I am Non Denominational and unorthodox

[Job8]

We seem to have a big problem with all those evil angels around. As a simple human being I feel not being able to match their spiritual powers and protect myself.

You are absolutely correct in noting that we have a big problem -- in fact a very big problem -- with all those evil angels around. And you are also correct in concluding that we are no match for them. Because this is so, God has made sure that we can withstand their assaults.

Firstly those who are children of God have Christ within, and "GREATER IS HE THAT IS IN US, THAN HE THAT IS IN THE WORLD" (1 Jn 4:4).

Secondly, there is an invisible war going on right now between the holy angels and the evil angels, with God behind the holy angels. We get a glimpse of this in 2 Kings 6:13-17, when Elisha prayed for his servant to see the angelic horses and chariots surrounding them. There will come a time when Satan and all the evil angels will be cast down to the earth (Rev 12:7,9).

Thirdly God has given Christians spiritual armour to stand againt all the evil angels (Eph 6:10-18).

 

[Job8]

There is a problem with what you said. Mainly Noah was the only good man alive at this time. So when all of the families were wicked save one man, where did the good families come from? We have to look at that verse in the context of the entire bible. Every single time the bible mentions Sons of God in the old testament it is referring to angels. Man is only referred to as sons of God when we do not have a corrupt nature. Obviously, man had a corrupt nature right before the flood so Sons of God couldn't be man. I know some Christians have come to believe the traditions that their church tries to pass off as God's Word, but give the the scripture where it says that the sons of God were good men while the daughters of men were evil. I can tell you that the Jewish people were serious regarding claims of being God's sons, hence them wanting to stone Jesus when he said it.

Sketcher,

Since Joshua has responded to you as I would have, you have your answer. That fantasy about the "the sons of God" being the righteous ones and "the line of Seth" is fully refuted by the actual Genesis account (Gen 6:1-8). The only righteous man mentioned is Noah, because he found grace in the eyes of the LORD. Just go back and read this chapter carefully. It is only when we come to the New Testament that those who are born again are called "sons of God".

 

[Sketcher]

There is a problem with what you said. Mainly Noah was the only good man alive at this time. So when all of the families were wicked save one man, where did the good families come from?

Both the fallen angels interpretation and the both sides being human interpretation imply that it took time (probably generations) for the amount of wicked people and for the culture of wickedness to grow to the point that the flood became necessary. At bare minimum, it would have been 120 years, which itself is plenty of time (pre-flood, the earliest recorded age of a person who was born becoming a parent is 65, and it could have happened earlier than that).

Let's look at the implications of the fallen angels interpretation. This interpretation as I understand it (as numerous Christians have told it) is as follows:

1) Fallen angels decide to take human women as wives. These wives bear them children. These children are powerful giants, Anakites.
2) These powerful giants are also thoroughly wicked. The idea being to taint all of humanity with this bloodline to make the coming of Christ, and the redemption of humanity, impossible.
3) They make good enough progress so that God needs to start a global flood to wipe them out. Somehow, Noah doesn't have any of this demon-blood in him, and somehow, they didn't kill him, in spite of their evil purpose.
4) The flood happens, wiping them out. God learns his lesson and puts a limit on demonic activity, preventing them from doing this again. He throws all the demons who did this in prison, leaving the rest on Earth to tempt, deceive and possess people.

However, there are some serious problems with the implications of this story.

- In Numbers 13, the Anakites are back. Did God not do the job right the first time? Did he restrain some demons from sexual activity, but not others? Did one slip through? Did one or a few escape for a short bit to renew the Anakite race, in contradiction of this tale's interpretation of 1 Peter 3:19?
- Why is Satan still loose, if he was the #1 fallen angel, as Revelation 12:7-12 states? And if he was still loose and if this were possible, why not just do this all over again? Or did these fallen angels have a different ringleader? If so, who? Which of the fallen angels would be more wicked, clever, and decisive than Satan himself (this would be necessary because creating a race of demon-children seems a lot more effective than just tempting people)? And if it really was Satan who did it, why did God give him enough free reign to do this in the first place only to restrict it later? And why is he not in prison as the other fallen angels who did this are said to be? Why leave him free to tempt people to make large-scale wars, commit genocide, mass rapes (where no demon-blood is involved), institute religions that require child sacrifice, and institute slavery?
- More to the point, if all this were possible, why wouldn't Satan himself, or any of these demons, just overpower Adam, and rape Eve after their banishment?

