Why is Jesus the ????

[Elder 111]

It does mean complete. What happens with a completed contract? Is it still valid and making requirements?

bugkiller

To complete does not mean to abolished either. In the context of Mat. 5:17-18 it can not mean abolish. What it does mean is that Jesus carried out all the requirements of the law. In the light of such and the fact that Christ is to be in me and I in Him, I will also live out the requirement of the law.
Jesus in us does not negate the keeping of the law but right doing or the requirements of the law. Rom. 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

 

[Elder 111]

you want abolished verses? Check your Bible.






Hebrews 7:18 For on the one hand there is an annulling of the former commandment because of its weakness and unprofitableness,


Hebrews 10:9
then he added, ‘See, I have come to do your will.’ He abolishes the first in order to establish the second.

2 Corinthians 3:13 And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

Ephesians 2:15
by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace,

Colossians 2:14
having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross

You do realize that there is no abolishing of the Ten Commandments in any of these. These speak to ceremonial laws. Why would you not sanction stealing if you are so convince that the law is abolished? Speak up!!!

 

[Elder 111]

Faith without works is dead? Then that would mean you think works can bring life. It has to be for if what you say is true, then works have to bring life.

Yet Paul said they do not.

21 Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law.

Now what you have done here is evil! Faith without works is dead can not mean that works bring like! Is that what God is saying in James 2:
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
You want to discount works when God plainly states that faith and works go together. This act by you pains me to the heart and I know it hurts heaven. Sad Sad Sad!

 

[TheBarrd]

And of course, no one could answer my question...I think I've asked it about three times now.
Let me try this again.

Which of the ten commandments, barring the infamous day of rest, may a Christian break with impunity?
If we are no longer under any law, why can't we:
1. Worship other gods?
2. Make graven images and worship them?
3. Take God's name in vain?
4. Okay, skip this one, for now.
5. Disrespect our parents?
6. Kill?
7. Commit adultery?
8. Steal?
9. Lie?
10. Covet?

If you cannot answer this question, you tacitly admit that we are under the law, just as we always were.

 

[TheBarrd]

Yes...whenever I ask this question it produces an hour or so of silence in this thread.
That is because there is no answer to it.

Let me say again...
I am not SDA, or any other brand of "Sabbatarian". I do not belong to any particular denomination, believing as I do that splitting the body of Christ into over 30,000 fragments is a sin we will have to answer for.
So I have no axe to grind here. I'm not out to prove to you that you have to change the day you go to church. Go on Thursdays, for all I care...
Me, I only worship God on days that end in "y".

 

[Elder 111]

1 John 3:23 just talks about 2, love God, love the church. just 2..hehehe

The same two that was there from Deut. 11:13 & 13:3 Lev. 19:34. The same that was understood to be coupled with the Ten commandments from the beginning.
Joshua 22:5 But take diligent heed to do the commandment and the law, which Moses the servant of the Lord charged you, to love the Lord your God, and to walk in all his ways, and to keep his commandments, and to cleave unto him, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul.
So why are you separating them? Jesus did not, for Jesus also required the ten in Mat 19:16-19.

 

[Elder 111]

Yes...whenever I ask this question it produces an hour or so of silence in this thread.
That is because there is no answer to it.

Let me say again...
I am not SDA, or any other brand of "Sabbatarian". I do not belong to any particular denomination, believing as I do that splitting the body of Christ into over 30,000 fragments is a sin we will have to answer for.
So I have no axe to grind here. I'm not out to prove to you that you have to change the day you go to church. Go on Thursdays, for all I care...
Me, I only worship God on days that end in "y".

You will not get an answer, I never got one except to here that they do not promote sin. So according to the argument, the ten commandments are not for Christians but break them is sin and you should not sin. Maybe someone can explain to us how that works. I call it stupidity.

 

[TheBarrd]

You will not get an answer, I never got one except to here that they do not promote sin. So according to the argument, the ten commandments are not for Christians but break them is sin and you should not sin. Maybe someone can explain to us how that works. I call it stupidity.

