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benedictaoo

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I see my fellow Catholic Knights working against abortion. I see the Church's slowed but still significant growth. I see the Eucharist, the summit of our faith and I see people in Adoration weeping in joy before His beauty. I see the love that large, Catholic families (and even formerly Catholic families - RoseOfLima is eagerly expecting her 9th any day now!) display for their children, and the love those children show for eachother. I see the people who teach my kids, who coach my kids, and who are role models for my kids. I see the children I teach, coach, and serve as a role model for. I see my fellow parishioners supporting our local crisis pregnancy center and even adopting children at risk of abortion. I see a lot of good being done by Christians who love Christ and are thankful for the opportunity to serve Him. Online however, I see a lot of partisan bickering, cowardly question-dodging, misery, malaise, complaints, and quote-mined out-of-context nonsense from people who don't have the guts to embrace a bit of vulnerability and put their name behind their beliefs. This is an opportunity to show people how loving, honest, thankful, faithful, and trustworthy Catholics are, but we come off as a bunch of obsessive compulsive weaklings who won't even answer questions directly presented to them. We should be ashamed of ourselves, but there are some faithful people out there doing some great things for the Lord.

What you see is life going on. Like the bible says life will be going on up until the end. The point is the way of the world is what it is. We are godless. We have embraced a culture that gives God no place. We only marginally give lip service, marginally. We're trying to figure out ways to make the world a better place with out God with godless means. And how's that working? Its not but misguided faithless folks will think the solution is to go even further with the godlessness and the fault is faith itself. That's what I see. We are getting closer and closer to excepting full blown government who seeks to solve the worlds problems by making us dependent on them and God is supposed to be some private thing that has no place in society. Those who seek their lives will lose it, those who lose their lives will save it. If we look not to God but government, we are going to be in trouble. We are already
 
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Armoured

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Please don't try to whitewash the persecution happening in this world.
He isn't. He's specifically talking about the armchair persecution endemic to comfortable Western Christians. Not, you know, actual persecution.
 
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benedictaoo

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This is something we all need to seriously read, contemplate because its what is happening. From Benedict a few short years ago.


Dear Brothers and Sisters,


Today, Ash Wednesday, we are beginning the liturgical Season of Lent, 40 days that prepare us for the celebration of Holy Easter; it is a time of special commitment during our spiritual journey. The number 40 recurs in Sacred Scripture on various occasions. It calls to mind in particular, as we know, the 40 years during which the People of Israel wandered through the wilderness; a long period of formation in order to become the People of God, but also a long period in which the temptation to be unfaithful to their Covenant with the Lord was ever present. Forty was also the number of days that it took Elijah to reach God’s mountain, Mount Horeb; and this was likewise the period that Jesus spent in the wilderness before beginning his public ministry and where he was tempted by the devil. In today’s Catechesis, I would like to reflect on this very moment in the Lord’s earthly life which we shall be reading in the Gospel next Sunday.

First of all, the wilderness to which Jesus withdrew is the place of silence and poverty, where man is deprived of material support and faces the fundamental existential questions; where he is driven to the essential and for this very reason can more easily encounter God. However the wilderness is also the place of death because there is no water, nor even life, and it is the place of solitude where man feels temptation more acutely. Jesus went into the wilderness and was subjected there to the temptation to stray from the path marked out for him by the Father so as to follow other easier and more worldly paths (cf. Lk 4:1-13). He thus took on our temptations, burdened himself with our wretchedness in order to defeat the Evil One and open a path to God for us, a pathway of conversion.

Reflecting on the temptations to which Jesus was subjected in the wilderness invites each one of us to answer a fundamental question: What really counts in my life? In the first temptation the devil proposes to Jesus that he turn a stone into bread to appease his hunger. Jesus retorts that man lives on bread as well, but that he does not live on bread alone. Without a response to his hunger for truth, to his hunger for God, man cannot be saved (cf. vv. 3-4).

