GENTILES OR CHRISTIANS PRACTICING THE SABBATH ?

[YouAreAwesome]

Thanks for your reply...for the record the 10 no longer apply for the believers

Agree

Love is the best and only foundation.

The letter kills, the Spirit is life.

 

[BobRyan]

Thanks for your reply...for the record the 10 no longer apply for the believers

For the record you just "quoted you" not the Bible.

====================================

here is the actual Bible being quoted --
.

In the NT - sin is still "defined" this way "SIN IS transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4 NKJV

notice how explicitly NT authors not only affirm the Commandments of God - but quote from them to help those who might wonder if the TEN Commandments should be included?

================= notice the "Bible details"


In Matt 22 Jesus affirms OT - LAW and scripture
"Love God with all your heart" Deut 6:5
"Love your neighbor as yourself" Lev 19:18
Matt 22 "On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.

Matt 22
34 But when the Pharisees heard that He had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together. 35 Then one of them, a lawyer, asked Him a question, testing Him, and saying, 36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?”
37 Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ (Deut 6:5) 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ (Lev 19:18) 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

The firm foundation for the LAW and the prophets - LOVE.

TEN COMMANDMENTS AFFIRMED in NT

Matt 19
And someone came to Him and said;Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life 17 And He said to him, Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments; 18 Then he *said to Him, Which ones? And Jesus said,
You shall not commit murder;
You shall not commit adultery;
You shall not steal;
You shall not bear false witness;
19 Honor your father and mother;
and
You shall love your neighbor as yourself


"what matters is Keeping the Commandments of God" 1Cor 7:19

"Love Me and KEEP My Commandments" Ex 20:6
"If you LOVE Me KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15

Matt 5
17 Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.


"do we then make void the Law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we ESTABLISH the LAW" Rom 3:31

What law? The Law that condemns all mankind as sinners -

Rom 3
19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

That same law - same chapter

"do we then make void the Law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we ESTABLISH the LAW" Rom 3:31




Acts 13:15 And after the reading of the Law and the Prophets, the rulers of the synagogue sent to them, saying, Men and brethren, if you have any word of exhortation for the people, say on.

=================================

Rom 7
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
12 So then, the Law is holy, and the commandment is holy and righteous and good.
13 Therefore did that which is good become a cause of death for me? May it never be! Rather it was sin, in order that it might be shown to be sin by effecting my death through that which is good, so that through the commandment sin would become utterly sinful.
14 For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin. 15 For what I am doing, I do not understand; for I am not practicing what I would like to do, but I am doing the very thing I hate. 16 But if I do the very thing I do not want to do, I agree with the Law, confessing that the Law is good.


Rom 13 NKJV
8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law.
9 For the commandments,
“You shall not commit adultery,”
“You shall not murder,”
“You shall not steal,”
“You shall not bear false witness,”
“You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.

Rom 13 HCSB - Holman Bible
8 Do not owe anyone anything, except to love one another, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law.
9 The commandments:
Do not commit adultery;
do not murder;
do not steal;
do not covet;
and whatever other commandment—all are summed up by this: Love your neighbor as yourself.
10 Love does no wrong to a neighbor. Love, therefore, is the fulfillment of the law.



Romans 2
14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law.

13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.
...
25 For circumcision is indeed profitable if you keep the law; but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision has become uncircumcision. 26 Therefore, if an uncircumcised man keeps the righteous requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be counted as circumcision? 27 And will not the physically uncircumcised, if he fulfills the law, judge you who, even with your written code and circumcision, are a transgressor of the law? 28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

Rom 3
19 Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; 20 because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.

"Sin IS transgression of the Law" 1 John 3:4
"ALL have sinned" Romans 3:23

Both Jews AND Gentiles are explicitly included in Romans 2 --
4 Or do you think lightly of the riches of His kindness and tolerance and patience, not knowing that the kindness of God leads you to repentance? 5 But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, 6 who will render to each person according to his deeds: 7 to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life; 8 but to those who are selfishly ambitious and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, wrath and indignation. 9 There will be tribulation and distress for every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek, 10 but glory and honor and peace to everyone who does good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. 11 For there is no partiality with God.


Eph 6: 2 Honor your father and mother (which is the first commandment with a promise), -- the 5th commandment in that still-valid "unit of ten" is the "FIRST commandment with a promise.

