Is YAHWEH andALLAH the same person?

[SolomonVII]

No Christian embraces Islam.
And it is a fact that the pope does not speak for any but the RCC. If you don't know that you should stop now. And I never said the pope was not a Christian so please don't lie on top of everything else.

Catholics need to be able to separate the rhetoric from the fact when it comes to Church statements too.
After WWII, and the extermination of the Jews, Vatican II understood that the language of religious war could not continue, not in the name of Jesus at any rate.
The position of the Church on the Trinitarian nature of God has not changed. Nor has the Islamic teaching changed, where God as Three Person is considered blasphemy.
All that has changed is that the Vatican now chooses to focus on what we have in common with Muslims, and Jews, and even atheists, rather than what separates us.

The disagreements on the nature of God between Catholics and Muslims is fundamental and essential parts of both faiths. No papal statement, or rhetorical position will ever bridge that kind of chasm.

 

[Neochristian]

As weak as you think it may be, the counter-argument against you refuted it with is even weaker.

That was not a counter-argument. That was just a reaction.

 

[SolomonVII]

That was not a counter-argument. That was just a reaction.

Exactly.
The ball is still in your court.

 

[Neochristian]

No Christian embraces Islam.
And it is a fact that the pope does not speak for any but the RCC. If you don't know that you should stop now. And I never said the pope was not a Christian so please don't lie on top of everything else.

These two claims are incompatable: (1) no Christian embraces Islam, (2) the Pope, a Christian, embraces Islam.

 

[Neochristian]

Exactly.
The ball is still in your court.

Did I read it incorrectly? It says that because everyone should kneel before Christ that YHWH is the trinity, right? That isn't much.

 

[brinny]

I hear many people say when Muslims refer to ALLAH they are worshiping the same God Christians worship YAHWEH and others say Islam is worships ALLAH as a moon God and is NOT the same God Christians worship.

So is the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob YHWH/YAH/YAHWEH... etc, the same God ALLAH that Islam claims to worship??

Did you surmise that from what the Bible says?

 

[Jahrooshshalom]

As a Catholic would you say the pope embraces Islam? I.E. bows toward Mecca five times a day, recites the Azan, reads the Qur'an regularly, concedes that Jesus was the slave of the god of islam, that he was not born of a virgin, did not die on a cross, did not take the sins of the world upon himself on the cross?

Catholics need to be able to separate the rhetoric from the fact when it comes to Church statements too.
After WWII, and the extermination of the Jews, Vatican II understood that the language of religious war could not continue, not in the name of Jesus at any rate.
The position of the Church on the Trinitarian nature of God has not changed. Nor has the Islamic teaching changed, where God as Three Person is considered blasphemy.
All that has changed is that the Vatican now chooses to focus on what we have in common with Muslims, and Jews, and even atheists, rather than what separates us.

The disagreements on the nature of God between Catholics and Muslims is fundamental and essential parts of both faiths. No papal statement, or rhetorical position will ever bridge that kind of chasm.

 

[Neochristian]

I hear many people say when Muslims refer to ALLAH they are worshiping the same God Christians worship YAHWEH and others say Islam is worships ALLAH as a moon God and is NOT the same God Christians worship.

So is the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob YHWH/YAH/YAHWEH... etc, the same God ALLAH that Islam claims to worship??

It is a misunderstanding that Allah is a "moon God." That resulted from a misunderstanding of the flag. It is a mistaken understanding.

The Islamic community claims to worship the God of Abraham, and, in fact, Islam is classified as an Abrahamic Religion by scholars. Islam claims heritage to Abraham through Ishmael instead of Isaac and Jacob. To my knowledge, this is the only place where Islam might diverge, but I have never seen anything to suggest that Ishmael and Isaac do not worship the same God. It is possible that these two lines worship the same one God. In fact, they must worship the same God, or the mere existence of both implies that the other is mistaken in their assertion that their respective ancestors worship the same God as Father Abraham. I think this is actually a matter of some contention. Both sides seem to be underemphasizing the fact that both claim Abraham as the father of the faith, and that therefore, the three Abrahamic Religions (Judaism, Christianity and Islam) are actually brothers.