In the second temptation the devil proposes the way of power to Jesus. He takes him up and offers him dominion over the whole world; but this is not God’s way. Jesus is very clear that it is not worldly power that saves the world, but the power of the Cross, of humility and of love (cf. vv. 5-8).

In the third temptation the devil suggests to Jesus that he throw himself down from the pinnacle of the Temple of Jerusalem and have himself saved by God through his angels, that is, that he do something sensational to put God himself to the test; but the answer is that God is not an object on which to impose conditions of our own making; he is the Lord of all (cf. vv. 9-12).

What is the essence of the three temptations to which Jesus is subjected? It is the proposal to exploit God, to use him for one’s own interests, for one’s own glory and for one’s own success. And therefore, essentially to put oneself in God’s place, removing him from one’s own existence and making him seem superfluous. Each one of us must therefore ask him- or herself: what place does God have in my life? Is he the Lord or am I?

Overcoming the temptation to subject God to oneself and one’s own interests, or to put him in a corner and be converted to the correct order of priorities, giving God first place, is a journey that each and every Christian must make over and over again. “Repent” is an invitation we shall often hear in Lent, it means following Jesus in such a way that his Gospel is a practical guide for life; it means letting God transform us, in order to stop thinking that we are the only ones to build our existence. It means recognizing that we are creatures, that we depend on God, on his love, and that only by “losing” our life in him can we gain it.

This requires us to make our decisions in the light of the Word of God. Today it is no longer possible to be Christian as a mere consequence of living in a society that has Christian roots: even those who are born into a Christian family and receive a religious education must every day renew their decision to be Christian, that is, to give God first place in the face of the temptations that a secularized culture constantly suggests to them and in the face of the critical opinion of many of their contemporaries.

The trials to which society today subjects Christians are indeed numerous and affect their personal and social life. It is far from easy to be faithful to Christian marriage, to practice mercy in daily life, to make room for prayer and inner silence; it is far from easy to oppose publicly the decisions that many take for granted, such as abortion in the case of unwanted pregnancy, euthanasia in the case of serious illness and embryo selection in order to prevent hereditary diseases. The temptation to set faith aside is always present and conversion becomes a response to God that must be strengthened several times in life.

As an example and an incentive we have important conversions such as that of St Paul on the road to Damascus, or of St Augustine; yet, in our epoch of the eclipse of the sense of the sacred, God’s grace is at work and works marvels in the life of so many people. The Lord never tires of knocking at man’s door in social and cultural milieus that seem engulfed in secularization.

This is how it was for the Russian Orthodox Pavel Florenskij. Following an agnostic upbringing, so thorough that he felt really hostile to the religious teaching imparted at school, Florenskij the scientist found himself exclaiming: “No, it is impossible to live without God”, and entirely changed his life, even to the point of becoming a monk.

I am also thinking of Etty Hillesum, a young Dutch girl of Jewish origin who died in Auschwitz. At first far from God, she discovered him looking deep within her and she wrote: “There is a really deep well inside me. And in it dwells God. Sometimes I am there, too. But more often stones and grit block the well, and God is buried beneath. Then he must be dug out again” (Diaries, 97). In her disrupted, restless life she found God in the very midst of the great tragedy of the 20th century: the Shoah. This frail and dissatisfied young woman, transfigured by faith, became a woman full of love and inner peace who was able to declare: “I live in constant intimacy with God”.

The ability to oppose the ideological enticements of her time in order to choose the search for truth and to open herself to the discovery of faith was witnessed by another woman of our time, the American Dorothy Day. She confessed openly in her autobiography to having succumbed to the temptation to solve everything with politics, adhering to the Marxist proposal: “I wanted to be with the protesters, go to jail, write, influence others and leave my dreams to the world. How much ambition and how much searching for myself in all this!”. The journey towards faith in such a secularized environment was particularly difficult, but Grace acts nevertheless, as she pointed out: “It is certain that I felt the need to go to church more often, to kneel, to bow my head in prayer. A blind instinct, one might say, because I was not conscious of praying. But I went, I slipped into the atmosphere of prayer...”. God guided her to a conscious adherence to the Church, in a life dedicated to the underprivileged.

