Why do people like Seventh-day Adventist and Adventist doctrine?

[stuart lawrence]

Instead of that - the "details" in Christ's teaching in the verses quoted are on the 5th commandment and the law-breaking efforts of Jewish leaders to promote "traditions of man" above "Moses Said" - and above "The Word of God" and above "The Commandments of God" ... this was making void their worship according to Christ.

Let's quote the actual text and see.

Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

Yes each one of the details I listed is IN the text being quoted.

The teachers of the law and Pharisees sit in Moses seat so you must be careful to do everything they tell you
But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach
Matt23:2&3
The above cannot possibly refer to the traditions of men, for concerning those they did practice what they preached!

 

[BobRyan]

James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

It based on "He who said"


Now let's look at the "actual Bible details" in James' teaching in the verses quoted in James 2 -- the details of two of the TEN Commandments. James argument is that what makes them binding on NT saints is "HE WHO SAID" - it is the fact that God is speaking - that it is His commandments as given in the actual Bible.

In fact James' focus is on the "WORD" the written WORD , on scripture, the Code of LAW WRITTEN in the Bible... the very thing we have seen some folks condemn in other posts.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Anyone who claims the christian is under a law of righteousness rejects the core foundation of the christian faith, and the core message of the person who wrote half the books of the NT

And people who do claim the christian is under the law unto righteousness dont obey the law themselves, so by their own words they stand condemned

 

[BobRyan]

stuart lawrence said: ↑
The Pharisees insisted the people fully obey the law, but on the inside were full of wickedness, hypocrisy and everything unclean.

Instead of that false idea of "Jews insisting that people faithfully and fully obey the Law of God" in Mark 7:6-13 let's look at the "actual Bible details" in Christ's teaching in the verses quoted are on the 5th commandment and the law-breaking efforts of Jewish leaders to promote "traditions of man" above "Moses Said" - and above "The Word of God" and above "The Commandments of God" ... this was making void their worship according to Christ.

Let's quote the actual text and see.

Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

Yes each one of the details I listed is IN the text being quoted.

Instead of Christ charging them with obeying the Word of God, the Commandment of God, the place where "Moses said" -- Christ charges them with violating the "Commandment of God", the written code, the Word of God, the place where "Moses said". Instead of the problem being that they are too faithful, or too obedient to God's Commandments, the charge is that they are too quick to use "traditions of man" -- speculations of man to set aside the Commandment of God - the written code.

In fact Christ focuses on the "WORD" the written WORD , on scripture, the Code of LAW WRITTEN in the Bible... the very thing

we have seen some folks condemn in other posts.

The teachers of the law and Pharisees sit in Moses seat so you must be careful to do everything they tell you
But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach
Matt23:2&3
The above cannot possibly refer to the traditions of men, for concerning those they did practice what they preached!

If your choice is to ignore the teaching of Christ in Mark 7 and only look at Matt 23... just let us know why.

After all Mark 7 has been posted many times trying to get you to pay attention to those details -- and now at last ... you almost agreed to tolerate some details in that teaching of Christ.. then quickly skipped past it once again... this time going to Matt 23 "instead".

 

[stuart lawrence]

James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

It based on "He who said"


Now let's look at the "actual Bible details" in James' teaching in the verses quoted in James 2 -- the details of two of the TEN Commandments. James argument is that what makes them binding on NT saints is "HE WHO SAID" - it is the fact that God is speaking - that it is His commandments as given in the actual Bible.

In fact James' focus is on the "WORD" the written WORD , on scripture, the Code of LAW WRITTEN in the Bible... the very thing we have seen some folks condemn in other posts.

For whoever keeps the whole law yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

Therefore under your law of righteousness it is sinless perfection or you are condemned to hell.

I worry about you, I truly do, you relentlessly quote scripture Tha proves your beliefs to be nonsensical

 

[stuart lawrence]

If your choice is to ignore the teaching of Christ in Mark 7 and only look at Matt 23... just let us know why.

I've never ignored the teaching of mark 7
Ie

What goes into a persons stomach does not make them unclean but what comes out of the heart does.
Hope you dont ignore matt23

 

[stuart lawrence]

If your choice is to ignore the teaching of Christ in Mark 7 and only look at Matt 23... just let us know why.

Of course mark 7 is in alignment with Paul twice stating in rom ch14 ALL food is clean

Meat is food!!

