Why is Jesus the ????

[TheBarrd]

im not sure what is the hope of the op, what is to be accomplished..? the grace of God leads us to christ and many come by many differing roads to finally arrive at the cross

Jesus only knew of one road to life.
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Evidently, it is a rather difficult path, and few find it.

OTOH, it's a broad and easy way to destruction...
One wants to be sure that he is following Jesus.

 

[Alithis]

Jesus only knew of one road to life.
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Evidently, it is a rather difficult path, and few find it.

OTOH, it's a broad and easy way to destruction...
One wants to be sure that he is following Jesus.

yes all true .. but what does the op seek to accomplish by speaking of a stumbling block? ..its like telling a blind ban he has blindfold on ...
they never saw past it when the lord Jesus said it so whats to be accomplished ?

 

[TheBarrd]

Gen 12:3 was not about judaism it was gentile inclusive, ALL nations..

good night..

Yes..."all the families of the earth" is pretty inclusive.
However, there is a great deal of history to get through between Genesis and Jesus.

It is Jesus Who is the blessing promised to all the families of the earth...I'm sure I don't have to point that out to you.

And...well, I hate to break it to you...but Jesus was both fully God...
And fully Man. A Jewish man.

 

[TheBarrd]

yes all true .. but what does the op seek to accomplish by speaking of a stumbling block? ..its like telling a blind ban he has blindfold on ...
they never saw past it when the lord Jesus said it so whats to be accomplished ?

The OP is trying to prove that Christians need not bother themselves with the ten commandments.
I disagree.
I am following Jesus...stumbling along, to be sure...but trying to stay on the path He showed me.
Did Jesus keep the commandments?
Then I will do my level best to keep them also.
Did Jesus preach about love?
Then I will also try to love my neighbor...as my Lord also loved me.
Do I mess up?
You betcha!
And He forgives me.
But why should He forgive me if I don't even try?

 

[Alithis]

The OP is trying to prove that Christians need not bother themselves with the ten commandments.
I disagree.
I am following Jesus...stumbling along, to be sure...but trying to stay on the path He showed me.
Did Jesus keep the commandments?
Then I will do my level best to keep them also.
Did Jesus preach about love?
Then I will also try to love my neighbor...as my Lord also loved me.
Do I mess up?
You betcha!
And He forgives me.
But why should He forgive me if I don't even try?

then again.. i ask what is the op hoping to accomplish by doing so .. ?

but frogs going to like this reply if he stumbles across it ...maybe

The commands proved me a sinner
the proof condemned me .
the condemnation worked death in me
and i was lost .

the lord Jesus stands in our place ..in my place, having fulfilled the requirements of Gods law
he did what i cannot ..
his success freed me and he promised to impute his success to me

thus what was a command which condemned me has become a promise which frees me .

Gods pure and perfect law stands but it is fulfilled on my behalf if i abide in christ who fulfilled it (and it is this "if i abide in christ" part that folks really debate hard )

but any way ..
the command was- thou shalt not steal
the promise is ..because of christ in me .. i shall not steal ...

the command was -thou shalt not commit adultery
the promise is ..because of christ in me .. i shall not commit adultery
etc
(i have seen and experienced this power of the holy Spirit at work in my life -because it is written he works tirelessly in us (praise God ).i was a porn addict ..imprisoned to the filth and degradation and self hate of sexual immorality .. and i tied everything and could not stop permanently.. But i never ceased believing that his promise was true -that he will perfect that which concerns me ..until the day he told me i continues i that sin because i loved it more then i loved him ( love is key to everything in God )and i said lord i want o love you more - and he said to me do what I tell you .. and i began to listen to the holy Spirit ..an he led me out of that prison and set me free and i miraculously stopped doing that sin and iv never been so joyful .. this was some years back now and God is so wonderful ..

you see what had condemned me was the command proving my guilt "thou shalt not commit adultery (porn is the sin of adultery [don't be deceived],
has become his promise that because of Christ in me .. "i shall not commit adultery ".. we must have faith in him alone .but the evidence that we do is the transformation.the evidence is the fruit .

his perfect and eternal law does not cease to exist.. it is fulfilled in us by the lord JEsus ,ever increasingly, as he abides in us
and for him to abide in us we must abide in him .

