The origins of atheism

[Chriliman]

To God, an atheist is like a stubborn child who thinks they can do everything on their own and don't need help from Dad. Eventually this behavior is going to get the child seriously injured or possibly killed, especially if they never ask for help from Dad. Still, Dad is always there trying to teach them what is right, even though they refuse to listen.

Atheists are interested in the philosophical truths that theism provides, just not interested in the source of the truths. Atheism provides a way to deny the source of all philosophical truths.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

To God, an atheist is like a stubborn child who thinks they can do everything on their own and don't need help from Dad. Eventually this behavior is going to get the child seriously injured or possibly killed, especially if they never ask for help from Dad. Still, Dad is always there trying to teach them what is right, even though they refuse to listen.

What help does God offer? What do I need help with that I would have to ask God for?

 

[Belk]

From the discussions (sometimes one-sided arguments with me being yelled at) I've had with atheists, I believe it stems from a deep-seated fear and insecurity, based on the thought of being judged for what you have done with your life. That anger even overrides the message of forgiveness with a false pride that declares, "How dare you suggest I have anything to be ashamed of!"

Some suggest that a spiritual element of satanic or demonic influence may be at hand. There are several passages in both the old and new Testaments that bear that out, but I think the major cause is the stubbornness the Bible says in inherent in all of us at birth. Stubbornness that grows into fear and then anger. For why else would atheistic organizations be so angry at a God they declare does not exist?

Why do theists always mistake anger at their actions as anger at a god?

 

[Chriliman]

What help does God offer? What do I need help with that I would have to ask God for?

Depends if you have a deep desire for truth. Are you satisfied with the answer that atheists offer as "I don't know the truth yet or even if there is a truth to be known". If you're satisfied with that, then God can't help you, but if you desire to know the truth, then God is the only answer.

 

[ToddNotTodd]

Depends if you have a deep desire for truth. Are you satisfied with the answer that atheists offer as "I don't know the truth yet or even if there is a truth to be known". If you're satisfied with that, then God can't help you, but if you desire to know the truth, then God is the only answer.

Every atheist I know wants to know as many true things as possible.

 

[Chriliman]

Every atheist I know wants to know as many true things as possible.

You could know many true things and still miss the truth.

 

[JONVIL]

Hello there everyone. I am sure this has been discussed before but I would like to start a new discussion on this. I want to hear your opinions on why do you think atheism exists and its cause. I will tell mine only after I see yours.

Atheists are those who will not accept a moral authority greater then themselves.

 

[CTGuy]

There's God and Satan....there are those who choose to live according to God or according to man/this world/satan. God gave us the gift of free will to choose. Origins of Atheism...I think it goes way back to almost the beginning...Let's look at 1 John 3:12 "Do not be like Cain, who belonged to the evil one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his own actions were evil and his brother's were righteous" - not of God - just some thoughts

 

[Belk]

Depends if you have a deep desire for truth. Are you satisfied with the answer that atheists offer as "I don't know the truth yet or even if there is a truth to be known". If you're satisfied with that, then God can't help you, but if you desire to know the truth, then God is the only answer.

Which is why all theists agree. What with them having "The Truth" and all.

 

[ToddNotTodd]

You could know many true things and still miss the truth.
View attachment 163586

So if you're calling the set of all true facts "The Truth", that's fine, but I don't see a particular reason to bring it up. Whether or not a god exists would just be another member of the set.

 

[gord44]

Depends if you have a deep desire for truth. Are you satisfied with the answer that atheists offer as "I don't know the truth yet or even if there is a truth to be known". If you're satisfied with that, then God can't help you, but if you desire to know the truth, then God is the only answer.

Yeah. No. A wise man will admit that he cannot know everything and will not make judgements when he cannot confirm all the facts. A fool will say 'there is only one way' even when there is no conclusive evidence to support it.

 

[Belk]

Atheists are those who will not accept a moral authority greater then themselves.

I was under the impression atheists are those who do not find the claims of gods credible.

 

[jackcv]

"A-theism" - the word means against God, and we all interpret this to mean against the 'belief' in God. This disbelief has of course existed since any belief in God or gods have existed. Some people are not convinced or choose to disbelieve. Bottom line: people believe what they want to believe. Why do some WANT to believe and some do not? God puts this desire in some but not in others. As Jesus said, "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day." (John 6:44)

In the main, I think your comments here are apropos. However, etymologically the a- part of the word means without or away from. Against is often the result, but the word atheist is about lack or flight rather than conflict.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Atheists are those who will not accept a moral authority greater then themselves.