James 2
8 If, however, you are fulfilling the royal law according to the Scripture, ou shall love your neighbor as yourself, (Lev 19:18) you are doing well.
9 But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors. 10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all.
11 For He who said, [/FONT]
Do not commit adultery
also said,
Do not commit murder.
Now if you do not commit adultery, but do commit murder, you have become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak and so act as those who are to be judged by the law of liberty

============================

"the Sabbath was MADE for MANKIND" Mark 2:27
"from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship" Is 66:23


God says in Genesis 4 "SIN is crouching at your door - but you must master it" - more than 2000 years before Sinai

Genesis 26:5 Abraham obeyed Me and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes and My laws.

Ex 20:11 points to Genesis 2:1-3 for the creation of the Sabbath

 

[BobRyan]

Was sabbath keeping a noachide commandment or added?

Same as asking -- Was the command "not to take God's name in vain" a noachide commandment or was it added??

Are you serious?

Ex 20:11 tells us that the Bible Sabbath commandment originates in Genesis 2:1-3 events/facts/act of God.

But Ex 20:7 does not tell us that same level of detail about not taking God's name in vain. Yet we all know that it is sin to take God's name in vain -- nonetheless.

Genesis 26:5 "Abraham obeyed Me and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes and My laws."

Who told Noah in Genesis 6 and 7 what an "unclean animal" is? How would the reader of Moses' book of Genesis know what was in Moses' book of Leviticus? (Perhaps that one is pretty obvious)

More accepting the Bible -- less dismissing it please.

Of course I'm serious... what do I know about your religion?... I ask cause I want to know your position....

I accept the new covenant thank you .. all meats are clean to me
Romans 14:2

1. The point was about 'details' in Genesis where you don't see the details explained until you get to Leviticus.. but this would not be a problem since Moses wrote both. So then sin is defined, the Law of God defined and of course it was always a "sin" to take God's name in vain. The book of Genesis is not an exhuastive account of every word spoken until Sinai - a point where I think we would all agree.

I think you entirely missed the point of the post. The law of God existed according to Genesis 26 -- even before Sinai. (And of course most pro-sunday scholars also admit to this point when it comes to the TEN Commandments)

2. As for the New Covenant defined in the Bible --> Jeremiah 31:31-33, and the idea that it is talking about permission to eat rat sandwiches.. maybe you can point that out for us.

Never tried rat sandwiches but I'll try anything once

That's good news -- so then try the actual Gospel. Christ did not die on the cross so that you could eat rat sandwiches.

The gospel is not even about that.

Point being no law is broken in Christ if I do decide to try it

Until you read the actual Bible.

In Hebrews 8:6-10 we are told that it is Christ Himself giving us the LAWs at Sinai.

Which Christ were you thinking of ??

 

[AbbaLove]

I wouldn't want to live in a world where the 10 do not apply.

All Ten are still applicable for both Jew and non-Jew. The reason some Christians still discount God's Moral Law started way back with the RCC wanting to distance themselves from Jewish culture. First discounting the Fourth followed by centuries of horrific anti-Semitism by non-Jewish Believers. So in order to be consistent the RCC and much of Christendom discounted all Ten as being Jewish ceremonial laws instead of God's Moral Law for ALL mankind.

Acts 14:1
At Iconium, Paul and Barnabas entered the Jewish synagogue as usual, and they spoke so well that a great number of Jews and Greeks believed.
Acts 18:4
And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
Acts 19:8
And he went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of three months, disputing and persuading the things concerning the kingdom of God.​

There are no primary or secondary sources implying that Jewish Believers in Yeshua ever suggested that Greek Believers in Messiah Yeshua gather on the 1st day of the week instead of the 7th day of the week. It was the non-Jewish RCC that established the 1st day of the week while minimizing the Ten Commandments as God's Moral Law for ALL mankind.

 

[YouAreAwesome]

All Ten are still applicable for both Jew and non-Jew. The reason some Christians still discount God's Moral Law started way back with the RCC wanting to distance themselves from Jewish culture. First discounting the Fourth followed by centuries of horrific anti-Semitism by non-Jewish Believers. So in order to be consistent the RCC and much of Christendom discounted all Ten as being Jewish ceremonial laws instead of God's Moral Law for ALL mankind.

Acts 14:1
At Iconium, Paul and Barnabas entered the Jewish synagogue as usual, and they spoke so well that a great number of Jews and Greeks believed.
Acts 18:4
And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
Acts 19:8
And he went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of three months, disputing and persuading the things concerning the kingdom of God.​

There are no primary or secondary sources implying that Jewish Believers in Yeshua ever suggested that Greek Believers in Messiah Yeshua gather on the 1st day of the week instead of the 7th day of the week. It was the non-Jewish RCC that established the 1st day of the week while minimizing the Ten Commandments as God's Moral Law for ALL mankind.

