For all eternity - "From Sabbath to Sabbath shall all mankind come before God to Worship"

[bugkiller]

Were the Apostles some of those weak in the faith? They never willingly continued to break YHWH'S commandments - and if they did, YHWH'S WORD explained what they did to repent.

The arguments presented to break YHWH'S commands all come from man's traditions , or worse.
There is no indication in SCRIPTURE anywhere, that any ecclesia should continue to willingly break YHWH'S commands.

What commands are you talking about?

bugkiller

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I don reject Moses, but I wasn't commanded to follow him either. I follow Christ and his apostles. Why do you think God sent apostles?

The Apostles
taught Y'SHUA(YHWH'S SALVATION) from TORAH. (MOSES).

TORAH IS the SCRIPTURE THEY ALL READ, learned, knew, were trained in,
and Y'SHUA taught and trained all the Apostles
to teach others (disciples) to live in YHWH'S KINGDOM on earth by FAITH RELYING ON YHWH and knowing TORAH experientially (written on their heart, lived out in their lives).

 

[BABerean2]

The Apostles
taught Y'SHUA(YHWH'S SALVATION) from TORAH. (MOSES).

TORAH IS the SCRIPTURE THEY ALL READ, learned, knew, were trained in,
and Y'SHUA taught and trained all the Apostles
to teach others (disciples) to live in YHWH'S KINGDOM on earth by FAITH RELYING ON YHWH and knowing TORAH experientially (written on their heart, lived out in their lives).

Gal 4:24　 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
　
Gal 4:25　 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.　

Gal 4:26　 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.　 (Hebrews 11:16)

Gal 4:27　 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.　

Gal 4:28　 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
　
Gal 4:29　 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.　

Gal 4:30　 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.　

Gal 4:31　 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.



al 5:1　 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
　
Gal 5:2　 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.　

Gal 5:3　 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.　

Gal 5:4　 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.　

　
Php 3:2　 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.　

Php 3:3　 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.　

Php 3:4　 Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:　

Php 3:5　 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;　

Php 3:6　 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.　

Php 3:7　 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.　

Php 3:8　 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,　

Php 3:9　 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:　

Php 3:10　 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;　

Php 3:11　 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.


　
Gal 5:12 I wish those who unsettle you would emasculate themselves!

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[yeshuaslavejeff]

Blessed is the man who does this,
... .
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”

 

[W2L]

The Apostles
taught Y'SHUA(YHWH'S SALVATION) from TORAH. (MOSES).

TORAH IS the SCRIPTURE THEY ALL READ, learned, knew, were trained in,
and Y'SHUA taught and trained all the Apostles
to teach others (disciples) to live in YHWH'S KINGDOM on earth by FAITH RELYING ON YHWH and knowing TORAH experientially (written on their heart, lived out in their lives).

They don't teach us the law of Moses. No circumcision, death penalties, or food purity laws, and no Sabbath either. Get real bro.

 

[Bob S]

To all of you that think you have to abide by ritual laws given to only one nation, I ask this question, where in New Testament scripture do you find where you are doing right by doing what you do?

I know from scripture that what I am doing is right. Yep, I pass the test, something you cannot do. The test is found in 1Jn 3:19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence:

22 and receive from him anything we ask, because we keep his commands and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. 24 The one who keeps God’s commands lives in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.

Do you see any ritual laws of the old covenant in doing what is right? Our duty to Jesus is to love others as Jesus loves us. By doing this for Jesus we have, just as He did for His Father, fulfilled the law. Thank you Jesus that we are not under the laws of death 2Cor 3:
7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!


Do you really believe the writings of John and Paul? You do if you can truthfully tell us you belong to the truth as John has explained to all of us who believe in Jesus as our High Priest and Savior.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

They don't teach us the law of Moses. No circumcision, death penalties, or food purity laws, and no Sabbath either. Get real bro.

They all taught circumcision of the heart, as TORAH teaches,
"death is the penalty of sin", as TORAH teaches,
"do not eat anything that causes someone weak in faith to stumble", as TORAH teaches,
and
as Y'SHUA said "If you love ME, you will keep the commandments", as TORAH teaches.

 

[W2L]

They all taught circumcision of the heart, as TORAH teaches,
"death is the penalty of sin", as TORAH teaches,
"do not eat anything that causes someone weak in faith to stumble", as TORAH teaches,
and
as Y'SHUA said "If you love ME, you will keep the commandments", as TORAH teaches.