In our time there are many conversions, understood as a return of those who, after a Christian, though superficial upbringing, distanced themselves from the faith for years, only later to rediscover Christ and his Gospel. In the Book of Revelation we read: “Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me” (3:20). Our inner self must prepare to be visited by God and for this very reason must not let itself be invaded by illusions, appearances and material things.

In this season of Lent, in the Year of Faith, let us renew our commitment to the journey of conversion, to overcome the tendency to withdraw into ourselves and instead, to make room for God, seeing daily reality with his eyes. The alternative between being closed into our own egotism and openness to the love of God and of others, we might say, corresponds to the alternative of the temptations of Jesus: an alternative, that is, between human power and love of the Cross, between redemption seen in material wellbeing alone, and redemption as a work of God to which we should give primacy in life.

Being converted means not shutting ourselves into the quest for our own success, our own prestige, our own status, but rather ensuring that every day, in the small things, truth, faith in God and love become the most important thing of all.
 
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pdudgeon

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You are very inconsistent with your posts. Sometimes you insist that Planned Parenthood does "some good" while you accuse the Pro-Life side of being liars. At other times you say that the Pro-Life side isn't doing enough to end abortion. But when it comes to the question of whether the conditions are ripe for the Antichrist to be here in the world you suddenly switch to saying everything is awesome, and oddly, while venting anger and calling others names. People can either go with your claim that everything in the world is going great or they can believe what the Church has said about it. I'm going with the Church.

agreed. consistancy one way or the other would be best all around, if that were possible.
 
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pdudgeon

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He isn't. He's specifically talking about the armchair persecution endemic to comfortable Western Christians. Not, you know, actual persecution.

i'll take that as a snark response.

even so, what you call armchair persecution is still real. it still does harm, and it still hurts.
the problem is that if we wait until society has legally condoned mass murder to recognize that persecution is happening,
it will be that much harder to halt.

oh wait---they already have.
but they've changed the murder tag, and now call it abortion and assisted suicide.
 
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He isn't. He's specifically talking about the armchair persecution endemic to comfortable Western Christians. Not, you know, actual persecution.
Mike already clarified what he meant. I am sure you are aware of that.
 
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benedictaoo

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I'm not whitewashing persecution of Christians in this world - there are Christians dying for their faith every day. There are Christians who are not allowed to worship, there are countries that have banned Chtist's Church from their borders or insisted on naming their own bishops. Persecution of Christians is real and I have no intent of whitewashing it. The imaginary persecution that I referenced was something that we see in this very thread - Christians who suggest that they are victims of persecution because they make indefensible statements and other Christians call them on it. I should have been more clear - my comments about persecution were in the context in the USA in 2015 and in this thread specifically.
We are being persecuted on all kinds of different levels and degrees. I don't know Mike, you seem to be trying to deny biblically the things Christ himself told us would happen. You seem to think everything is fine and dandy in the Christian's world and people aren't suffering due to this massive wide spread apostasy we know is happening everywhere in the world. It's sad but Russia did spread her error everywhere.
 
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Armoured

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We are being persecuted on all kinds of different levels and degrees. I don't know Mike, you seem to be trying to deny biblically the things Christ himself told us would happen. You seem to think everything is fine and dandy in the Christian's world and people aren't suffering due to this massive wide spread apostasy we know is happening everywhere in the world. It's sad but Russia did spread her error everywhere.
...Russia?
 
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MikeK

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You are very inconsistent with your posts. Sometimes you insist that Planned Parenthood does "some good" while you accuse the Pro-Life side of being liars.

PP does some good things.