So the fallen angels interpretation, and its accompanying story, paint God as being less clever or less powerful, Satan as being less clever or less powerful, and his rank-and-file demons as being more clever and more powerful than the Bible seems to teach. You pointed out one problem that isn't really a problem with my interpretation (Noah being the one righteous head of a family left on Earth). I see many more problems with this tale, which are not consistent with what Scripture teaches about God, Satan, and the demons. If the "sons of God" refer to good men, some say from the line of Seth exclusively, then none of the problems I brought up exist. We have a narrative that is consistent with the Law's rebuke to not marry foreign women, and the story of foreign women corrupting Israel's kings. It just as adequately explains the need for the flood, it serves as a greater warning to us, showing us how far plain old people can fall without any genetic interference from demons. It has Nephilim as a term for great and wicked homo sapiens sapiens, which also resolves the issue of the Anakites coming up again in Numbers 13, and presents no potential issues for the redemption of the descendants of their surviving offspring.

 

[Gunny]

In my humble opinion, Nephilim (demonic hybrid) still are present in our world.


The Nephilim were upon the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God went into the daughters of humankind, and they bore children to them.

Genesis 6:4
Lexham English Bible (LEB)

 

[Sketcher]

In my humble opinion, Nephilim (demonic hybrid) still are present in our world.


The Nephilim were upon the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God went into the daughters of humankind, and they bore children to them.

Genesis 6:4
Lexham English Bible (LEB)

Can they be saved or not? Why or why not?

 

[joshuanazar]

Can they be saved or not? Why or why not?

While I do not believe that nephilim are still present today, Gunny did quote the verse that I wanted to quote. You see the bible says that the angels are innumerable, but we all know this as a figure of speech. A lot of people believe with good reason that when Satan rebelled he took 1/3 of the angels with him. But lets look at it like you described. Satan gets some of his angels to sleep with women to create an impure line and do away with the promised seed. God locks these particular angels up in the abyss I can only assume that Satan never mated with woman so that is why he was never locked up. God sends a flood and saves Noah and his family who are pure. Then more angels mated with more women. Those angels then also being locked up. God this time cleansed the world of this evil race through his agents, the Israelites. They were finally wiped out again during the reign of king David. As for why Satan doesn't do it again? Well it will be pointless after Christ has already been born. Also, maybe Satan saw that his plan wasn't going to work having failed two separate times and he wants to keep his remaining angels free so that he can try to pollute the church and world against God. Maybe he just can't afford another try. There are several reason why he might not have tried after that second time.

But if there were so many good men before Noah, then how come only Abel and Enoch are mentioned as faithful in Hebrews? Also, how can a union between a good man and an evil woman create a giant and why does it not create giants now? Also, If not for trying to corrupt Adam's line, why else would God lock up angels as in 2 Peter 2:4. If the sin was just rebellion then he would be unjust for not also locking up every other angel that also rebelled against God. Also, can you show me where they called man sons of God before Jesus came on the scene? How about we look at Job 1:6, 2:1, and 38:7 (these sons of God were singing for joy when God laid the foundations of the earth, before he created man). How about Daniel 3:25,28? The king could have been talking about Jesus or he could have been talking about an angel, being a pagan king he probably wouldn't have been able to tell the difference. But whichever showed up it was clear that it was not a man.

