From faith to fact.

[tallbouy]

One is correct.

Yes you have been taken for a ride.

 

[ScottA]

Yes you have been taken for a ride.

I have been shown the truth by God, so I need not wait for proof. But you, you see with your eyes and hear with your ears, but will not know the truth until the end.

 

[tallbouy]

I have been shown the truth by God, so I need not wait for proof. But you, you see with your eyes and hear with your ears, but will not know the truth until the end.

You have imagination.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

Okay, so I don't get it. Why do I (or Anyone for that matter) have to give up my critical faculties in order to come to know God... or Allah, or Vishnu, or Zeuss, Odin, the FSM, etc. ? Why is it that the only way to come to "truth" is by discarding evidenced reality? If God were true, surely he'd be in keeping with his Creation, and not be in contradiction with it, right?

 

[JacksBratt]

Creationists will believe whatever they want to believe regardless, when someone believes in magic there is nothing more to say.

Now you are getting it. "magic" "supernatural" "Creator" "God"..... they all make this possible. Without something "magic" you have no life. This is why evolutionists will not go near the "origin" of life with a ten foot pole.

Yep, we know how it all took place. Right from step 2 all the way to step 1 billion....... Don't ask us about step 1 though.

Life did not happen out of thin air. It took what you call "magic". Like you said "when you believe in magic there is nothing more to say" Exactly.

Once you need to get life from somewhere, you need magic. Once you have magic there is no need for billions of years of chance.

I have "magic". I have God. God wrote it down so I would know.

 

[Jimmy D]

God wrote it down so I would know.

Apart from a few commandments and a bit of graffiti on Belshazzar's wall he didn't bother writing that much did he?

 

[TLK Valentine]

I have been shown the truth by God, so I need not wait for proof. But you, you see with your eyes and hear with your ears, but will not know the truth until the end.

God speaks to you directly, but a billion other Christians have to rely on "faith."

Have you considered a career as a prophet?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Okay, so I don't get it. Why do I (or Anyone for that matter) have to give up my critical faculties in order to come to know God... or Allah, or Vishnu, or Zeuss, Odin, the FSM, etc. ? Why is it that the only way to come to "truth" is by discarding evidenced reality? If God were true, surely he'd be in keeping with his Creation, and not be in contradiction with it, right?

Because apparently, God wants mindless followers -- not mindless by design (He could've done that himself), but mindless by choice.

 

[amariselle]

Because apparently, God wants mindless followers -- not mindless by design (He could've done that himself), but mindless by choice.

This is absolutely false. God does in fact call us to use our minds.

 

[amariselle]

Okay, so I don't get it. Why do I (or Anyone for that matter) have to give up my critical faculties in order to come to know God... or Allah, or Vishnu, or Zeuss, Odin, the FSM, etc. ? Why is it that the only way to come to "truth" is by discarding evidenced reality? If God were true, surely he'd be in keeping with his Creation, and not be in contradiction with it, right?

You don't need to "give up" your "critical faculties" to come to God.

That is a false presumption often made of Christians. God wants us to use the minds He gave us. He doesn't desire mindless followers who never think, never question and never seek discernment.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

You don't need to "give up" your "critical faculties" to come to God.

That is a false presumption often made of Christians. God wants us to use the minds He gave us. He doesn't desire mindless followers who never think, never question and never seek discernment.

What about questioning dogma?

 

[amariselle]

I think the OP is referring to faith in the religious sense, which means believing irrespective of how well grounded the belief is, and maintaining belief even if the preponderance of evidence stands opposed to that belief. It's not merely about whether the religionist is able to produce a reason for their belief, but whether those reasons adequately justify the belief. We know that the religious are able to give many reasons for their supernatural claims. The question is whether those reasons are strong enough to warrant the confidence they have in those claims.

Sure, but how is that a question you can answer for someone else?

 

[amariselle]

What about questioning dogma?

By all means, question it, seek wisdom and discernment in all things.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

By all means, question it, seek wisdom and discernment in all things.

Can you question dogma though?

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Sure, but how is that a question you can answer for someone else?

How shall we answer it except by examining it as honestly as we can?

 

[amariselle]

What a wonderful imagination you have, sadly death puts pay to all of our imaginations, our minds and all that's in them dies when our brains die, believe me no one wishes we were all going to another place when we die more than me but it's just not going to happen, even if we wish and wish and wish it's still not going to happen, but if it helps you to cope with this life then go for it and wish away to your hearts content.

Religions have a negative effect on our lives because all they do is drag us down, they give us false hopes that death is not the end when everything else tells us it is, why waste time trying to change the inevitable? live the one life you have and enjoy it because we "Know" we have this one but we only wish we had another one.

How exactly do you know for certain that there is no life after death?

What is this "everything else" that has somehow convinced you beyond the shadow of a doubt that death is the end?

 

[ScottA]

Okay, so I don't get it. Why do I (or Anyone for that matter) have to give up my critical faculties in order to come to know God... or Allah, or Vishnu, or Zeuss, Odin, the FSM, etc. ? Why is it that the only way to come to "truth" is by discarding evidenced reality? If God were true, surely he'd be in keeping with his Creation, and not be in contradiction with it, right?

Because you have not correctly assessed your "reality."

If you knew that it was a prison and that you were sentenced to death after doing this hard labor, you would not hold on to your rations, your bars, and your pain. You too would be happy to put them down for what they are and make your appeal.

 

[tallbouy]

I have "magic". I have God. God wrote it down so I would know.

It was men who said they had been moved by God to write it down so it's men you believe not God?
Do all religious people have 'magic' or is the 'magic' only reserved for Christians?

 

[amariselle]

Can you question dogma though?

Yes, I think anyone can, and should. Why blindly accept anything as truth?

 

[amariselle]

How shall we answer it except by examining it as honestly as we can?

You can examine someone else's claims or beliefs, but you can't decide for them whether or not they are sufficient. Each person must make their own choice.