydroponics and they didn't taste much different from plants grown in soil. But I'm not completely sure...

Interesting .....
So you grow in sand or gravel? Do you find you must add a lot of fertilizer? What type? It seems I'd wonder about the balance between starving the plants and burning them. Sand and gravel probably result in fertilizer being washed quickly away?

I only add a little bit of fertilizer, but I add it more often than I would with soil. I usually use liquid fertilizer that I make. One experiment I did was mix 1 tablespoon of molasses with 8 oz of water and I soaked Spanish moss in it for a day or two, and used it as a fertilizer. It worked really well. I think it is sometimes hard to get the right amount of fertilizer, but it's even harder to figure out how much water to use. It might sound weird, but I've mixed in some ripped up paper into sand a few times to keep it from drying out too quickly. I think that helps to keep the fertilizer in the sand longer too.

I wonder if it's possible to combine fish with a sand or gravel system? Hmmmmmmmm .....

That's actually a great idea. I want to try that now...

And whether or not it's cheaper depends on what the alternative is, and how much is necessary to set up hydroponics. But normally direct sowing, if effective, is the cheapest means.

Thanks for your thoughts, I'll consider that. I think sand is a lot cheaper than soil (at least where I live it is), but I don't know about gravel.

 

[Humble me Lord]

Yes, I agree, I have two organic 30 x 80 foot gardens, all natural, I water with rain water, and fertilize with compost and goat/chicken manure. I plant oats or barley in the fall and turn it back under in the spring.
The sad fact is its going to be near impossible to get many farmers to leave any land fallow for any length of time, unless they are getting paid to do so, see CRP program. It's like everything else, it's all about $$$$$$$$.$$

 

[DavidaAC]

First, Hello, glad you joined us. And I like your rat !
I grew up on a farm in the midwest, where the soil is very good, and they grow tons of food for animals and people. The sad fact is everything is being pushed to grow more corn for example in the same amount of acreage. So they now use pesticides to control bugs, herbicides to control weeds, and are changing the seeds with GMO science. Most of the fertilizers they use are not good for the environment. There are very few small farmers that grow things naturally. This is going to come back to haunt us in the future. We need great young people like you to come up with new ideas for growing food. They do use hydroponics now to grow food without any soil at all. Hydroponics are a great idea for areas with poor soil (like you said), or in deserts. Theres also aquaponics, that uses fish living in the water that provide fertilizer for the plants you might be interested in here,Recommended Plants and Fish in Aquaponics | Nelson & Pade, Inc.
Will try to help you any way I can
God Bless

Hello! Thanks
I've almost always grown things organically, it is harder but worth it. It's easier with hydroponics, because you have less problems with insects that way (another reason why I like it).
I have considered aquaponics, and I'd like to experiment with that too. And thanks for the link, it was really helpful.

 

[DavidaAC]

Yes, I agree, I have two organic 30 x 80 foot gardens, all natural, I water with rain water, and fertilize with compost and goat/chicken manure. I plant oats or barley in the fall and turn it back under in the spring.
The sad fact is its going to be near impossible to get many farmers to leave any land fallow for any length of time, unless they are getting paid to do so, see CRP program. It's like everything else, it's all about $$$$$$$$.$$

Yes, it's sad that they put money before people's health too.

 

[Humble me Lord]

DavidaAC, have you heard of this ? THE GARDENERS FRIEND

 

[FrankDux]

There are many types of hydroponics, each with it's own set of challenges

Really depends on the setup, is it indoor, is it outdoor, is mono-cropping, etc

I use ebb and flood tables, personally, but I also grow in soil because hydroponics is overkill for some crops

 

[Humble me Lord]

Bees , thats my next endeavor ! We had a definite lack of pollinators last growing season and I want to learn bees, and how to keep the bears away from them.
I had the biggest healthiest pepper plants last year, but yield was horrible. Do you garden also Joseph@hisbees ?

 

[Joseph@HISbees]

Yes we do cover gardens, they work amazing if you allow at least a year for the covering to decay. In the bible God was very clear to the israelites the land needed to rest inbetween certian seasons. (beekeeping tip, I have found in beekeeping that the same material I use to cover my gardens woodchips, hay, rotting wood, and leaves, if placed in the bottom of my hives creates a similar enviroment to a log. I use topbar hives and am still experimenting with the best way to harvest comb for honey. Top bar hives (or long hives with slanted sides with no artifical comb) I have found to produce the healthiest bees, most honey, and fastest growth. The hard part is harvesting because they have a tendency to cross their comb. So I am currently designing a hive similar to that of the hives recently found in israel (the oldest beehives on record) dated back to the time of the book of second kings. I looked at their design and it is brilliant, and too simple. It looks like a long hive but it has a removable cap on one end to remove comb. Instead of removable top bars. Making cheap to make and no need to worry about perfect comb. So if you are interesting in beekeeping I will post some links to some really good hive designs and explain how to improve them.

 

[DavidaAC]

DavidaAC, have you heard of this ? THE GARDENERS FRIEND

No I haven't, but that looks interesting (and seems like a great idea to use in something like sand, to keep the water and nutrients in it longer).

 

[Humble me Lord]

No I haven't, but that looks interesting (and seems like a great idea to use in something like sand, to keep the water and nutrients in it longer

I'm so happy you are interested in plants. Are you planning on college after HS ? This seems like it might be a career path for you.

 

[Humble me Lord]

So if you are interesting in beekeeping I will post some links to some really good hive designs and explain how to improve them.

Yes, it sounds interesting. Sounds like a good idea for a new thread. I also have to figure out how to get them through brutal winters. I am on the northern edge of planting zone 3, where it's not uncommon to get temps of -30 degrees F.

 

[DavidaAC]

I'm so happy you are interested in plants. Are you planning on college after HS ? This seems like it might be a career path for you.

I wasn't originally planning on going to college, but I've been wondering for the past few months if I should become a botanist.

 

[Humble me Lord]

It's a hard decision to make and you are still young. I am 48 and have had many jobs in my life, but I have found that I have been the happiest when I have a job doing what I like to do. I started out studying in architectural drafting, I love to draw, and went to school for it. When I got a job doing it, I found out that I couldn't sit behind a desk. I had to be outside.
Keep up the good work and God Bless you.