 

[Semyamara]

I see a bunch of different arguments here about who the sons of God are, and I am familiar with the teaching that says they are just human sons of Seth. That teaching is wrong. The Book of Enoch is really clear that the sons of God were the watchers, who are one type of angel. They are not the same as the one third of rebellious angels that were cast out of heaven with Satan. There were only about 200 of the watchers sent to earth. They were a different class of angels just like you have different classes mentioned in the Bible like arch angels, seraphim and cherubim, and ministering spirits. In the demonic world there are principalities and powers, and there are spirits of divination like familiar spirits that are a lower class of spirit than the rulers in the high places. I think people get mixed up when they think the watchers were the same ones from the group that followed Satan against God in heaven. The human and watchers children are part human and if someone has a part of that bloodline from a long time ago that doesn't mean that person is an evil person or they are doomed. They still have free will to choose salvation through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[Gunny]

Can they be saved or not? Why or why not?

In my humble opinion, they can not be saved for they are manifestations of our defeated foe.

For the last 5-7 years many of the biblical prophecy preachers and teachers have speaking much regarding the nephilim especially concerning the prophecy regarding:

"For as were the days of Noah, so will be the coming of the Son of Man."

Matthew 24:37
ESV

Once again, many biblical preachers and teachers; state that manifestation of nephilim have been occurring with increase over the last 20-30 years which has lead many individuals being deceived. The biblical preachers and teachers with increased urgency have stated that the "nephilim" issue is connected directly to the onslaught of the world's fascination with supposed ET's, UFO's, and aliens. The biblical prophecy camp that really seeks God and His Word believe that the nephilim/ET's, UFO's, and alien fascination by the world (especially with all the media shows devoted to this topic-not nephilim(biblical) but ET's, UFO's and aliens (that which is used by the enemy to deceive and distract).

 

[joshuanazar]

First as to whether these giants can be saved or not the Bible says that there is no resurrection for them. So I don't even know if they would go to hell since that would be the resurrection of the damned. Now as for what Semyamara has said, the Book of Enoch that we see around here today is not the same one that Jude quoted from. This book that you have read is not scripture. I have read it and it does not agree with the Spirit of God.

 

[Job8]

Sketcher,

Since God has chosen to reveal just a few facts about this issue, all your questions and cogitations are unnecessary. We really don't know how the gigantic and terrifying Anakim appeared after the Flood, so no need to speculate. But it is more than likely that evil angels began corrupting the human race long before Noah, and the culmination of wickedness took place just before the Flood. It is believed by some that Tubal Cain and others like him were taught by evil angels, and it would appear that Lamech's murderous inclination could also have been influenced by them (Gen 22-24). Here's a comment in Wikipedia:

Others connect Tubal-cain's work to making weapons of war. Rashi notes that he "spiced and refined the Cain's craft to make weapons for murderers." In The Antiquities of the Jews, Flavius Josephus says that "Tubal exceeded all men in strength, and was very expert and famous in martial performances, ... and first of all invented the art of working brass." Walter Elwell suggests that his invention of superior weapons may have been the motivation for Lamech's interest in avenging blood.

 

[dragongunner]

The teaching of angels marrying woman is a long false doctrine, with many theories and no facts, in fact the Holy Scriptures are full of facts. And Wisdom concludes that its a false teaching, with may problems that those who want to believe the fable seem inclined to believe.
The very earliest interpretation of the scriptures was that "sons of God" are those who believed in God and worshipped Him. Some argue that "sons" everywhere else in the OT proves angels. with that theory then Jesus is invalid because his name never appeared in the OT. However many places in the OT shows "sons" and that they are those who worship and believe in Jehovah. God even called Isreal his "son".

Note that in the OT Numbers and Jerimiah, worshipers of Jehovah took heathen wives it is said that they (Judah) had married a daughter of a strange god.

"Ye are the children (sons) of the Lord your God", Deut. 14:1 "ye are the sons of the living God" Hosea 1:10

So then are all of us who believe and worship God not men, but angels? Let wisdom dictate here a little.

