The doctrine of hell

[anonymous person]

Let us discuss.

 

[rockytopva]

1. The doctrine of hell
2. The reality of hell

The doctrine of hell is our opinion on the matter
The reality of hell is the actual eternal lake of fire

It is easy to discuss the doctrine of hell breathing fresh air in a lighted comfortable environment.
It is heartbreaking to experience the actual hell knowing that you will never experience the same environment you had on earth!

 

[Widlast]

As St. Padre Pio once stated "They'll believe in Hell when they get there."

 

[durangodawood]

It is heartbreaking to experience the actual hell knowing that you will never experience the same environment you had on earth!

You know this....how?

 

[wayfaring man]

I'd rather believe there's a hell and find out there isn't.....then believe that there isn't - and find out there is....

 

[ImAllLikeOkWaitWat]

All you need to know.

 

[Learn2live]

For what purpose has a benevolent God created hell. Perhaps it is to dissuade people from committing the actions that may harm them or others. As a parent tells a child, don't cross the street and enter that jungle, if you do, you will be eaten by a lion who lives there. Or perhaps there is an actual hell that does lasts for eternity. But it is difficult to fathom why a benevolent God who has created humanity would fashion such an existence for mortal souls.

If the existence of an eternal hell is real, what sin causes one to go to hell. We as soldiers kill in the name of national pride and are glorified as heroes. Then there are those who are born gay without a choice on of their own. If the soldier is a glorified hero and the gay person condemned to hell for the way he or she is born, how is this justified?

There is an anomaly to common sense and to our inner most conscience when we start thinking in the ways of hell as punishment. The Lord strikes fear into the hearts of people and with it comes obediance. But true meekness is brought about without fear of hell, without want of anything, and having no pride of ego in his or herself.

I personally doubt there is an eternal hell. It is just difficult to believe that there is an eternal existence of punishment. It is difficult for me to imagine a God of love, a Creator of this universe to have designed it in such a way.

 

[Dave-W]

Hell is real.
Hell is temporary. (it will be thrown into the Lake of Fire after the final judgement)
Hell is infinitely intense torture - physical, emotional, spiritual.
The torture of Hell is continued for eternity in the Lake of Fire.

 

[Dave-W]

I personally doubt there is an eternal hell. It is just difficult to believe that there is an eternal existence of punishment. It is difficult for me to imagine a God of love, a Creator of this universe to have designed it in such a way.

Because you are superimposing your human conception of "love" onto God.

 

[IAMANOBODY2015]

For what purpose has a benevolent God created hell. Perhaps it is to dissuade people from committing the actions that may harm them or others. As a parent tells a child, don't cross the street and enter that jungle, if you do, you will be eaten by a lion who lives there. Or perhaps there is an actual hell that does lasts for eternity. But it is difficult to fathom why a benevolent God who has created humanity would fashion such an existence for mortal souls.

If the existence of an eternal hell is real, what sin causes one to go to hell. We as soldiers kill in the name of national pride and are glorified as heroes. Then there are those who are born gay without a choice on of their own. If the soldier is a glorified hero and the gay person condemned to hell for the way he or she is born, how is this justified?

There is an anomaly to common sense and to our inner most conscience when we start thinking in the ways of hell as punishment. The Lord strikes fear into the hearts of people and with it comes obediance. But true meekness is brought about without fear of hell, without want of anything, and having no pride of ego in his or herself.

I personally doubt there is an eternal hell. It is just difficult to believe that there is an eternal existence of punishment. It is difficult for me to imagine a God of love, a Creator of this universe to have designed it in such a way.

I don't understand God's love at all. But I know better to question God.

Hell scares me.

 

[durangodawood]

I'd rather believe there's a hell and find out there isn't.....then believe that there isn't - and find out there is....

Thats a terrible way of thinking.

It sort of twists you into believe whatever story proposes the very worst downside to disregarding the story.

I'd hope people can see through this transparent appeal to fear.

 

[football5680]

Because you are superimposing your human conception of "love" onto God.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[Aryeh]

Hell is real.
Hell is temporary. (it will be thrown into the Lake of Fire after the final judgement)
Hell is infinitely intense torture - physical, emotional, spiritual.
The torture of Hell is continued for eternity in the Lake of Fire.

Then that solidifies my choice NOT to have kids.

I don't want them to possibly fail, and go "there."

