Why evolution should not be a religious issue

[HitchSlap]

Ah, I see.....Observing things that already exist, that have already been created by .....?

{ "The fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God'." }

Yes, observing things that already exist, and refining explanatory models that best comport with reality.

 

[Astrophile]

Is that how Pluto was demoted?

Probably. That's why most astronomers now regard Pluto, Ceres, Eris, Haumea and Makemake as dwarf planets. But this is off-topic.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Good luck, friend, you're attempting to debate with the willfully ignorant.

Wrong again, the willfully ignorant are those that believe that Bible stories. Please it is not honest to steal the accurate description of those that accept reality of creationists.

A typical bypassing of the question, and a typical deflection. When did I bring up trusting the Bible more than any other religious books in my question?

You are not fooling anyone with this approach. I can see that my questions cut to the quick Why did you dodge them?

(I do, but that's besides the point, and was inserted by you, not me.)

No, it was the point.

You claim to have these 'intelligent ideas' that come out of thin air, then proceed to try and prove then by testing them against what...other ideas that came from some other intelligent thinker upper of ideas.

No, I made no such claims. Please, strawman arguments are not honest either. Try again and ask properly next tiem.

Ok, fine, but are you then intelligent enough in your creative idea-thinking to acknowledge and believe in the Supreme Intelligent Idea-Creator that is the Source of all Intelligence? Or do you use your OWN intelligence to think up the idea that you are your own Creator?

There is no valid evidence for this creator. Why would anyone believe in something that is not supported by any valid evidence? Or perhaps you have some. I doubt it since most creationists do not understand the nature of evidence.

 

[AV1611VET]

Probably. That's why most astronomers now regard Pluto, Ceres, Eris, Haumea and Makemake as dwarf planets. But this is off-topic.

How's come the Hydrogen atom hasn't been demoted?

It doesn't even have a neutron!

 

[HitchSlap]

Once more I don't see what other people's flaws, if indeed they are flaws, would have to do with me personally and why I would need to become enmeshed in any dispute revolving around such alleged flaws. .
As for invoking anything, I am not invoking out of a psychological necessity as you are implying. I am merely taking things to their logical conclusion. That you consider those conclusions illogical is your right to an opinion just as it is my right to consider yours equally as illogical and unwarranted.

BTW
I don't consider the universe a mystery. I view it as an effect of a designing intellect. So the first mystery you are proposing doesn't exist in my viewpoint. The second mystery, or the nature of it, fits more into the mysterious. However, delving into those areas would throw the thread completely off so perhaps it should be discussed on a thread of its own. .

Again, fine. But don't spout off about what you think ID is, and when I point you're in the wrong direction, feign disgust that I'm not addressing what you personally believe about ID. This is typical creationist behavior - knock it off, it's rude.

 

[AV1611VET]

Let's be civil, gentlemen.

It's Christmas.

 

[Astrophile]

How's come the Hydrogen atom hasn't been demoted?

It doesn't even have a neutron!

As I said, this is off-topic in this thread. Perhaps we could discuss it in 'Kylie's Pluto Challenge'.

 

[HitchSlap]

Let's be civil, gentlemen.

It's Christmas.

Happy Holidays!

 

[Kenny'sID]

What "paper"? The Bible is not a valid source for science. If you want to claim that it is the burden of proof is upon you. Otherwise myths from any religion have just as much weight as yours does.

Kenny, you don't even seem to understand the nature of evidence. How about we start there?

The "you don't understand" is about the weakest cop out of an argument I've heard yet around here, so please, just don't.

Burden of proof? I gave you my proof. If you disagree with it, refute it, but pretending what I consider my proof, and what I used to draw my conclusion with, is not there at all, is a super cop out.

If you can't handle the heat, don't turn the oven up.

That's just not going to get you out if this...you wanted a paper, you got a paper, and now we have to abide by your rules too? What's next, we all have to agree your way is right in the end?

The bible didn't force me to draw my conclusion, it's drawn strictly on what I feel is most sensible, my proof is what I saw/what I observed, and I don't even know why I'm having to explain any of this lol. You think I'm wrong, tell me why...simple. Then tell me why it simply happening is more, what was the term? Cogent? than my conclusion.

The floor is yours.

 

[HitchSlap]

The "you don't understand" is about the weakest cop out of an argument I've heard yet around here, so please, just don't.

Burden of proof? I gave you my proof. If you disagree with it, refute it, but pretending what I consider my proof, and what I used to draw my conclusion with, is not there at all, is a super cop out.

If you can't handle the heat, don't turn the oven up.

That's not going to get to get you out if this...you wanted a paper, you got a paper, and now we have to abide by your rules too? What's next, we all have to agree your way is right in the end?

The bible didn't force me to draw my conclusion, it's drawn strictly on what I feel is most sensible.

The floor is yours.

Sensible conclusions are based on a bare modicum of knowledge, of which you've demonstrated none.

As for "evidence" you've provided, you're not even cooking with gas, so I wouldn't be too worried about hot kitchens just yet.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Sensible conclusions are based on a bare modicum of knowledge, of which you've demonstrated none.

As for "evidence" you've provided, you're not even cooking with gas, so I wouldn't be too worried about hot kitchens just yet.

Evasive maneuvers Captain.