The theory that angels are meant as "sons of God" in Geneisis contradicts the doctrine concerning angels. It writes nowhere that a angel could or would enter into marriage with a human.

As man increased on the earth, worshipers of God (sons) so far degenerated themselves that in choosing wives for themselves they neglected that in choosing wives for themselves they neglected character, and esteemed beauty above godliness. Even Paul said that those who believe in God should not marry those who are unbelievers, how can light dwell with darkness.

When the above happened God was grieved, and a sentence was handed out to man…..no sentence to angels.(they weren't involved). Punishment for man only.


Please brethren, seek wisdom and flee fables and be not deceived by seducing spirits and doctrines of devils. Angels do not marry, do not have offspring.

 

[joshuanazar]

You said that it is a long false doctrine but can you offer any real proof? Out of the two verses that you gave only the Deuteronomy verse applies to the OT and it says children. Hosea is talking about a future point. Sons of God is like a title and every time that phrase is used it is about an angel. My question is if a union between a good man and an evil woman created giants that oppressed the people, then why does that not happen now? There are plenty of good men married to evil women today and none of them has produced a giant. In fact, 1 Corinthians 7:12-14 seems to say something different about the children of such unions.

 

[Sketcher]

While I do not believe that nephilim are still present today, Gunny did quote the verse that I wanted to quote. You see the bible says that the angels are innumerable, but we all know this as a figure of speech. A lot of people believe with good reason that when Satan rebelled he took 1/3 of the angels with him. But lets look at it like you described. Satan gets some of his angels to sleep with women to create an impure line and do away with the promised seed. God locks these particular angels up in the abyss I can only assume that Satan never mated with woman so that is why he was never locked up. God sends a flood and saves Noah and his family who are pure. Then more angels mated with more women. Those angels then also being locked up. God this time cleansed the world of this evil race through his agents, the Israelites. They were finally wiped out again during the reign of king David. As for why Satan doesn't do it again? Well it will be pointless after Christ has already been born. Also, maybe Satan saw that his plan wasn't going to work having failed two separate times and he wants to keep his remaining angels free so that he can try to pollute the church and world against God. Maybe he just can't afford another try. There are several reason why he might not have tried after that second time.

Why wouldn't he have tried again after David? It would have been easy to do since the Messianic bloodline had been revealed. Solomon was a known womanizer, it would have been easy to sneak a nephilim's daughter in there as one of his 700 wives or 300 concubines.

But if there were so many good men before Noah, then how come only Abel and Enoch are mentioned as faithful in Hebrews?

There are varying levels of goodness and badness. I wouldn't rank Seth at the same moral level as Lamech (Gen 4:19-24), for instance.

Also, how can a union between a good man and an evil woman create a giant and why does it not create giants now?

My position is that "giants" is not literal. Let's say someone comes from a family where most people hover around 5 feet tall, and they enter a land where most people are 7 feet tall. The shorter ones might call the taller ones giants, and might feel like grasshoppers compared to them. But to answer directly, genetics. Good enough genes from both sides will produce big, strong, healthy, and intelligent people, certainly those capable of great deeds. As for why we don't see "giants" now? Again, that depends on perspective. There are tribes in Africa where men are commonly over 7 feet tall, some men have reached 8 feet tall. That's not Goliath-like proportions most likely, but Goliath was an anomaly.

Also, If not for trying to corrupt Adam's line, why else would God lock up angels as in 2 Peter 2:4. If the sin was just rebellion then he would be unjust for not also locking up every other angel that also rebelled against God.

It's all angels in the rebellion, and the language is figurative - the verse meaning their fate is inescapable.

Also, can you show me where they called man sons of God before Jesus came on the scene?

Genesis 6:2.

I see a bunch of different arguments here about who the sons of God are, and I am familiar with the teaching that says they are just human sons of Seth. That teaching is wrong. The Book of Enoch is really clear that the sons of God were the watchers, who are one type of angel.

