Is the seventh day the Sabbath?

[from scratch]

You quoted Jeremiah 31:31 what about the next few verses? It is the same law that is written on our hearts not removed!

Only if you change word meaning and throw out verse 32.

 

[VictorC]

That is the confusion. You don't steal lie or commit adultery but the very commandments that say the same thing is not for you. Jesus says you should not steal. You say it does not apply to you but it does not mean that you are a thief. Make sense to you?

Regarding your claim attributed to Jesus wherein "Jesus says you should not steal": Where oh where did Jesus say this? To whom that you include as "you"? Even if you were to attribute this to the pre-incarnate Voice Who declared His covenant at Horeb, you have a problem with your claim.

I perform compliance test duties in a laboratory environment, so I'm used to the language encountered in regulatory standards. There is a huge difference in the meaning between "should" and "shall", where the former encourages something optional, while the latter doesn't permit any option. The Law you appeal to demands atonement for noncompliance, as it doesn't include the attribute of mercy God retained to Himself.

Don't forget to furnish the 'whom' requested. Then find out if it includes anyone here on the forum.

 

[VictorC]

The adjective 'eternal' does not apply to the Sabbath, which we can all document the origin of. Application of 'eternal' to a periodic entity that ends as often as it repeats also comes across as a oxymoron.

The ideas that God's Holy Sabbath is not for His faithful followers is ludicrous.
Even more so is the idea that the Ten commandments are abolished for Christians!

Applying the core tenets of Judaism to Christianity and those outside Judaism's jurisdiction is silly.
Using the plural verb "are" to describe the singular covenant from Mount Sinai is poor grammar.
Failing to capitalize the proper-noun title of the covenant from Mount Sinai shows others you don't know what the Ten Commandments was.

But at the very least it appears that your previous claim of an "eternal" Sabbath vanished.
That's a good thing.
What isn't is when your posts are knee-jerk reactions, showing your sensibilities are offended whenever the realities of the Gospel are provided to you. And, that's the tenor of your whole post.

 

[JacobLaw]

You quoted Jeremiah 31:31 what about the next few verses? It is the same law that is written on our hearts not removed!

Elder 111,
You are making my point; without arguing and doting about questions and strifes of words; let me say this and I hope you would pause and actually think about this, that what you consider commandments really have now become promises.

 

[Elder 111]

Elder 111,
You are making my point; without arguing and doting about questions and strifes of words; let me say this and I hope you would pause and actually think about this, that what you consider commandments really have now become promises.

What do you mean?

 

[Elder 111]

What is interesting is the fact that the commandments that are said to be abolished by many are often repeated in Revelation as the mark of God's people and the requirement of God and Jesus.
How can that be?
Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rev 22:
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
How can God expect me to keep His commandments that does not apply to me?
Or is it that Revelation does not apply to Christians.
John 2:2-3 is not for us either!
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

 

[JacobLaw]

What do you mean?

No longer is there a fleshly struggle with the commandments, no abolishment but simply the commandments have become promise, thou shall not lie what a great promise, thou shall not take the Lord's name in vain, awesome promise, thou shall keep the Sabbath day holy what an awesome promise, the promises of God are our inheritance.

 

[Elder 111]

No longer is there a fleshly struggle with the commandments, no abolishment but simply the commandments have become promise, thou shall not lie what a great promise, thou shall not take the Lord's name in vain, awesome promise, thou shall keep the Sabbath day holy what an awesome promise, the promises of God are our inheritance.

So what do you understand is involved in keeping the Sabbath?

 

[from scratch]

So what do you understand is involved in keeping the Sabbath?

I take it you're asking a personal question not wanting to know personally what keeping the Sabbath really means because its been explained to you several times. You have no interest in knowing. You're doing personal evangelism.

 

[VictorC]

I take it your asking a personal question not wanting to know personally what keeping the Sabbath really means because its been explained to you several times. You have no interest in knowing. You're doing personal evangelism.

I don't really know what Elder111 is doing. He isn't defending his distinctives, and that's all I can surmise from his latest contributions.

 

[JacobLaw]

So what do you understand is involved in keeping the Sabbath?

Think Sabbaths, plural.
That is truly up to you to decided at this point, no one can tell you or judge you in it.
Your liberty is by promise, but being warned not to be entangled in the bondage of the percepts of men. God will give you wisdom and understanding by the Holy Ghost. There is no condemnation if you walk in the Spirit or the word and not the letter.
You seem sincere enough seek and you will find ask and it will be give to you.