1 Corinthians 9:20.

 

[gadar perets]

Nope. I keep His royal law of love; James 2:8.

James 1:22-25 - "For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass: For he beholds himself, and goes his way, and straightway forgets what manner of man he was. But whoso looks into the perfect law of liberty, and continues therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed."
​

What is the perfect law of liberty? First, Psalm 19 says the Law of Yahweh is perfect. It is a perfect law. Secondly, James 2:8-12 tells us what the perfect law of liberty is.

"If you fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, you do well: But if you have respect to persons, you commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors. For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if you commit no adultery, yet if you kill, you are become a transgressor of the law. So speak you, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty."
​

The law of verses 8-11 is the Old Covenant law. In verse 8, James is quoting the second greatest commandment which is actually an Old Covenant commandment found in Leviticus 19:18. In verse 9, the law he is referring to is the Old Covenant law. Verse 10 is often used by those opposed to obeying the Old Covenant laws. They say, "if you break one law you've broken them all, so why even try to keep the law?" So verse 10 is also speaking of the Old Covenant law. Of course, verse 11 is quoting two of the Ten Commandments which are also Old Covenant laws. In verse 12, James is saying that people are going to be judged by that same law. So, in order to receive a good judgment, speak and do according to those laws.

 

[gadar perets]

I accept the new covenant thank you .. all meats are clean to me

Romans 14:2

The context is not about the laws of clean and unclean meat. It is about being a vegetarian or eating both vegetables and meat. Notice the weaker brother only eats vegetables. It does not say the weaker brother only eats clean meat. Notice the stronger brother eats “anything”. It does not say the stronger brother eats both clean and unclean meat. Therefore, in context, the word “anything” refers to eating both meat and vegetables.

The question that needs addressing is, why is the weaker brother only eating vegetables? I'll answer that later.

3 One who eats must not look down on one who does not eat; and one who does not eat must not criticize one who does, because God has accepted him.

This verse says nothing about eating clean or unclean meat. In context, we can restate the verse as follows:

3 One who eats {meat} must not look down on one who does not eat {meat, but only vegetables}; and one who does not eat {meat, but only vegetables} must not criticize one who does {eat meat}, because God has accepted him.​

4 Who are you to criticize another's household slave? Before his own Lord he stands or falls. And stand he will! For the Lord is able to make him stand.5 One person considers one day to be above another day. Someone else considers every day to be the same. Each one must be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 Whoever observes the day, observes it to the Lord. Whoever eats, eats to the Lord, since he gives thanks to God; and whoever does not eat, it is to the Lord that he does not eat, yet he thanks God.

I will not get into the days of verses 5-6, but it doesn’t refer to Yahweh’s Holy Days. Verse 6, in context, can be restated as follows:

Whoever eats {meats and vegetables}, eats to the Lord, since he gives thanks to God; and whoever does not eat {meat, but only vegetables}, it is to the Lord that he does not eat {meat}, yet he thanks God.​

Again, the context has nothing to do with Yahweh’s dietary laws which are still in effect for all believers.

7 For none of us lives to himself, and no one dies to himself. 8 If we live, we live to the Lord; and if we die, we die to the Lord. Therefore, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. 9 Christ died and came to life for this: that He might rule over both the dead and the living. 10 But you, why do you criticize your brother? Or you, why do you look down on your brother? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God. 11 For it is written: As I live, says the Lord, every knee will bow to Me, and every tongue will give praise to God. 12 So then, each of us will give an account of himself to God. 13 Therefore, let us no longer criticize one another, but instead decide not to put a stumbling block or pitfall in your brother's way.

14 (I know and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself. Still, to someone who considers a thing to be unclean, to that one it is unclean.)

This is the verse that has led many astray. The word “unclean” is a translation of the Greek word “koinon” (from koinos) and it means “common, defiled, profaned”. This word is never translated “unclean” except in Romans 14:14 because Christian translators read their own belief into the text.

Here is the definition of “koinos” from biblehub.com:

2839 koinós – properly, common, referring to what is defiled (stripped of specialness) because treated as ordinary ("common"). 2839 /koinós ("defiled") describes the result of a person reducing what God calls special(holy, set apart) – to what is mundane, i.e. stripping it of its sacredness.​

2839 /koinós ("defiled because treated as common") is always used negatively, i.e. for what is profaned – except in Jude 1:3 where it refers to the gift of salvation shared (held in common) by all true believers.