What are you afraid of, Hitch? What is not knowledgeable about believing what I see? Seems pretty sensible to me. But clearly, that's just me.

Go ahead, tear my paper/me and my conclusion pieces, or am I just going to get more excuses?

 

[Kenny'sID]

I could sit here all day long and tell you how you've demonstrated no knowledge, or how you aren't cooking with gas either, but that's just not going to get us anywhere now is it, Hitch?

I prefer to stick with the flow here.

 

[Neatz]

Happy Holidays!

Why? If there is no God, there is no Holy, or Holy Days, ... there is ultimately no happy either, so saying Happy Holidays as a non-believer is rather moronic. But then again, I DID ask for your source....... ;D

 

[Subduction Zone]

The "you don't understand" is about the weakest cop out of an argument I've heard yet around here, so please, just don't.

Wrong again. You keep posting strawman arguments and other fallacies that show you have a very very limited understanding of science.

Burden of proof? I gave you my proof. If you disagree with it, refute it, but pretending what I consider my proof, and what I used to draw my conclusion with, is not there at all, is a super cop out.

You gave no valid evidence, you gave no proof. You hand waved in an argument and it only takes a handwave to refute your claims.

If you can't handle the heat, don't turn the oven up.

I can handle it fine. I am not the one that runs away from debates here.

That's just not going to get you out if this...you wanted a paper, you got a paper, and now we have to abide by your rules too? What's next, we all have to agree your way is right in the end?

Wrong, I needed a proper peer reviewed paper. You provided junk science.

The bible didn't force me to draw my conclusion, it's drawn strictly on what I feel is most sensible, my proof is what I saw/what I observed, and I don't even know why I'm having to explain any of this lol. You think I'm wrong, tell me why...simple. Then tell me why it simply happening is more, what was the term? Cogent? than my conclusion.

But that is not "proof". In fact that is the weakest sort of evidence out there. You are relying on your errant translation of a book that has been shown to be far from trustworthy in matters of science. You can't complain when your religious views are kicked out of school for being without merit.

The floor is yours.

Fine, let's go over this image again:

I know that you can't see it but it does refute the claim of a worldwide flood roughly 4,500 years ago. Let's keep it short and sweet and deal with just this.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Why? If there is no God, there is no Holy, or Holy Days, ... there is ultimately no happy either, so saying Happy Holidays as a non-believer is rather moronic. But then again, I DID ask for your source....... ;D

Equivocation error on your part.


One does not need anything holy for a holiday.

 

[Neatz]

Equivocation error on your part.


One does not need anything holy for a holiday.

Lol a Holy Day, but nothing's Holy. Lol ,
Yep, the source lolol I'm crackin up. Good one!

 

[Subduction Zone]

Lol a Holy Day, but nothing's Holy. Lol ,
Yep, the source lolol I'm crackin up. Good one!

I see that you don't understand how languages work either. The definitions of words change over time. Take the word "homely" for example. It used to have a definition that was very close to the concept of "the girl next door". Now it means nothing of the sort.

The word "Holiday" does obviously have its roots in "holy day" but that does not mean that is the words only definition. There are many holidays that have nothing to do with religion today. Your laughter only underscores your ignorance in this topic.

 

[Kenny'sID]

You gave no valid evidence, you gave no proof.

*Why* it is not evidence, is the part you missed and the part you would have insisted upon had I made the same claim. Double standard.

With all the excuses and evasions of my comments, and now the double staqndards, surly you don't expect me to take anything you bring forth seriously...right? So no, let's not go over your image. And of course you can dismiss my absolutely reasonable take on why I won't and say I'm running from it but that will only help make my point, where you pick and choose what to use and leave relevant arguments unanswered. However I would like you to show me how you concluded I "ran from that" in the first place as you claimed...another request you slipped right by.

You guys are batting 100 on pick and choose/evasion, dotted with double standards, today, and when you are ready to have a fair conversation with equal give and take, with no slipping by what doesn't further *your* agenda, or making challenges and once we go to the trouble to meet them, you hide away/evade, because you can't deal with what you yourself asked for to begin with...then let me know, I may or may not make myself available to you.

As it is, I'm just not seeing the sincerity, and the way you are dealing with things here, makes any debate useless, and a waste of time.

 

[Neatz]

I see that you don't understand how languages work either. The definitions of words change over time. Take the word "homely" for example. It used to have a definition that was very close to the concept of "the girl next door". Now it means nothing of the sort.

The word "Holiday" does obviously have its roots in "holy day" but that does not mean that is the words only definition. There are many holidays that have nothing to do with religion today. Your laughter only underscores your ignorance in this topic.

Lol. Sure sure. A week before most of the world is preparing to celebrate the commemoration of the time when God became man in the person of Jesus Christ, some nice person wishes you a Merry Christmas and you respond with Happy Holidays, (on a website called 'Christian Forums') but you make the claim that there is no God and proceed to lecture me on the meaning of the word Holiday and call me ignorant. Lol ok.
It's alright, keep searching. Jesus loves you. Merry Christmas. ☺

 

[AV1611VET]

Why? If there is no God, there is no Holy, or Holy Days, ... there is ultimately no happy either, so saying Happy Holidays as a non-believer is rather moronic. But then again, I DID ask for your source....... ;D

It's a "private joke."

He knows how I feel about HAPPY HOLIDAYS and SEASON'S GREETINGS.