Jack Chick's View on Catholicism

[Gideon]

By attacking the Catholic Church, you attack all of the Catholics on this forum.



True, but the LINKS to the cartoons were there.

Settle down Brendan. The O.P. was not unreasonable.

 

[MarysSon]

And thank YOU for that warm and charitable response.

I understand the past pretty well. And the primary lesson to be drawn from it the world over is that religion has to be kept firmly under the control of secular civil authorities, because religious people become fanatical murderers when they have power. So they can't ever have power.

Yes, I can see that you truly never have seen any of the divine sense of humor.

Perhaps, you could show me some Scriptural examples of God's raucous sense of humor, then . . .

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I want to say that when I make comments, I keep to fair debate about the issues. I believe in kicking the ball and not the players. If I say that something is nonsense and ridiculous, I am saying that what is being proposed is that, and not the member making the comments. I respect every person that posts on these threads and I find the diverse opinions make the debates really interesting and fun. They also cause me to think quite deeply about what I believe, and it is good to see a different way of looking at issues. We may not like someone's reponses to what we post, but we need to suck it up, not take it personally, and prepare a good answer to keep the debate fired up.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

Constantine ended the persecution of the Christian faith. Before he did so Christianity was illegal. Christians died. He didn't make Christianity the state religion, as so many detractors think he did. He made Christianity as legal as Paganism.

He did try to meddle in the faith, true. When Christian bishops were arguing over the teaching of Arius, Constantine summoned all of the bishops to meet in Nicea to hammer it out. But Constantine wanted a compromise position, semi-Arianism. The council rejected what Constantine wanted, totally rejecting Arianism and semi-Arianism. So Constantine's meddling wasn't even effective.

The mythology about Constantine is way thicker than the truth about him.

Dang I was joking tbh didn't think people would take it so seriouisly.

And yeah I agree he ended the persecution of the christian faith by manifesting a sort of safe version you could say to practice.

 

[MarysSon]

I did a Mastorate paper in Early Christian history and that is what my texts told me about Constantine. It depends on what history you read and the extent of the research that you base your views on.

Unfortunately, then your mastorate was based on myth.

The Edict of Milan simply proclaimed tolerance for Christianity.
It didn't make it the official religion of Rome. But, like you said - it all depends on where you get your information - and that is the danger of Jack Chick.

 

[prodromos]

And yeah I agree he ended the persecution of the christian faith by manifesting a sort of safe version you could say to practice.

Still wrong

 

[MarysSon]

Still wrong

Yup - where does he get this stuff??

 

[Vicomte13]

Perhaps, you could show me some Scriptural examples of God's raucous sense of humor, then . . .

Well, there's the "Bears of Bashan". A bunch of boys make fun of Elijah's bald head, so God sics a whole pack of bears on them that tear them to pieces. That's pretty funny.

In real life, there's the platypus and the camel, for starters.

 

[J-Man70]

I think that statement can be made about any Church or denomination - some there are saved. Some perhaps not. Only God knows.

Yes. That's correct. The only reason I mentioned Roman Catholics that time is because we're talking about a man's views about that particular denomination. I was raised in both the Roman Catholic AND the Protestant churches, but I never actually gave my life to Christ until I was in college.

That were neither historical nor facts. If you disagree, then by all means present some evidence from primary sources.

Where in the Bible does it say that you should pray to patron saints? Nowhere.

What does the Bible say about praying repetitious prayers? It says not to do it.

What did the Roman pagans do? They prayed repetitious prayers to patron gods.

Conclusion: Roman Catholicism was formed by the merging of Christianity with Roman paganism.

Does this make me think the Roman Catholics are all going to hell? No, it doesn't.

 

[MarysSon]

Well, there's the "Bears of Bashan". A bunch of boys make fun of Elijah's bald head, so God sics a whole pack of bears on them that tear them to pieces. That's pretty funny.

In real life, there's the platypus and the camel, for starters.

I know you're just being silly because I embarrassed you - bout there is nothing funny about kids getting killed by bears.
Nor is there anything funny about camels or platypuses.

Are deformed children funny?
How about people with cerebral palsy??

The fact is that there are no examples of God being a funnyman.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Green jello?

That's about as accurate as any other suggestion up to now. ;-)

 

[~Anastasia~]

Ummmm .... Jesus prayed a repetitious prayer in the Garden of Gethsemane (Mark 14).

Scripture never said not to repeat prayers. We are told to avoid VAIN repetition.

Any kind of prayer can contain vain repetition, including extemporaneous ones. In fact, they are sometimes more vainly repetitive if the person doesn't know what to say and fills up their prayer with "Lord, we just ask you Lord, to bless them. We ask you to bless them, Lord, and be with then, Lord ..." and so on. Prayers should be alive, coming from the heart, whether formal or extemporaneous, and not just a lot of words filling the air. It's ok to pause with God, and gather your thoughts. Better, in fact. But we as humans tend to be uncomfortable with the silence ....