[2839 /koinós ("common") typically refers to spiritual desecration. This happens when a person treats what is sacred (set apart to God) as ordinary ("not special").]​

Recall what Peter said in Acts 10:14, ". . . I have never eaten anything that is common or unclean." Peter is referring to two categories of things he never ate. The word common in this verse is "koinos" and the word unclean is the Greek word "akathartos". Animals declared unclean by Yahweh in Leviticus 11 are akathartos. However, when a clean animal becomes inedible for some reason it is called common or koinos. Paul's statement in Romans 14:14 referred to clean meat which a weak brother would consider common and therefore not eat, preferring instead to only eat vegetables, (vs. 2). A pig is unclean of itself, it was created unclean. However, a goat, which is a clean animal, can become inedible in someone’s mind for some reason. The weaker brother esteemed in his own mind that meat should not be eaten because it may have become common for some reason. We are not told what caused the meat to become common or defiled in the weaker brother’s mind. However, it is common meat that Paul was referring to, not unclean meat.

Yahweh gave man specific meats that he may eat. These meats, in keeping with the definitions above, are “special” or “sacred”. However, if something happened to the meat “stripping it” of its “specialness” or “sacredness”, it becomes defiled or common.

15 For if your brother is hurt by what you eat {common meat}, you are no longer walking according to love. By what you eat {common meat}, do not destroy that one for whom Christ died. 16 Therefore, do not let your good be slandered, 17 for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Spirit. 18 Whoever serves the Messiah in this way is acceptable to God and approved by men. 19 So then, we must pursue what promotes peace and what builds up one another.

20 Do not tear down God's work because of food. Everything is clean, but it is wrong for a man to cause stumbling by what he eats.

In context, “everything is clean” must refer to everything that is edible for “food”. Unclean meat was never edible for food and never will be edible. You cannot find anywhere in Scripture where unclean meat is called “food”.

Also, if we take Paul’s words literally, then we have problems because Paul said there are other things that are “unclean”. He wrote of “unclean spirits”, “unclean” children, “unclean” birds, “unclean” people, etc.

21 It is a noble thing not to eat meat, or drink wine, or do anything that makes your brother stumble.

This verse does not say, “It is a noble thing to not eat unclean meat …” Paul means “it is a noble thing to not eat clean meat that your brother thinks is no longer edible for food …”

22 Do you have faith? Keep it to yourself before God. Blessed is the man who does not condemn himself by what he approves.

We cannot “approve” of something that Yahweh disapproves of. If He disapproves of murder, our approval of it does not make it right. Yahweh disapproves of eating unclean animal flesh. He has told us what we can and cannot eat. Therefore, we cannot approve of eating pig, for example, if Yahweh disapproves of it. Paul is referring to eating something that Yahweh has already said we could eat, therefore, he cannot condemn himself unless he eats against his own conscience.

23 But whoever doubts stands condemned if he eats {something he doesn’t think he should}, because his eating is not from faith, and everything that is not from faith is sin.

 

[gadar perets]

Thanks for your reply...for the record the 10 no longer apply for the believers

I offer the following study to disprove that belief:

http://everlastinggoodnewsofyahweh.info/Studies/Testimonies.html

 

[YouAreAwesome]

James 1:22-25 - "For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass: For he beholds himself, and goes his way, and straightway forgets what manner of man he was. But whoso looks into the perfect law of liberty, and continues therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed."
​

What is the perfect law of liberty? First, Psalm 19 says the Law of Yahweh is perfect. It is a perfect law. Secondly, James 2:8-12 tells us what the perfect law of liberty is.

"If you fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, you do well: But if you have respect to persons, you commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors. For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if you commit no adultery, yet if you kill, you are become a transgressor of the law. So speak you, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty."
​

The law of verses 8-11 is the Old Covenant law. In verse 8, James is quoting the second greatest commandment which is actually an Old Covenant commandment found in Leviticus 19:18. In verse 9, the law he is referring to is the Old Covenant law. Verse 10 is often used by those opposed to obeying the Old Covenant laws. They say, "if you break one law you've broken them all, so why even try to keep the law?" So verse 10 is also speaking of the Old Covenant law. Of course, verse 11 is quoting two of the Ten Commandments which are also Old Covenant laws. In verse 12, James is saying that people are going to be judged by that same law. So, in order to receive a good judgment, speak and do according to those laws.