ALL food is clean

 

[stuart lawrence]

Under the NC it is the traditions of men that insist you must refrain from the levitical unclean foods, for NC scripture states:
ALL food is clean

 

[stuart lawrence]

That is a violation of TC at CF -- are you aware of that?



Would you mind confining yourself to questions that are not false accusations and violations of TC of CF rules??

?

BTW

If you were on another website I have debated on, you would have been banned by now for posting against what is very plainly written in the bible when you claim the Christian is under the law/ of righteousness

 

[BobRyan]

James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

It based on "He who said"


Now let's look at the "actual Bible details" in James' teaching in the verses quoted in James 2 -- the details of two of the TEN Commandments. James argument is that what makes them binding on NT saints is "HE WHO SAID" - it is the fact that God is speaking - that it is His commandments as given in the actual Bible.

In fact James' focus is on the "WORD" the written WORD , on scripture, the Code of LAW WRITTEN in the Bible... the very thing we have seen some folks condemn in other posts.

For whoever keeps the whole law yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

Therefore under your law of righteousness it is sinless perfection or you are condemned to hell.

I worry about you, I truly do, you relentlessly quote scripture Tha proves your beliefs to be nonsensical

Ignoring almost the entirety of James 2:8-12 - you apparently agree to tolerate "just vs 10" as if the rest can be deleted. Why do that? In what you ignore we see James quoting the very written code that some would 'condemn' . And what is more instead of James arguing that vs 10 leaves us in position to go ahead and take God's name in vain - James argues the opposite of it. And we both know it.


Now let's look at the "actual Bible details" in James' teaching in the verses quoted in James 2 -- the details of two of the TEN Commandments. James argument is that what makes them binding on NT saints is "HE WHO SAID" - it is the fact that God is speaking - that it is His commandments as given in the actual Bible.

In fact James' focus is on the "WORD" the written WORD , on scripture, the Code of LAW WRITTEN in the Bible... the very thing we have seen some folks condemn in other posts.

 

[BobRyan]

It's not about the 10 commandments, it's not about The Law.

And Paul demands that we admit that the TEN commandments are included in the LAW of God in Eph 6:2 in Romans 13, in Romans 7 as does James demand it in James 2, as does Christ demand it in Matthew 19 -- as we have show a few zillion times on this thread.

Please give us "The Bible" instead, if you looking to present a compelling POV.

We have been given instructions by Christ himself in many places in the Bible concerning what is expected of us.

As we saw in Mark 7:6-13

How then does God view this idea of editing/downsizing one of the "Commandments of God"??


Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

It based on "He who said"


Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


These are the basics,

Matthew 22:37
Jesus declared, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'

Mark 12:30
and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'

Mark 12:33
and to love Him with all your heart and with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself, which is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."

Luke 10:27
He answered, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind' and 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'"

Deuteronomy 4:29
"But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find Him if you search for Him with all your heart and all your soul.

Deuteronomy 10:12
"Now, Israel, what does the LORD your God require from you, but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all His ways and love Him, and to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul

=====

all of those scriptures stated - before the cross. And none of them deleting the TEN commandments

Even your own Pope John Paul II admits that the TEN Commandments are for all mankind - the moral law of God.

so also does your own CCC. This is not the part where you are supposed to differ. (Though we do have many differences with the RCC - the Bible TEN commandments as the moral law of God for all mankind -- is not one of them)... Hence my signature line.

In the first 2 commandments there is the fulfillment of the ten. No need for the 613 Mitzvahs (Commandments) of the Torah. That is really what I am getting at here. Legalism is no longer necessary now that we have Grace.

Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


hint: Lev 19:18 and Deut 6:5 did not "delete Exodus 20" when they were given in the OT nor when they are quoted in the NT. I think we all can see that.

And even your own Pope John Paul II, and your own CCC admit the TEN Commandments (all ten) remain included in the moral law of God binding on all mankind. I think we both know that.

your denomination and mine - have some points of difference. But this Bible detail that all TEN of the TEN Commandments are still included in the moral law of God and are still binding on all mankind - even binding on the people of God, is not one of those differences.

Is that the 2 great commandments, the 10 commandments, or the 613 commandments?

Answer: Lev 19:18 is one of the 613 in the OT and it is one of the 1050 in the NT as we see in Matt 22.

What is your point?

Here is another one --

"Do not take God's name in vain" is one of the 613 in the OT but not one of the 1050 in the NT.