 

[MarysSon]

Yes. That's correct. The only reason I mentioned Roman Catholics that time is because we're talking about a man's views about that particular denomination. I was raised in both the Roman Catholic AND the Protestant churches, but I never actually gave my life to Christ until I was in college.

Where in the Bible does it say that you should pray to patron saints? Nowhere.

What does the Bible say about praying repetitious prayers? It says not to do it.

What did the Roman pagans do? They prayed repetitious prayers to patron gods.

Conclusion: Roman Catholicism was formed by the merging of Christianity with Roman paganism.

Does this make me think the Roman Catholics are all going to hell? No, it doesn't.

And this kind of ignorance cannot go unanswered . . .

First of all - we are commanded to pray for each other as the Body of Christ (James 5:!6).
Does a person cease to be a member of the Body of Christ when they go to Heaven?? Who gave YOU the authority to kick them out??

Rev. 5:8 shows the saints in Heaven taking our prayers before God and Rev. 8:4-5 shows the angels doing the SAME thing. They are interceding for us.

As for repetitious prayers - Jesus didn't condemn that. He said:
“And when you pray, do not use VAIN repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words.” (Matt. 6:7).

Was Jesus a heathen?? HE prayed repetitiously.
- In Matt. 26:44, Jesus himself prayed the exact same prayer three times in the Garden of Gethsemane after the Last Supper.

- In the Parable of the Determined Widow in Luke 18:-87, Jesus emphatically states that God hears those who keep petitioning him in sincere faith:
“Will not God then secure the rights of his chosen ones who call out to him day and night? Will he be slow to answer them? I tell you, he will see to it that justice is done for them speedily.”

- In Luke 18:13, the tax collector repeatedly beat his breast and prayed, “God be merciful to me, a sinner.”
This was pleasing to God.

- We see in Rev. 4:8 that the angels pray the SAME prayer day and night without ceasing in the presence of almighty God, “Holy, Holy, Holy is the Lord God Almighty.”

- Psalm 136 goes on for 26 verses in a row, repeating the exact same prayer, “God's love endures forever”.

- In Dan. 3:56-88 we read the exact same prayer for 32 verses, which is “bless the Lord; praise and exalt him above all forever.”
This is FAR more repetitious than a decade of the Rosary.

So much for YOUR unbiblical rejection of repetitous prayer . . .

 

[FireDragon76]

That's about as accurate as any other suggestion up to now. ;-)

I think Constantine did change the tone of the Church in the Roman world, but not in the way that anti-Catholics suggest. The eucharist, icons, Mary, saints, etc. were all parts of the Church before Constantine. What Constantine did, was make Christianity respectable, even required, and theologians started having to figure out ways to make the religious ethics more pragmatic. Which is not necessarily a bad thing.

 

[MarysSon]

I think Constantine did change the tone of the Church in the Roman world, but not in the way that anti-Catholics suggest. The eucharist, icons, Mary, saints, etc. were all parts of the Church before Constantine. What Constantine did, was make Christianity respectable, even required, and theologians started having to figure out ways to make the religious ethics more pragmatic. Which is not necessarily a bad thing.

While Christianity undoubtedly replaced some pagan celebrations with Christian feasts - this was not a "mixing" of paganism and Christianity as some falsely charge.

 

[FireDragon76]

Jesus used humor, it's obvious from seeing his interaction with the religious leaders of his day. Many of his images are obviously meant to be humorous. Like straining a gnat and swallowing a camel, or the image of the blind leading the blind.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

Same for Alberto Ribera, wished his views had gone to the grave with him instead of being picked up by Darby and Scofield and many preachers today.

I think Jack Chick was trying to point out that there is pagan rituals in the RCC form of worship brought in by Constantine.

Still wrong

everyone has their opinion. If you think i'm wrong suit yourself.

 

[MarysSon]

Jesus used humor, it's obvious from seeing his interaction with the religious leaders of his day. Many of his images are obviously meant to be humorous. Like straining a gnat and swallowing a camel, or the image of the blind leading the blind.

Hyperbole is not humor.
It is simply a way of exaggerating to make a point.

 

[prodromos]

Where in the Bible does it say that you should pray to patron saints? Nowhere.

It does say to pray for one another, it says God is the God of the living (referring to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob) and it says the prayers of a righteous man are powerful and affective.

What does the Bible say about praying repetitious prayers? It says not to do it.

It says not to make "vain repetitions as the heathens do". Is there anything vain about repeatedly asking God to have mercy on us?

What did the Roman pagans do? They prayed repetitious prayers to patron gods.

Patron gods? What are patron gods?

Conclusion: Roman Catholicism was formed by the merging of Christianity with Roman paganism.

So you are posting your opinion, not historical facts. Thank you, that is much less misleading.

 

[prodromos]

everyone has their opinion. If you think i'm wrong suit yourself.

I know you're wrong. Constantine tried to influence the Church but he ultimately failed. He did end the persecution though which allowed the Church to flourish.