 

[Neochristian]

As a Catholic would you say the pope embraces Islam? I.E. bows toward Mecca five times a day, recites the Azan, reads the Qur'an regularly, concedes that Jesus was the slave of the god of islam, that he was not born of a virgin, did not die on a cross, did not take the sins of the world upon himself on the cross?

Dude, I shared an article with you last night about how the Pope embraced Islam. Embracing Islam is not equal to practicing Islam. Also, I have a Muslim friend who says that her faith claims that Jesus Christ is the only means of salvation and the removal of sin.

 

[SolomonVII]

As a Catholic would you say the pope embraces Islam? I.E. bows toward Mecca five times a day, recites the Azan, reads the Qur'an regularly, concedes that Jesus was the slave of the god of islam, that he was not born of a virgin, did not die on a cross, did not take the sins of the world upon himself on the cross?

The pope still is very much a Catholic.
I would say it is true that the current pope embraces Muslims, and Jews, and atheists too for that matter.
But he no more embraces Islam than he embraces atheism.

 

[Neochristian]

Catholics need to be able to separate the rhetoric from the fact when it comes to Church statements too.
After WWII, and the extermination of the Jews, Vatican II understood that the language of religious war could not continue, not in the name of Jesus at any rate.
The position of the Church on the Trinitarian nature of God has not changed. Nor has the Islamic teaching changed, where God as Three Person is considered blasphemy.
All that has changed is that the Vatican now chooses to focus on what we have in common with Muslims, and Jews, and even atheists, rather than what separates us.

The disagreements on the nature of God between Catholics and Muslims is fundamental and essential parts of both faiths. No papal statement, or rhetorical position will ever bridge that kind of chasm.

I cannot speak for Catholics or Muslims, as I am neither. But it seems the most essential part of Christianity in general is benevolence. God is love, and those who love know God, and God is in them. No theological disagreement will ever change the truth of that scripture. But when we focus on these things we are like the Pharisees Jesus rebuked saying they strain out a gnat but swallow a camel, because we are more concerned with these matters than justice, mercy and faithfulness.

 

[Neochristian]

The pope still is very much a Catholic.
I would say it is true that the current pope embraces Muslims, and Jews, and atheists too for that matter.
But he no more embraces Islam than he embraces atheism.

That is a subtle distinction, my friend. Well done.

This article seems to say the Pope does indeed embrace Islam: http://nationalreport.net/pope-francis-followers-koran-holy-bible/

 

[Berean777]

...

 

[Berean777]

Catholics need to be able to separate the rhetoric from the fact when it comes to Church statements too.
After WWII, and the extermination of the Jews, Vatican II understood that the language of religious war could not continue, not in the name of Jesus at any rate.
The position of the Church on the Trinitarian nature of God has not changed. Nor has the Islamic teaching changed, where God as Three Person is considered blasphemy.
All that has changed is that the Vatican now chooses to focus on what we have in common with Muslims, and Jews, and even atheists, rather than what separates us.

The disagreements on the nature of God between Catholics and Muslims is fundamental and essential parts of both faiths. No papal statement, or rhetorical position will ever bridge that kind of chasm.

You have seen the Adam's family right? The Munsters I mean.

When growing up I saw this abnormal and scary family that resembled anything but normal.

When we are born of the Spirit of God we are a new creation in Christ. So as far as God is concerned there is no common ground between the Adam's family and the new creation in Christ.

However when the religious leaders speak of common ground it has to be clearly stated that this makeshift worldly togetherness is nothing more than politics. So religion must not be brought into it at all. This means that the leaders of the Christian faiths have to clearly declare that they are not representing Christ and the Christian faith in this political stance.

If they don't wish to declare their political stance as completely separate to the Christian faith, then they must leave the faith altogether because their whole attitude is destructive to the congregation.

The deceived and/or deceivers should not hide behind religion and use the name of Christ/God/Christianity in vein for political gain.

We are seeing evidence of the unfolding of the prophesy of the ten denominational kings who give their power to the prince of this world for a short time (hour), so that they can have political say and a worldly kingdom that was never the prerogative of the great commission, for these denominational heads had previously no earthly political power (kingdom).

This mutiny and betrayal towards the Lord is the Strong Delusion to weed out those who believed not the truth who is Jesus Christ and his way and had pleasure in unrighteousness by replacing the cross for a worldly agenda, the universal (universal-ism) one world order (Babylon agenda) of the Prince of this world.