It's not in the Jewish or Christian canons for a reason.

I think people get mixed up when they think the watchers were the same ones from the group that followed Satan against God in heaven. The human and watchers children are part human and if someone has a part of that bloodline from a long time ago that doesn't mean that person is an evil person or they are doomed. They still have free will to choose salvation through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Then what was the point of corrupting the bloodline to begin with?

In my humble opinion, they can not be saved for they are manifestations of our defeated foe.

For the last 5-7 years many of the biblical prophecy preachers and teachers have speaking much regarding the nephilim especially concerning the prophecy regarding:

"For as were the days of Noah, so will be the coming of the Son of Man."

Matthew 24:37
ESV

Once again, many biblical preachers and teachers; state that manifestation of nephilim have been occurring with increase over the last 20-30 years which has lead many individuals being deceived. The biblical preachers and teachers with increased urgency have stated that the "nephilim" issue is connected directly to the onslaught of the world's fascination with supposed ET's, UFO's, and aliens. The biblical prophecy camp that really seeks God and His Word believe that the nephilim/ET's, UFO's, and alien fascination by the world (especially with all the media shows devoted to this topic-not nephilim(biblical) but ET's, UFO's and aliens (that which is used by the enemy to deceive and distract).

Where are these nephilim? Everyone I've seen on TV talking about aliens is just a regular sized person, perhaps a little smaller. Besides, our call is to bring the Gospel to the nations, people of every tongue, tribe and nation must come to God (Rev. 7:9).

Since God has chosen to reveal just a few facts about this issue, all your questions and cogitations are unnecessary. We really don't know how the gigantic and terrifying Anakim appeared after the Flood, so no need to speculate. But it is more than likely that evil angels began corrupting the human race long before Noah, and the culmination of wickedness took place just before the Flood.

I know of no doctrine that is explicitly stated in Scripture that is so inconsistent with Scripture's teaching as this one is. This passage can be interpreted in a reasonable way that is consistent with Scripture, or in a fanciful way that is inconsistent with the rest of Scripture. I choose the reasonable interpretation that is consistent with Scripture. I must love God with my mind.

 

[joshuanazar]

Why wouldn't he have tried again after David? It would have been easy to do since the Messianic bloodline had been revealed. Solomon was a known womanizer, it would have been easy to sneak a nephilim's daughter in there as one of his 700 wives or 300 concubines.


There are varying levels of goodness and badness. I wouldn't rank Seth at the same moral level as Lamech (Gen 4:19-24), for instance.


My position is that "giants" is not literal. Let's say someone comes from a family where most people hover around 5 feet tall, and they enter a land where most people are 7 feet tall. The shorter ones might call the taller ones giants, and might feel like grasshoppers compared to them. But to answer directly, genetics. Good enough genes from both sides will produce big, strong, healthy, and intelligent people, certainly those capable of great deeds. As for why we don't see "giants" now? Again, that depends on perspective. There are tribes in Africa where men are commonly over 7 feet tall, some men have reached 8 feet tall. That's not Goliath-like proportions most likely, but Goliath was an anomaly.


It's all angels in the rebellion, and the language is figurative - the verse meaning their fate is inescapable.


Genesis 6:2.


It's not in the Jewish or Christian canons for a reason.


Then what was the point of corrupting the bloodline to begin with?


Where are these nephilim? Everyone I've seen on TV talking about aliens is just a regular sized person, perhaps a little smaller. Besides, our call is to bring the Gospel to the nations, people of every tongue, tribe and nation must come to God (Rev. 7:9).


I know of no doctrine that is explicitly stated in Scripture that is so inconsistent with Scripture's teaching as this one is. This passage can be interpreted in a reasonable way that is consistent with Scripture, or in a fanciful way that is inconsistent with the rest of Scripture. I choose the reasonable interpretation that is consistent with Scripture. I must love God with my mind.