Nope. James 2:8-12 begins with "If you..." Then says "But if you..." And finishes with "So speak you...". Royal law, old law, Royal law. In other words "if you keep X then Y, but if you keep A then B. So keep X."

 

[visionary]

Nope. James 2:8-12 begins with "If you..." Then says "But if you..." And finishes with "So speak you...". Royal law, old law, Royal law. In other words "if you keep X then Y, but if you keep A then B. So keep X."

Please get a Mount Sinai, Moses type of experience with God.. then you will understand eternal, eternity and His foundation for His kingdom forever.

 

[dfw69]

I wouldn't want to live in a world where the 10 do not apply.

The 10 are good with me so long as no one starts throwing stones for breaking them ..

 

[YouAreAwesome]

I offer the following study to disprove that belief:

http://everlastinggoodnewsofyahweh.info/Studies/Testimonies.html

The ten didn't apply to anyone before Moses. Do you agree? Before Moses people either walked with God and followed their conscience or they lived according to their own desires.

Same today. Plus we have the Helper.

 

[YouAreAwesome]

Please get a Mount Sinai, Moses type of experience with God.. then you will understand eternal, eternity and His foundation for His kingdom forever.

Are you still willing to learn and grow?
Did you know many people have incredible experiences with God and come to different conclusions about Him?
Doctrine does not rely on experience but experience relies on doctrine.

 

[dfw69]

That's good news -- so then try the actual Gospel. Christ did not die on the cross so that you could eat rat sandwiches.

The gospel is not even about that.

I agree

Until you read the actual Bible.

(Sigh)

In Hebrews 8:6-10 we are told that it is Christ Himself giving us the LAWs at Sinai.

Yes my brother and he fulfilled it for me and you ... but if you wish to continue in the old covenant to please God it must be done lawfully and in light of the gospel... and you will do well ... because the Christian heart is one that loves and judges not and condemns not by the law he wishes to continue in.... in this way we have peace with one another and may our peace continue until we enter into gods kingdom

Which Christ were you thinking of ??

We have the same Christ ...

 

[dfw69]

I offer the following study to disprove that belief:

http://everlastinggoodnewsofyahweh.info/Studies/Testimonies.html

What's the basic points?

 

[dfw69]

.

 

[visionary]

The 10 are good with me so long as no one starts throwing stones for breaking them ..

Gravity works the same way, Just because you jump off the cliff, breaking the law of gravity, doesn't mean it will hit you. What happens is at the bottom when the fall ends and the landing starts. The law of gravity tell you that it is an abrupt and often tragic ending to life given the fall is great. It is not the laws fault, it is the fault of those who believe they are above the law, yet have not counter laws that they can safely glide on. The ten are solid and basic to the continuance of life. The Sabbath is a key that many miss... but the fall is great and the landing traumatic.

 

[YouAreAwesome]

Gravity works the same way, Just because you jump off the cliff, breaking the law of gravity, doesn't mean it will hit you. What happens is at the bottom when the fall ends and the landing starts. The law of gravity tell you that it is an abrupt and often tragic ending to life given the fall is great. It is not the laws fault, it is the fault of those who believe they are above the law, yet have not counter laws that they can safely glide on. The ten are solid and basic to the continuance of life. The Sabbath is a key that many miss... but the fall is great and the landing traumatic.

Is circumcision like gravity?

 

[gadar perets]

Nope. James 2:8-12 begins with "If you..." Then says "But if you..." And finishes with "So speak you...". Royal law, old law, Royal law. In other words "if you keep X then Y, but if you keep A then B. So keep X."

Loving one's neighbor (the royal law) was an OT law that became a NT law. No adultery and no murder were OT laws that became NT laws. They are all part of the "law of liberty" which is obedience to the Torah written on our hearts.

 

[gadar perets]

The ten didn't apply to anyone before Moses. Do you agree? Before Moses people either walked with God and followed their conscience or they lived according to their own desires.

Same today. Plus we have the Helper.

I disagree. All ten existed as oral laws before they were written on stone. That is why Joseph knew adultery was wrong or why we see the Sabbath in Exodus 16 before it was given on Mt. Sinai, etc. Yes, now we have the Helper to help us keep the Ten. Of course, the Helper will not help you keep the Ten unless you want him to. He will not force us. The Father wants people who will obey from the heart. If we say, "I don't need help keeping the Ten because they no longer exist as laws", then we won't get the help.