 

[BobRyan]

BTW

If you were on another website I have debated on, you would have been banned by now

Your constant resort to ad hominem false accusation would have gotten you banned on some of the other web sites I post on.. what is worse you 'quote you' to create false positions for me - instead of actually giving one of my positions.

Can't imagine a worse example of "fruit". But you have free will -- you can go down that road if you wish.

 

[stuart lawrence]

And Paul demands that we admit that the TEN commandments are included in the LAW of God in Eph 6:2 in Romans 13, in Romans 7 as does James demand it in James 2, as does Christ demand it in Matthew 19 -- as we have show a few zillion times on this thread.

Please give us "The Bible" instead, if you looking to present a compelling POV.




As we saw in Mark 7:6-13

How then does God view this idea of editing/downsizing one of the "Commandments of God"??


Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

It based on "He who said"


Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


These are the basics,

Matthew 22:37
Jesus declared, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'

Mark 12:30
and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'

Mark 12:33
and to love Him with all your heart and with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself, which is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."

Luke 10:27
He answered, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind' and 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'"

Deuteronomy 4:29
"But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find Him if you search for Him with all your heart and all your soul.

Deuteronomy 10:12
"Now, Israel, what does the LORD your God require from you, but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all His ways and love Him, and to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul

=====

all of those scriptures stated - before the cross. And none of them deleting the TEN commandments

Even your own Pope John Paul II admits that the TEN Commandments are for all mankind - the moral law of God.

so also does your own CCC. This is not the part where you are supposed to differ. (Though we do have many differences with the RCC - the Bible TEN commandments as the moral law of God for all mankind -- is not one of them)... Hence my signature line.






Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


hint: Lev 19:18 and Deut 6:5 did not "delete Exodus 20" when they were given in the OT nor when they are quoted in the NT. I think we all can see that.

And even your own Pope John Paul II, and your own CCC admit the TEN Commandments (all ten) remain included in the moral law of God binding on all mankind. I think we both know that.

your denomination and mine - have some points of difference. But this Bible detail that all TEN of the TEN Commandments are still included in the moral law of God and are still binding on all mankind - even binding on the people of God, is not one of those differences.



Answer: Lev 19:18 is one of the 613 in the OT and it is one of the 1050 in the NT as we see in Matt 22.

What is your point?

Here is another one --

"Do not take God's name in vain" is one of the 613 in the OT but not one of the 1050 in the NT.

James focus is on the written code?
So now you must claim James opposes Paul's message for he states we have been released from the law and serve in the new way of the spirit, not the old way of the written code.
Clearly you are just desperate to try and make scripture state what you want it to state.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Your constant resort to ad hominem false accusation would have gotten you banned on some of the other web sites I post on.. what is worse you 'quote you' to create false positions for me - instead of actually giving one of my positions.

Can't imagine a worse example of "fruit". But you have free will -- you can go down that road if you wish.

What else can you do but malign me. When your beliefs are proved to be wrong with an abundance of scripture you simply ignore the scripture put before you which plainly shows tour error.
You have to deflect away from that any which way you can

 

[stuart lawrence]

Your constant resort to ad hominem false accusation would have gotten you banned on some of the other web sites I post on.. what is worse you 'quote you' to create false positions for me - instead of actually giving one of my positions.

Can't imagine a worse example of "fruit". But you have free will -- you can go down that road if you wish.

Just to recap

I gave you sixteen verses of scripture proving the christian is not under a law of righteousness. You ignored them all then claim I ignore your scriptures.

You cannot give me one verse of scripture once the NC is in operation That states

You must obey the TEN commandments.

So you have to try and make scripture fit your errant beliefs with faulty exegesis.

Besides this your church believes under the NC the levitical unclean foods are still unclean.

Yet Paul twice states in rom ch14

ALL( ALL) food us clean

Your errors do mount up

 

[stuart lawrence]

Your constant resort to ad hominem false accusation would have gotten you banned on some of the other web sites I post on.. what is worse you 'quote you' to create false positions for me - instead of actually giving one of my positions.

Can't imagine a worse example of "fruit". But you have free will -- you can go down that road if you wish.

You also claim the christian must follow the written code when Paul plainly states we do not serve in the old way of the written code.

You constantly ignore the plainest of scripture that refutes your errant beliefs

 

[stuart lawrence]

And Paul demands that we admit that the TEN commandments are included in the LAW of God in Eph 6:2 in Romans 13, in Romans 7 as does James demand it in James 2, as does Christ demand it in Matthew 19 -- as we have show a few zillion times on this thread.