I imagine many people are distraught who try to reconcile their assumed unwarranted, unrequested birth - and hell as we know it.

Even existentialism is enough, some times. And, then you have to make sure you also don't do enough to go to hell. Or, (since it is God's choice who He draws anyway,) hope you are on God's radar, and you aren't a vessel created for destruction and learning so that His chosen can learn and live.

 

[JackRT]

As human beings we are bounded in both time and place. That is to say, we are finite. On the other hand we think of God as completely unbounded. God exists outside of both time and space. God is present everywhere and at all times. That is to say, God is infinite. This is the orthodox theistic understanding of God. To compare the finite to the infinite is beyond our human comprehension. Even to compare a grain of sand to Mount Everest falls far, far, far short. All of this brings up a number of questions in my mind.

The first question being “How is it even possible for a finite creature to offend an infinite God?” Could a grain of sand offend Mount Everest?

The second question being “If it were possible for the finite to offend the infinite, would the infinite punishment of a finite creature be just?” I will attempt to craft an analogy. You are in a park enjoying a picnic lunch when you glance down and notice an ant crawling across your sandwich. You are offended. How do you react? You have a number of options. You could ignore the ant. You could brush the ant away. You could move to a different location. You could kill the ant. You could kill the entire ant colony. You could capture the ant and confine it and proceed to torture it for several weeks until it finally dies. That last option is quite inadequate as a comparison to hell because hell is infinite in duration whereas the ant can only be tortured for a finite length of time.

To me the concept of hell flies in the face of any concept of a just and compassionate God. Hell would seem to be an entirely human invention based on a vindictive concept of retributory justice. Perhaps we have the wrong idea of hell. Perhaps we have the wrong idea of justice. Perhaps we have the wrong idea of God. I completely reject the concept of hell as it is traditionally understood in most Christian churches.

 

[IAMANOBODY2015]

Then that solidifies my choice NOT to have kids.

I don't want them to possibly fail, and go "there."

I imagine many people are distraught who try to reconcile their assumed unwarranted, unrequested birth - and hell as we know it.

Even existentialism is enough, some times. And, then you have to make sure you also don't do enough to go to hell. Or, (since it is God's choice who He draws anyway,) hope you are on God's radar, and you aren't a vessel created for destruction and learning so that His chosen can learn and live.

Definitely agree with this.

 

[Aryeh]

As human beings we are bounded in both time and place. That is to say, we are finite. On the other hand we think of God as completely unbounded. God exists outside of both time and space. God is present everywhere and at all times. That is to say, God is infinite. This is the orthodox theistic understanding of God. To compare the finite to the infinite is beyond our human comprehension. Even to compare a grain of sand to Mount Everest falls far, far, far short. All of this brings up a number of questions in my mind.

The first question being “How is it even possible for a finite creature to offend an infinite God?” Could a grain of sand offend Mount Everest?

The second question being “If it were possible for the finite to offend the infinite, would the infinite punishment of a finite creature be just?” I will attempt to craft an analogy. You are in a park enjoying a picnic lunch when you glance down and notice an ant crawling across your sandwich. You are offended. How do you react? You have a number of options. You could ignore the ant. You could brush the ant away. You could move to a different location. You could kill the ant. You could kill the entire ant colony. You could capture the ant and confine it and proceed to torture it for several weeks until it finally dies. That last option is quite inadequate as a comparison to hell because hell is infinite in duration whereas the ant can only be tortured for a finite length of time.

To me the concept of hell flies in the face of any concept of a just and compassionate God. Hell would seem to be an entirely human invention based on a vindictive concept of retributory justice. Perhaps we have the wrong idea of hell. Perhaps we have the wrong idea of justice. Perhaps we have the wrong idea of God. I completely reject the concept of hell as it is traditionally understood in most Christian churches.

I would love to reject the hellfire and damnation doctrine of hell, but the has done it's job perfectly.

Out of FEAR, I can't afford NOT to believe there is a fiery pit many of us will be thrown in - for at least a measurable amount of time of supreme torture.

Ideally, one would just "sleep," cease to exist. And, from what I understand that was the Hebrew notion, until the Church decided to add a bit of "flare."

Plus, it isn't like any angel, magistrate or even prophet has helped/instructed us any differently on hell. We have the canon, but the canon implies fire, brimstone and eternal torture.