I don't really expect an answer, Elder.
Obviously, if breaking one of these commandments is sin, then those commandments are the law.
And I think Frogster and the Bug and the rest of them must know that. They can't really be that stupid.




Can they?

 

[Elder 111]

I don't really expect an answer, Elder.
Obviously, if breaking one of these commandments is sin, then those commandments are the law.
And I think Frogster and the Bug and the rest of them must know that. They can't really be that stupid.




Can they?

Is it possible that no one dare reply to you on this matter? They have already admitted that to do the things that the commandments condemn are sin and that they do not advocate sinning, so they can not say that we can break them. Yet they boast that the same commandments do not apply to us.
Can they? What do they leave for us to assume of them?
At least others can see that they are wrong!!!! ALL WRONG!!!!

 

[TheBarrd]

Is it possible that no one dare reply to you on this matter? They have already admitted that to do the things that the commandments condemn are sin and that they do not advocate sinning, so they can not say that we can break them. Yet they boast that the same commandments do not apply to us.
Can they? What do they leave for us to assume of them?
At least others can see that they are wrong!!!! ALL WRONG!!!!

It seems pretty obvious, doesn't it?
No one would advocate breaking these commandments.
Breaking them would be sin, and we all know that.
And even Paul kept the Sabbath...pull up a New Testament and do a word search on "Sabbath"...concentrate on Acts. The result will amaze you...

 

[listed]

To complete does not mean to abolished either. In the context of Mat. 5:17-18 it can not mean abolish. What it does mean is that Jesus carried out all the requirements of the law. In the light of such and the fact that Christ is to be in me and I in Him, I will also live out the requirement of the law.
Jesus in us does not negate the keeping of the law but right doing or the requirements of the law. Rom. 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

What happens to a completed contract?

 

[listed]

You do realize that there is no abolishing of the Ten Commandments in any of these. These speak to ceremonial laws. Why would you not sanction stealing if you are so convince that the law is abolished? Speak up!!!

The Sabbath is 100% ceremonial.

 

[listed]

Now what you have done here is evil! Faith without works is dead can not mean that works bring like! Is that what God is saying in James 2:
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
You want to discount works when God plainly states that faith and works go together. This act by you pains me to the heart and I know it hurts heaven. Sad Sad Sad!

Nothing in the chapter says anything about works of the law which we are delivered from.

 

[listed]

You will not get an answer, I never got one except to here that they do not promote sin. So according to the argument, the ten commandments are not for Christians but break them is sin and you should not sin. Maybe someone can explain to us how that works. I call it stupidity.

Yes it is stupidity to the max to suggest 1 is free to sin. We both oppose sin. You say it is because 1 follows the law. I say it is because I have a changed heart and follow the leading of the Spirit. Gal 5:18

 

[listed]

Is it possible that no one dare reply to you on this matter? They have already admitted that to do the things that the commandments condemn are sin and that they do not advocate sinning, so they can not say that we can break them. Yet they boast that the same commandments do not apply to us.
Can they? What do they leave for us to assume of them?
At least others can see that they are wrong!!!! ALL WRONG!!!!

Depends on which covenant 1 wants to follow. The New Covenant is not an addendum, amendment or extension of the covenant issued at Mt Sinai.

 

[TheBarrd]

No answer yet?
I am not surprised.

 

[listed]

It seems pretty obvious, doesn't it?
No one would advocate breaking these commandments.
Breaking them would be sin, and we all know that.
And even Paul kept the Sabbath...pull up a New Testament and do a word search on "Sabbath"...concentrate on Acts. The result will amaze you...

Being in the synagogue is not proof of keeping the Sabbath.

 

[listed]

To what? Are you only expecting a certain answer to fit your beliefs?

 

[listed]

Here's another little tidbit you left out:

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

True, we are not justified by the law. True that we are justified by faith.
But does that make the law null and void?
Here Paul rings out a resounding NO!

Nothing more than a miss application of Scripture.

 

[listed]

1 John 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

But once again, you left out a bit.

1 John 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1 John 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

Love is an action word.

No my buddy frogster did not leave out anything. Your additional verses do not support keeping the law or works of the law.