Some pro-life people are liars.

That should not be understood to mean that we should support PP. We shouldn't, because the evil that they do far outpaces the good that they do. My position has been very consistent.

At other times you say that the Pro-Life side isn't doing enough to end abortion.

They aren't, obviously. Many of the people I know who identify as pro-life don't give anything of themselves for those at risk of abortion or those mothers who are struggling to raise small families. Pro lifers as a whole do much good but we could do more.

But when it comes to the question of whether the conditions are ripe for the Antichrist to be here in the world you suddenly switch to saying everything is awesome, and oddly, while venting anger and calling others names. People can either go with your claim that everything in the world is going great or they can believe what the Church has said about it. I'm going with the Church.

I have never said that everything is awesome and you are lying about my position. In this thread I have stated on multiple occasions that there is much work to be done but that there has also been progress made in some areas. That you resort to misrepresenting my position says a lot more about your belief in your own position than it does about mine.
 
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MikeK

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We are being persecuted on all kinds of different levels and degrees. I don't know Mike, you seem to be trying to deny biblically the things Christ himself told us would happen.

Not at all. Christ's promises will come to pass, no doubt. Will they come today or in six million years? Heck if I know. I'm not the sort of person who decides what he believes and then looks for reasons to support my belief. That's rather backwards. I am a man, and men are upfront and reject cowardice and dishonesty. If I wanted to "deny biblically the things Christ said would happen" I would do so directly. Similarly, because I am not a coward, I will directly answer any question you present to me. I am willing to make statements and stand by them, I am willing to be tested, I am willing to be shown that I am wrong and I am willing to be corrected.

You seem to think everything is fine and dandy in the Christian's world and people aren't suffering due to this massive wide spread apostasy we know is happening everywhere in the world. It's sad but Russia did spread her error everywhere.

How do you interpret my repeated statements that there is real persecution against Christians happening and that the pro-life community needs to do more and that Christians need to really live their faith as evidence that I think everything is good in the world? There are bad things happening and there are good things happening.
 
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I see my fellow Catholic Knights working against abortion. I see the Church's slowed but still significant growth. I see the Eucharist, the summit of our faith and I see people in Adoration weeping in joy before His beauty. I see the love that large, Catholic families (and even formerly Catholic families - RoseOfLima is eagerly expecting her 9th any day now!) display for their children, and the love those children show for eachother. I see the people who teach my kids, who coach my kids, and who are role models for my kids. I see the children I teach, coach, and serve as a role model for. I see my fellow parishioners supporting our local crisis pregnancy center and even adopting children at risk of abortion. I see a lot of good being done by Christians who love Christ and are thankful for the opportunity to serve Him.
Are you saying your views are based off living in a privileged area of the world? That takes a lot of 'burying your head in the sand' don't you think?
Online however, I see a lot of partisan bickering, cowardly question-dodging, misery, malaise, complaints, and quote-mined out-of-context nonsense from people who don't have the guts to embrace a bit of vulnerability and put their name behind their beliefs. This is an opportunity to show people how loving, honest, thankful, faithful, and trustworthy Catholics are, but we come off as a bunch of obsessive compulsive weaklings who won't even answer questions directly presented to them. We should be ashamed of ourselves, but there are some faithful people out there doing some great things for the Lord.
You should be ashamed of those remarks. Baseless allegations about persons you don't even know. Not Christ like at all...
 
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LivingWordUnity

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Are you saying your views are based off living in a privileged area of the world? That takes a lot of 'burying your head in the sand' don't you think?

You should be ashamed of those remarks. Baseless allegations about persons you don't even know. Not Christ like at all...
Those who are united to the body of Christ can feel it when another part of the body is suffering.
 
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MikeK

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Are you saying your views are based off living in a privileged area of the world? That takes a lot of 'burying your head in the sand' don't you think?