Please give us "The Bible" instead, if you looking to present a compelling POV.




As we saw in Mark 7:6-13

How then does God view this idea of editing/downsizing one of the "Commandments of God"??


Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

It based on "He who said"


Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


These are the basics,

Matthew 22:37
Jesus declared, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'

Mark 12:30
and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'

Mark 12:33
and to love Him with all your heart and with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself, which is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."

Luke 10:27
He answered, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind' and 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'"

Deuteronomy 4:29
"But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find Him if you search for Him with all your heart and all your soul.

Deuteronomy 10:12
"Now, Israel, what does the LORD your God require from you, but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all His ways and love Him, and to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul

=====

all of those scriptures stated - before the cross. And none of them deleting the TEN commandments

Even your own Pope John Paul II admits that the TEN Commandments are for all mankind - the moral law of God.

so also does your own CCC. This is not the part where you are supposed to differ. (Though we do have many differences with the RCC - the Bible TEN commandments as the moral law of God for all mankind -- is not one of them)... Hence my signature line.






Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


hint: Lev 19:18 and Deut 6:5 did not "delete Exodus 20" when they were given in the OT nor when they are quoted in the NT. I think we all can see that.

And even your own Pope John Paul II, and your own CCC admit the TEN Commandments (all ten) remain included in the moral law of God binding on all mankind. I think we both know that.

your denomination and mine - have some points of difference. But this Bible detail that all TEN of the TEN Commandments are still included in the moral law of God and are still binding on all mankind - even binding on the people of God, is not one of those differences.



Answer: Lev 19:18 is one of the 613 in the OT and it is one of the 1050 in the NT as we see in Matt 22.

What is your point?

Here is another one --

"Do not take God's name in vain" is one of the 613 in the OT but not one of the 1050 in the NT.

As you are not prepared to yield to the immense amount of very plain scriptures placed before you that directly refute your beliefs/ you just ignore them all As you try to divert away from these scriptures placed before you by writing lengthy posts with the aim of contradicting the very plain scriptures placed before you this conversation is futile.
In my view this debate has highlighted many sda glaring errors. Something good came from it then

 

[BobRyan]

You cannot give me one verse of scripture once the NC is in operation That states

You must obey the TEN commandments.

I already gave you Ephesians 6:2 -- and we both know it.
I already gave you 1 Cor 7:19 -- and we both know it.
I already gave you Rev 14:12 - and we both know it.
I already gave you Hebrews 8:6-10 -- and we both know it.
I already showed you the teaching of Christ in Mark 7:6-13 -- and we both know it.
I already showed you the teaching of Christ on the subject "which commandments" in Matt 19 -- and we both know it.

I already gave you James 2:8-12 -- and we both know it.

 

[BobRyan]

It's not about the 10 commandments, it's not about The Law.

And Paul demands that we admit that the TEN commandments are included in the LAW of God in Eph 6:2 in Romans 13, in Romans 7 as does James demand it in James 2, as does Christ demand it in Matthew 19 -- as we have show a few zillion times on this thread.

Please give us "The Bible" instead, if you looking to present a compelling POV.

We have been given instructions by Christ himself in many places in the Bible concerning what is expected of us.

As we saw in Mark 7:6-13

How then does God view this idea of editing/downsizing one of the "Commandments of God"??


Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

It based on "He who said"


Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


These are the basics,

Matthew 22:37
Jesus declared, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'

Mark 12:30
and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'

Mark 12:33
and to love Him with all your heart and with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself, which is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."

Luke 10:27
He answered, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind' and 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'"

Deuteronomy 4:29
"But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find Him if you search for Him with all your heart and all your soul.

Deuteronomy 10:12
"Now, Israel, what does the LORD your God require from you, but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all His ways and love Him, and to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul

=====

all of those scriptures stated - before the cross. And none of them deleting the TEN commandments

Even your own Pope John Paul II admits that the TEN Commandments are for all mankind - the moral law of God.

so also does your own CCC. This is not the part where you are supposed to differ. (Though we do have many differences with the RCC - the Bible TEN commandments as the moral law of God for all mankind -- is not one of them)... Hence my signature line.

In the first 2 commandments there is the fulfillment of the ten. No need for the 613 Mitzvahs (Commandments) of the Torah. That is really what I am getting at here. Legalism is no longer necessary now that we have Grace.

Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


hint: Lev 19:18 and Deut 6:5 did not "delete Exodus 20" when they were given in the OT nor when they are quoted in the NT. I think we all can see that.