I will address your comments in order. First, I posted before that Satan most likely saw that this plan wouldn't work after failing twice and decided to abandon it. That's my guess.

As to varying levels of good and evil, I say sin is sin. There is no levels there is only good and bad.

Giants cannot be figurative. Goliath was over nine feet when the average height was five feet and he was not an anomaly. Og had a bed that 13.5 feet by 6 feet. And what does "good enough" genes have to do with morality of good and evil?

Also we cannot pick and choose what we take literal and what we take figuratively. If we take man going to hell as literal we must also take the angelic prison as literal. And you cannot use the verse that is the topic of debate to prove your side of the debate. Find another verse please. one that is absolutely clear that it is referring to man.

But I agree with you in regards to the Book of Enoch being trash.

 

[Sketcher]

I will address your comments in order. First, I posted before that Satan most likely saw that this plan wouldn't work after failing twice and decided to abandon it. That's my guess.

He's been doing other stuff for much longer that hasn't worked as well.

As to varying levels of good and evil, I say sin is sin. There is no levels there is only good and bad.

Jesus attested to varying levels of sin in John 19:11. All sin is bad enough, but some sins are worse than others. It's self-evident when comparing a petty insult to the war crimes of ISIS, for instance.

Giants cannot be figurative. Goliath was over nine feet when the average height was five feet and he was not an anomaly.

That by definition is an anomaly. If he was not an anomaly, he would have been average.

And what does "good enough" genes have to do with morality of good and evil?

They're two separate things. In this case, they merely correlated. The genetics did not cause morality or immorality. Good-looking, bad people got together with good-looking good people, and the bad people corrupted the children's morals. Beauty and pride trapped people then as they do now.

Also we cannot pick and choose what we take literal and what we take figuratively. If we take man going to hell as literal we must also take the angelic prison as literal.

If you do not believe that the bride in Song of Songs literally had two towers on her chest and literally had a flock of goats running down her head, you do pick and choose what you take literally and what you take figuratively. The issue is does the context lend more credibility to a literal or figurative interpretation. Considering that all angelic visions were signs from God to a primitive people, their very appearances were figurative for the purpose of communicating the message they were sent to deliver (hence swords and horses and chariots when angels appeared regarding war - advance the technology a few thousand years, and they would more likely be seen with guns instead).

And you cannot use the verse that is the topic of debate to prove your side of the debate. Find another verse please. one that is absolutely clear that it is referring to man.

I wasn't using that to prove my point. You simply asked for an example and I gave you one. Since one must be very careful with cross-referencing, I wouldn't be so quick to call the sons of God in that passage angels.

 

[Job8]

When the above happened God was grieved, and a sentence was handed out to man…..no sentence to angels.(they weren't involved). Punishment for man only.

Evidently you don't believe 2 Peter or Jude who specifically mention a severe sentence to angels.

 

[dragongunner]

Evidently you don't believe 2 Peter or Jude who specifically mention a severe sentence to angels.

Evidently you think 2 Peter says angels had sex with humans and that was their punishment…."For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains, to be reserved unto judgement." Sadly thats not why they were cast down, nor does it say being cast down they had sex with humans. Thats a fable.

Genesis 6:1-7King James Version (KJV)
6 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

6 And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.


No were does it say nor imply angels being involved anywhere in all this. Nor anywhere does it say God saw the wickedness of the angels, or he was grieved at the angels, or he repented of making angels. Nor does he destroy the angels, but destroys man. Evidently you and some others would rather read your own opinion and guessing and rewrite the scriptures.

 

[joshuanazar]

He's been doing other stuff for much longer that hasn't worked as well.


Jesus attested to varying levels of sin in John 19:11. All sin is bad enough, but some sins are worse than others. It's self-evident when comparing a petty insult to the war crimes of ISIS, for instance.


That by definition is an anomaly. If he was not an anomaly, he would have been average.