Circumcision of the heart. You said it. Sabbath is also of the heart. Its taught in Hebrews 4 and is not rest on a certain day of the week.

We don't need circumcision of the flesh, neither rest on Saturday.

 

[BABerean2]

They all taught circumcision of the heart, as TORAH teaches,
"death is the penalty of sin", as TORAH teaches,
"do not eat anything that causes someone weak in faith to stumble", as TORAH teaches,
and
as Y'SHUA said "If you love ME, you will keep the commandments", as TORAH teaches.

Philippians 3:2

(CJB)　 beware of the dogs, those evildoers, the Mutilated!

(ESV)　 Look out for the dogs, look out for the evildoers, look out for those who mutilate the flesh.

(Geneva)　 Beware of dogges: beware of euil workers: beware of the concision.

(GW)　 Beware of dogs! Beware of those who do evil things. Beware of those who insist on circumcision.

(LITV-TSP)　 Look out for the dogs, look out for the evil workers, look out for the concision party .

(KJV)　 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.

(KJV+)　 BewareG991 of dogs,G2965 bewareG991 of evilG2556 workers,G2040 bewareG991 of theG3588 concision.G2699


(NKJV)　 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the mutilation!

.

 

[BobRyan]

I'm bowing out, you guys don't even give me time to respond.

Am happy to wait so you will have time to respond

 

[BobRyan]

Some folks place a great deal of effort to argue the case that the Bible is not making and in fact flatly contradicts not only the Bible but also - EVEN - pro-sunday Bible scholarship - not just the pro-Bible Sabbath scholars.

That is choosing the hard path of opposing both the Bible and almost all Bible-scholarship -- so that solution leaves a lot of points for questioning.

As for me - my choice is to just stick with what the Bible says.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

As for me - my choice is to just stick with what the Bible says.

AMEIN and HALLELUYAH ! in Y'SHUA TODAY and FOREVER -

seeking YHWH ABBA (GOD THE FATHER) constantly, listening to HIM, praying always,

and DO what HE SAYS, SPEAK what HE says. (ALWAYS, no exception, in line with and perfect HARMONY with SCRIPTURE. )

 

[BobRyan]

Sophrosyne said: ↑
It is like they don't acknowledge that MOST of the worship is BETWEEN the Sabbaths (Mon,Tues,Wed,Thurs,Fri). One could say worship is from Monday to Monday and it would mean the same thing.
- in the actual Bible there are TWO cycles in Is 66:23 - -not "one daily".

Is 66:23 "From new moon to new moon AND FROM Sabbath to Sabbath shall all MANKIND come before Me to worship"

Why don't we let the Apostle Paul give his viewpoint of this Old Testament prophecy?

A. Paul does not quote it - as is the case with most of the NT and OT - that he does not quote.
B. My affirmation of Isaiah 66:23 does not stop Paul from doing something.

Col 2 deals with traditions of man -- it is not abolishing eating or drinking or the annual Sabbaths.

Col 2:16　 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:　

In Colossians 2 Paul explicitly points to the problem of people "making stuff up" -- notice is words.

===============================

So then "Bible details" --

in Col 2 - we do not find Paul condemning the Bible, no condemnation of eating, no condemnation of drinking - and no condemnation of God's Sabbath as we find it in the Ten Commandments.

Col 2 is about making up a rule and judging others of being guilty of sin because they differ with you, even if that invented rule is related to a Bible command.

But Col 2 is not an attempt by Paul to delete the scriptures. Rather Paul condemns the idea of making stuff up that is not in scripture at all - where the only source/authority is "man".

Col 2:18 Let no one keep defrauding you of your prize by delighting in self-abasement and the worship of the angels, taking his stand on visions he has seen, inflatedwithout cause by his fleshly mind,
19 and not holding fast to the head, from whom the entire body, being supplied and held together by the joints and ligaments, grows with a growth which is from God.


Col 2
20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men? 23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh. (KJV)

Col 2
20 If you have died with Christ to the elementary principles of the world, why, as if you were living in the world, do you submit yourself to decrees, such as,
21 “Do not handle, do not taste, do not touch!” 22 (which all refer to things destined to perish with use)—in accordance with the commandments and teachings of men?
23 These are matters which have, to be sure, the appearance of wisdom in self-made religion and self-abasement and severe treatment of the body, but are of no value against fleshly indulgence.(NASB)


In Mark 7:6-13 the Jews were simply "making stuff up" to get around one of the TEN Commandments - and of course Christ condemned them for that.