Thanks for asking. I am stating that there are good things happening in the world and that there are Christians who are embracing the tasks they've been given gladly, and there are bad things happening in the world and there are Christians who do little but whinge, even though they have been gifted much and suffer little. It is not a binary thing.

You should be ashamed of those remarks. Baseless allegations about persons you don't even know. Not Christ like at all...

I would be ashamed of them if they weren't accurate. What I observe online is what I observe and I make no apologies for it. I will not misrepresent anyone's position. I will not allow anyone to misrepresent mine. I will answer questions for clarification upon request. Although you don't know me, you feel justified in judging my statements here as not Christ-like. That seems very much like what you are accusing me of. I am okay with your judgement. All you know of me is what I post, and I invite your criticism of my statements and character.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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Here's something that was said by Pope Benedict XVI:

Pope-Benedict-XVI.jpg


Holy Mass on the Solemnity of the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary - Homily of His Holiness Benedict XVI


We see this power, the force of the red dragon, brought into existence once again in the great dictatorships of the last century: the Nazi dictatorship and the dictatorship of Stalin monopolized all the power, penetrated every corner, the very last corner. It seemed impossible in the long term that faith could survive in the face of this dragon that was so powerful, that could not wait to devour God become a Child, as well as the woman, the Church. But also in this case, in the end love was stronger than hate.

Today too, the dragon exists in new and different ways. It exists in the form of materialistic ideologies that tell us it is absurd to think of God; it is absurd to observe God's commandments: they are a leftover from a time past. Life is only worth living for its own sake. Take everything we can get in this brief moment of life. Consumerism, selfishness and entertainment alone are worthwhile. This is life. This is how we must live. And once again, it seems absurd, impossible, to oppose this dominant mindset with all its media and propagandist power. Today too, it seems impossible to imagine a God who created man and made himself a Child and who was to be the true ruler of the world.

Even now, this dragon appears invincible, but it is still true today that God is stronger than the dragon, that it is love which conquers rather than selfishness.

(Read more)​
 
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pdudgeon

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i like this part of his homily:

"Today too, the dragon exists in new and different ways. It exists in the form of materialistic ideologies that tell us it is absurd to think of God; it is absurd to observe God's commandments: they are a leftover from a time past. Life is only worth living for its own sake. Take everything we can get in this brief moment of life. Consumerism, selfishness and entertainment alone are worthwhile. This is life. This is how we must live. And once again, it seems absurd, impossible, to oppose this dominant mindset with all its media and propagandist power. Today too, it seems impossible to imagine a God who created man and made himself a Child and who was to be the true ruler of the world.

Even now, this dragon appears invincible, but it is still true today that God is stronger than the dragon, that it is love which conquers rather than selfishness."

little things, little ways, quiet devotion, faithfulness.
it doesn't take a megaphone or a fantastic speech, or a PR specialist to make a difference.
it only takes one voice whispering into one ear to change a life.
one act done with grace, one word of hope given, one smile, one prayer offered up.
little things.
 
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I would be ashamed of them if they weren't accurate. What I observe online is what I observe and I make no apologies for it. I will not misrepresent anyone's position.
You already have, and continue to... repeatedly.
I will not allow anyone to misrepresent mine. I will answer questions for clarification upon request. Although you don't know me, you feel justified in judging my statements here as not Christ-like. That seems very much like what you are accusing me of. I am okay with your judgement. All you know of me is what I post, and I invite your criticism of my statements and character.
Let's break it down a bit then. Since you continue to be disingenuous.

Online however, I see a lot of partisan bickering, cowardly question-dodging, misery, malaise, complaints, and quote-mined out-of-context nonsense from people who don't have the guts to embrace a bit of vulnerability and put their name behind their beliefs.
In italics would qualify as 'your' observations. In bold are your baseless allegations (since you do not know the persons), with the intent to insult. Do not assume others lack 'guts' because they will not appeal to your demands. That is the real judgment here.