 

[TheBarrd]

then again.. i ask what is the op hoping to accomplish by doing so .. ?

but frogs going to like this reply if he stumbles across it ...maybe

The commands proved me a sinner
the proof condemned me .
the condemnation worked death in me
and i was lost .

the lord Jesus stands in our place ..in my place, having fulfilled the requirements of Gods law
he did what i cannot ..
his success freed me and he promised to impute his success to me

thus what was a command which condemned me has become a promise which frees me .

Gods pure and perfect law stands but it is fulfilled on my behalf if i abide in christ who fulfilled it (and it is this "if i abide in christ" part that folks really debate hard )

but any way ..
the command was- thou shalt not steal
the promise is ..because of christ in me .. i shall not steal ...



the command was -thou shalt not commit adultery
the promise is ..because of christ in me .. i shall not commit adultery
etc
(i have seen and experienced this power of the holy Spirit at work in my life -because it is written he works tirelessly in us (praise God ).i was a porn addict ..imprisoned to the filth and degradation and self hate of sexual immorality .. and i tied everything and could not stop permanently.. But i never ceased believing that his promise was true -that he will perfect that which concerns me ..until the day he told me i continues i that sin because i loved it more then i loved him ( love is key to everything in God )and i said lord i want o love you more - and he said to me do what I tell you .. and i began to listen to the holy Spirit ..an he led me out of that prison and set me free and i miraculously stopped doing that sin and iv never been so joyful .. this was some years back now and God is so wonderful ..

you see what had condemned me was the command proving my guilt "thou shalt not commit adultery (porn is the sin of adultery [don't be deceived],
has become his promise that because of Christ in me .. "i shall not commit adultery ".. we must have faith in him alone .but the evidence that we do is the transformation.the evidence is the fruit .

his perfect and eternal law does not cease to exist.. it is fulfilled in us by the lord JEsus ,ever increasingly, as he abides in us
and for him to abide in us we must abide in him .

YES!
Yes, yes, yes!
Christ in me...
The law is written in my heart, because I am sealed with the Holy Spirit of God.

I am thrilled to hear of your release, and I praise God for it.

 

[Frogster]

That is how you treat Jesus? His words means nothing to you?

oh cut that out! Please..lets elevate the debate!

 

[Frogster]

How can the father of the Jews be a Gentles? Why would you believe that the root of the tree is mango roots and the tree banana? Only the rejection of truth leads to such errors.

My dear dear bro, please try to understand, that Abe was not circumcised when he got the gospel, or was justified, and paul uses Abe as the gentile in Rom 4.

Rom 4:10 How then was it counted to him? Was it before or after he had been circumcised? It was not after, but before he was circumcised.


Gal 3:8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “In you shall all the nations be blessed.”

These verse show the gospel, and justification came to Abe the Gentile, not about judaism.

 

[Frogster]

Rom, 11: We are part of the same tree Israel.
20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:

21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.

22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.

24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

please, not the tree argument again! read Eph 2, and 1 Peter 2, Paul and Peter talk about a spiritual temple, and don't forget the one new man came after the abolishment of Jewish law in 2:15, thanks!

 

[Frogster]

Goodness, Paul was also a Jew...don't these people know this?

He called it all poop in Phil 3, in Gal 1, he said his FORMER life in Judaism.

In Gal 4:12, he said he became as a gentile.

Even the Jewish Christians in Antioch were living as Gentiles

 

[Frogster]

I understand the scriptures in the OP perfectly. What I don't understand is how anyone could add their opinion contrariwise, just to support a sect of law keepers, who simply have only demonstrated "stumbling" here so far. The Old Covenant is the Law of Moses. No one but Jesus kept it. Then it was abolished, for that reason. Now we who are drawn by Jesus, have the NEW LAW written in our hearts. Not on stone, where it was impossible for a man to keep. But with the Spirit of Christ in me, of Him who keeps the Law, then by His Spirit, so also do I then, for we are ONE.
A New Covenant by the Spirit of Christ gives us the obedience to the Faith of Abraham. Nothing under the Law could or ever will be able to accomplish salvation, such a thought process is the stumblingblock. Jesus is the only Way.
It seems clear to me...

Preach it sis! Good stuff!

 

[Elder 111]

I understand the scriptures in the OP perfectly. What I don't understand is how anyone could add their opinion contrariwise, just to support a sect of law keepers, who simply have only demonstrated "stumbling" here so far. The Old Covenant is the Law of Moses. No one but Jesus kept it. Then it was abolished, for that reason. Now we who are drawn by Jesus, have the NEW LAW written in our hearts. Not on stone, where it was impossible for a man to keep. But with the Spirit of Christ in me, of Him who keeps the Law, then by His Spirit, so also do I then, for we are ONE.
A New Covenant by the Spirit of Christ gives us the obedience to the Faith of Abraham. Nothing under the Law could or ever will be able to accomplish salvation, such a thought process is the stumblingblock. Jesus is the only Way.
It seems clear to me...