In Mark 2:19-22 they did it as well and Christ refuted their arguments.

Is it any wonder that in Col 2 the saints were contending with the same problem of man-made-doctrine and traditions -- "making stuff up"??

Not at all surprising.

 

[W2L]

Am happy to wait so you will have time to respond

No thanks. Because of SDA vs RC vs EO vs Anglican vs Lutheran vs Baptist vs Pentecostal vs Methodist vs Calvinist vs Presbyterian... my faith is already in shambles. You couldn't prove anything at this point. All you do is ignore valid points of scripture and keep arguing. What kind of fool does it take to engage in that mess? Not this one bro.

 

[BobRyan]

No thanks. Because of SDA vs RC vs EO vs Anglican vs Lutheran vs Baptist vs Pentecostal vs Methodist vs Calvinist vs Presbyterian... my faith is already in shambles. You couldn't prove anything at this point. All you do is ignore valid points of scripture and keep arguing. What kind of fool does it take to engage in that mess? Not this one bro.

My offer was to give you time to respond.

I see you found the time.

 

[BobRyan]

AMEIN and HALLELUYAH ! in Y'SHUA TODAY and FOREVER -

seeking YHWH ABBA (GOD THE FATHER) constantly, listening to HIM, praying always,

and DO what HE SAYS, SPEAK what HE says. (ALWAYS, no exception, in line with and perfect HARMONY with SCRIPTURE. )

indeed - the Bible makes the point very clear.

 

[BobRyan]

Shut Door Documents: from the Estate of Ellen G. White
http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/shutdoor.html

.

off topic post - on almost every thread - the same off topic post???

October 22, 1844 ???


Shut Door Documents from the Estate of Ellen G. White:
http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/shutdoor.html

.

I have started a thread for you - in a discussion area where your post is not simply a derailing CF forum rules breaking off-topic post.

2 minutes ago #1


hint: Your linked site says this --

================================================

6. December, 1844--Ellen Harmon's First Vision Changed Her Mind About the Significance of the "7th Month Experience."

Under date of May 30, 1847, James White wrote:

When she received her first vision, Dec. 1844, she and all the band in Portland, Maine, (where her parents then resided) had given up the midnight-cry, and shut door, as being in the past. It was then that the Lord shew her in vision, the error into which she and the band in Portland had fallen. She then related her vision to the band, and about sixty confessed their error, and acknowledged their 7th month experience to be the work of God.--James White, A Word to the Little Flock, p. 22.

================================

interesting statement

go to the thread started for your benefit and show us your case.

Shut Door Documents from the Estate of Ellen G. White:
http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/shutdoor.html

October 22, 1844 ???

.

off-topic response -- again

Shut Door Documents from the Estate of Ellen G. White:
http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/shutdoor.html

October 22, 1844 ???

.

Ok fine -- you win

 

[W2L]

My offer was to give you time to respond.

I see you found the time.

Its pointless Bob. Utterly useless. (big freakin' SIGH)

Religion, O how I dislike it. My heart has a thousand wounds bleeding theological discord. How can you love this?

 

[BobRyan]

No thanks. Because of SDA vs RC vs EO vs Anglican vs Lutheran vs Baptist vs Pentecostal vs Methodist vs Calvinist vs Presbyterian... my faith is already in shambles. You couldn't prove anything at this point. All you do is ignore valid points of scripture and keep arguing. What kind of fool does it take to engage in that mess? Not this one bro.

My offer was to give you time to respond.

I see you found the time.

Its pointless Bob. Utterly useless. (big freakin' SIGH)

Religion, O how I dislike it. My heart has a thousand wounds bleeding theological discord. How can you love this?

I prefer sticking with the Bible.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

No thanks. Because of SDA vs RC vs EO vs Anglican vs Lutheran vs Baptist vs Pentecostal vs Methodist vs Calvinist vs Presbyterian... my faith is already in shambles. You couldn't prove anything at this point. All you do is ignore valid points of scripture and keep arguing. What kind of fool does it take to engage in that mess? Not this one bro.

Exactly - don't.