We're making some progress with Jeremy now. Let's look at what he has conceded:
1) That the encounter is initiated through a physical act, not anything else.
2) That the man shames/violates/humiliates the woman.
However, Jeremy is still unwilling to call this rape because he says:
Jeremy said:
Correct. The same word is used for a man who has consensual sex with his neighbor's wife. He has defiled her i.e. made her unclean etc.
But he's wrong:
"
If a man is discovered having sexual relations with another man’s wife, both the man who had sex with the woman and the woman must die. You must purge the evil from Israel." -- Deuteronomy 22:222
You'll see that there is no mention of the man shaming the woman. And, in fact, this verse may be far worse in that regardless of whether the sex is consensual or rape, the woman's going to die. In this case, the man also dies because he has damaged another man's property. Let's take a look at another example:
"
If there is a young woman who is a virgin engaged to a man, and another man encounters her in the city and has sex with her, you must take the two of them out to the gate of that city and stone them to death—the young woman because she did not cry out in the city and the man because he has violated his neighbor’s fiancée. You must purge the evil from you." -- Deuteronomy 22:23-24
Now here's a real doozy for you. If a woman is choked and raped, she's going to be beaten with rocks for the fact that she was raped. Let that sink in and then we'll continue...
... Okay, so here we have what happens if a man rapes another man's fiance/possession. And that is the key difference between the man being killed and the man purchasing the victim. If the victim is already another man's property then the rapist has to die. If the victim is not yet the property of another man besides her father,
then the rapist has to buy her from daddy. That's it. In another verse it deals with what happens when the woman is raped and she screams but is too far away in a field; in that case she is not killed with rocks being thrown at her. So, Hebrew ladies, please remember that if you're going to be raped, you need to stay in town.
Now the ancient Hebrews were familiar with the laws found in Deuteronomy, and chances are they understood ancient Hebrew better than Jeremy. They're sort of like the
modern translators of ancient Hebrew (believers and non-believers) that Jeremy doesn't trust. Here's how the ancient Hebrews applied the law:
"
So they instructed the Benjamites, saying, “Go and hide in the vineyards and watch. When the young women of Shiloh come out to join in the dancing, rush from the vineyards and each of you seize one of them to be your wife. Then return to the land of Benjamin. When their fathers or brothers complain to us, we will say to them, ‘Do us the favor of helping them, because we did not get wives for them during the war. You will not be guilty of breaking your oath because you did not give your daughters to them.’”
So that is what the Benjamites did. While the young women were dancing, each man caught one and carried her off to be his wife. Then they returned to their inheritance and rebuilt the towns and settled in them." -- Judges 21:20-23
Uh-oh, there's that "seize" word again, and it doesn't look like they're using it to hold hands. Nope, they're ambushing the
girls and carrying them off ('cause let's get real, these are like twelve year-olds). That's how the ancient Hebrews applied the laws of Deuteronomy in a real-life scenario... they couldn't find enough girls for the Benjamites, so they got together and concluded the
best possible action was for the Benjamites to ambush, kidnap, and rape 'em some wives, pay the fathers, and voila, everybody was good to go. If you'll read the story before where I quoted, you'll be treated to a real tale of courage when the Hebrews murder an entire town except virgin girls cause they needed some wives.
All of this takes place without a hint of judgment from Yahweh. Moses can't get in the promised land because he hits a rock incorrectly, but you can rape thousands and make them your sex-slave wives; Yahweh won't utter a peep (its his law after all).