They're two separate things. In this case, they merely correlated. The genetics did not cause morality or immorality. Good-looking, bad people got together with good-looking good people, and the bad people corrupted the children's morals. Beauty and pride trapped people then as they do now.


If you do not believe that the bride in Song of Songs literally had two towers on her chest and literally had a flock of goats running down her head, you do pick and choose what you take literally and what you take figuratively. The issue is does the context lend more credibility to a literal or figurative interpretation. Considering that all angelic visions were signs from God to a primitive people, their very appearances were figurative for the purpose of communicating the message they were sent to deliver (hence swords and horses and chariots when angels appeared regarding war - advance the technology a few thousand years, and they would more likely be seen with guns instead).


I wasn't using that to prove my point. You simply asked for an example and I gave you one. Since one must be very careful with cross-referencing, I wouldn't be so quick to call the sons of God in that passage angels.

Wow this is a good post. It really makes me think. But what stuff has Satan been trying, and is still trying even though it hasn't worked out?

I agree that there are varying levels of punishment, but these are based on the amount of knowledge rejected. Remember when Jesus said that it would be better for Sodom than Capernaum because they rejected Jesus?

And yes Goliath was an anomaly, but it seemed like you were saying that he was an isolated anomaly instead of part of a race that was an anomaly. He was not alone by far. You say that the morality of the people and their genetics were correlated, but this scripture seems to imply that it was more of an issue of cause and effect.

And you are right not everything in the bible is literal, but it is obvious that the Song of Solomon has a lot of figurative writings. It is also obvious that when the spies were calling themselves grasshoppers compared to the inhabitants of the land that it was figurative. That being said we have to be careful. My personal practice is that unless it is obvious that it is figurative I take the scripture literal. I also believe that underneath the main lesson of the scripture is more literal and figurative things to take from it.

Simply put there really is no clear proof one way or the other on this subject. We probably will never know the whole truth of it till we get it from Jesus himself. Either way whether we believe in demon marriages or not, it will make no difference on our salvation.

But I am interested in discussing your last statement further though. The one about angelic technology and it's manifestation in visions according to our technology. I am going to create a thread about it and I would like for you to share your views.

 

[joshuanazar]

Evidently you think 2 Peter says angels had sex with humans and that was their punishment…."For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains, to be reserved unto judgement." Sadly thats not why they were cast down, nor does it say being cast down they had sex with humans. Thats a fable.

Genesis 6:1-7King James Version (KJV)
6 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

6 And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.


No were does it say nor imply angels being involved anywhere in all this. Nor anywhere does it say God saw the wickedness of the angels, or he was grieved at the angels, or he repented of making angels. Nor does he destroy the angels, but destroys man. Evidently you and some others would rather read your own opinion and guessing and rewrite the scriptures.

It is clear from revelation that Satan and all his will be punished. And some are already locked up in the abyss.

 

[Kutte]

I see a bunch of different arguments here about who the sons of God are, and I am familiar with the teaching that says they are just human sons of Seth. That teaching is wrong. The Book of Enoch is really clear that the sons of God were the watchers, who are one type of angel. They are not the same as the one third of rebellious angels that were cast out of heaven with Satan. There were only about 200 of the watchers sent to earth. They were a different class of angels just like you have different classes mentioned in the Bible like arch angels, seraphim and cherubim, and ministering spirits. In the demonic world there are principalities and powers, and there are spirits of divination like familiar spirits that are a lower class of spirit than the rulers in the high places. I think people get mixed up when they think the watchers were the same ones from the group that followed Satan against God in heaven. The human and watchers children are part human and if someone has a part of that bloodline from a long time ago that doesn't mean that person is an evil person or they are doomed. They still have free will to choose salvation through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Hi Semyamara,

I think one could look at the issue of "sons of God" differently. When considering that the creator of all things, God, also created humans, males as well as females, we may realize that we are all sons and daughters of God. Don't Christians pray and look to God as their Father?

My best, Kutte