Nothing of the bible is of man far less the OC being of Moses. All is of God! The ten Commandments were and will never be abolished. Jesus Himself said
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?

17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
(Mathew 5, 19)

 

[Frogster]

What did Jesus have to do with the church?
Uh...without Jesus, there would be no church.

.

it is not a Jewish church...there is no jew or greek in the body, gal 3:28, col 3:11.

 

[Frogster]

im not sure what is the hope of the op, what is to be accomplished..? the grace of God leads us to christ and many come by many differing roads to finally arrive at the cross

the OP is simple to understand.

 

[Frogster]

then again.. i ask what is the op hoping to accomplish by doing so .. ?

but frogs going to like this reply if he stumbles across it ...maybe

The commands proved me a sinner
the proof condemned me .
the condemnation worked death in me
and i was lost .

the lord Jesus stands in our place ..in my place, having fulfilled the requirements of Gods law
he did what i cannot ..
his success freed me and he promised to impute his success to me

thus what was a command which condemned me has become a promise which frees me .

Gods pure and perfect law stands but it is fulfilled on my behalf if i abide in christ who fulfilled it (and it is this "if i abide in christ" part that folks really debate hard )

but any way ..
the command was- thou shalt not steal
the promise is ..because of christ in me .. i shall not steal ...

the command was -thou shalt not commit adultery
the promise is ..because of christ in me .. i shall not commit adultery
etc
(i have seen and experienced this power of the holy Spirit at work in my life -because it is written he works tirelessly in us (praise God ).i was a porn addict ..imprisoned to the filth and degradation and self hate of sexual immorality .. and i tied everything and could not stop permanently.. But i never ceased believing that his promise was true -that he will perfect that which concerns me ..until the day he told me i continues i that sin because i loved it more then i loved him ( love is key to everything in God )and i said lord i want o love you more - and he said to me do what I tell you .. and i began to listen to the holy Spirit ..an he led me out of that prison and set me free and i miraculously stopped doing that sin and iv never been so joyful .. this was some years back now and God is so wonderful ..

you see what had condemned me was the command proving my guilt "thou shalt not commit adultery (porn is the sin of adultery [don't be deceived],
has become his promise that because of Christ in me .. "i shall not commit adultery ".. we must have faith in him alone .but the evidence that we do is the transformation.the evidence is the fruit .

his perfect and eternal law does not cease to exist.. it is fulfilled in us by the lord JEsus ,ever increasingly, as he abides in us
and for him to abide in us we must abide in him .

why is the law a stumbling block, when people try to come to Christ by law? I am making a true and simple point.

Rom 9:32 Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as if it were based on works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone,

Please refute verse 9:32, that shows the Jesus is a rock of offense to those who want to come to Him by law?

Gosh, I can't believe the reaction to such a simple fact.

 

[Frogster]

YES!
Yes, yes, yes!
Christ in me...
The law is written in my heart, because I am sealed with the Holy Spirit of God.

I am thrilled to hear of your release, and I praise God for it.

did you get the Spirit by works or faith?

Gal 3:5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith—

 

[Frogster]

yes all true .. but what does the op seek to accomplish by speaking of a stumbling block? ..its like telling a blind ban he has blindfold on ...
they never saw past it when the lord Jesus said it so whats to be accomplished ?

The stumbling block is used several times in the NT, what did the writers hope to accomplish who said it? You should ask them.

 

[Frogster]

Nothing of the bible is of man far less the OC being of Moses. All is of God! The ten Commandments were and will never be abolished. Jesus Himself said
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?

17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
(Mathew 5, 19)

I have explained the abolished for who, and where, the Christian at the cross, many times now. Gosh luke 24 even says the mosaic code was fulfilled.

 

[Elder 111]

oh cut that out! Please..lets elevate the debate!

Cut what out? The fact that you completely ignore the words of Jesus Himself? After ignoring the very words of Christ how can there be any elevation in this debate? That is just impossible!

 

[Elder 111]

I have explained the abolished for who, and where, the Christian at the cross, many times now. Gosh luke 24 even says the mosaic code was fulfilled.

Fulfill does not mean abolished!!!! Check your dictionary.