Not true. They do not accept the existence of deities. That is all. You can still accept a moral authority greater than yourself if you adhere to a non-theistic religion like Humanism or some forms of Buddhism, etc or if you accept that moral philosophy, while not eternal or magical, can still be something greater than yourself. Those would be moral philosophies that are certainly greater than the individual, they're just not supernatural in origin. Morality is not limited to the supernatural.

 

[Foxhole87]

You could know many true things and still miss the truth.
View attachment 163586

The square labeled "A" is the same color as the square labeled B, but you'd swear up and down they are different colors.

 

[Chriliman]

So if you're calling the set of all true facts "The Truth", that's fine, but I don't see a particular reason to bring it up. Whether or not a god exists would just be another member of the set.

I'm not calling the set of all true facts "The Truth". I'm saying you could have all true facts and still miss the truth as the image so geniusly illustrates. I wonder if it was a theist or an atheist who came up with that graphic.

 

[Chriliman]

The square labeled "A" is the same color as the square labeled B, but you'd swear up and down they are different colors.

Thanks, I already made this point.

 

[Colter]

As an atheist, the origins for a persons disbelief in god(s) comes from the same place a persons belief in god(s) comes from. Within the individual.

Myself, I was raised in a baptist home and spent a few years in the baptist children's home as a teen. I fully believed in god at that time and immersed myself in studying the bible morning, noon and night. I studied mainly textual criticisms of the NT but spent a few months looking into why the newly founded christian canon would seek to rearrange the order that the books appeared originally in the Tanakh.

It was during this period that the seeds of doubt started. I was raised that the bible was the infallible word of god and when I started noticing things that couldn't be reconciled I tried every way possible to make them fit together but eventually I had to admit that there was a mistake. This revelation didnt sit well with the whole 'infallible word of god' belief I was taught so eventually cracks in my faith started to form. I wonder how I would have ended up had I been raised in a more apologetic faith that can handle a fallible bible but I dont spend a lot a lot of time thinking about it now. I do still enjoy textual criticism of the ancients texts which is why I spend a lot of time on religiously themed forums and groups so I guess that's a positive.

A lot of atheists will make the claim that we are all born atheist and only find a god after being indoctrinated by our societies. The way I define atheism is making a positive claim that god does not exist or that there is no evidence of such a being. Obviously newborns dont make claims about a lot except that they need a bottle so I disagree with this claim. Newborns certainly arent theists nor are they agnostic. "Unaffiliated" seems pretty accurate. lol. If you define atheism as the lack of a belief in god then newborns do fit that definition and I think that's where the confusion comes from.

In the end, there are those with very low evidence thresholds for things they are willing to believe in and there are those whos thresholds are higher. We see it not just in religion but almost every topic; conspiracy theories, claims of personal conquests, new scientific advances etc. That's why some of us are atheists and some are theists, polytheists, etc.

Thanks, I liked that. The Bible is indeed a mess! But why do I have faith? The Bible book collection is as imperfect and contradictory as one would expect all things considered. I have never believed the Bible books were written by God, rather I think the books reflect very real revelations and events as understood by the primitive minds of the ages in which those events occurred.

Then I found the Urantia book when I was a teen! That has been blowing my mind ever since!

 

[ToddNotTodd]

I'm not calling the set of all true facts "The Truth". I'm saying you could have all true facts and still miss the truth as the image so geniusly illustrates. I wonder if it was a theist or an atheist who came up with that graphic.

The fact that the cylinder is shaped the way it is is just a fact, as well as the fact that the shape of the shadow of the cylinder changes depending on how the light is placed relative to the cylinder.

You're still not saying anything about "The Truth" as separate from a collection of facts. And this certainly has nothing to do with any possible god, does it?

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Depends if you have a deep desire for truth.

Oh, but I do! I just don't believe your God is The Truth™. I'm not convinced anyone really knows The Truth™.

Are you satisfied with the answer that atheists offer as "I don't know the truth yet or even if there is a truth to be known".

It depends on the question being asked. I don't turn to atheists to seek the answers to life's big questions. I don't hold anyone as an authority to those questions. I don't think they have any answers that would satisfy but neither do Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, Scientologists, Satanists, Mormons, Jews, the Ancient Greeks or Romans, and so on.... No one, not one person truly knows how it all started or where it all came from or why we are all here. So I don't ask that question. I really don't care for the answer as it seems to be unknowable as of yet.

If you're satisfied with that, then God can't help you, but if you desire to know the truth, then God is the only answer.

Religion doesn't satisfy my curiosity either. If I don't know something, I don't just shove God in there as a place holder. I simply say, "I don't know." If you are okay with that then, please go right ahead. I will continue with an open mind until I find my answers, and if I don't ever find the answer, I will have at least enjoyed my brief stint.