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

Knowing the true God is not a question of politics.

I hear a whoosh as the point of the post goes over your head.

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

I hear many people say when Muslims refer to ALLAH they are worshiping the same God Christians worship YAHWEH and others say Islam is worships ALLAH as a moon God and is NOT the same God Christians worship.

So is the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob YHWH/YAH/YAHWEH... etc, the same God ALLAH that Islam claims to worship??

There have been many bibles printed in Arabic with the word for God translated "Allah". Indeed, if you go to a motel and open a Gideon bible placed there, you can look up in the first pages where they have John 3:16 translated into many different languages. The Arabic translation uses "Allah" for the "God" in "For God so loved the world . . . "

 

[SolomonVII]

That is a subtle distinction, my friend. Well done.

This article seems to say the Pope does indeed embrace Islam: http://nationalreport.net/pope-francis-followers-koran-holy-bible/

I am still waiting for the counter-argument against my 'weak' argument.

 

[Berean777]

I hear a whoosh as the point of the post goes over your head.

Oh Ok.

How does it go again?

Whooooooosh

 

[DamianWarS]

I hear many people say when Muslims refer to ALLAH they are worshiping the same God Christians worship YAHWEH and others say Islam is worships ALLAH as a moon God and is NOT the same God Christians worship.

So is the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob YHWH/YAH/YAHWEH... etc, the same God ALLAH that Islam claims to worship??

That depends who you talk to. The way i see it is Islam worships the same God as Christianity and as the Jews. Of course there are differences to how we understand and approach God.

Paul cites the "unknown God" to the Athenians as the true God and he offers to revel to them how this unknown God can be knowable. This isn't relativism making every worshipable thing as the true God just gone about the wrong way but it is keeping the redeemable values and instead of introducing something new Paul shows how God can be revealed with what they already know showing them God was always there.

With islam it is even closer. The God of islam is rooted in the God of Abraham and everyone knows this. They have the same source but they diverge. But just because they see things differently doesn't make the source different. God still stays the same even if he is worshiped differently and understood differently.

We have all heard of the elephant analogy where each man describes the elephant differently. But what about the man who can only describe the elephant from a distance and cannot experience the elephant with their senses. They never experience the elephant but know it is real. They may get a lot of the details wrong but this doesn't make the elephant they are describing as wrong it only makes the details wrong.

This doesn't make islam right but It also doesn't make God false. muslim's worship an unknowable God and because of that will never know redemption through islam but that God is the same God that we worship. we just worship him in spirit and in turth.

 

[Neochristian]

You have seen the Adam's family right? The Munsters I mean.

When growing up I saw this abnormal and scary family that resembled anything but normal.

When we are born of the Spirit of God we are a new creation in Christ. So as far as God is concerned there is no common ground between the Adam's family and the new creation in Christ.

However when the religious leaders speak of common ground it has to be clearly stated that this makeshift worldly togetherness is nothing more than politics. So religion must not be brought into it at all. This means that the leaders of the Christian faiths have to clearly declare that they are not representing Christ and the Christian faith in this political stance.

If they don't wish to declare their political stance as completely separate to the Christian faith, then they must leave the faith altogether because their whole attitude is destructive to the congregation.

The deceived and/or deceivers should not hide behind religion and use the name of Christ/God/Christianity in vein for political gain.

We are seeing evidence of the unfolding of the prophesy of the ten denominational kings who give their power to the prince of this world for a short time (hour), so that they can have political say and a worldly kingdom that was never the prerogative of the great commission, for these denominational heads had previously no earthly political power (kingdom).

This mutiny and betrayal towards the Lord is the Strong Delusion to weed out those who believed not the truth who is Jesus Christ and his way and had pleasure in unrighteousness by replacing the cross for a worldly agenda, the universal (universal-ism) one world order (Babylon agenda) of the Prince of this world.

My dear, who has taught you these things?

Yes, I have heard there is no common ground between those two families. That means there is no common ground between the righteous and the wicked, between the wise and the foolish. That means all those who are righteous follow Christ, not that all those who follow Christ are righteous.

When these leaders speak in this way, they are following Christ's teaching to love everyone. They are forced to make public displays because of the legions of believers who have misunderstood and therefore harbor feelings of hatred and speak words of unkindness. These bold displays are leaders attempting to shepherd their flocks.