So, is it surprising you get people who are scared to literal death of God following Him out of fear? I don't think that is what He wants, and when He says, "Fear the Lord..." He means to revere him.

Moreover, how do we expect people to "buy into" God, when we say, "we are all degenerates destined for hell?" Yet, if one does convert, one must be righteous along the narrow road, and there is no guarantee after all of that you still won't end up in flames.

I don't really blame people for wanting to "only live once," and participating in debauchery as if they have already seen their fate?


If you think about it, hell can deter people from God.

 

[JackRT]

I came across this years ago but I cannot recall the source:

What About Hell? Fiction and Fact

By Jon M. Sweeney

5 popular fictions:
1. The Bible is crystal clear on the subject of Hell. (It isn't. The Bible is vague at best.)
2. Jesus said that Hell is real. (He didn't, but he spoke several times about Gehenna, a violent, sad place just outside Jerusalem where child sacrifice once took place.)
3. Hell has nine descending circles. (That's all Dante, Hell's true architect.)
4. The worse your sins in life, the worse your punishments for eternity. (Again, that's Dante, this time inspired by Aristotle and Cicero.)
5. Satan reigns in Hell, with pitchfork and tail. (In the Bible, Satan is mostly an impersonal force.)

5 little known facts:
1. Of all the world's scriptures, the Qur'an teaches most consistently the concept of a violent afterlife for unrepentant sinners.
2. Hell is far more real in Virgil's Aeneid than in the New Testament.
3. The Old Testament speaks only of Sheol, not Hell, and Sheol is the dusty place in the earth where everybody goes after they die.
4. St. Paul, who lived and wrote before the New Testament gospels were written, doesn't seem to have thought much about Hell at all.
5. The idea of Hell wouldn't have been possible without the doctrine of the immortality of the soul, and that comes most from Socrates and Plato.

What does all this mean? Perhaps: For 2,000 years, Christian teaching on Hell has been built more on ancient myth and pagan philosophy than the Bible. So, Christians who still want to preach Hell, should at least know what they're talking about.

 

[SnowyMacie]

I personally believe that the unsaved will be tormented by being in the presence of God because while unable (willing or not, I'm a bit unsure as to which is true) accept God's love, thus being in communion and fellowship with him. In other words, the saved and unsaved are in the presence of God; to the righteous, it is comfort, to the wicked, agony.This ultimate rejection of being image of God will result in them become less and less human to the point they ultimately destroy themselves.


Probably the best videos on Hell I've ever seen

 

[Sammy-San]

Hell is real.
Hell is temporary. (it will be thrown into the Lake of Fire after the final judgement)
Hell is infinitely intense torture - physical, emotional, spiritual.
The torture of Hell is continued for eternity in the Lake of Fire.

Would it be incorrect to say people are in Hell for eternity? The term "Hell" has evolved to mean the place where people are punished after death.

 

[Aryeh]

Since we are in the E&M I will throw this out there...

How do we know that we aren't already in Hell? Because the sky is blue. Because the genetically modified Frankenfood tastes OK?

The structure of the planet screams hell. It screams injustice. It screams silence from help. It screams with torment already.

And, it has been like that for thousands of years.

What if that "hope" already came, saved the world, took them with Him, and left the rest of us here - and we keep having kids born into this hell ignorant of the state.

Even the patriarchs actually spoke to God. People saw His activity. Faith was rewarded concretely, and one could draw a line of distinction.

Now? We defend the lies that up is down, left is right, black is white - with vigor. We promote destruction of ourselves, and ignore the suffering of others. We expect some phantom paradigm to change the results of life. Many of us already worship beasts. We tolerate lies. We know our leaders lie to us, and we turn a blind eye. We admonish any information that makes us comfortable.

Earth is a rotten cesspool; that has to be obvious in order to escape the PSYCHOSIS of believing this planet is worth living forever on (as per longevity and such.) PeoE should be happy to die and go to heaven
People should be rejoicing that their friends and family get white robes of light before God.

And yet, we mourn when people die, despite eulogies about God and how He watches over us. It is a spiritual psychosis - similar to men who LOVE war and fighting in them as opposed to peace, or simply "getting a job done." This may be especially apt, considering we are at spiritual war.

(I think earth is physical heaven trying to be hell, but soon to be restored to physical heaven.)