And even your own Pope John Paul II, and your own CCC admit the TEN Commandments (all ten) remain included in the moral law of God binding on all mankind. I think we both know that.

your denomination and mine - have some points of difference. But this Bible detail that all TEN of the TEN Commandments are still included in the moral law of God and are still binding on all mankind - even binding on the people of God, is not one of those differences.

Is that the 2 great commandments, the 10 commandments, or the 613 commandments?

Answer: Lev 19:18 is one of the 613 in the OT and it is one of the 1050 in the NT as we see in Matt 22.

What is your point?

Here is another one --

"Do not take God's name in vain" is one of the 613 in the OT but not one of the 1050 in the NT.

As you are not prepared to yield to the immense amount of very plain scriptures placed before you that directly refute your beliefs/ you just ignore them all As you try to divert away from these scriptures placed before you by writing lengthy posts with the aim of contradicting the very plain scriptures placed before you this conversation is futile.
In my view this debate has highlighted many sda glaring errors. Something good came from it then

Hint: That was me presenting scripture.

Less fiction - more reality please.

 

[stuart lawrence]

And Paul demands that we admit that the TEN commandments are included in the LAW of God in Eph 6:2 in Romans 13, in Romans 7 as does James demand it in James 2, as does Christ demand it in Matthew 19 -- as we have show a few zillion times on this thread.

Please give us "The Bible" instead, if you looking to present a compelling POV.




As we saw in Mark 7:6-13

How then does God view this idea of editing/downsizing one of the "Commandments of God"??


Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

James 2
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well;
9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by THE Law as transgressors.
10 For whoever shall keep the whole Law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of THE Law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

It based on "He who said"


Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


These are the basics,

Matthew 22:37
Jesus declared, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'

Mark 12:30
and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'

Mark 12:33
and to love Him with all your heart and with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself, which is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices."

Luke 10:27
He answered, "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind' and 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'"

Deuteronomy 4:29
"But from there you will seek the LORD your God, and you will find Him if you search for Him with all your heart and all your soul.

Deuteronomy 10:12
"Now, Israel, what does the LORD your God require from you, but to fear the LORD your God, to walk in all His ways and love Him, and to serve the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul

=====

all of those scriptures stated - before the cross. And none of them deleting the TEN commandments

Even your own Pope John Paul II admits that the TEN Commandments are for all mankind - the moral law of God.

so also does your own CCC. This is not the part where you are supposed to differ. (Though we do have many differences with the RCC - the Bible TEN commandments as the moral law of God for all mankind -- is not one of them)... Hence my signature line.






Eph 6:2
2 “Honor your father and mother,” which is the first commandment with promise:

Ten Commandments spoken by Christ at Sinai - Ex 20. Heb 8:6-10

And in His frequently upholding of Lev 19:18 "Love our neighbor as yourself"
And to "Love God with all your heart " Deut 6:5


hint: Lev 19:18 and Deut 6:5 did not "delete Exodus 20" when they were given in the OT nor when they are quoted in the NT. I think we all can see that.

And even your own Pope John Paul II, and your own CCC admit the TEN Commandments (all ten) remain included in the moral law of God binding on all mankind. I think we both know that.

your denomination and mine - have some points of difference. But this Bible detail that all TEN of the TEN Commandments are still included in the moral law of God and are still binding on all mankind - even binding on the people of God, is not one of those differences.



Answer: Lev 19:18 is one of the 613 in the OT and it is one of the 1050 in the NT as we see in Matt 22.

What is your point?

Here is another one --

"Do not take God's name in vain" is one of the 613 in the OT but not one of the 1050 in the NT.



Hint: That was me presenting scripture.

Less fiction - more reality please.

And Paul demands....?????

Your kiddin right?

You believe Paul preached a false Gospel message

He relentlessly states the christian is not under a law of righteousness. You believe that is a false statement.
Paul states ALL(ALL) food is clean.
SDA believe that is a false statement
Paul believes the christian dies to the law, they have been released from the law and don't serve in the old way of the written code.
You believe that is a false statement.
Paul states one man considers one day more holy/ sacred than another, another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind.
There is nothing in or around that verse that mentions feast days/ ceremonial days.
So you believe Paul made a false statement.
You believe James preaches a message opposed to Paul for you say James stresses the written code must be followed.
So why are you starting a post that states:

And Paul demands....

You believe Paul preached a false message, so you must believe he preached false demands.