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

 

[Elder 111]

Think Sabbaths, plural.
That is truly up to you to decided at this point, no one can tell you or judge you in it.
Your liberty is by promise, but being warned not to be entangled in the bondage of the percepts of men. God will give you wisdom and understanding by the Holy Ghost. There is no condemnation if you walk in the Spirit or the word and not the letter.
You seem sincere enough seek and you will find ask and it will be give to you.

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

I am trying to understand your position on this matter. I must say that I have a position on the matter already.
Firstly you mention Sabbaths and not Sabbath. What do you mean hear?
Do you see the Seventh day Sabbath as bondage?
Do you understand that if we are lead by the Spirit that we will not seek to keep the Ten commandments?
I am seeking clarity.

 

[from scratch]

I don't really know what Elder111 is doing. He isn't defending his distinctives, and that's all I can surmise from his latest contributions.

He's merely a salesman trying to make a sale. He needs a reason/objection so he can overcome his potential client.

 

[Elder 111]

How should we regard this?
234. What is the third commandment of God?

The third commandment of God is: Remember thou keep holy the Lord's day.
And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had done. (Genesis 2:2)
235. Why does the Church command us to keep Sunday as the Lord's day?

The Church commands us to keep Sunday as the Lord's day, because on Sunday Christ rose from the dead, and on Sunday the Holy Ghost descended upon the apostles.
236. What are we commanded by the third commandment?

By the third commandment we are commanded to worship God in a special manner on Sunday, the Lord's day.
Keep you my sabbath; for it is holy unto you. (Exodus 31:14)
237. How does the Church command us to worship God on Sunday?

The Church commands us to worship God on Sunday by assisting at the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
238. What is forbidden by the third commandment of God?

By the third commandment of God all unnecessary servile work on Sunday is forbidden.
Six days shall you do work; in the seventh day is the sabbath, the rest holy to the Lord. (Exodus 31:15)
239. What is servile work?

Servile work is that which requires labor of body rather than of mind.
240. When is servile work allowed on Sunday?

Servile work is allowed on Sunday when the honor of God, our own need, or that of our neighbor requires it.
The Second and Third Commandments of God

 

[Elder 111]

Interesting to those that say that Sabbath was not kept or known before Sinai.
The Sabbath is first met with in connection with the fall of the manna (Exodus 16:22 sqq.), but it there appears as an institution already known to the Israelites. The Sinaitic legislation therefore only gave the force of law to an existing custom.
CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sabbath

 

[Sophrosyne]

Interesting to those that say that Sabbath was not kept or known before Sinai.
The Sabbath is first met with in connection with the fall of the manna (Exodus 16:22 sqq.), but it there appears as an institution already known to the Israelites. The Sinaitic legislation therefore only gave the force of law to an existing custom.
CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sabbath

I agree this is the first sabbath but it wasn't known because they had to be instructed as to what to do in the collection of manna. If they had truly known about it there wouldn't need to be mention of it whatsoever logically.

 

[VictorC]

He's merely a salesman trying to make a sale. He needs a reason/objection so he can overcome his potential client.

Sales isn't his first calling. Each time someone drops Scripture into his lap, his response is uniform deflection to avoid dealing with his variance with Scripture. And, no one is buying the tainted product.

 

[VictorC]

Interesting to those that say that Sabbath was not kept or known before Sinai.
The Sabbath is first met with in connection with the fall of the manna (Exodus 16:22 sqq.), but it there appears as an institution already known to the Israelites. The Sinaitic legislation therefore only gave the force of law to an existing custom.
CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Sabbath

We've told you all along the Sabbath traces its origin coincident with the manna experience about a month before God declared His covenant to His vassal Israel. That you're just now noticing the Sabbath's actual origin shows that you're way behind the learning curve. And no, if you read the account in Exodus 16 you will find that following the weekly cycle marked with the Sabbath was problematic at best, showing that it was a new concept the children of Israel weren't accustomed to. It was not an existing custom, the reason Nehemiah 9:14 attributes the first knowledge of the Sabbath to Moses, after those depicted in the account studied the Book of the Law.

 

[VictorC]

We can shorten your post this way to get to the meat contained therein:

How should we regard this?

The Second and Third Commandments of God

The way we should regard this is recognizing your dependency on the Roman Catholic Church for your doctrinal assertions. That is the nature of Adventism, depending on a straw man to justify its existence rather than forming a Biblical world view to base its belief system.

 

[Sophrosyne]

We can shorten your post this way to get to the meat contained therein:

The way we should regard this is recognizing your dependency on the Roman Catholic Church for your doctrinal assertions. That is the nature of Adventism, depending on a straw man to justify its existence rather than forming a Biblical world view to base its belief system.

Yeah... what is it with all this catholic dogma here on us non catholics why would we care?