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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
The Early Church is the Catholic Church
- Thread starter Thursday
- Start date
Because Jesus promised the Church that it would be led in ALL truth.
The Church is protected by the promises of Christ. In addition, it has held on to the same teachings for nearly 2000 years.
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When making personal decisions and statements.
He can be wrong about many things, but when making a doctrinal statement in union with the Bishops and guided by the Holy Spirit he is never wrong.
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rakovsky
Newbie
Let me explain better what I meant by the RCS and EOS being or continuing the early church organizationally.
RCS and EOS have a concept of apostolic succession where they trace themselves organizationally directly to the first century church in their respective regions. I guess you can say that the Anglicans trace themselves to first century English christians, but I think that they are still stuck tracing their line through RC English bishops who held RC beliefs like Transubstantiation.
EOS can trace themselves directly through succession without going through RCS to Jerusalem.
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Peter spoke for God. James merely reiterated God's decision.
7After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
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I understand this. Here's the thing, in the first several centuries there was only one Church. Both Orthodox and Catholics came from this Church. I believe that the Catholic Church is the rightful heir to this Church, but I understand your position as well. Regardless of who is right, I think we both agree that Jesus started a single Church and that our roots are in that Church.
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Luther built his own stew and came to regret it. There were plenty of reformers who worked within the Church, which is what Luther intended.(Erasmus and Catherine of Siena come to mind)
Pride led him to error and despair.
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Elders in heaven carry the prayers of the saints on earth to God.
This is what intercessory prayer is.
The bible tells us that the prayers of the righteous are powerful and effective. Who in heaven is not righteous?
Why wouldn't we ask the saints in heaven to pray for us?
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Because you have access to God Himself.
Is it God's will that is to be done or one's own? If you pray and God does not answer how you want, there is a work around? Or is it not God's will that should be done on earth as it is in heaven?
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Don't you ever ask others to pray for you? Do you think it is good to pray for others and seek their prayers?
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Most of my prayers are talking to God, not asking for things. I believe that God wants us to have good things and when we do not have them, most of the time that is God's will.
So, few of my prayers are formal. Most are clarification of something I do not understand.
I have found that much of walking in faith is being thankful for what we do have rather than wanting more. That's the way I think of prayer and faith.
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tickingclocker
Well-Known Member
I don't think you understood what I was saying. People in heaven are not aware of our pain any longer. God promised when believers enter heaven all pain and sorrow would cease. Pain and sorrow are part of the earth, never heaven. Those alive in heaven cannot 'feel' for us any longer. Those in heaven have been given their heavenly rest from all cares of this earthly world, to worship God unhindered. Not to worry over us, knowing Jesus has it ALL under control. So how can they pray for us if there is no more sorrow or pain for them?
Jesus is more than enough of an Intercessor for us here on earth. He can get the job done, by Himself, fully knowing what we must deal with here on earth. He alone can bridge the gap between the living and the dead because He alone is divine. Those saintly people, despite being in heaven, are still not divine. They will never be divine, aka "having the ability to become 'gods'" (aka "little Christs").
Trust Him, because He cares for you.
We can and should pray for each other! But we are on "earth", are we not? Able to share each others sorrows and joys? Someday we, too, will be in heaven, where all our sorrows and pain will be no more. We will know only love, peace, and joy in the Lord.
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I think you are mistaken:
Luke 15:7
I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent.
Heb 11,12
39These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised, 40since God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect. 1Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us, 2fixing our eyes on Jesus, the pioneer and perfecter of faith.
Rev 6:10
9And when the Lamb opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony they had upheld. 10And they cried out in a loud voice, “How long, O Lord,holy and true, until You judge those who live on the earth” and avenge our blood.
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