This is an opportunity to show people how loving, honest, thankful, faithful, and trustworthy Catholics are, but we come off as a bunch of obsessive compulsive weaklings who won't even answer questions directly presented to them. We should be ashamed of ourselves, but there are some faithful people out there doing some great things for the Lord.
Using 'obsessive compulsive weaklings' as a derogatory insult is not Christ-like. A simpleton can understand that. If you want to insult someone, try and refrain from using conditions as your ammunition. None of those positive attributes you listed have you portrayed in this case.

I was reading through some EO documents today and this line struck me:

"As with fasting, mentioning to others one's own virtuous deeds tends to reflect a sinful pride, and may also be considered extremely rude."
 
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pdudgeon

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agreed. it is enough that God sees a virtuous deed.

and since the object of a virtuous deed is first to imitate Christ,
and secondly to inspire in others thanks to God,
it spoils everything if the thanks and inspiration both become earthly.
 
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MikeK

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You already have, and continue to... repeatedly.

How so? Who's position have I misrepresented?

Let's break it down a bit then. Since you continue to be disingenuous.

Online however, I see a lot of partisan bickering, cowardly question-dodging, misery, malaise, complaints, and quote-mined out-of-context nonsense from people who don't have the guts to embrace a bit of vulnerability and put their name behind their beliefs.
In italics would qualify as 'your' observations. In bold are your baseless allegations (since you do not know the persons), with the intent to insult. Do not assume others lack 'guts' because they will not appeal to your demands. That is the real judgment here.

I'm not assuming, I'm observing. There exist, unfortunately, people who are too insecure to put their name on the line and take a clear stand. There are also people who let their fears prevent them from serving God as best they can. These people are cowards.

Using 'obsessive compulsive weaklings' as a derogatory insult is not Christ-like. A simpleton can understand that. If you want to insult someone, try and refrain from using conditions as your ammunition. None of those positive attributes you listed have you portrayed in this case.

When you say "a simpleton can understand that, you appear to be doing exactly what you accuse me of. Christ was a lot of wonderful things, but He was not always flowery on His speech.

I was reading through some EO documents today and this line struck me:

"As with fasting, mentioning to others one's own virtuous deeds tends to reflect a sinful pride, and may also be considered extremely rude."

I partially reject that idea. Mother Theressa was quick to promote the good she did, that her mission could grow and more service to God could be done. I like the way Jimmy Carter appeals to people to join him in working for Habitat for Humanity. I like the way the Apostles and so many great Saints used examples of their successes to inspire us, and also plainly shared their failures...also to inspire us.
 
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MikeK

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agreed. it is enough that God sees a virtuous deed.

and since the object of a virtuous deed is first to imitate Christ,
and secondly to inspire in others thanks to God,
it spoils everything if the thanks and inspiration both become earthly.

Nobody here is advocating for Earthly glory. There is no harm in saying "join me in picketing this abortion clinic", or "can you help me out at the food pantry?" or even "I was blessed to be able to take part in a Parish blood drive."
 
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How so? Who's position have I misrepresented?

I'm not assuming, I'm observing. There exist, unfortunately, people who are too insecure to put their name on the line and take a clear stand. There are also people who let their fears prevent them from serving God as best they can. These people are cowards.

When you say "a simpleton can understand that, you appear to be doing exactly what you accuse me of. Christ was a lot of wonderful things, but He was not always flowery on His speech.

I partially reject that idea. Mother Theressa was quick to promote the good she did, that her mission could grow and more service to God could be done. I like the way Jimmy Carter appeals to people to join him in working for Habitat for Humanity. I like the way the Apostles and so many great Saints used examples of their successes to inspire us, and also plainly shared their failures...also to inspire us.
There's no point arguing with you Mike. I have stated what you have done, and continue to.

All I ask is you consider your words, and stop using certain terms derogatorily. That's not much to ask, especially of a Christian.
 
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